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Besides, according to a high-ranking official, experts of appropriate agencies "are developing design of a new 5-generation SSN and a new destroyer";
Α new SSN? Will that be useful to have 2 types? Unless is a cheaper solution
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Project 885: Yasen class
George1- Posts : 18513
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Α new SSN? Will that be useful to have 2 types? Unless is a cheaper solution
Austin- Posts : 7617
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Join date : 2010-05-08
Location : India
The 5th gen SSN is a small ( 5000-6000T ) submarine to be built in numbers to replace Akula/Victor SSN
George1- Posts : 18513
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Before some years they talked for about 30 submarines. Then the number fell to 10. And now to 7. It is clear that they work on a cheaper project
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=12780
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=12780
George1- Posts : 18513
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TR1- Posts : 5435
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George1 wrote:Before some years they talked for about 30 submarines. Then the number fell to 10. And now to 7. It is clear that they work on a cheaper project
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=12780
There were never plans touted by actual Navy officials for 30 885s.
George1- Posts : 18513
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A new 5th generation nuclear submarine is on design i have read in some sources
George1- Posts : 18513
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Commission of SSGN Severodvinsk Postponed
Project 885 Yasen fourth-generation nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine (SSGN) Severodvinsk will be commissioned into Russian Navy not earlier than 2013 due to problems in nuclear powerplant, reports business newspaper Vzglyad referring to Interfax and an insider in Russian defense industry.
"It was found out at the trials of SSGN Severodvinsk that her nuclear powerplant did not produce required power. Moreover, the sub does not keep designed level of silence. The submarine with such serious defects cannot join the Navy", said the source of Interfax.
In addition, Dagdiesel Plant has not executed the contract for a new homing torpedo designed for Yasen-class submarines, said the interviewee. "So far, the new torpedo with required performance characteristics is not ready. The weapon they have made is dangerously explosive so cannot be used in submarines", explained the source. According to him, if production of the new torpedo continues protracting, Severodvinsk can be armed with torpedoes used by Kursk-type nuclear subs.
Russian deputy defense minister Alexander Sukhorukov told reporters on Aug 8 that "the sub is on trials in the White Sea, and then will head from shallow waters to the Barents Sea". He expressed confidence that the sub would finish trials in the current year, since "the manufacturer faces delay damages every day".
Project 885 Yasen lead sub SSGN Severodvinsk was put afloat on June 15, 2010 and started sea trials in Sept 2011.
The second submarine SSGN Kazan is being built under advanced Project 885M Yasen-M. At least 8 submarines of this class are supposed to join Russian Navy by 2020.
Submerged speed of the submarine must exceed 30 knots; test depth must be 600 meters. Endurance is 100 days; crew is 90 men (32 officers). SSGN Severodvinsk costs about RUR 47 bln.
Expectedly, noisiness level of Yasen-class subs would be comparable to that of America's Virginia-class submarines.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15626
Project 885 Yasen fourth-generation nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine (SSGN) Severodvinsk will be commissioned into Russian Navy not earlier than 2013 due to problems in nuclear powerplant, reports business newspaper Vzglyad referring to Interfax and an insider in Russian defense industry.
"It was found out at the trials of SSGN Severodvinsk that her nuclear powerplant did not produce required power. Moreover, the sub does not keep designed level of silence. The submarine with such serious defects cannot join the Navy", said the source of Interfax.
In addition, Dagdiesel Plant has not executed the contract for a new homing torpedo designed for Yasen-class submarines, said the interviewee. "So far, the new torpedo with required performance characteristics is not ready. The weapon they have made is dangerously explosive so cannot be used in submarines", explained the source. According to him, if production of the new torpedo continues protracting, Severodvinsk can be armed with torpedoes used by Kursk-type nuclear subs.
Russian deputy defense minister Alexander Sukhorukov told reporters on Aug 8 that "the sub is on trials in the White Sea, and then will head from shallow waters to the Barents Sea". He expressed confidence that the sub would finish trials in the current year, since "the manufacturer faces delay damages every day".
Project 885 Yasen lead sub SSGN Severodvinsk was put afloat on June 15, 2010 and started sea trials in Sept 2011.
The second submarine SSGN Kazan is being built under advanced Project 885M Yasen-M. At least 8 submarines of this class are supposed to join Russian Navy by 2020.
Submerged speed of the submarine must exceed 30 knots; test depth must be 600 meters. Endurance is 100 days; crew is 90 men (32 officers). SSGN Severodvinsk costs about RUR 47 bln.
Expectedly, noisiness level of Yasen-class subs would be comparable to that of America's Virginia-class submarines.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15626
TR1- Posts : 5435
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Join date : 2011-12-06
Yeah that industry source is.....interesting to say the least.
I wouldn't worry too much about this report.
I wouldn't worry too much about this report.
Austin- Posts : 7617
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Join date : 2010-05-08
Location : India
Pr 885 Yasen ( via balancer forum )
Yasen-1
Yasen-2
Yasen-3
Not sure what it says but looks interesting
Yasen-1
Yasen-2
Yasen-3
Not sure what it says but looks interesting
Austin- Posts : 7617
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Join date : 2010-05-08
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Submarine "Severodvinsk" equip cruise missiles "Calibre"
http://vpk-news.ru/news/2039/
http://vpk-news.ru/news/2039/
The bow shock nuclear-powered submarine (NPS) "Severodvinsk" Project 885 class "Ash" is armed with no analogues in the world of supersonic cruise missiles, "Caliber", the maximum flight range of more than 2.5 thousand kilometers, told reporters on Tuesday, a source in the defense industrial complex of Russia.
"The missile meets all the requirements of the Ministry of Defence of the Russian-range shooting accuracy, lethality and invulnerability effect during the flight to the target. Such a missile because of its unique performance characteristics of no one else in the world "- said the source.
According to him, a cruise missile, "Caliber" is a multivariate military equipment. "The rocket will carry the monoblock warhead. In the event that the warhead would be with conventional warheads, the maximum range missiles will be more than two and a half thousand kilometers. If the warhead is nuclear kiloton class, the range is reduced somewhat, "- said the source.
"Caliber" - a precision-guided weapons, its probable deviation from the target by firing thousands of kilometers does not exceed two or three feet, "- he stressed.
At the same time, the source confirmed the presence of a number of problems with nuclear power plant (NPP) submarine "Severodvinsk". "Indeed, there is a problem with high noise levels at work as a nuclear power, and energy transfer to the ship's propeller shaft, but this wine is not" Sevmash ", which built the submarine, and the power industry, which created a nuclear reactor. On the "Sevmash" simply put in for it meant the nuclear compartment.
Now it's energy, which should reduce the noise of the boat, "- said the source.
George1- Posts : 18513
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SSGN Severodvinsk to Obtain Caliber Cruise Missiles
Lead submarine of Project 885 Yasen, SSGN Severodvinsk will be armed with supersonic cruise missiles Caliber which have no analogs worldwide with flight range exceeding 2,500 km, a source in Russian defense industry told reporters on Tuesday.
"The missile meets all defense ministry's requirements regarding range, accuracy, destructive effect, and in-flight survivability. Because of unique performance characteristics, none country has such missile at the present time", pointed out the source.
As for the expert, Caliber cruise missiles can be armed differently. "The missile will carry one-piece warhead. If it is conventional, the missile's flight range would exceed 2,500 km. If the warhead is kiloton-class nuclear one, flight range would be shorter", specified the interviewee.
"Caliber is a high-precision weapon, its probable error is not more than two or three meters while flight range is thousands of kilometers", he stressed.
On the other hand, the expert confirmed there were some problems in the sub's nuclear powerplant. "Indeed, there is a problem of high noisiness both at work by nuclear powerplant and at power transmission to the screw. It's not the fault of Sevmash shipwrights; there were designers who developed the nuclear reactor. All what the shipyard did was only planting the reactor into appropriate compartment", the interviewee explained.
"And now the matter depends on power engineers. They will have to reduce the sub's noisiness", said the source.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15638
Lead submarine of Project 885 Yasen, SSGN Severodvinsk will be armed with supersonic cruise missiles Caliber which have no analogs worldwide with flight range exceeding 2,500 km, a source in Russian defense industry told reporters on Tuesday.
"The missile meets all defense ministry's requirements regarding range, accuracy, destructive effect, and in-flight survivability. Because of unique performance characteristics, none country has such missile at the present time", pointed out the source.
As for the expert, Caliber cruise missiles can be armed differently. "The missile will carry one-piece warhead. If it is conventional, the missile's flight range would exceed 2,500 km. If the warhead is kiloton-class nuclear one, flight range would be shorter", specified the interviewee.
"Caliber is a high-precision weapon, its probable error is not more than two or three meters while flight range is thousands of kilometers", he stressed.
On the other hand, the expert confirmed there were some problems in the sub's nuclear powerplant. "Indeed, there is a problem of high noisiness both at work by nuclear powerplant and at power transmission to the screw. It's not the fault of Sevmash shipwrights; there were designers who developed the nuclear reactor. All what the shipyard did was only planting the reactor into appropriate compartment", the interviewee explained.
"And now the matter depends on power engineers. They will have to reduce the sub's noisiness", said the source.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15638
George1- Posts : 18513
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Maybe they will put S-400F in nuclear subs lollllllllllll!!!!!!!!!!!
Austin- Posts : 7617
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Information about the failure Test submarine "Severodvinsk" is not true
MOSCOW, August 15. (ARMS-TASS). Reports of some media about the failure of tests of nuclear submarines with rocket-torpedoes (CARDS) Project 885 (code "Ash") "Severodvinsk" is not true, according to Itar-Tass the official representative of the United Shipbuilding Corporation (USC).
"Which appeared in some media allegations of serious deficiencies identified during the testing of nuclear submarine" Severodvinsk "4th generation are not baseless," - he said. "Submarine" Severodvinsk "successfully carries out factory performance trials in the White Sea in full accordance with the approved program", - noted the official.
As explained by the ITAR-TASS Head of state defense order, USC Vice-Admiral Anatoly helmets: "This test program is carried out strictly according to plan. In 2011, there have been three successful release of" Severodvinsk "to the test in the sea, this year made two successful exit . currently preparing for a new submarine out to sea. "
Helmets also denied recent media reports about alleged problems with the nuclear submarine power plant. "As the testing of nuclear power plant the ship fully complies with specified performance characteristics, and this was confirmed during the test," - said the head of the Department of USC.
"Severodvinsk" in its architecture is a single-shaft polutorakorpusnoy boat with a reduced level of the acoustic field. Felling has streamlined
an oval shape, which is a pop-up camera on the entire crew. Rugged (PC) is divided into nine compartments. For the first time in the practice of the Russian ship torpedo tubes are not located in the nose compartment and behind the central post. This led to a complete release of the nasal tip to accommodate the antennas of the new sonar system. To use the vertical missile launchers, placed in a PC similar to the subs and torpedo tubes.
To reduce the noise provided by widespread use of sound insulation and cushioning for the foundation of all the mechanisms, sound-absorbing coating, etc. According to experts, polutorakorpusnaya architecture will also greatly improve the reserve.
GarryB- Posts : 40492
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Maybe they will put S-400F in nuclear subs lollllllllllll!!!!!!!!!!!
Actually a more interesting idea would be Morfei in conventional and nuclear subs.
The main problem would be short range but a solid rocket booster should solve that problem.
The Morfei is a unified short range IIR guided missile with lock on after launch capability. It will be a small highly manouverable missile that will be used as a short range self defence missile for aircraft, a short range defence missile for ground forces, and potentially a CIWS missile for the Navy.
Basically it is designed to be launched before it has even seen its target with only a general idea of the direction and type of target it is looking for.
It has an imaging IR seeker, so unlike old IR guided AAMs that see points of heat to lock on to, this missile creates an image of the target like with a thermal imaging sight which can be transmitted back to the launch platform so the operator can select a part of the target to hit. The missile itself will have a 3D image database of IR images of targets, so if in flight it sees in its very wide field of view two F-16s and an F-22 then it will select the F-22 as the greatest threat and engage it.
The IR sensor is passive and can be run from launch to entering the enemy space.
It should be able to engage incoming missiles as well, so for a Sub it could be used to shoot down incoming ASROC type weapons, or maritime patrol aircraft or ASW helos would also be a priority target.
In naval use it would be very much like Sea Ram, though of course unlike Sea Ram it would be standardised for the navy, air force, and army, and likely aerospace defence force. If it is similar in size and shape to the TOR missile it would be interesting to add it to the TOR system where it would be totally fire and forget, though more expensive than the standard command guided TOR missiles.
The QWIP based IIR sensors required to make it work will start out expensive like AESA modules but over time will become quite cheap.
Austin- Posts : 7617
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Just Came across this
So to give a general idea what this would mean
Noise of submarine K-284 ( Akula-1 ) was 12-15 dB or 4-4.5 times lower than the noise of pr.671RTM VICTOR-III
Noise submarine K-335 ( Akula-3/Gepard ) was below the noise level of K-284 (Akula-1 ) by 3.5 times
So i believe they are talking of Borei class SSBN being 5 times less noisy than an Akula-2 or could be Akula-1.
If its Akula-1 then borei class is roughly 2 times less noisy than an Akula-2/Gepard and 5 times less noisy than Akula-1 , Oscar-2
So to give a general idea what this would mean
Noise of submarine K-284 ( Akula-1 ) was 12-15 dB or 4-4.5 times lower than the noise of pr.671RTM VICTOR-III
Noise submarine K-335 ( Akula-3/Gepard ) was below the noise level of K-284 (Akula-1 ) by 3.5 times
So i believe they are talking of Borei class SSBN being 5 times less noisy than an Akula-2 or could be Akula-1.
If its Akula-1 then borei class is roughly 2 times less noisy than an Akula-2/Gepard and 5 times less noisy than Akula-1 , Oscar-2
Last edited by Austin on Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:07 am; edited 1 time in total
George1- Posts : 18513
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What about the 4 Graney's that have been ordered. When will they be laid down?
TR1- Posts : 5435
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George1 wrote:What about the 4 Graney's that have been ordered. When will they be laid down?
You mean Yasan?
3rd one is supposed to be laid down this year.
TR1- Posts : 5435
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- Post n°93
What about the 4 Graney's that have been ordered. When will they be laid down?
TR1 Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:20 am
http://balancer.ru/sites/s/5/s51.radikal.ru/i131/1208/f8/12c27a67925b.jpg
http://s006.radikal.ru/i215/1208/e3/c7b21ba96832.jpg
The beast moves in.
http://s006.radikal.ru/i215/1208/e3/c7b21ba96832.jpg
The beast moves in.
George1- Posts : 18513
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Navy Commander: SSGN Severodvinsk to Hoist Naval Ensign This Year
Fourth-generation Project 885 Yasen nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine (SSGN) Severodvinsk will be commissioned into Russian Navy by the end of the current year, Admiral Viktor Chirkov, Russian Navy Commander-in-Chief told Central Navy Portal today.
"Trials of Yasen project are held up to schedule. Hopefully, Russian naval ensign will be hoisted on Severodvinsk by the year end", Chirkov said.
As was earlier reported, SSGN Severodvinsk could join the Navy not earlier than 2013 due to problems in nuclear powerplant. According to a source of Interfax, "it was found out at the trials of SSGN Severodvinsk that her nuclear powerplant did not produce required power. Moreover, the sub does not keep designed level of silence. The submarine with such serious defects cannot join the Navy".
However, as early as Aug 15 an official representative of JSC United Shipbuilding Corporation refuted media reports about failed trials of Severodvinsk.
"Yasen-class submarine Severodvinsk is effectively undergoing shipyard's sea trials in the White Sea in accordance with predetermined schedule", said the USC spokesman then.
Project 885 Yasen lead sub SSGN Severodvinsk was put afloat on June 15, 2010 and started sea trials in Sept 2011.
The second submarine SSGN Kazan is being built under advanced Project 885M Yasen-M. At least 8 submarines of this class are supposed to join Russian Navy by 2020.
Submerged speed of the submarine must exceed 30 knots; test depth must be 600 meters. Endurance is 100 days; crew is 90 men (32 officers). SSGN Severodvinsk costs about RUR 47 bln.
Expectedly, noisiness level of Yasen-class subs would be comparable to that of America's Virginia-class submarines.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15686
Fourth-generation Project 885 Yasen nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine (SSGN) Severodvinsk will be commissioned into Russian Navy by the end of the current year, Admiral Viktor Chirkov, Russian Navy Commander-in-Chief told Central Navy Portal today.
"Trials of Yasen project are held up to schedule. Hopefully, Russian naval ensign will be hoisted on Severodvinsk by the year end", Chirkov said.
As was earlier reported, SSGN Severodvinsk could join the Navy not earlier than 2013 due to problems in nuclear powerplant. According to a source of Interfax, "it was found out at the trials of SSGN Severodvinsk that her nuclear powerplant did not produce required power. Moreover, the sub does not keep designed level of silence. The submarine with such serious defects cannot join the Navy".
However, as early as Aug 15 an official representative of JSC United Shipbuilding Corporation refuted media reports about failed trials of Severodvinsk.
"Yasen-class submarine Severodvinsk is effectively undergoing shipyard's sea trials in the White Sea in accordance with predetermined schedule", said the USC spokesman then.
Project 885 Yasen lead sub SSGN Severodvinsk was put afloat on June 15, 2010 and started sea trials in Sept 2011.
The second submarine SSGN Kazan is being built under advanced Project 885M Yasen-M. At least 8 submarines of this class are supposed to join Russian Navy by 2020.
Submerged speed of the submarine must exceed 30 knots; test depth must be 600 meters. Endurance is 100 days; crew is 90 men (32 officers). SSGN Severodvinsk costs about RUR 47 bln.
Expectedly, noisiness level of Yasen-class subs would be comparable to that of America's Virginia-class submarines.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15686
Austin- Posts : 7617
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I hope they dont stop at 8 and keep developing advanced variant of yasen in the next decade.
Like the Americans are developing Virginia in block 1 2 3 and will make 30 of these , it reduces the cost and makes logistics easier.
Yasen is more powerful than virginia and acoustically as quiter if not more.
So better to make use of existing production line and churn it out faster
Like the Americans are developing Virginia in block 1 2 3 and will make 30 of these , it reduces the cost and makes logistics easier.
Yasen is more powerful than virginia and acoustically as quiter if not more.
So better to make use of existing production line and churn it out faster
GarryB- Posts : 40492
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I suspect at 2020 approaches they will re-evaluate the class performance and costs and decide whether they want to continue production or go for a cheaper model.
Austin- Posts : 7617
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The problem is there is no such thing as cheaper model subs , if they develop a new 5th gen sub which are smaller says 6000 T then the initial investement is always higher.
If they continue developing Yasen then they can keep adding technology to it and due to long production cycle and numbers they will make the subs cheaper and can churn out faster.
I think at some point of time the Russian Navy will seriously think about it , USN has taken similar approach and are building Virginia subs in many block version as it advances into program keeping it competitive and making it cheaper.
Infact Virginia subs are said to be the only naval program where there has been no cost or time over runs and is considered the best managed project of all USN program
If they continue developing Yasen then they can keep adding technology to it and due to long production cycle and numbers they will make the subs cheaper and can churn out faster.
I think at some point of time the Russian Navy will seriously think about it , USN has taken similar approach and are building Virginia subs in many block version as it advances into program keeping it competitive and making it cheaper.
Infact Virginia subs are said to be the only naval program where there has been no cost or time over runs and is considered the best managed project of all USN program
George1- Posts : 18513
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Russia Arms Yasen-Class Sub Severodvinsk with Caliber Supersonic Missiles
Project 885 Yasen nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine (SSGN) Severodvinsk will be armed with Caliber supersonic cruise missiles. With flight range exceeding 2,500 km, the Caliber missile has no analogs worldwide.
The missile meets all specifications of Russian Defense Ministry as of range, accuracy, destructive effect, and in-flight survivability. No other country operates a missile with similar performance characteristics at the present time. Caliber cruise missile can be armed differently and carries a one-piece warhead.
If the warhead is conventional, the missile's flight range would exceed 2,500 km. If it is kiloton-class nuclear one, flight range would be shorter. Caliber is a high-precision weapon; its probable error is not more than two or three meters while flight range is thousands of kilometers. Export variant of the missile, 3M-14E Club is designed for engagement of land targets and has flight range of 300 km.
However, it was confirmed there are some problems in the submarine's nuclear powerplant. An insider in Russian defense industry said that "there is a problem of high noisiness both in nuclear powerplant and at power transmission to the screw. It's not the fault of Sevmash shipwrights; there were designers who developed the nuclear reactor. All what the shipyard did was only planting the reactor into appropriate compartment. And now the matter depends on power engineers. They will have to reduce the sub's noisiness", the interviewee explained.
During the current trials of SSGN Severodvinsk, her nuclear powerplant will be tested at various operational modes. It is planned to insulate the powerplant's aggregates, put numerous new gaskets, replace bearings and metal. It is not the first time our submarines had such problems with noisiness during trials, but every time they were settled in one way or another. Experts say SSGN Severodvinsk will not be an exception, but they need time to eliminate all defects.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15727
Project 885 Yasen nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine (SSGN) Severodvinsk will be armed with Caliber supersonic cruise missiles. With flight range exceeding 2,500 km, the Caliber missile has no analogs worldwide.
The missile meets all specifications of Russian Defense Ministry as of range, accuracy, destructive effect, and in-flight survivability. No other country operates a missile with similar performance characteristics at the present time. Caliber cruise missile can be armed differently and carries a one-piece warhead.
If the warhead is conventional, the missile's flight range would exceed 2,500 km. If it is kiloton-class nuclear one, flight range would be shorter. Caliber is a high-precision weapon; its probable error is not more than two or three meters while flight range is thousands of kilometers. Export variant of the missile, 3M-14E Club is designed for engagement of land targets and has flight range of 300 km.
However, it was confirmed there are some problems in the submarine's nuclear powerplant. An insider in Russian defense industry said that "there is a problem of high noisiness both in nuclear powerplant and at power transmission to the screw. It's not the fault of Sevmash shipwrights; there were designers who developed the nuclear reactor. All what the shipyard did was only planting the reactor into appropriate compartment. And now the matter depends on power engineers. They will have to reduce the sub's noisiness", the interviewee explained.
During the current trials of SSGN Severodvinsk, her nuclear powerplant will be tested at various operational modes. It is planned to insulate the powerplant's aggregates, put numerous new gaskets, replace bearings and metal. It is not the first time our submarines had such problems with noisiness during trials, but every time they were settled in one way or another. Experts say SSGN Severodvinsk will not be an exception, but they need time to eliminate all defects.
http://rusnavy.com/news/navy/index.php?ELEMENT_ID=15727
Austin- Posts : 7617
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From link below
http://www.isn.ethz.ch/isn/Security-Watch/Articles/Detail/?lng=en&id=150713
This should make it 40 Kalbir or 32 Oniks or a mix of both
http://www.isn.ethz.ch/isn/Security-Watch/Articles/Detail/?lng=en&id=150713
In late 2012 the navy expects the commissioning of the K-329 Severodvinsk. This lead vessel of the Project 885 is considered to be of the fourth generation. The K-329 is outfitted with eight vertical SM-346 silos (10m-long, diameter 2m) each capable of housing either four Onix or five Caliber missile containers.
This should make it 40 Kalbir or 32 Oniks or a mix of both
GarryB- Posts : 40492
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That is pretty impressive for an attack sub.
Keep in mind that If they choose Kalibre that means the subsonic all the way or subsonic and then supersonic in land attack or anti ship, or the anti sub torpedo delivery rocket.
That is pretty flexible.
Keep in mind that If they choose Kalibre that means the subsonic all the way or subsonic and then supersonic in land attack or anti ship, or the anti sub torpedo delivery rocket.
That is pretty flexible.