PAK DP prospective long-range interceptor

KomissarBojanchev wrote:I'm inclined to believe that the Mig-41 will be a much needed replacement  due to aformentioned long range patrol. But I also really hope that it will be agressively marketed. The  achievement of creating a manned hypersonic interceptor will be a massive matter of prestige that will discredit retarded American hypersonic drone vaporware.

A massive speed will also increase the flight speed and range of existing BVR missiles due to the aircraft's speed adding to the missile's, thus imrpoving the performance of Russian weaponry.

Is there any chance that the Mig-41 might use more than 2 engines?

What is the chance of it being a flying wing?

Also, i wonder why the russians can build mach 3+ capable engines since the 60s but cant build an equivalent to the F-22's engine. Is miniaturization the problem?

Is it possible that the Mig-41 will mount a cannon? Given that it will travel almost as fast as a 30mm shell there might be a danger of it hitting itself.

that hypothetical mig-41 will eat into pak-fa budget massively and less pak=fa units will be made.

wants and gets are 2 different things.

if we look at what opponents are fielding pak-fa is good enough for the task , and in more massive numbers you can have more dispersed units closer to each other, and actually better coverage.

we will see what will the pak-fa maximum speed be with new engines ,stealth is not a priority so it wont be a speed limiting factor in interceptor version of pak-fa.

I'm inclined to believe that the Mig-41 will be a much needed replacement due to aformentioned long range patrol. But I also really hope that it will be agressively marketed. The achievement of creating a manned hypersonic interceptor will be a massive matter of prestige that will discredit retarded American hypersonic drone vaporware.

A massive speed will also increase the flight speed and range of existing BVR missiles due to the aircraft's speed adding to the missile's, thus imrpoving the performance of Russian weaponry.

Is there any chance that the Mig-41 might use more than 2 engines?

What is the chance of it being a flying wing?

Also, i wonder why the russians can build mach 3+ capable engines since the 60s but cant build an equivalent to the F-22's engine. Is miniaturization the problem?

Is it possible that the Mig-41 will mount a cannon? Given that it will travel almost as fast as a 30mm shell there might be a danger of it hitting itself.

so it wont have stealth like pak-fa and it will be detected from long range ,then due to speed it will glow like a sun on the enemy irst ,and it will be made out of titanium so it will be very cheap Rolling Eyes Laughing No yeah talk about a tax payer milking program

magnumcromagnon wrote:As far as the Mig-41 goes, I think a reasonable amount of stealth can be done, but within reason. For example having a internal weapon bays could actually help both in reducing drag and RCS, and having retractable weapon pylons too. I also believe having engine intakes on top instead of on the bottom should allow more room for internal weapon bays. But at those speeds it doesn't matter if it's stealthy, it will glow like a hot-iron poker on IRST. I like the idea that it'll have large delta wings with many retractable pylons and internal weapon bays.

Rmf wrote:so it wont have stealth like pak-fa and it will be detected from long range ,then due to speed it will glow like a sun on the enemy irst ,and it will be made out of titanium so it will be very cheap yeah talk about a tax payer milking program

Pierre Sprey wrote:

Rmf wrote:so it wont have stealth like pak-fa and it will be detected from long range ,then due to speed it will glow like a sun on the enemy irst ,and it will be made out of titanium so it will be very cheap yeah talk about a tax payer milking program

This is typical thinking of the stealth absolutist orthodoxy who thinks that wars on paper always translate to wars in real life.

If its an interceptor that's protecting Russian airspace, I don't think stealth is useful.

It will also make for good theater for minor airspace violations. I look forward to seeing the fastest jet in the world scream onto the scene through a nato camcorder.

If its an interceptor that's protecting Russian airspace, I don't think stealth is useful.

Pierre Sprey wrote:

Rmf wrote:so it wont have stealth like pak-fa and it will be detected from long range ,then due to speed it will glow like a sun on the enemy irst ,and it will be made out of titanium so it will be very cheap yeah talk about a tax payer milking program

This is typical thinking of the stealth absolutist orthodoxy who thinks that wars on paper always translate to wars in real life.

If its an interceptor that's protecting Russian airspace, I don't think stealth is useful.

It will also make for good theater for minor airspace violations. I look forward to seeing the fastest jet in the world scream onto the scene through a nato camcorder.

Mindstorm wrote:
above all one where a limited employment of tactical nuclear warheads, purposely developed for this product, could render almost irrelevant dozen of years and several hundreds billion dollars of investement in aircraft production of almost any kind by part of most likely potential opponents and "force" a sudden de-escalation of the conflict.

GarryB wrote:

Rmf wrote:http://tass.ru/opinions/interviews/3957569
Потенциал же самого перехватчика далеко не исчерпан — до сих пор по ряду параметров он не превзойден. Если говорить о перспективах перехватчиков, то у головной компании "МиГ" и у нас есть предложения по созданию нового изделия, но решение о начале работ по этой теме пока не принято.
interview with yurij beli.
mig proposed new project but authorisation for starting work on that plane was not given.

The piece you quote says permission was not given for a replacement aircraft because there is scope to further improve the existing aircraft.

That makes sense for the next ten years but for the 20 years after that they will need a replacement so it would be logical for them to be working on something.

There is little chance we'll see a newly designed mig-31 successor enter service in the next 15 years. So all this is fun talk but it's sort of meaningless right now.

GarryB wrote:

There is little chance we'll see a newly designed mig-31 successor enter service in the next 15 years. So all this is fun talk but it's sort of meaningless right now.

Actually the potential for hypersonic threats means a successor for the MiG-31 is actually very likely in the next 15 years.

There is potential to improve the MiG-31 in terms of radar and engines and replacement of materials to make it lighter and cheaper to operate... it is mostly made of steel which is rather heavy, though necessary to deal with the temperatures this aircraft has to deal with.

The current work on supersonic combustion ramjets for missiles like Zircon which will reportedly enter service by 2020 suggests that experience with Scramjet technology has progressed to the point where new jet engines can be designed to allow higher speed to be achieved for the MiG... which was largely speed limited due to the engines it uses currently.

New heat resistant materials and new engines able to operate at higher flight speeds opens the door to much higher performance.

Pierre Sprey wrote:

GarryB wrote:

There is little chance we'll see a newly designed mig-31 successor enter service in the next 15 years. So all this is fun talk but it's sort of meaningless right now.

Actually the potential for hypersonic threats means a successor for the MiG-31 is actually very likely in the next 15 years.

There is potential to improve the MiG-31 in terms of radar and engines and replacement of materials to make it lighter and cheaper to operate... it is mostly made of steel which is rather heavy, though necessary to deal with the temperatures this aircraft has to deal with.

The current work on supersonic combustion ramjets for missiles like Zircon which will reportedly enter service by 2020 suggests that experience with Scramjet technology has progressed to the point where new jet engines can be designed to allow higher speed to be achieved for the MiG... which was largely speed limited due to the engines it uses currently.

New heat resistant materials and new engines able to operate at higher flight speeds opens the door to much higher performance.

higher speed and performance ? Its the fastest jet in service, in the world right now.

   

Rmf wrote:http://tass.ru/opinions/interviews/3957569
Потенциал же самого перехватчика далеко не исчерпан — до сих пор по ряду параметров он не превзойден. Если говорить о перспективах перехватчиков, то у головной компании "МиГ" и у нас есть предложения по созданию нового изделия, но решение о начале работ по этой теме пока не принято.
interview with yurij beli.
mig proposed new project but authorisation for starting work on that plane was not given.

GunshipDemocracy wrote:Dear Lads, looks like famous MiG-41 is PAK DP. I did not know what thread shall I report this news - pls advise.

http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20150812/1179112588.html

MOSCOW, Aug 12 — RIA Novosti, Yekaterina Spirovska, Alexander Nevar. Work on defining the shape of the radio-electronic complex of a promising aviation complex distant intercept (PAK DP), which will replace the MiG-31 began in "NIIP Tikhomirov", reported to journalists the General Director of the enterprise Yury Belyi.

Last year the Russian air force commander Colonel-General Viktor Bondarev said that Russia in 2017 will begin research work on the development of PAK DP. Readiness to participate in the development of the aircraft in February this year, said the RAC "MiG".
"Development system "Zaslon" of the fighter-interceptor MiG-31 has been a milestone for our Institute and became his "calling card". So, of course, we couldn't stay out of participation in the creation of new radio-electronic complex for PAK DP. Started research work on determination of appearance-based systems not only modernized "Zaslon", but for all of the latest developments, including "bars", "IRBIS", radio-electronic system for the PAK FA and others," said Belyi.

He noted that for the new interceptor should be developed on a modern basis and all other systems.

"If NIIP will be chosen by the developer of electronic industry, we will need to ensure communication with all onboard systems. We are also ready, have the necessary experience," added the CEO of the developer.

NIIP is a developer of systems management service (OMS) fighter aircraft, as well as the developer of anti-aircraft missile systems of medium-range air defense Ground forces, whose task is to protect against air attack. Currently the shareholders of "NIIP Tikhomirov" are "Concern PVO "Almaz-Antey" (56%) and "Concern radio-Electronic Technology" (44%), part of state Corporation Rostech.

GunshipDemocracy wrote:Well well next PAK DP news as of today...

http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20150812/1179366786.html

Commander videoconferencing: Interceptor future will not create before 2019

MOSCOW, August 12 - RIA Novosti. Development work on the development of perspective aviation complex long-range interception (PAK DP), which in the future will replace the MiG-31, will begin no earlier than 2019, told journalists on Wednesday VKS Commander Colonel-General Viktor Bondarev.

"Start of development work on the creation PAK DP planned no earlier than 2019. At the moment, the Russian Defense Ministry has successfully carried out the modernization of existing facilities interception - the MiG-31," - said Bondarev.

He noted that the timing of the ROC to build PAK DP does not affect the status of the park interceptors videoconferencing.

Last year, Bondarev reported that Russia in 2017 will begin research work on PAK DP. And earlier on Wednesday CEO NIIP VV Tikhomirov Yury White announced that the company has already begun work on the definition of the complex shape of electronic interceptor future.

Viktor wrote:What matters the most is that MiG-41 is in the pipeline  

Commander videoconferencing: Interceptor future will not create before 2019

KRET as always busy

In Russia, we started to create electronic systems for the PAK DP

Work on the creation of high-rise of a new generation of interceptors, which in the long term will replace the MiG-31, continues and not only in the RAC "MiG" said RNS General Designer - Vice-President for Innovation PJSC "United Aircraft Corporation" (UAC) Sergey Korotkov .

"Designers are working on this topic", - Korotkov said, when asked about the prospects for the creation of new high-altitude interceptor.

According to him, "the defense ministry said that such a plane is needed."

Korotkov noted that in this study involved not only the Corporation "MiG", which once produced the first Soviet aircraft 4th generation - the MiG-31, but also other KLA designers. "Every design office does not stop in its development, especially in those areas where it has the highest competence," - said general designer.

He did not talk about the future characteristics of the high-altitude fighters and their weapons, referring to the closeness of the topic.

Earlier it was reported that a high-altitude fighter-interceptor MiG-41 can be created in Russia, which will replace the MiG-31.

Svetlana Savitskaya told reporters that the program restoring the park tall interceptor MiG-31 in the composition of air and space forces will allow to leave them in battle formation at least 15 years. "These machines are at least 15 years will ensure our security of these machines without the North and the Far East are not protected by the safety One missile can not be solved.." - Savitskaya said.

MiG-31 - Soviet and Russian double supersonic interceptor long range. The aircraft was developed in the 1970s, it is the first Soviet fighter of the fourth generation. MiG-31 operated since 1981, only 519 units produced.