S-300/400/500 News [Russian Strategic Air Defense] #2

"We heard figures indicating that the Russian Aerospace Forces will soon receive more S-400 systems. The S-500 will soon finish state tests and enter service,” Korotchenko said following the board meeting of the Russian Defense Ministry on Friday. The Russian army, according to Korotchenko, has achieved significant progress and is one of the best globally. “It is fully capable of defending our country for decades to come.” The S-500 Prometey, also known as 55R6M Triumfator-M, is a cutting-edge anti-aircraft and anti-ballistic missile system currently under development in Russia.



The long-range system, designed by Almaz Antey, is said to have a range of 600 kilometers (more than 370 miles). The system could simultaneously intercept up to ten ballistic missiles traveling at a speed of 5 kilometers per second. “The S-500 missiles will be used only against the most important targets, such as intercontinental ballistic missiles, AWACS and jamming aircraft,” Military Today noted. Earlier reports suggested that the S-500 surface-to-air missile system will enter service in 2017. The Russian Armed Forces are expected to purchase ten S-500 battalions."

Abit more info on S500.

Source: http://www.therussophile.org/potent-defense-russian-army-could-soon-receive-newest-s-500-air-defense-system.html/

Maybe it was shared before but oh well.

Sounds like we'll get to see the S-500 "in the flesh" soon...and if the 2017 in service date is correct, that's a pretty good development pace

Sobering article for Western tacticians on the impact of the probable forthcoming S-400 sales. US site but the article could almost be lifted and inserted into Almaz-Antey's sales material, plus a couple of Vitaly's pictures. One para from it

As one senior U.S. Marine Corps aviator told me earlier in the year, the S-300 series is a deadly threat to everything except the most advanced stealth fighters and bombers. “A complete game changer for all fourth-gen aircraft [like the F-15, F-16 and F/A-18]. That thing is a beast and you don’t want to get near it,” he said.

http://warisboring.com/articles/russias-lethal-s-400-missile-goes-global/comment-page-1/#comment-20087

JohninMK wrote:Sobering article for Western tacticians on the impact of the probable forthcoming S-400 sales. US site but the article could almost be lifted and inserted into Almaz-Antey's sales material, plus a couple of Vitaly's pictures. One para from it

As one senior U.S. Marine Corps aviator told me earlier in the year, the S-300 series is a deadly threat to everything except the most advanced stealth fighters and bombers. “A complete game changer for all fourth-gen aircraft [like the F-15, F-16 and F/A-18]. That thing is a beast and you don’t want to get near it,” he said.

http://warisboring.com/articles/russias-lethal-s-400-missile-goes-global/comment-page-1/#comment-20087

First S-400 then Putin "let them fly" then

According to Reuters, a spokesman with the US military’s European Command has confirmed that the US will withdraw 12 F-15 Eagles and Strike Eagle fighters from Turkey. The spokesman said that the aircraft had completed temporary deployment, despite having only been moved to Incirlik air base one month ago.

http://sputniknews.com/military/20151216/1031862104/us-jets-leave-turkey.html
http://www.ilgiornale.it/news/mondo/lamerica-scarica-ankara-ritirati-i-caccia-turchia-1205442.html





just a coincidence

1) How S-400 works against a target that is 300 km away ? Does it iluminate the target from the start or does it lunch the missile in its direction and never illuminate it and just uses detection radar ?

2)1)If it illuminate it or if the plane knows that there is a S-400 by analyzing the radar wave, the plane will know it and could easily evade it, no ? By flying low.

2)2) Same question but for semi actif missiles, a fighter evade a missiles by flying very low ? (missiles with 120-250 km range)

3) If the missiles are active radar homing, does it needs an illuminating radar (i know the answer is no but the system has an illuminating radar) ? Can the missiles in this case track a stealth plane ?

4) If your radar achieve to found a F-22, can any of the S-400 missiles attack it ?

5) BTW what's the minimal altitude the target has to have to be detected by S-400 at 300 km ? At 250km? 120 km?

A lot of questions, but we are here to ask questions

Isos wrote:1) How S-400 works against a target that is 300 km away ? Does it iluminate the target from the start or does it lunch the missile in its direction and never illuminate it and just uses detection radar ?

Depends on Target. If it is an airplane it is given by VVS and PVO command guidance and coordinates local S-400's and sub systems that a threat is comming from a specific direction and points it out for it so it can illuminate it with its own weapon lockon/guidance radar. If the target is Ballistic Missile it gets usually detected from very far range several thousand km if it is started from an aircraft (Cruise Missile) a formation of aircrafts that have targeted the country are observed and VHF/OHT radars provide enough information to VKS/PVO and VVS for interception and it is then triangulated by several ground and air based radars if possible and then S-400 the closest to it illuminates it itself or is given a different guidance solution.

Isos wrote:
2)1)If it illuminate it or if the plane knows that there is a S-400 by analyzing the radar wave, the plane will know it and could easily evade it, no ? By flying low.  

If a S-400 is painting you then there are at least 4 other based radars that have you spotted from far higher range and aircrafts are already in the air Su-27 and MiG-31M's. IT is not easy to just evade an SAM or its radars especially as soon you enter an enemies air space that is dominated by enemy airforce and PVO. It will end more or less like in the movie "Behind Enemy lines" except if the S-400 hits your aircraft there won't be any parachuting.

Isos wrote:
2)2) Same question but for semi actif missiles, a fighter evade a missiles by flying very low ? (missiles with 120-250 km range)

The missile of S-400 or from other Systems are never going to shoot at the furthest range they can manage to fly. There is a zone of Hitprobability they have to take into consideration. That zone is usually at 70-80% of the maximum range, not to mention official numbers of range of such tactical based SAM's and TABM's are never accurate. Anyways, flying very low would break guidance if it is far enough away, however such deep strike or deep penetration tactics are never started from high altitudes whatsoever.

Isos wrote:

3) If the missiles are active radar homing, does it needs an illuminating radar (i know the answer is no but the system has an illuminating radar) ? Can the missiles in this case track a stealth plane ?

Yes it does need an illuminating radar. Radars of such missiles are very small and limited by their Power to have enough range or resolution to detect VLO/LO objects even normal sized Aircrafts won't be dedacted by the missiles seeker untill they come in OLS range (IRST). So the big part of this answer is no they can not detect stealth planes unless that stealth plane is stupid enough to be illuminated by ground based radar along with other radar sources then the Missile has all information necessary to get close to the target and see it from short range itself.

Isos wrote:
4) If your radar achieve to found a F-22, can any of the S-400 missiles attack it ?

It is an airplane not an ICBM. If it can see it, it can shoot it.

Isos wrote:
5) BTW what's the minimal altitude the target has to have to be detected by S-400 at 300 km ? At 250km? 120 km?

A lot of questions, but we are here to ask questions  

Something like 4 km altitude was already above 120km detection range for small aircrafts Awacs are flying at roughly 10km and can be detected at maximum range.

Tanks for the answers.

But I need precisions about active radar homing missiles (3rd question).

Yes it does need an illuminating radar. Radars of such missiles are very small and limited by their Power to have enough range or resolution to detect VLO/LO objects even normal sized Aircrafts won't be dedacted by the missiles seeker untill they come in OLS range (IRST). So the big part of this answer is no they can not detect stealth planes unless that stealth plane is stupid enough to be illuminated by ground based radar along with other radar sources then the Missile has all information necessary to get close to the target and see it from short range itself.

You're saying that it needs illuminating radar. But if the missile has an active radar homing head it means that it is tracking a target by its own in the terminal phase. It uses ground radar just for mid corrections to give it an aproximative position (I'm not an expert but I don't think you need an illuminating radar for that, no ??) , otherwise it's a semi-actif missile.

So for stealth plane, according to what you said, they will more likely use semi-actif ??

Isos wrote:Tanks for the answers.

But I need precisions about active radar homing missiles (3rd question).

Yes it does need an illuminating radar. Radars of such missiles are very small and limited by their Power to have enough range or resolution to detect VLO/LO objects even normal sized Aircrafts won't be dedacted by the missiles seeker untill they come in OLS range (IRST). So the big part of this answer is no they can not detect stealth planes unless that stealth plane is stupid enough to be illuminated by ground based radar along with other radar sources then the Missile has all information necessary to get close to the target and see it from short range itself.

You're saying that it needs illuminating radar. But if the missile has an active radar homing head it means that it is tracking a target by its own in the terminal phase. It uses ground radar just for mid corrections to give it an aproximative position (I'm not an expert but I don't think you need an illuminating radar for that, no ??) , otherwise it's a semi-actif missile.

So for stealth plane, according to what you said, they will more likely use semi-actif ??

I am sorry if i can't give you right away precise numbers or guestimations i am not SOC.

The active radar homing heads for such missiles are only and exclusively used in terminal guidance but need through the entire course a ground based radar or AWACS to provide coordination to target and as soon its own radar can come in range and achieve a lockon it will operate only then as an active radar before that semi-active. IIRC that was not always the case.

Isos wrote:Tanks for the answers.

But I need precisions about active radar homing missiles (3rd question).

Yes it does need an illuminating radar. Radars of such missiles are very small and limited by their Power to have enough range or resolution to detect VLO/LO objects even normal sized Aircrafts won't be dedacted by the missiles seeker untill they come in OLS range (IRST). So the big part of this answer is no they can not detect stealth planes unless that stealth plane is stupid enough to be illuminated by ground based radar along with other radar sources then the Missile has all information necessary to get close to the target and see it from short range itself.

You're saying that it needs illuminating radar. But if the missile has an active radar homing head it means that it is tracking a target by its own in the terminal phase. It uses ground radar just for mid corrections to give it an aproximative position (I'm not an expert but I don't think you need an illuminating radar for that, no ??) , otherwise it's a semi-actif missile.

So for stealth plane, according to what you said, they will more likely use semi-actif ??

missiles can have mini radars.. s-400 have radars.. fixed radar stations can have longer range radars . At what minimum altitude an S-400 can hit?  last i saw was 5 meters above ground.
it all depends of how well you monitor the airspace.. if all you do is deploy an S-400 unit in one place and hope to target all at any altitude as far as 400km range ,then you a re doing something really wrong.  Because enemy can fly under the radar ..taking advantage of earth that is not flat. You need planes and awacs to improve the vision of radars ,specially at low altitudes of things that use mountains or elevated terrain as cover.



if you look at that image ,you will see there are areas that radars can't see.. when something very solid blocks the way.. either a mountain or the earth curvature at some long distance it blocks radars view on the ground. So this is why you need Radars at high altitude,ideally planes,
like awacs or hellicopters with radars or planes..



The smaller the radar the smaller the area it can see at the same time.
If you ever used binoculars ,that will be similar to the radars of missiles. it can only focus in a small area.. So you need a bigger Radar to tell the missile where to go ,and the missile use its own radar only when the plane is at visual distance in the final approach.

Stealth planes are not invisible ,they only have a lower radar signature. So what that means?
that if the S-400 can detect a plane at 600km.. something like an F-22 will only be detected using conventional radars at 100km to 200km. But this is only the case IF... you only had one S-400 system deployed in one place.. if you deploy Pantsirs defenses in the front line ,at the borders of any country.. they have ultra sensitive Heat sensors that stealth cannot hide..and it will provide location of any F-22 plane as soon it enters illegally your airpace and supply that information to the S-400 unit.. so that it can engage the stealth plane ,that usually see at 100km to 200km distance.. now will see it at any distance.

That said Stealth planes will lose its stealthiness is a zone heavily covered by many different
kinds of radars. deployed across a country. and no plane will be able to hide from radars if they are setup correctly across a whole territory and have the support of Air radars ,like Awacs or hellicopters etc.

This means that S-400s are far from the only dangerous weapon that Russian enemies needs to be worried. Things like Pantsirs are really deadly.. even more i will say. because they have a gatling gun ,that can't be jammed, you can't jam a bullet.. and pantsirs can operate with radars turned off and highly mobile , so you will only know where they are ,when they hit your plane.

So effectively S-400s works like a sniper rifle.. while pantsirs is like a mine. it will get you if your plane move to the wrong place where a pantsir is hiding and defending it.   Imagine you entering a minefield ,that you don't know where the mines are.. and at the same time a sniper is shooting at you. Not cool.. and indeed you will not go there if you knew the place was mined
with a sniper that you cant see either its position but that he can see you.

A really well defended airspace ,needs to combine long range with medium and short range defenses. it should have S-400s + Buks/Tors  + pantsirs. The only ones the enemy will know
the location are the S-400s..and they will be out of range of any enemy plane.. only cruise missiles could target long range places.. but they can be easily defeated by Pantsirs ,Gps jamming and other things. All said is not a piece of cake to defeat a zone well covered by S-400s. not even by stealth planes ,contrary to what you have heard.  And if you have a strong Airforce is even worse.. because the airforce will interrupt any enemy attempt to even try to break into your airspace.

The only effective way to defeat an S-400 is with boots on the ground..with paramilitary groups
undercovertly taking territory and getting to artillery distance to your air defenses. This is exactly why Russia is bombing any terrorist position in Syria latakia ,because they represent the biggest threat to S-400s.  They are not designed to operate withing artillery range of enemy positions.

It is also important to remember that S-400s are only useful if used. and you cannot measure
its real performance now in places like Syria.. because Russia is not a war with any nation . not yet. So Russia rules of engament allows foreign nations to get a bit close to S-400s positions. The real way to measure S-400s capabilities is in a full scale war and against a modern nation with modern air defenses and airforce. thats when Russia can really keep at distance any potential enemy plane ,beyond its range of combat.

Tanks for the answer Vann

In Syria.

Russia's S-400 to Be Equipped With High-Tech Communication System

The Russian air defense is developing Tuf-MA and Tuf-M2 communication systems for the new air defense missile systems S-400, S-500 and ‘Vityaz’
The new system will have the possibility of high-frequency tuning for electronic reconnaissance, equipping the defense missiles systems with a higher potential to evade enemy surveillance.

“The new S-400, S-500 and ‘Vityaz’ missiles will have the Tuf-MA and Tuf-M2 systems installed in them. This system will include a new modern design and digital signal processing systems that will decode signals and permit evading enemy,” the CEO of the United Instrument-Construction Corporation, Alexander Yakunin, told in an interview.According to him the new system, “uses phased array antennas with digital beamforming, high frequency tuning for the protection against electronic reconnaissance and interference.”

The United Instrument-Construction Corporation is a Russian state corporation, created in 2014 as part of the ‘Rostec’ corporation. Its aim is produce a high-tech manufacture of competitive products in the field of technology and communications systems, automated control systems, electronic warfare and robotic systems for the Armed Forces and other special groups, as well as competitive products for civil use

40N6 missile passed all state tests

Source: new missile capabilities fully implements the C-400

At the moment, completed new missile tests, told RIA Novosti source in the military-industrial complex. According to him, the missile will provide "the most a maximum range of defeat."

"Missile tests are completed. This will enable the rocket fully realize the potential of the system," - said the source.

Any information what constitutes one S-400 regiment , How many TEL's , How many Reloads , How many other supporting platforms like radars , C&C stuff etc

Austin wrote:Any information what constitutes one S-400 regiment , How many TEL's , How many Reloads , How many other supporting platforms like radars , C&C stuff etc

That highly depends on customer. Coz you can slave like 3-4 different radars to one command unit to increase detection range in various envelopes.

55K6E Command Post and 91N6E Big Bird acquisition radar + up to 6 92N6E Grave Stone engagement radars + up to 12 5P85TE2 TELs can be slaved to each. This basically means 1 whole "division" of 72 can be slaved to one command post, with up to 72 launchers, however unit composition is mostly on batallion lvl.

Command post + Acquisition radar + 2 Engagement radars + up to 16 TELs from what i can tell is most common practice.

And even then there is huge difference amoung what you might order, how many 5T58-2 transport vehicles per unit, how many additional acquision radars you want, which type, do you want to integrate Protivnik-GE or Nebo-M...list is literally huge.

But i belive most of Russian units consists of two batallions slaved to one command post.

"According to Russian defense industry, a new missile with a longer range specifically developed for Russia’s S-400 air defense system will push the range at which the system can engage targets to its limit. The S-400 is Russia's most advanced anti-aircraft defense system. A new missile with a longer range specifically developed for Russia’s S-400 air defense system will push the range at which the system can engage targets to its limit, a Russian military industry source said Sunday.

"Missile tests are about to be complete. This missile will allow to use the S-400 system to its full potential," the source told RIA Novosti, adding the air defense system will be able to engage targets at its maximal range. The missile is now undergoing the final tests, which are expected to conclude in the near future, according to the Russian Defense Ministry.

The S-400 is as an upgrade of the S-300 Growler family, designed and developed by the Russian Defence Comapny Almaz Antey. The S-400 is used to ensure air defense using long- and medium-range missiles that can hit aerial targets at ranges up to 400 kilometers. The S-400 is capable of hitting tactical and strategic aircraft as well as ballistic and cruise missiles. The system includes a set of radars, missile launchers and command posts. The S-400 Triumph uses the 9M96E and 9M96E2 missiles. The S-400 Triumph can also use the 48N6E missile of the S-300 PMU-1 system and 48N6E2 missiles of the S-300 PMU-2 Favorit system. The S-400 missile has a maximum range of 400 km and can hit all air targets wit high accuracy.

Russia has recently deployed S-400 air defense missile system in Syria to protected the Khmeimim airbase in Latakia. The airbase is protected by state-of-the-art air defense systems and radars. Khmeimim also has a fully operational unit for maintaining fixed- and rotor-wing aircraft and providing logistical assistance to pilots."

Source: http://www.armyrecognition.com/january_2016_global_defense_security_news_industry/russia_has_developed_a_new_missile_for_s-400_air_defense_system_with_a_longer_range_10301151.html

Militarov wrote:

Austin wrote:Any information what constitutes one S-400 regiment , How many TEL's , How many Reloads , How many other supporting platforms like radars , C&C stuff etc

That highly depends on customer. Coz you can slave like 3-4 different radars to one command unit to increase detection range in various envelopes.

55K6E Command Post and 91N6E Big Bird acquisition radar + up to 6 92N6E Grave Stone engagement radars + up to 12 5P85TE2 TELs can be slaved to each. This basically means 1 whole "division" of 72 can be slaved to one command post, with up to 72 launchers, however unit composition is mostly on batallion lvl.

Command post + Acquisition radar + 2 Engagement radars + up to 16 TELs from what i can tell is most common practice.

And even then there is huge difference amoung what you might order, how many 5T58-2 transport vehicles per unit, how many additional acquision radars you want, which type, do you want to integrate Protivnik-GE or Nebo-M...list is literally huge.

But i belive most of Russian units consists of two batallions slaved to one command post.

@Austin - not sure if you are asking for the theoretical units for India or what is at the Russian forces. In Russia there are 36 300/400 SAM regiments by my count. When a Regiment goes S-400, it's Command, Control & Communications along with it's Engagement and Acquisition Radars are upgraded to those mentioned by Militarov along with one of it's battalions converting to the S-400 missiles and TEL's. The other battalion(s) stay 300PM or 300PS. A regiment will have between 2-4 battalions with Radars plus CP's along with each having between 1-4 divisions (batteries) of 3-4 TEL's. A normal Regiment if such existed would be a regiment with 2 battalions of 2 divisions each or 16 TEL's plus the Radars. Support and service units attached to both Regiment and Battalions.

Another S-400 Regiment to Moscow. This article states this is the 4th Regiment which if correct clears up some confusion from last year.

http://tass.ru/en/defense/848264

franco wrote:Another S-400 Regiment to Moscow. This article states this is the 4th Regiment which if correct clears up some confusion from last year.

http://tass.ru/en/defense/848264

the 4th RGT at Moscow was already set up in March 2015 (549 RGT).
The confusion clears up when you consider the following:
The new "shadow Regiment" (which didn't count as a fifth RGT) around Moscow comes to sense when you consider that 3 (of the 4 RGT) had each two S-400 and one S-300PM (this is for 606, 210 and 93 RGT).
Only 549 RGT had just two batt of PM being completely replaced by S-400 in March/April.
But in the last quater they start replacing the three corresponding S-300PM batt of 606/210/93 (at least for 210 there is confirmation)! That makes a “complete regimental set” not in a separate RGT but one additional Batt in each of these 3 RGT.
So we stand (at the end of 2015) officially at 11 RGT but have included one more set that didn't officially count as RGT.

The article "forgott" to mentioned the (officially) 12th RGT (Vladivostok)...if this already happened and not only announced
http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20151125/1327872970.html

Cheers

franco wrote:

Militarov wrote:

Austin wrote:Any information what constitutes one S-400 regiment , How many TEL's , How many Reloads , How many other supporting platforms like radars , C&C stuff etc

That highly depends on customer. Coz you can slave like 3-4 different radars to one command unit to increase detection range in various envelopes.

55K6E Command Post and 91N6E Big Bird acquisition radar + up to 6 92N6E Grave Stone engagement radars + up to 12 5P85TE2 TELs can be slaved to each. This basically means 1 whole "division" of 72 can be slaved to one command post, with up to 72 launchers, however unit composition is mostly on batallion lvl.

Command post + Acquisition radar + 2 Engagement radars + up to 16 TELs from what i can tell is most common practice.

And even then there is huge difference amoung what you might order, how many 5T58-2 transport vehicles per unit, how many additional acquision radars you want, which type, do you want to integrate Protivnik-GE or Nebo-M...list is literally huge.

But i belive most of Russian units consists of two batallions slaved to one command post.

@Austin - not sure if you are asking for the theoretical units for India or what is at the Russian forces. In Russia there are 36 300/400 SAM regiments by my count. When a Regiment goes S-400, it's Command, Control & Communications along with it's Engagement and Acquisition Radars are upgraded to those mentioned by Militarov along with one of it's battalions converting to the S-400 missiles and TEL's. The other battalion(s) stay 300PM or 300PS. A regiment will have between 2-4 battalions with Radars plus CP's along with each having between 1-4 divisions (batteries) of 3-4 TEL's. A normal Regiment if such existed would be a regiment with 2 battalions of 2 divisions each or 16 TEL's plus the Radars. Support and service units attached to both Regiment and Battalions.

That would represent minimum requirements for a regiment. There is no need for a full war time deployments as of yet. New radar sets and command posta are esential however and several dozens per year are entering service annually. How many engagement radar set is available for counting Franco?
Besides one regiment of S-300/400 is never deployed on their own its always connected with separate command posts of the radar troops employing ECM/ECCM low/mid/high altitude radar sets, decoys and passive radar sets and command posts of the air defense aviation and their specific intelligence troops all connected togeather with other regimental sets into integrated Area defence system and on the even higher hierachy Zonal defence.

http://hr.rbth.com/news/2016/01/10/ruska-vojska-ce-do-kraja-godine-dobiti-jos-tri-kompleta-s-400_558067

Rbth in Croatian says that the latest S400 delivery is the part of the S-400 deliveries for 2016. It could easily be that production capabilities of Almaz Antey has considerably grown. It would also imply now 12 S-400 regiments.

According to this article, the new 400 regiment makes 4 for the Moscow area and the next 3 go to the Districts (unspecified)

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12073535@egNews

Russia's Eastern Military District will hold 10 large-scale air defense drills with Buk, S-400, S-300, Tor and other air defense systems in 2016, according to the Defense Ministry.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20160115/1033168496/russia-air-defense-units-drills-east-siberia.html#ixzz3xKErlUxV

Russia to Rearm 5 Air Defense Regiments With S-400 Missile Systems in 2016

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20160122/1033561437/s-400-russia-air-defense.html#ixzz3y1uF9ETy