French Navy: News

http://www.opex360.com/2019/06/03/la-fregate-francaise-languedoc-lancee-a-la-poursuite-dun-sous-marin-russe-surnomme-septembre-rouge/

French sailors of FREMM frigates got a patch showing that they tracked a russian Oscar 2 (probably off Syria).

Would be more impressed if it was a Yassen.

Isos wrote:http://www.opex360.com/2019/06/03/la-fregate-francaise-languedoc-lancee-a-la-poursuite-dun-sous-marin-russe-surnomme-septembre-rouge/

French sailors of FREMM frigates got a patch showing that they tracked a russian Oscar 2 (probably off Syria).

Would be more impressed if it was a Yassen.

Unless it was a 949AM, who cares.

AlfaT8 wrote:

Unless it was a 949AM, who cares.

If they can track our submarines for 25 days straight then I care. It makes them unable to conduct operations while they are being tracked.

Vladimir79 wrote:

AlfaT8 wrote:

Unless it was a 949AM, who cares.

If they can track our submarines for 25 days straight then I care.  It makes them unable to conduct operations while they are being tracked.

I can't read the whole story about the "25 days" it is not a free article.

They also write that US don't beleive them about that (so US couldn't do that) and I remember words of the admiral in chief of the french navy saying that they can secure a zone with ASW operation but not all the coast. It was back when a russian sub was near french coast.

Ships a generally lowder than subs so the subs can also know about the FREMM following him. With its 533mm and 650mm torpedoes it still has some advantages over the FREMM.

Anyway the hard part is to find the sub before he finds you. When not runing on diesel engines the fremm is a simple target.

Edit: I found the article https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.letelegramme.fr/_amp/078/12210078.php

It's writen like a book rather than an article. I would take the claims with a grain of salt or two.

FREMM: A master asset on the high seas

Subscribers article
Posted on 01/03/2019 by Vincent Groizeleau

The multi-mission frigates are the spearhead of the Navy against the rise of threats. Reportage in the Mediterranean aboard La Provence, on the eve of its operational deployment with the carrier group.

On the instructions of the shift leader, the helmsman maneuvers his joystick. Insensibly, Provence is positioned a thousand meters from Charles de Gaulle, in his rear three-quarter. The tall silhouette of the aircraft carrier is part of the canopy of the bridge. Clearly the Rafale ready on their catapults. Abruptly, the reactors scream. Top off. In a few minutes, the mastodon drops a deck of four hunters.


A short distance from the Charles-de-Gaulle, Provence is ready to intervene in the event of a crash Rafale catapult ( MERIADEC RAFFRAY)

In addition to the Dauphin helicopter which assures since the carrier mission Pedro, in case of crash, the multi-mission frigate (FREMM) would have been diverted to recover the pilot: "We train regularly to this procedure always delicate in open sea, especially in rough weather, "explains Pasha, Captain Julien Duthu. He took command at Toulon this summer. After an early career in the Atlantic, Provence joined Languedoc and Auvergne.
Specialized in anti-submarine warfare but designed to be versatile, FREMMs are in great demand to cope with the growing threats offshore. In Brest, Aquitaine and Brittany operate. In the process of completion, Normandy will join them this year. By 2022, two more units (Alsace and Lorraine) are expected, with increased capabilities in air defense.

A signal sent to belligerents

The Rafales are heading south in search of "hostile" ships. They are simulated by pawns of the real naval armada that crosses north of Corsica that day. On the horizon, the sun is declining. In the corridors, the red lamps light up, marking the passage to the night. Most of the 108 sailors live confined within the superstructures. On this building of 142 meters displacing 6000 tons, the openings are almost non-existent, stealth obliges. Radar, infrared, acoustic, magnetic: "the footprint" of the FREMM is limited. Its gas turbine gives it the power of acceleration and the speed required to follow the aircraft carrier, while its propulsion in diesel-electric mode guarantees its discretion and autonomy. In case of crisis, it takes less than three days from Toulon to reach the eastern Mediterranean to inform the staff through its sensors. Its only presence is a signal sent to belligerents: it carries 16 cruise missiles capable of striking ground targets at 1000 kilometers. It can also track a Russian submarine from the North Atlantic to Gibraltar for 25 days without a break: "Believe me, when a commander realizes he is constantly being followed, the pressure changes sides," smiles on Commander of Provence.


Trailed Sonar Captas 4 ( SEA AND MARINE - VINCENT GROIZELEAU)

Americans "incredulous"

At the back, a bell rings. It announces the opening of the hatch at the water's edge that masks the building's main asset against the submarines: its sonar Captas 4. Suspended by a mechanical arm extended by a coil containing 2 kilometers of cable, this condensed miniaturized technology has been developed by Thales. Towed at varying depths depending on the conditions of temperature, pressure and salinity of the water, the module painted in yellow produces miracles. "Incredulous, our American partners demanded to check our parameters," says Lieutenant-Commander Pauline, an officer in charge of anti-submarine warfare. At Central Operations, four screens are assigned to this "domain". On one of them, the traces of the mechanical noise picked up by the two sonars of the building are displayed in green, which also has an integrated antenna at its bow. An operator continues to listen to sounds: it is the crossroads of technique and experience that produce the best results. If necessary, the Cayman helicopter parked on the back beach takes off to raise a doubt or refine a contact using its own sensors. Astonishingly stable, the aircraft can fly hours in heavy weather.


Trapped Sonar Captas 4 ( NATIONAL MARINE - LISA BESSODES)


The FREMM Provence escorting Charles de Gaulle ( NATIONAL MARINE - YOANN LETOURNEAU)

"A bubble around the aircraft carrier"

Another screen has a series of circles and dots of color. The pictogram materializes the tactical situation under water for the whole carrier group. Its update is the priority of Commander Duthu: "I best articulate all the sensors in the fleet to ensure a bubble around the aircraft carrier. I even use the eyes of lookouts on the bridge: statistically, their chances of locating a periscope are significant. In this war of attrition and wills, the FREMM imposed a new standard. Today, when we detect a submarine, we keep the initiative for a long time ... ", says the expert.

A report by Mériadec Raffray made in February during the FANAL exercise


The FREMM Languedoc ( NAVAL GROUP)

The multi-mission frigates are the result of a cooperative program led by France and Italy, each country having developed its own frigate design, but by pooling studies and equipment purchases.

Within the Navy, the FREMM will ensure the succession of nine anti-submarine and anti-aircraft frigates type F70, of which there will be more at the end of this year that three copies in service: FASM La Motte-Picquet and Latouche-Tréville operational since 1988/1990 and based in Brest, as well as FAA Jean Bart (1991) in Toulon.

Designed by Naval Group and carried out in Lorient, the FREMM are now five in service in the French fleet. These are Aquitaine, Provence, Languedoc, Auvergne and Brittany, respectively delivered in 2012, 2015, 2016, 2017 and 2018. Normandy, which will soon begin its sea trials, will be received by the French Navy in the course of the year. year for admission to active service in 2020. Follow Alsace and Lorraine, which must be completed in 2021 and 2022 for an ASA scheduled by 2023.

In the long term, four FREMMs will be based in Brest and four others in Toulon.

142 meters long, 20 meters wide and 6,000 tonnes loaded, these new frigates are designed for all areas of combat, from submarine hunt to anti-ship battles, to air defense, long-range strikes against land targets, intelligence missions and special force projection.


MdCN shot from Aquitaine ( MARINE NATIONALE - L. BERNARDIN)

The first six can implement 16 naval cruise missiles (MdCN), 16 surface-to-air missiles Aster 15 (Brittany and Normandy with longer vertical launchers to be able to ship later Aster 30) and 8 Exocet MM40 Block3 anti-ship missiles. They also have a 76mm turret, two 20mm tele-operated guns and MU90 torpedo tubes. Capable of shipping a Caiman Marine (NH90) type helicopter, and in the future an SDAM (VSR 700) aerial drone, the FREMMs are equipped with powerful sensors, including a Herakles multifunction radar, a hull sonar and a trailer sonar. Captas 4. In addition, there are various means of electronic warfare, including two jammers, as well as anti-missile and anti-torpedo decoy launchers. These buildings are also able to


Vertical launchers for MdCN and Aster ( MER ET MARINE - FRANCIS JACQUOT)


Aster 15 missile firing from a FREMM ( NATIONAL MARINE)


Torpedo shot MU90 ( NATIONAL MARINE)


CO of a FREMM ( MARINE NATIONALE - PERRINE GUIOT)


Marine Caiman Helicopter ( MARINE NATIONALE - ALAIN MONOT)

Called FREMM DA, the last two units in the series, the Alsace and Lorraine, will have enhanced air defense capabilities to replace the FAA Cassard and Jean Bart, while completing the two great frigates air defense Forbin and Chevalier Paul. These FREMM DAs will not ship MdCN, but instead will have 16 additional surface-to-air missiles, a total of 32 Aster 15 and Aster 30. The base of their main mast will be thinner to minimize the masking effect for the Herakles radar, which will be more powerful than on the first six FREMMs. The combat system and the CO of Alsace and Lorraine will also be adapted to the air defense mission.  


FREMM DA ( NAVAL GROUP)

https://www.meretmarine.com/fr/content/fremm-un-atout-maitre-en-haute-mer

PapaDragon wrote:
If true then Russians might as well stop wasting money on Navy because if even French can own them like this then it's game over

Imagine trying to take on US Navy when you can't even deal with their French maids?

Ordering your people to operate ships under these conditions would be criminal negligence

They know very well how their subs fair against nato ships. If they are not speeding up with husky and use money on upgrading older ones means they are still very good.

First, French Rubis class is older than Akulas. They are also smaller which for a nuclear isn't really good as nuclear plant produce lot of noise and its size doesn't allow as much reduction noise solutions to be used as on russian subs.

Second, french technology is often better than US.

Finally, subs can always be tracked. You have no idea of what russian sonars are capable of. If a FREMM can track it from 20km away but the russian sub tracks her from 40km away the sub has the advantage, specially when armed with 600km cruise missiles... It's like f-35 stealth, if you put all the eggs in one basket don't be surprised if your system sucks. Oscars have 24 oniks that they can fire from 600km away and soon 72 oniks or Zirkon.

Tracking it when it patrols in the middle of the Med off Syria and tracking it when it want to attack a carrier (main job of that sub) are two different things.

French subs are very good but we have only 6 of them. 2 close to the carrier, 2 protecting mainland and 2 used to hunt the oscars which can fire from 600km away. That's a big research zone. Oscars have still the advantage against carriers. The number of freems is not better.

Tactics and improvements over time can compensate for shortcomings... for all we know the Russian sub might have been running with a noisemaker that is activated during peace time to make potential enemy forces relaxed about the threat they pose... something they could turn off when things got serious...

Doesn't promote a lot of confidence when they show a cardboard cut out instead of a 3D model of the ship in that photo...

PapaDragon wrote:
If true then Russians might as well stop wasting money on Navy because if even French can own them like this then it's game over

Imagine trying to take on US Navy when you can't even deal with their French maids?

Ordering your people to operate ships under these conditions would be criminal negligence

What on earth are you talking about? these frog ships are nothing special just your average nato brand cans of sewage.

How might I ask would one of these even scratch the paint of a gorshkov class? Their best bet would be to throw some particularly hard baggetes at the Russian ship because thoes 8 exocets shure as hell won't do anything.

The damned exocet is not even as good as the moskit!

You can slap a fancy label and high price tag on any old excrement but it will sill be excrement.

Oh well I guess in your mind up tp 16 oniks or zirkons is no match for baggetes and the cleaner coat of paint on the froggies ships will protect them against any conceivable hypersonic missiles for atleast the next million years.

It can also track a Russian submarine from the North Atlantic to Gibraltar for 25 days without a break: "Believe me, when a commander realizes he is constantly being followed, the pressure changes sides," smiles on Commander of Provence.

Being able to track a sub for 25 days is not ideal for that sub, but considering that sub is an Oscar II class sub with 72 Onyx anti ship missiles and in the near future could be armed with 72 Zircon hypersonic anti ship missiles I would have to ask how well protected that french ship was, and also whether that Russian sub detected that French vessel and the other ships operating with it.

If that Oscar II sub is ordered to sink the French fleet it could probably do it on its own... whether the french detect it or otherwise...

No disrespect to the French naval technology, I am sure it is probably very good... sounds like it is better than American stuff... but is it enough to make a significant difference?

In a conflict in Syria the presence of a French ship shadowing the Oscar II might lead it to be unable to launch Kalibr land attack cruise missiles against terrorist targets, but in WWIII, which is what it is designed and built for, as it detects French ships it is likely free to engage them and I suspect the French ships will be detecting missile launches beyond the horizon as the first suggestion the Russian sub is there.

US and French aircraft carriers conduct cross-deck exercises

https://usa-newnews.com/new-news/us-and-french-aircraft-carriers-swapped-fighters-during-an-exercise-in-the-mediterranean/