Domestic production of marine engines for Russian Navy

- Is there a program of import substitution in engine?
- The program has also actively implemented. As I said, there are several players who, with the assistance Minpromtorga design and preparing to start production of the major ship systems: diesel generator sets, gas turbine units, main propulsion systems. Test samples and prototypes have already made, we hope to begin mass production until 2018. In this case, the USC will be their main customer.
- Who will produce the engines?
- Work on the turbine engines of the Russian manufacture is conducted in Rybinsk on "Saturn", we expect to receive their engines from 2018 for gas turbine gearboxes will be made of the St. Petersburg factory "Star". Also work on import substitution, but the ship's diesel engines is to Kolomna near Moscow plant. We are working on localization and production of diesel engines imported brands.

Two brand new Russian-made engines were installed in the hull of a Gremyashchy-class navy corvette inside the Severnaya Verf shipyard in Saint Petersburg on Thursday.

zg18 wrote:Russia: Full steam ahead for Russia's import substitution as navy gets new Moscow-built engines

Two brand new Russian-made engines were installed in the hull of a Gremyashchy-class navy corvette inside the Severnaya Verf shipyard in Saint Petersburg on Thursday.

kvs wrote:

zg18 wrote:Russia: Full steam ahead for Russia's import substitution as navy gets new Moscow-built engines

Two brand new Russian-made engines were installed in the hull of a Gremyashchy-class navy corvette inside the Severnaya Verf shipyard in Saint Petersburg on Thursday.

Nice!  

Reading some threads one gets the impression that this sort of thing is some show stopper challenge for Russia.
Russia can make some nice big gas turbine engines also.   Of course, they have to design, prototype and test them
which takes too much time for internet experts.

Militarov wrote:

kvs wrote:

zg18 wrote:Russia: Full steam ahead for Russia's import substitution as navy gets new Moscow-built engines

Two brand new Russian-made engines were installed in the hull of a Gremyashchy-class navy corvette inside the Severnaya Verf shipyard in Saint Petersburg on Thursday.

Nice!  

Reading some threads one gets the impression that this sort of thing is some show stopper challenge for Russia.
Russia can make some nice big gas turbine engines also.   Of course, they have to design, prototype and test them
which takes too much time for internet experts.

Those are diesel, not turbine engines

It should be DDA12000 "Automated diesel unit", which is basically just two "old" 16D49 engines together with gearbox in mid. New generation of diesels and substitute turbine engines are not even close to be ready, especially turbines.

kvs wrote:

Militarov wrote:

kvs wrote:

zg18 wrote:Russia: Full steam ahead for Russia's import substitution as navy gets new Moscow-built engines

Two brand new Russian-made engines were installed in the hull of a Gremyashchy-class navy corvette inside the Severnaya Verf shipyard in Saint Petersburg on Thursday.

Nice!  

Reading some threads one gets the impression that this sort of thing is some show stopper challenge for Russia.
Russia can make some nice big gas turbine engines also.   Of course, they have to design, prototype and test them
which takes too much time for internet experts.

Those are diesel, not turbine engines

It should be DDA12000 "Automated diesel unit", which is basically just two "old" 16D49 engines together with gearbox in mid. New generation of diesels and substitute turbine engines are not even close to be ready, especially turbines.

Read what I wrote again.   Look for the word "also".    And don't dismiss these engines as old trash.  You don't know
what you are talking about.  

http://www.uk-odk.ru/rus/products/marine_engine/

Those engines must be vapourware according to you.   Russia can't make anything.  Russians are all idiots.  Obama told you
so.

Bugger off.

Militarov wrote:

kvs wrote:

Militarov wrote:

kvs wrote:

zg18 wrote:Russia: Full steam ahead for Russia's import substitution as navy gets new Moscow-built engines

Two brand new Russian-made engines were installed in the hull of a Gremyashchy-class navy corvette inside the Severnaya Verf shipyard in Saint Petersburg on Thursday.

Nice!  

Reading some threads one gets the impression that this sort of thing is some show stopper challenge for Russia.
Russia can make some nice big gas turbine engines also.   Of course, they have to design, prototype and test them
which takes too much time for internet experts.

Those are diesel, not turbine engines

It should be DDA12000 "Automated diesel unit", which is basically just two "old" 16D49 engines together with gearbox in mid. New generation of diesels and substitute turbine engines are not even close to be ready, especially turbines.

Read what I wrote again.   Look for the word "also".    And don't dismiss these engines as old trash.  You don't know
what you are talking about.  

http://www.uk-odk.ru/rus/products/marine_engine/

Those engines must be vapourware according to you.   Russia can't make anything.  Russians are all idiots.  Obama told you
so.

Bugger off.

First of all, where did i exactly "dismiss these engines as old trash"? I said "old", which they sort of are, that engine is based on USSR diesel engine technology from 80s. They ended up being installed in these ships due to sanctions, simple as that, if there were no sanctions MTUs would still prevail. I am not sure why are you bitching on me and not Russian MoD here like its my fault somehow...

Both М70ФРУ and М75РУ are using some Ukrainian components. At this moment Russia does not have navalised turbine engine in production on its own, production in Rybinsk is yet to start when all components beside actual turbine are being replaced with domestic ones. In late 2014. it was annoynced that replacement of those components will happen in "2 to 3 years".

For that part how i "dont know what i am talking about" you will have to excuse me, i spent most of my life in military overhaul facility with my father, my field in engineering might not be mechanical but i know alot more than you might imagine.

"Those engines must be vapourware according to you.   Russia can't make anything.  Russians are all idiots.  Obama told you
so.

Bugger off."


Nice arguments right there. Do something mature like that once more and i will block you.

Militarov wrote:

You were the one who got your panties in a bunch with my post and proceeded to accuse me of saying something that I did not
say.   Now that I have posted information on the M90FR replacement you ignore it and continue to claim that all Russian gas turbine
engines have Ukrainian components.   Without a shred of proof.

So my use of "bugger off" is right on target.  You are full of it.  What's your interest in Russia anyway.  The same of as that of
some Banderite?

sepheronx wrote:I don't see anyone stating as such KVS.  It was more like that it will take time for the replacement components, not that they cannot do it.

But regardless, could anyone answer my last question?

The 20380 used previous 4x of these engines.  So why is this using 2? Does it use Turbines as well? 20380 first model made was with 2x turbines and 2x these 16D49 engines but afterwards, the others were made with 4x16D49 engines.  As well, are they indeed 100% Russian?  The ones in the video look like brand new so I assume they are.

Long before the events in Ukraine, the Russian Government and the military industrial complex were concerned about the issues regarding import substitution in order to become as independent as possible from foreign suppliers. Therefore, back in 2006, state trials were completed for the M90FR engine (producing 27,500 hp) developed by the Turborus firm, of which 40% belonged to the Ukrainian company Zorya–Mashproekt, and the remaining Russian share was divided between NPO Saturn and Avrora, a well-known designer of automated control systems for surface ships.

Militarov wrote:
Yes, its me Poroshenko /wave -.-

sepheronx wrote:Well, Militarov stated that the engines you mentioned "turbine" are partially obtained parts from Ukraine, which unfortunately is quite true.  And in my opinion, the use of these two older diesel engines is actually smart and a good alternative to what they cannot get because well, it will provide the power needed and propulsion needed to make their ships work, and it is domestic, so it is good.  If need be, they may just find methods of increasing its capabilities to make it more effective for other ships.  I mentioned there were possibilities of work around and this is it.  And that is good as it will get ships working, which is more important.  As for the turbines, well, they will get them working.  Militarov isn't stating that they are not doing anything.  He is stating that the engines are not ready yet due to the fact that they have to replace the Ukrainian components with Russian ones.  If they end up rushing it, they will end up the Chinese route with sub par quality components on the turbines which may end up as a problem.

But you are also correct in stating that this is a good move and proves that Russia does indeed make what it is needed and prevails in doing so.  The engines may be old, but it is old design not old in built.

I got a question though: If these engines are indeed fully Russian built and has been for years as Militarov states, then how come they are talking of it as part of import substitution since these engines were apparently built for Steregushchiy corvettes as well:
http://survincity.com/2012/04/kolomna-plant-sent-to-the-shipyard-diesel-diesel/
http://articles.maritimepropulsion.com/article/Russian-Corvette-Steregushchiy-1081.aspx

So how come this is news now?

sepheronx wrote:I don't see anyone stating as such KVS.  It was more like that it will take time for the replacement components, not that they cannot do it.

But regardless, could anyone answer my last question?

The 20380 used previous 4x of these engines.  So why is this using 2? Does it use Turbines as well? 20380 first model made was with 2x turbines and 2x these 16D49 engines but afterwards, the others were made with 4x16D49 engines.  As well, are they indeed 100% Russian?  The ones in the video look like brand new so I assume they are.

sepheronx wrote:
I got a question though: If these engines are indeed fully Russian built and has been for years as Militarov states, then how come they are talking of it as part of import substitution since these engines were apparently built for Steregushchiy corvettes as well:
http://survincity.com/2012/04/kolomna-plant-sent-to-the-shipyard-diesel-diesel/
http://articles.maritimepropulsion.com/article/Russian-Corvette-Steregushchiy-1081.aspx

So how come this is news now?

The 20380 used previous 4x of these engines. So why is this using 2?