ZSU-23-4 and ZU-23-2 AA Guns: Views

No it actually shows zu-23-2 as well as it mounted on BTR. And states twin 23mm zu mount as well as given the weights for each part including the mount at 950kg. I agree with the zsu-23-4 as I stated earlier they wouldn't produce such items but something as basic as a zu-23-2 yes they would. Also on the zsu-23-4 page they only state barrel weight and not the platform (chassis) which suggest only the barrel is offered but the mount weight is included on the zu-23-2. But also you would have think eehnie your saying it's only barrels being produced which goes against your owns words that nothing is getting to produced as production ended to now it's barrels only but ask yourself if they are producing barrels then why not the mount ? As the mount is basic as I mentioned earlier and fulfilling customers needs it makes no sense in producing half a system when the other half is basic to produce and 1000'S still in use. As I mentioned it wouldn't make any sense to start production of zsu -23-4 chassis. But also as mentioned the zsu -23-4 can still be offered for sale as old overhauled stock to clear stocks because at the end of the day Russia also wants to sell tunguska and Pantsir and clear zsu -23-4. But Russia has no new like for like alternative for the
zu-23-2. And to be honest from a business point of view it makes sense to produce zu-23-2 for customers cheap and basic to produce and brings sales in on a piece of equipment still widely used. And makes no sense to start production of zsu-23-4 as it wouldn't be economically viable to set up production. Also how many zsu-23-4 still in use in Russian Armed forces and how many zu -23-2 still in Russian Armed forces? And ask your self if Russia depleted there stocks of zu-23-2 would they really go and buy from another country who makes it? That also wouldn't make sense a country which originally produces it and still has the tooling to produce something so basic to come and buy from another country which not only would cost more but what kinda quality are u getting and lost sales on Russian soil.

For some reason pics upload wouldn't open up on my last post so had to post separate

It would not make sense to make new ZSU-23-4 because replacement systems have been developed and put into service, but the ZU-23-2 is just two guns on a light towed mount that are used in an array of different roles.

In the 1990s they started using them on light boats to give them a cheap and simple capability against air and ground and sea threats... there has been no official replacement for the towed ZU-23-2, so while it might not be in full production at the moment, they likely still make parts and barrels and bits and pieces to keep them working.

The light four wheeled vehicle shown previously with a ZU-23-2 mounted on the back of it shows it is still a viable system... the shells significantly bigger than any HMG round...

Exactly GarryB no replacement yet. And yes as I said zsu-23-4 has had two replacements and Russia can still offer zsu -23-4 upgrades and zsu -23-4 while they still have them in storage. But has the pics I provided and explanation thst it seems back in 2009 they were still producing the full zu-23-2 because it is very basic and cheap to produce all the parts and a towed mount would be mad. A trailered mount it cheap and simple to make. So it makes perfect business sense to produce the mount as well and sell to countries that want it. Business needs to make money, serve customers needs and keep customers coming back

Russia is good that it has options for everyones budget and needs.

Pantsir
Tunguska
Zsu -23-4 (while stocks last)
Zsu -23-4 upgrades
Zu-23-2 various versions
Zu-23-2 upgrades

So it can supply all of above and offer upgrades on two systems to those already having them. Even the upgrades can vary on price and whats needed. Zsu can get upgraded radar only or add on strela-10 or any manpad sa-7/sa-14/sa-16/sa-18/sa-24/verba and can have these in 2/4/6/8 missiles so prices can vary depending on manpad and number. As for zu-23-2 they have radar only and all of the above. The good thing about zu is that it can be mounted on just about anything and Russia can also supply the chassis from 4x4/trucks/mt-lb /bmp/bmd/btr/brdm/typhoon etc and boats and I think that's this another reason to keep it in production to help the options and sale of other equipment new or old.

You are confusing production of the 2A14 and the 2A7 with the entire ZU-23(-2). This is not right. They are only components produced as spare parts.

Nope I ain't. You are not reading anything I said nor looking at the pics eehnie. The picture and page CLEARLY states that the 
zu-23--2 was on its (kbp) production page and CLEARLY states weights including the mount 950kg. But as I stated when you look at their listing for zsu-23-4 it CLEARLY states the weights of just the barrels and no mention of the chassis weight. Which as I mentioned shows that the zsu-23-4 isn't in production. No confusion there eehnie only on your part. I know that you don't like to accept it because it's not what you want but I am only stating what was on the kbp production page in 2009. And everyone on here reading this can see that from the pics but you fail to see it not sure why.  The zu-23-2 I believe original is 2a13 and later in life a better barrel the 2a14 was being produced and still is although you will likely argue that it isn't unless you changed your mind from your original comments. The 2a7 is the shilka barrel which is different. Now it states on their (kbp) production page that the " 23mm 2a14 automatic anti-aircraft gun AND twin 23mm ZU air defence MOUNT" I ain't making this up eehnie. Please see the pic.

You are saying things that are not right.

Why you include not the web.archive link complete instead of weird partial image captures?

eehnie wrote:You are saying things that are not right.

Why you include not the web.archive link complete instead of weird partial image captures?

OMG still in denial face it eehnie to are wrong this time it knows it's hard for you accept that but please do try. 

I supplied pics fully all I did was zoom in to highlight the text you failed to see previously I can keep providing pics inch by inch if you like. It clearly states kbp production page and it CLEARLY states what its producing and CLEARLY states mount. Eehnie I've provided links in the past to debates and you still failed to acknowledge the evidence hence screen shots were done but now it's clear you accept that either nor ex servicemens experiences only think you accept is anything that you post. What you suggesting eehnie that I faked them? That I spent hours or days making the pics up? For one I ain't that sad and pathetic enough to do so secondly I don't have enough skills in that area to do so. And I don't speak lies eehnie everything that I said I have done and experiencedhas been proven with evidence feel free to check my threads of pics including me in the pics I don't lie and people on this forum have seen my pics etc I have no agenda and no reason to lie. 

Can a moderator please intervene with this. Eehnie is CLEARLY in denial of fact and truth despite evidence which I didn't create but what kbp created I am just showing evidence but in true eehnie fashion refuses it because it's not what HE wants. There no progressive debate with him everyone is wrong and he's right. And I am not the only person on here that has this problem with eehnie

As as more evidence in comparison when you view the 2a7 page it CLEARLY states the barrel and no mention of and zsu-23-4 chassis because it ain't being produced but I proved earlier in the case of 2a14 the barrel AND zu -23-2 MOUNT was mentioned in production page not my words eehnie but kbp back in 2009 I don't have a laptop I do it all on my phone I didn't bring one with me when I moved to east Africa. Kbp make the barrels for various systems and clearly produce barrels and mount for zu-23-2 however they have never produced shilka or tunguska BUT do produce the barrels hence they on their page only state 2a7 barrel and not the chassis as is the same for tunguska and aircraft guns they supply guns but aircraft it's that simple. The complete zu -23-2 was designed qnd produced by kbp not part produced. Suck it up buttercup and admit your were wrong and fail to accept it. Ur denial is bordering on troll status. No point in debatingwith someone who denies the truth and fact  and has it in their mind they are 100% right all of the time. And that's exactly what you do eehnie it's not clever it's not funny and it loses ur credibility many people now just scroll past your posts or have u on ignore that's not a good thing eehnie although you probably think it is.

2A7 and 2A14 are components, are parts of the ZU-23(-2) and the ZU-23-4, not the entire weapons.

Habitually when someone takes the work of taking small partial image captures instead of providing the original link, which require significantly less work, and gives the complete informarion to the reader, it smells strongly to a bid of manipulation.

eehnie wrote:2A7 and 2A14 are components, are parts of the ZU-23(-2) and the ZU-23-4, not the entire weapons.

Habitually when someone takes the work of taking small partial image captures instead of providing the original link, which require significantly less work, and gives the complete informarion to the reader, it smells strongly to a bid of manipulation.

Well completely blind again if you FAIL to see the words from the picture which CLEARLY STATES MOUNT then you are nothing but a complete idiot. As explained and show you the complete pic earlier but fail yet again to see it so I zoomed in so you could see and I have provided links in past debates and you refused to accept them those are your actions not mine. I don't mind providing links and do but u would still refuse as now u have done so. You FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL to see that it states barrel AND mount you don't need a link eehnie u need a brain. Quite frankly you are nothing but a fool who lives in world u only exist. If your so great eehnie go find the link yourself maybe you accept it then. I haven't manipulated anything I haven't tampered with anything I actually think you should be banned on the grounds of being mentally unstable and for trolling this forum. Because all you do is deny and destroy this forum. Maybe we show start a poll on this forum asking what action should be taken against you a democratic vote on and issue which plagues this forum.

d_taddei2 wrote:

eehnie wrote:2A7 and 2A14 are components, are parts of the ZU-23(-2) and the ZU-23-4, not the entire weapons.

Habitually when someone takes the work of taking small partial image captures instead of providing the original link, which require significantly less work, and gives the complete informarion to the reader, it smells strongly to a bid of manipulation.

Well completely blind again if you FAIL to see the words from the picture which CLEARLY STATES MOUNT then you are nothing but a complete idiot. As explained and show you the complete pic earlier but fail yet again to see it so I zoomed in so you could see and I have provided links in past debates and you refused to accept them those are your actions not mine. I don't mind providing links and do but u would still refuse as now u have done so. You FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL to see that it states barrel AND mount you don't need a link eehnie u need a brain. Quite frankly you are nothing but a fool who lives in world u only exist. If your so great eehnie go find the link yourself maybe you accept it then. I haven't manipulated anything I haven't tampered with anything I actually think you should be banned on the grounds of being mentally unstable and for trolling this forum. Because all you do is deny and destroy this forum. Maybe we show start a poll on this forum asking what action should be taken against you a democratic vote on and issue which plagues this forum.

Collecting all the pictures you posted in the last messages, this is what we see:

In the foolowing pictures is perfectly clear that the produced parts are the 2A14 and the 2A7 mechanical ensambles, that are components of the ZU-23(-2) and the ZSU-23-4

In the following picture of a partial capture, where can be a little more doubt, in fact, in practical terms, you are providing not the complete link for the readers.

To use the retoric "23mm 2A14 Automatic Anti-Aircraft gun and Twin 23mm ZU-23-2 mount" for the whole mechanical ensamble which designation is ZU-23-2 makes not sense.

The reference to the "Twin 23mm ZU-23-2 mount" seems used to designate the mechanical structure that sustains the 2 2A14 mechanical ensembles that form the firing part of the ZU-23-2. Just the firing part, not the entire ZU-23-2 weapon.

In the blue words of the image we see it in the page of the 2A14 mechanical ensamble, and not in a page under the ZU-23-2 designation. Then the refered mount is unlikely to be the complete weapon.

Providing the entire link the readers would be able to see better which of the two interpretations is correct.

Instead, you prefer to insult me again, contradicting the message of Vladimir79 to the whole forum.

You are confusing production of the 2A14 and the 2A7 with the entire ZU-23(-2). This is not right. They are only components produced as spare parts.

2A7 and 2A14 are components, are parts of the ZU-23(-2) and the ZU-23-4, not the entire weapons.

The 2A7 is a 23mm cannon used on towed gun mounts... the ZU-23-2 is probably the most famous but it originally came in a single barrel and a quad barrel mount option for a towed system.

The 2A14 is also a 23mm cannon, but it is used ONLY on the ZSU-23-4. It is a different gun. It has a water cooling jacket for sustained higher rates of fire.

Habitually when someone takes the work of taking small partial image captures instead of providing the original link, which require significantly less work, and gives the complete informarion to the reader, it smells strongly to a bid of manipulation.

Or it suggests a level of pigheadedness of the people discussing the topic and a suspicion that links are not being read and ignored because they don't suit your current line of reasoning...

The reference to the "Twin 23mm ZU-23-2 mount" seems referend to the mechanical ensemble that contains 2 2A14 mechanical ensambles. Just the weapon part, not the entire ZU-23-2 weapon. In the blue words of the image we see it in the page of the 2A14 mechanical ensamble, and not under a ZU-23-2 designation. Then the refered mount is unlikely to be the complete weapon.

Except that the 2A14 is the water cooled model cannon that is only used on the ZSU-23-4.

It mentions the 2A14 because they are only talking about the barrels. With the 2A7 they are talking about the barrels AND the mount...

They are talking about selling barrels for the ZSU-23-4 because the vehicle is no longer in production in Russia... why would it... who in Russia would buy it when there are plenty in storage. There are still some in operation no doubt somewhere in Russia.

The 2A7 is in production... as is the ZU-23 mount because it was very widely used and is still used around the place in small numbers.

It is a very handy system to use on isolated bases and in mountains because it easily outranges HMGs and small arms fire.

GarryB wrote:Except that the 2A14 is the water cooled model cannon that is only used on the ZSU-23-4.

Sure? I think need to try to confirm it.

Until now, I see in multiple sources:

2A7 and 2A10 related to the ZSU-23-4
2A13 and 2A14 related to the ZU-23(-2)

2a7 barrel is zsu -23-4 and still in production 
2a14 is an upgraded barrel for zu-23-2 and still in production as is the MOUNT. Now eehnie you state that the mount is just the bits that hold the barrels actually ur wrong the mount is 950kg in weight you will find also it state twin 23mm zu mount this is fact the whole system complete and I have doubt as to why they wouldn't produce and sell it because of the sheer number of customers still using it and the WHOLE system is made at kbp nothing produced by other companies as is the case of zsu -23-4 hence they are only offering and producing the the barrels for it. If you  have a business head you might understand  (and that's not an insult btw) 

If you push aside your ignorance you might learn something from people in this forum especially ex servicemen. (Not an insult but friendly advice)

I don't think GarryB mix up was not intentional but rather a mistake

You can be exservicemen, but your comments contain lots of wrong statements, and show clearly that technical language is not something that you are prepared to understand (the captures you are including are of technical nature), otherwise you would not be posting images that contradict your own words.

To try to impose your opinions with insults makes not you right, only undermines the authority of the Administrator of the Forum and their Moderators, contradicting their rules and messages to the forum. They are being very generous with you, pardoning your insults multiple times, at the cost of their own credit, but you continue abusing, feeling entitled to insult me without consequences.

eehnie wrote:
You can be exservicemen, but your comments contain lots of wrong statements, and show clearly that technical language is not something that you are prepared to understand (the captures you are including are of technical nature), otherwise you would not be posting images that contradict your own words.

To try to impose your opinions with insults makes not you right, only undermines the authority of the Administrator of the Forum and their Moderators, contradicting their rules and messages to the forum. They are being very generous with you, pardoning your insults multiple times, at the cost of their own credit, but you continue abusing, feeling entitled to insult me without consequences.

Say what you will eehnie you have no technical knowledge or understanding nor any military knowledge it's clear you think your opinion is gospel and your ignorance hindersyou in learning anything this is very clear and your hated by many on this forum because unwillingnessto accept the truth and fact. It bothers me not that fail to see fact or truth. You  Dis ex servivemens experiences and u dis credible evidence because its not what you want to hear. In fact hardly any reads your nonsense anymore and not interested in What you have to say anymore that's some you brought onto yourself nobody else and certainly not a good thing. Your no longer hold any credibility because your blinded by your own ignorance. My insults are directed at one person who rightfully deserves them. However your nonsense posts that clog up this forum is inflicted on everyone destroy this forum because of it. Why don't we have a poll and see who is the one who destroys the forum with nonsense and who credibility is nil. I know for a fact that the majority would say you and you know it. And really the moderators need to address your nonsense posts that almost the the entire page up with dubious links and outdated information as well your complete denial of facts because they don't fit into warped mind.And to be honest many people hate you with a passion including me I didn't use to it was you made people hate you. Ur in complete denial of any facts or evidence because it doesn't fit into eehnie world. You truly have a mental issue. And ask yourself eehnie how many people on this forum have had problem with me? And how many people have had problems with you? You will find your the one who destroys and discredits this forum and hamper and progressive debate because of your incessant denial of facts and post complete nonsense nobody reads.

Oops, yes I did mix up the designations, but the facts are that the ground mount Zu-23-2, which was successful and widely produced, as well as the ZU-23-1 and ZU-23-4 towed single and four gun mounts that were not successful used an air cooled 23mm cannon that is still produced to this day called 2A14... new model called 2A14M, while the 23mm cannon carried and used on the ZSU-23-4 tracked air defence system called 2A7... called 2A7M in the current model is watercooled and different.

Water cooled 2A7 for the Shilka

With its water cooling jacket and water tube
(note there is an error in the spec data where it says it is a 30mm calibre gun...)

and the air cooled model for the ZU-23 is this one:

Air cooled 2A14 for ZU-23

Tulamash is the maker...

GarryB wrote:Oops, yes I did mix up the designations, but the facts are that the ground mount Zu-23-2, which was successful and widely produced, as well as the ZU-23-1 and ZU-23-4 towed single and four gun mounts that were not successful used an air cooled 23mm cannon that is still produced to this day called 2A14... new model called 2A14M, while the 23mm cannon carried and used on the ZSU-23-4 tracked air defence system called 2A7... called 2A7M in the current model is watercooled and different.

Water cooled 2A7 for the Shilka

With its water cooling jacket and water tube
(note there is an error in the spec data where it says it is a 30mm calibre gun...)

and the air cooled model for the ZU-23 is this one:

Air cooled 2A14 for ZU-23

Tulamash is the maker...

And to note GarryB thst it clearly states the mount weight in table as 950kg which fails to accept. Maybe he should check the facts before saying it's only the bits that effectively hold the barrels. When the facts are presented and the truth eehnie will ALWAYS fail to mention then a tactic he's guilty of in every thread he's posted in. He clearly failed to check the table of weights his observational skills and analysis skills are lacking even in basic terms it's something he is clearly lacking and hasn't grasped just like he has no service experience which is also very evident. Doesn't leave much else to be honest. Anyway am glad the facts have been laid bare for all on the forum to see the back in 2009 kbp was producing the complete zu-23-2 system along with 2a7 barrels as the facts have stated. And eehnie can live in denial it only hampers his knowledge and a chance to learn. 

A few pics that maybe eehnie can take some friendly advice from. And the first pic is for the forum in relation to eehnie. Not insults but friendly advice.

I am more than happy to have an agreement with eehnie that I won't comment on his posts if won't comment on mines a mutual agreement. But I know that trying to reason with him last time he refused any reasoning or common understanding I won't hold my breath 
 
 

As explained by the company (if you click in the reference to the 2A14 that GarryB linked), this is the mechanical ensemble produced actually:

http://www.tulamash.ru/catalog/18

Военная продукция

2А14Ствол 23-мм зенитного автомата

2А14 / Ствол 23-мм зенитного автомата



Ствол 23-мм зенитного автомата 2А14 применяется в спаренной зенитной установке ЗУ-23.

ТЕХНИЧЕСКИЕ ХАРАКТЕРИСТИКИ

Наименование параметра          Величина параметра

Калибр ствола, мм          23

Число нарезов          10

Начальная скорость, м/с          970

Масса ствола в сборе (с пламегасителем), кг          27,2

Длина ствола в сборе (с пламегасителем), мм          2010

Охлаждение          Воздушное

Темп стрельбы автомата, выстрелов/мин          800…1000


КАШТАН  /  АО-18К (6К30ГШ)  /  ПАЛЬМА  /  АК-630М  /  АК-630М-2 ДУЭТ  /  АО-18 (ГШ-6-30К)  /  АК-306, -01, -02, -03  /  АО-18Л (ГШ-6-30Л)  /  2А42  /  2А72  /  2А38М  /  2А7М  /  Масштабные макеты  /  3УБК10М  /  Поставка ЗИП  /  Модернизация ВТ  /

Traslated:

Military products

2A14Stvol 23 mm anti-aircraft machine

2A14 / Barrel 23 mm anti-aircraft machine



The barrel of a 23-mm anti-aircraft machine 2A14 is used in a twin anti-aircraft unit ZU-23.

SPECIFICATIONS

Parameter Name Parameter Value

Barrel caliber, mm 23

Number of grooves 10

Initial speed, m / s 970

Weight of the barrel assembly (with flame arrester), kg 27.2

Length of the barrel assembly (with flame arrester), mm 2010

Air Cooling

Rate of shooting machine, shots / min 800 ... 1000


KASHTAN / AO-18K (6K30GSh) / PALMA / AK-630M / AK-630M-2 DUET / AO-18 (GS-6-30K) / AK-306, -01, -02, -03 / AO-18L ( GSH-6-30L) / 2A42 / 2A72 / 2A38M / 2A7M / Scale layouts / 3UBK10M / Supply of spare parts / Modernization of W /

This is not the complete weapon. In fact the complete weapon, like many other towed weapons, has its own 2A designation, in this case 2A13. The 2A14 is a component of the 2A13.

2A13 <--> ZU-23-2
2A18 <--> D-30
2A19 <--> T-12
2A29 <--> MT-12 (variant of the previous)
2A36 <--> Giatsint-B
2A65 <--> Msta-B

In the case of the ZSU-23-4, the complete turret mechanical ensemble would receive the 2A10 designation, while the 2A7 is part of the 2A10 mechanical ensemble.

d_taddei2, in your last images you have something to learn.

eehnie wrote:As explained by the company (if you click in the reference to the 2A14 that GarryB linked), this is the mechanical ensemble produced actually:

http://www.tulamash.ru/catalog/18

Военная продукция

2А14Ствол 23-мм зенитного автомата

2А14 / Ствол 23-мм зенитного автомата



Ствол 23-мм зенитного автомата 2А14 применяется в спаренной зенитной установке ЗУ-23.

ТЕХНИЧЕСКИЕ ХАРАКТЕРИСТИКИ

Наименование параметра          Величина параметра

Калибр ствола, мм          23

Число нарезов          10

Начальная скорость, м/с          970

Масса ствола в сборе (с пламегасителем), кг          27,2

Длина ствола в сборе (с пламегасителем), мм          2010

Охлаждение          Воздушное

Темп стрельбы автомата, выстрелов/мин          800…1000


КАШТАН  /  АО-18К (6К30ГШ)  /  ПАЛЬМА  /  АК-630М  /  АК-630М-2 ДУЭТ  /  АО-18 (ГШ-6-30К)  /  АК-306, -01, -02, -03  /  АО-18Л (ГШ-6-30Л)  /  2А42  /  2А72  /  2А38М  /  2А7М  /  Масштабные макеты  /  3УБК10М  /  Поставка ЗИП  /  Модернизация ВТ  /

Traslated:

Military products

2A14Stvol 23 mm anti-aircraft machine

2A14 / Barrel 23 mm anti-aircraft machine



The barrel of a 23-mm anti-aircraft machine 2A14 is used in a twin anti-aircraft unit ZU-23.

SPECIFICATIONS

Parameter Name Parameter Value

Barrel caliber, mm 23

Number of grooves 10

Initial speed, m / s 970

Weight of the barrel assembly (with flame arrester), kg 27.2

Length of the barrel assembly (with flame arrester), mm 2010

Air Cooling

Rate of shooting machine, shots / min 800 ... 1000


KASHTAN / AO-18K (6K30GSh) / PALMA / AK-630M / AK-630M-2 DUET / AO-18 (GS-6-30K) / AK-306, -01, -02, -03 / AO-18L ( GSH-6-30L) / 2A42 / 2A72 / 2A38M / 2A7M / Scale layouts / 3UBK10M / Supply of spare parts / Modernization of W /

This is not the complete weapon. In fact the complete weapon, like many other towed weapons, has its own 2A designation, in this case 2A13. The 2A14 is a component of the 2A13.

2A13 <--> ZU-23-2
2A18 <--> D-30
2A19 <--> T-12
2A29 <--> MT-12 (variant of the previous)
2A36 <--> Giatsint-B
2A65 <--> Msta-B

In the case of the ZSU-23-4, the complete turret mechanical ensemble would receive the 2A10 designation, while the 2A7 is part of the 2A10 mechanical ensemble.

d_taddei2, in your last images you have something to learn.

Very glad you posted this this is from there current catalogue. So you have proven yourself WRONG and shown your ignorance to be true. In my link and pics of 2009 of which I was talking about I stated back in 2009 the barrel and mount was being produced which has proven to be q fact despite what you think and today you have added further evidence that I was correct on that thank you. Because two things are lacking from this link and info u provided but it's clear you failed to observe it or should I say lack of analysis skills is evident. Firstly no mention of mount in your info but states it in 2009 and secondly no mention of mount weight 950kg from your info so this backs up my claim that back in 2009 that the complete system was for sale this was on the back of GarryB comments saying it was for sale back in 2002 which you also ignored. So yes you have been proven wrong but you instead fail to even accept it. It's becoming ever evident that your ignorance might pissed people off but it does more damage to yourself as it hampers your learning to which I don't care if you limit your learning capacity which as I stated earlier is now becoming evident is small and majority of your knowledge is nothing more than fabrication of your mind with a handful of dubious links and outdated information and to be honest the last two anyone can Google and copy and paste. And only one that can change that attitude is you. I actually find it quite funny that you spend your time producing longnonsense posts adding all kinds of dubious outdated information oh and colours thinking that somehow it's adding value to the forum when it's not. Nobody actually reads them and skips past them or have you on ignore. But hey if it massages ur ego and superior complex loool. It's not anyone's time who you are wasting but your own. Don't believe eehnie start a poll asking people on this forum about your posts and attitude I aint lying. As the saying goes -  More fool you. 

GarryB knows enough to understand the meaning of the use of the 2A14 designation in recent and current catalogues, instead of the 2A13 designation. You are only ridiculizing yourself.

This is what I said and just we see it the catalog.

https://www.russiadefence.net/t3824p75-zsu-23-4-aa-gun-views#237663

eehnie wrote:Neither Im talking about scrapping, except maybe for the remains of some unit not recoverable.

All the items stored by Russia are today useful. Some more, some less. My comments about the less capable, less modern and less powerful weapons being first in line for exhaustion are just about how Russia is selecting the material to keep.

The ZSU-23-4 obviously is not in the top of the most modern, most capable and most powerful weapons, but has still a technological advantage over other weapons. Despite the BMPT would be a modern concept, the ZSU-23-4 is some kind of precedent, is some kind of primitive BMPT, and can be used for this with the best performance after the modern BMPTs based on the T-72, that are very few still.

In fact the list of items first in line for exhaustion is a list in relative terms.

It would be interesting that you and/or GarryB mention which weapons can go before the ZU-23(-2) in your opinion because of being less capable, less modern, less powerful or less useful in overall terms. Very likely you will mention only weapons also on exhaustion, if not totally exhausted at this point.

At this point we are not talking about myths like the T-34 or the BM-13. The current weapons in line for exhaustion will be exhausted if the needs in Syria require to finish the Russian stored reserve. And today to provide weapons to Syria is a high priority for Russia over many other countries.

To note that if Im not wrong the data for the end production of the ZU-23(-2) in the Soviet Union would be 1980. After this data the production would be in China. And logically repairs, sale of used units conveniently restored, even upgraded, sale of ammunition, and sale of spare parts, continued in the Soviet Union and Russia.

And still fail to see that in the link I provided and pics under kbp PRODUCTION thst the mount including its weight was mentioned OMG ignorance and blind. It was only a few posts ago you were slating GarryB for getting it wrong and to check now your changing ur mind saying he clearly understands. It's not me ridiculing myself it's u. And it ain't me who's hated on this forum for posting nonsense long useless posts and having an ignorant bigoted mind it's you eehnie. I  think you deserve the title of the forum jester to annoy and make people laugh all at once. Its a fact you're a bigot. If u don't believe do a poll or thread asking for people's views on you on this forum if you have the gall. I suspect u won't because u know deep down what I say is true. To had a tag on ur posts for a long time slagging people on here to which I am sure people found insulting. The forum was great in til you came along nobody had any real problems on here and forums threads were much better with less long winded posts with dubious links and outdated information and bigotry oh and less colours of the rainbow.

George1 wrote:Photos of busy self-made armored and converted into "gantrak" trucks "Ural", which were shot at a rehearsal for the Victory Parade in Yekaterinburg. In the back of one is installed a 23-mm anti-aircraft installation ZU-23 with a shield, the other - 12.7-mm machine gun DShK (!). Obviously, the machines are designed to demonstrate "the introduction of combat experience in Syria."



https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3595510.html

MOD did announce the development of a new light fast attack (technical driven) division learning from experiences in Syria. The light fast attack units would probably fall under the supervision of the VDV.