PAK DP prospective long-range interceptor

GarryB wrote:At events like MAKS people ask about programmes, so it is normal to give some answer, though it will have to be vague because most programmes are actually secret until declared not secret.

mnztr wrote:I do not like the idea of combining Sukhoi and MIG. These are two very distinct companies with very unique DNA and philosphies, both which have designed transformational aircraft. For Sukhoi I would say the SU-25 and SU-27 are the 2 iconic platforms. MIG acutally has a more storied history. In the jet age, mig 15, mig 21, mig-25, Mig 29 and Mig 31, all absolute icons of aviation.

Combining them will result in a loss of their uniqueness. Just like every US fighter is now LockMart ..kinda sounds like Walmart, lol.

dino00 wrote:

mnztr wrote:I do not like the idea of combining Sukhoi and MIG. These are two very distinct companies with very unique DNA and philosphies, both which have designed transformational aircraft. For Sukhoi I would say the SU-25 and SU-27 are the 2 iconic platforms. MIG acutally has a more storied history. In the jet age, mig 15, mig 21, mig-25, Mig 29 and Mig 31, all absolute icons of aviation.

Combining them will result in a loss of their uniqueness. Just like every US fighter is now LockMart ..kinda sounds like Walmart, lol.

The design bureau of Mig and Sukhoi will not merge, they will remain independent but sometimes work together, I think that's the best of both worlds.
Only the companies will merge, management etc etc.

Isos wrote:Why not ? It would speed up the creation of LMFS if sukhoi share with them the research work about stealth and weapon bay's aerodynamics for exemple.

They don't compete against each other as sukhoi makes bombers and multirole heavy jets and mig makes interceptors and lighter jets.

thegopnik wrote:Got some news from our distant cousins at eagle.forum.ru.

https://avia.pro/news/gibrid-miga-i-sushki-rossiyskiy-istrebitel-mig-41-budut-sozdavat-na-baze-su-57?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com

The Russian MiG-41 interceptor fighter will be built on the basis of the Su-57 fighter.

The information resource Avia.pro obtained information that the newest fighter-interceptor MiG-41, being developed by Russian aircraft manufacturers, is being created on the basis of the fifth generation Su-57 fighter. We are talking about the configuration of an aircraft with a modified airframe, since, according to the previously presented data, a combat aircraft will be able to reach speeds of more than 6100 km / h, and, obviously, the cruising speed of an interceptor fighter in this case will be about 2500-3000 km / h ., which, today, cannot be demonstrated by any other combat aircraft in the world.

Given the fact that we are talking about a fighter-interceptor, experts have suggested that the armament complex of this combat aircraft will be limited to perform specific tasks, in particular, we can talk about anti-satellite missiles, hypersonic interceptor missiles and, probably, hypersonic aircraft missile systems "Dagger" or their analogues.

Experts do not exclude that the design of the MiG-41 will be similar at the same time to the appearance of the Su-57, the appearance of the MiG-31, which this combat aircraft will have to replace in the near future.
Подробнее на: https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&pto=aue&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=ru&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://avia.pro/news/gibrid-miga-i-sushki-rossiyskiy-istrebitel-mig-41-budut-sozdavat-na-baze-su-57%3Futm_referrer%3Dhttps%253A%252F%252Fzen.yandex.com&usg=ALkJrhjBza9Lx3t68fws8bavr4kcgiiDYA

GarryB wrote:

Perhaps a super cruising Tu-160P... 45 tons would be a lot of AAMs carried internally...

The-thing-next-door wrote:

GarryB wrote:

Perhaps a super cruising Tu-160P... 45 tons would be a lot of AAMs carried internally...

So in essence a modern TU-128, could be interesting.

You could give it all round radar coverage ant it would be a terrifying opponent for the enemy, the AD firepower of a ship with the speed of a fighter.

So in essence a modern TU-128, could be interesting.

I'll go the opposite way: a MiG-31M derivative but with a better manoeuvrability (and supercruise).

GarryB wrote:

So in essence a modern TU-128, could be interesting.

With internal weapons carriage for improved flight speed and low drag...

I'll go the opposite way: a MiG-31M derivative but with a better manoeuvrability (and supercruise).

You mean take out of freezer and reheat in oven for 30 minutes...

The MiG-31 is already a slightly larger heavier MiG-25 with most of the stainless steel bits replaced with a bigger radar and extra crewman to work it and extra weapon positions in low drag belly locations and new engines.

I suspect this time it will be a clean sheet of paper design because Mach-4,2 is going to need something different.

Certainly a bigger aircraft would be useful but also more challenging.... it all comes do to the engines really... the normal problem with conventional jet engines is that as it accelerates the airflow through the engine has to be reduced... if those huge air intakes on the MiG-31 were open wide at top speed the volume of air going through the engine would choke it because of its speed... at top speed the intake constricts to reduce airflow volume and speed... but a scramjet design can open it up again and let lots of air through meaning a lot more power especially at high speed so a fighter sized aircraft at top speed will have the engines running at enormous energy ratings....  with a scramjet variation bypass turbofan...

It is going to be interesting... they now have supercomputers to test hundreds of designs a day... maybe something odd will work?

Firebird wrote:I think I can see how the Mig-41/Pak-DP might have similarities with the Su-57.
Remember when the Mig-31 and its predecessor were being developed, the USA thought it was a superfast fighter plane.
Its interesting to note, the Mig 31 and its Mig-25 predecessor also look a bit like the Mig-29 fighter's  predecessor ie the Mig-23. So I could imagine the Mig-41 as extremely fast, pretty stealthy but less manouverable than the Su-57.
I don't think every last ounce of stealth will be squeezed out of the Mig-41, mainly modern design and coatings etc.
I'd also expect the Mig-41 to be longer and heavier than the Su-57. More about extended fast speed, straight line speed, weapons carriage etc. Obviously its not planned for dogfighting etc!

kvs wrote:The claim that it will be some sort of derivative of the Su-57 is nonsensical.

magnumcromagnon wrote:1.) Consider the source: Aviapro is not respected.

2.) Why would a Sukhoi product (Su-57) be the base design of a MiG product (PAK-DP)?

thegopnik wrote:Got some news from our distant cousins at eagle.forum.ru.

https://avia.pro/news/gibrid-miga-i-sushki-rossiyskiy-istrebitel-mig-41-budut-sozdavat-na-baze-su-57?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com

The Russian MiG-41 interceptor fighter will be built on the basis of the Su-57 fighter.

The information resource Avia.pro obtained information that the newest fighter-interceptor MiG-41, being developed by Russian aircraft manufacturers, is being created on the basis of the fifth generation Su-57 fighter. We are talking about the configuration of an aircraft with a modified airframe, since, according to the previously presented data, a combat aircraft will be able to reach speeds of more than 6100 km / h, and, obviously, the cruising speed of an interceptor fighter in this case will be about 2500-3000 km / h ., which, today, cannot be demonstrated by any other combat aircraft in the world.

Given the fact that we are talking about a fighter-interceptor, experts have suggested that the armament complex of this combat aircraft will be limited to perform specific tasks, in particular, we can talk about anti-satellite missiles, hypersonic interceptor missiles and, probably, hypersonic aircraft missile systems "Dagger" or their analogues.

Experts do not exclude that the design of the MiG-41 will be similar at the same time to the appearance of the Su-57, the appearance of the MiG-31, which this combat aircraft will have to replace in the near future.
Подробнее на: https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&pto=aue&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=ru&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://avia.pro/news/gibrid-miga-i-sushki-rossiyskiy-istrebitel-mig-41-budut-sozdavat-na-baze-su-57%3Futm_referrer%3Dhttps%253A%252F%252Fzen.yandex.com&usg=ALkJrhjBza9Lx3t68fws8bavr4kcgiiDYA