S-300/400/500 News [Russian Strategic Air Defense] #2

Vann7 wrote:

Little old , but good..

Enemies will not be able to listen in on Russia’s new S-500 system

Russia’s new S-500 long-range surface-to-air missile system will have new radio communications systems that are unrivaled in terms of quality, data transmission distance and stealth, according to its developers.

"Currently, the corporation is developing the next, sixth-generation radio communications resources for completing the various types of military technology, including air-to-surface missile systems – those already present in the armed forces and those that will be in the future," said a representative of the Russian defense industry, noting that the future S-500 surface-to-air missile system is one of them.

The source explained that the radio stations of the previous generation worked on frequencies that had been established earlier, something that increased the possibility of the transmitted information being tracked and intercepted. In future systems it will be impossible for such situations to occur.

http://rbth.com/defence/2016/04/07/enemies-will-not-be-able-to-listen-in-on-russias-new-s-500-system_582867

They migrating to SDR - Software Defined Radio.

It is thereason why I smile allways when someone saying that the AESA radards are hard to detect due to frequency hopping

The amateurs hunting for frequency hopping AESA radards with RTL-SDR dongles , cost five pounds each ( it work only up to 2.2 GHz without modification, and the modification can push ip the cost to 50 pounds )

So we have now 3 Hypersonic missile for S-300V4 

9M83M - 130km
9M82M - 200 km
9M82MD - 400 km

for the first time we have confirmation of the St.Petersburg S-400 deployment with the 500th AD RGT
https://www.terraserver.com/view?utf8=%E2%9C%93&search_text=59.896431+29.438025&searchLat=&searchLng=
clearly S-400 with (only) 6 TELs 5P85S2 replacing some 24 S-300PM!

rambo54 wrote:for the first time we have confirmation of the St.Petersburg S-400 deployment with the 500th AD RGT
https://www.terraserver.com/view?utf8=%E2%9C%93&search_text=59.896431+29.438025&searchLat=&searchLng=
clearly S-400 with (only) 6 TELs 5P85S2 replacing some 24 S-300PM!

Seems to be the new TO&E for the S-400 and the S-300PMU. Can't wait until the S-350 starts arriving and see how they are deployed.

Does anyone have the co-ordinates of the S-300PM battalion posted up on one of the Northern Islands?

Has anybody found pictures of S-500 from Army 2016?

Flanky wrote:Has anybody found pictures of S-500 from Army 2016?

A friend of mine was there and told me that NO S-500 was presented at Kubinka this year

Does someone know how effective the S400 and S500 actually is, say vs some F22s trying to attack and destroy them?

How many planes would be needed to saturate one S400 battery?
WHat is the kill probability against 2,4 or whatever F22s.

Its always said that S400 makes an area a "no fly" zone. But is it that simple?
I know both anti aircraft systems are the best in the world and phenonmenal pieces of equipment, but I'd be interested to see how many are needed for specific activities. I mean what is the chance of them being jammed by enemies? How far out could they snuff out F22s etc?

Firebird wrote:Does someone know how effective the S400 and S500 actually is, say vs some F22s trying to attack and destroy them?

How many planes would be needed to saturate one S400 battery?
WHat is the kill probability against 2,4 or whatever F22s.

Its always said that S400 makes an area a "no fly" zone. But is it that simple?
I know both anti aircraft systems are the best in the world and phenonmenal pieces of equipment, but I'd be interested to see how many are needed for specific activities.  I mean what is the chance of them being jammed by enemies? How far out could they snuff out F22s etc?

F-22 without AWACS/JSTARS stand  no chance against S-400 simply because othervise it can not find it and when it opens its already  over .

Thats why mobility is important aspect of the Russian air defense doctrine.

Firebird wrote:Does someone know how effective the S400 and S500 actually is, say vs some F22s trying to attack and destroy them?

How many planes would be needed to saturate one S400 battery?
WHat is the kill probability against 2,4 or whatever F22s.

Its always said that S400 makes an area a "no fly" zone. But is it that simple?
I know both anti aircraft systems are the best in the world and phenonmenal pieces of equipment, but I'd be interested to see how many are needed for specific activities. I mean what is the chance of them being jammed by enemies? How far out could they snuff out F22s etc?

See I am not an expert on S-400. The S300V4 and S-500. They are area domination weapons.That means no U.S aircraft or missile can venture in the air space controlled by S-400.

Well let us S-400 uses some 5 types of tracking radar it even uses EW radar so as to not to expose its own radar .. it can track around 200 very small targets
upto 1000 kms away in all directions.

When US air force realized the true capabilities of S-400 they immediately signed partnershio deal to separate Syrian air space between U.S air force and VKS.

US air force was not afraid of su-30  or su-24 or su25.. what they were really shitting bricks was the lone component of S-400 sitting in hmeimein.It is officially recongnized that S-400 is a total area domination weapon.

There is also other side of this story.Russians were themselves skeptical of exposing S-400 true capabilities to U.S air force.
The US Air force would have conducted almost 100-200 strikes on syrian ground troops had it not been for s-400.

I would suggest S-400 is an no fly zone weapon .. but a catch is there it should not be exposed too much to the enemy.This is the general logic.
Another thing is the missiles .. all the provocations that US air force some how manged .. all those retreating aircraft could have been shot down by s-400. Over Iraq air space  over incirlick and also near Romania.

But that would MASSIVELY expose the extreme MACH NUMBERS(may be mach number 10 or evn possibly 2 dozen mach number or even more) of those missiles and how they get their targeting information.

We know that any missile flying over mach number 6 gets enveloped with air plasma(hot plasma). many othr forms of radiations.They are flying blind or sort off. Russia military industry (i dont know precisely the companies) but many companies have solved this problem (7 to 8 years ago).

The moral of the story .. dont expose S-400 and S-500 they have extremely high mach number missiles and long range.The information support to those missiles is also very classified.

That is the reason VKS is is pouring small aircraft and intelligence missions into syria so as to COMPENSATE for the lack of action of S-400.
s-400 /s-500 are weapons for high intensity conflict not for provocation warfare which turkey or may be the US air force is conducting because that will expose too much of S--400 attack systems.

Now yu are yourself seeing that Russia is able to maintain no fly zone over entire syria. This is because of awacsA-50 , IL38N ,TU-160M ground radar and other thermal imaging satellites that it has. It is continuously increasing su-34 , UAV, SU-35 , SU-33 which have very good thermal sights and all around observation capability. This is the way for no fly zone.Maximum airborne assets and do not expose S-400 specs.

Thats why what you said was correct .It is not that simple that S-400 is no fly zone weapon.

Russia to deploy S-400 air defense missile systems in Leningrad region

More:
http://tass.com/defense/901246

http://pvo.guns.ru/book/fakel/new_gen.htm

From comment section  http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/83980/

The day is near when the Russian Army will receive the first samples of the new brainchild of concern "Almaz-Antey" - anti-aircraft missile system S-500 system. At the same time, we continue to test other modern system S-350 "Vityaz", which will replace the air defense system S-300PS.


The new facility, which will occupy the top tier of layered single Russian air defense system will be able to fight with the targets at altitudes of about 200 kilometers. This means that C-500 will be able to hit the approaching supersonic aircraft, cruise and ballistic missiles of the enemy at a distance of 640 kilometers. The first regiment of new anti-aircraft missile systems to defend Moscow and central Russia.


It is expected that C-500 will be able to detect and simultaneously hit the 10 warheads of ballistic missiles flying at a speed of seven kilometers per second.


Meanwhile, Russian armed forces have conducted a mobile air defense systems and missile defense test C-350 "Vityaz". This new system will replace the older S-300PS and will complement the type of complexes "Buk-M3", C-300VM4, C-400 and C-500.
"Tests of anti-aircraft missile system S-350" Hero "continues - Gumennyy said. - The first launches were successful, the system has proved its performance and will be widely used to replace the anti-aircraft missile system S-300PS. "


Russian intend to link together the C-500 and other systems such as the C-400, C-300VM4, C-350 and the other, creating a single, integrated air defense network.


Some examples of these new systems so perfect that many US military leaders fear that even such stealth aircraft like the F-22, F-35 and B-2, will face challenges in overcoming them.

So S-500 missile will have range of 800 km ?

what does one make up of this write up ?

Could Russia Really Shoot Down an F-22, F-35 or B-2 Stealth Bomber in Syria?

Austin wrote:what does one make up of this write up ?

Could Russia Really Shoot Down an F-22, F-35 or B-2 Stealth Bomber in Syria?

I'm not sure if we would all survive long enough to hear the results. Besides that, yes the Russians could shoot down the stealth aircraft but at what rate of success is another question.

franco wrote:

Austin wrote:what does one make up of this write up ?

Could Russia Really Shoot Down an F-22, F-35 or B-2 Stealth Bomber in Syria?

I'm not sure if we would all survive long enough to hear the results. Besides that, yes the Russians could shoot down the stealth aircraft but at what rate of success is another question.

Well, in the article, they're basically saying "no," but they're obliged to say that. Won't know for sure till SHTF. Or, like you said, we probably won't find out even then; the staging areas from which the attacks were launched would come under attack themselves, etc. etc. The End.

Is russia planning to make medium or lang range IR missile system with lock on after lunch capabilty ? With low frequency radars and Russian defense structure it's a good defence against F-35/22. Specially to F-35 as it has a enormus IR signature.

Thanks for all your posts above re whether the S400 or 500 actually makes an area a "no fly zone".

Interestingly, just after the discussion one of the US journals was quoted in the Russian media, saying the US was "reviewing" its view of what constitutes a no fly zone for America eg re China or Russia.

Clearly the S400 and 500 are very potent instruments. This is why I think a supersonic transport plane (maybe a heavily converted Tu-160 type plane) would be ideal for something like a heavily modified S400.

____________
Its also interested to read about the future developments after the S-500. I read that Almaz Antey have looked at a 2 stage missile. Stage one flies to the vicinity of a target, and then fires off smaller missiles. Stage one can then fly away again. (I can't remember what happens after that - whether it would be reusable, or fire more mini-missiles?)

I also read that the designers reckon that after the S-500, they would be developing air launched missile systems. Perhaps that might mean planes hanging just outside American territorial waters to shoot down an ICBM in a nuclear event?

My own idea would be a land or air launched missile that could return to base. But rather than firing its own mini missiles it could get close to target and fire short range laser beams. Ofcourse thats a fair way from being operational though.

Lazy missile ^^

GarryB wrote:

Lazy missile ^^

I remember having a discussion some time ago about Rif-M... the naval version of this missile and how if it failed during launch what sort of problems it would create for the ship.

I seem to remember the person I was discussing it with suggested that a missile that was cold launched but failed to fire its rocket and accelerate off to the target would come crashing down and instantly burst into flames with the 150kg warhead setting off the other missiles in the vertical launch tubes and the front or rear of the ship being destroyed...

I don't think the warhead will explode, there are lot of securities in the missiles. However the engine can explode but it's not enough to damage a destroyer or cruiser as it's not so powerfull as a military warhead and the luncher are armourd.

There is the same issue with hot lunches, if the rocket failed to start and the missile activate it's radar and lasers and detect the structure of the luncher.