Serbian Air Force Needs and Modernization

George1 wrote:Government of Serbia has signed a firm contract with a European group Airbus for the purchase of nine military Airbus H145M multipurpose helicopters.

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2353156.html

Contract is shared between Military and Police however

Militarov wrote:

George1 wrote:Government of Serbia has signed a firm contract with a European group Airbus for the purchase of nine military Airbus H145M multipurpose helicopters.

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2353156.html

Contract is shared between Military and Police however

pity there buying western stuff they should have bought Ansat and/or Ansat 2RC,

d_taddei2 wrote:

Militarov wrote:

George1 wrote:Government of Serbia has signed a firm contract with a European group Airbus for the purchase of nine military Airbus H145M multipurpose helicopters.

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2353156.html

Contract is shared between Military and Police however

pity there buying western stuff they should have bought Ansat and/or Ansat 2RC,

Well, if they ordered both medium and light helicopters from Russia that wouldnt look anything like politics Serbia is trying to lead, of so called military neutrality. So expect to see weapon systems from everywhere in Serbian inventory, like it after all was the case in Yugoslavia too. In my unit radars were of Soviet origin, yet majority of com equipment was Yugoslavian, French....US....

Its confirmed that Belarus will gift to Serbia 8 retired MiG-29s and two "batallions" of Buk air defence system. Cost of modernisation and overhaul will be later determined by joint formed military board.

Source: http://www.rts.rs/page/stories/ci/story/124/drustvo/2609703/sistem-buk-i-migovi-29-iz-belorusije-pregovara-se-o-s-300.html

This should on long run mean Serbia will have 18 MiG-29s on its disposal.

Militarov wrote:Its confirmed that Belarus will gift to Serbia 8 retired MiG-29s and two "batallions" of Buk air defence system. Cost of modernisation and overhaul will be later determined by joint formed military board.

Source: http://www.rts.rs/page/stories/ci/story/124/drustvo/2609703/sistem-buk-i-migovi-29-iz-belorusije-pregovara-se-o-s-300.html

This should on long run mean Serbia will have 18 MiG-29s on its disposal.

Ηere also says also Serbia expects to receive two divisions of Buk SAM system

In addition, in the future of Serbia in Minsk plans to buy air defense systems S-300V and S-300P and Belarusian military trucks and construction equipment.

According to Djordjevic, in May this year between the two countries will be conducted negotiations on the establishment of a joint defense body.

As explained by our blog known Serbian expert Svetozar Jokanovic, this deal is a lot of questions, and one of the top - where Serbia would find as many pilots and technicians for the new aircraft. According to him, the Belarusian MiG-29 (type 9-13), which will be transferred to Serbia, can be upgraded according to the standard MiG-29BM. In this connection, it is also interesting to note that the plans changed and in relation to those of the MiG-29, which were transferred to Serbia from Russia in 2016. Now the modernization of these aircraft will be held in Serbia on aircraft repair plant in Moma, but with the technical assistance of Russian specialists. This is a serious change in the views of the Ministry of Defence of Serbia, as originally repair and modernization have been carried out in Russia.

Regarding SAM Svetozar Jokanovic said that to date, finally it is unclear whether an appeal is made to Russia to send two divisions SAM "Buk-M1" or one battalion SAM "Buk-M2". In addition, it is possible that the Serbian side is negotiating with Russiay and Belarus regarding the purchase of S-300B / C-300PS of availability.

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2401422.html

George1 wrote:

Militarov wrote:Its confirmed that Belarus will gift to Serbia 8 retired MiG-29s and two "batallions" of Buk air defence system. Cost of modernisation and overhaul will be later determined by joint formed military board.

Source: http://www.rts.rs/page/stories/ci/story/124/drustvo/2609703/sistem-buk-i-migovi-29-iz-belorusije-pregovara-se-o-s-300.html

This should on long run mean Serbia will have 18 MiG-29s on its disposal.

Ηere also says also  Serbia expects to receive two divisions of Buk SAM system

In addition, in the future of Serbia in Minsk plans to buy air defense systems S-300V and S-300P and Belarusian military trucks and construction equipment.

According to Djordjevic, in May this year between the two countries will be conducted negotiations on the establishment of a joint defense body.

As explained by our blog known Serbian expert Svetozar Jokanovic, this deal is a lot of questions, and one of the top - where Serbia would find as many pilots and technicians for the new aircraft. According to him, the Belarusian MiG-29 (type 9-13), which will be transferred to Serbia, can be upgraded according to the standard MiG-29BM. In this connection, it is also interesting to note that the plans changed and in relation to those of the MiG-29, which were transferred to Serbia from Russia in 2016. Now the modernization of these aircraft will be held in Serbia on aircraft repair plant in Moma, but with the technical assistance of Russian specialists. This is a serious change in the views of the Ministry of Defence of Serbia, as originally repair and modernization have been carried out in Russia.

Regarding SAM Svetozar Jokanovic said that to date, finally it is unclear whether an appeal is made to Russia to send two divisions SAM "Buk-M1" or one battalion SAM "Buk-M2". In addition, it is possible that the Serbian side is negotiating with Russiay and Belarus regarding the purchase of S-300B / C-300PS of availability.

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2401422.html

Yes, two Buk batallions, which should mean two batteries, probably 12 launchers.

Isos wrote:Do they have enough money to operate all of them ? If not, better spend money on social project.

With current budget for the airforce? No. Those 3 Mig-29s that are flying atm booked flying hours of about half what MiG-29 is projected to do for a year.

George1 wrote:Serbian Defense Ministry to Receive Six MiG-29 Jets From Russia by May

Funny part is that they will be accepted by Moma Stanojlovic "AERONAUTICAL PLANT" for modernisation in cooperation with Russians. That is going to be fun. Took them 4 years to overhaul one MiG-21BiS.

Retarded if true, Serbian MoD allegedly claims they "99% decided to modernise J-22 Orao". If you wonder why retarded, its quite easy, last spares for this aircraft were produced 25 years ago, industrial base to restart such production do not exist. And our current cappacity to overhaul them, is more or less 1 per 3 years. Modernisation of such aircraft is beyond logic from basically every stance, especially taking in count fact its estimated we have 6 to 8 of them eligible for overhaul in total.

Brothers-in-Arms: Russia Helps Serbia to Modernize Its Air Force Fleet

Serbia with Moscow’s aid is set to modernize its air force fleet, though apart from relying on Russia’s MiG jet fighter aircraft it also depends on its own potential, which it accumulated since the time of Yugoslavia.

Currently, Serbia awaits the delivery of six Russian MiG-29s, which the country will receive on very preferential terms, as it will pay only for repairs and upgrades.

According to the Russian Defense Ministry, the cost will amount to 185 million euros.

The exact date of this delivery will be known only after the relevant documents are signed by Vladimir Putin and all the technical details are mutually agreed upon.

However, apart from relying on the delivery of Russian jets, Serbia has a few of its own aircraft that need to be modernized.

The light attack and training aircraft Galeb and the twin-engine, subsonic ground-attack and reconnaissance aircraft Soko J-22 Orao, known for being the first in the history of Yugoslav aviation to overcome the sound barrier, are set for some upgrades soon.

“We need to modernize Orao to support land units and as a means of distance fighting,” head of the defense technologies department at the Serbian Defense Ministry Major-General Dr. Bojan Zrnic told Sputnik in an interview.

He further said that since from a technical point of view the process of modernization of Galeb differs little from the modernization of Orao, the ministry is close to deciding on the fighter jets first.

According to the head, presently they are awaiting the final decision, as modernization of Orao will include the development of new types of air weapons operating on a principle of standoff.

The Orao aircraft was first produced in the 80s and ceased in 1992 but according to the major general it is still early to write it off completely.

“Experts came to a conclusion that the service life of the jet can be extended to up to 40 years and possibly for another eight years, so in that way Orao can serve up to 48 years,” Zrnic said.

He further added that the modernization of each aircraft can cost on average from 1 to 8 million euros depending on its condition.

An upgraded version of the Orao jet equipped with laser-guided bombs, modern air-to-surface and air-to-air missiles and new reconnaissance equipment was revealed in April 2016 at Serbian aerodrome Batajnica.

https://sputniknews.com/military/201703281052054880-russia-helps-serbia-modernize-air-force/

I hope all Serb MiG-29 fighters will be upgraded to MiG-29SM standard and becomming fully multirole, like Myanmar will do. MiG-29SM is also equipped with new data link and SATNAV.

Regarding J-22 Orao, I think Serbia could modernize them with Gefest SVP-24, what will give to J-22 SATNAV and new data link and will be compatible with MiG-29SM. They could also equipp them with SOLT-25 from Su-25SM3. I doubt Serbia have money for Solt-25, but SVP-24 would be excellent upgrade package and it is combat proven.

medo wrote:I hope all Serb MiG-29 fighters will be upgraded to MiG-29SM standard and becomming fully multirole, like Myanmar will do. MiG-29SM is also equipped with new data link and SATNAV.

Regarding J-22 Orao, I think Serbia could modernize them with Gefest SVP-24, what will give to J-22 SATNAV and new data link and will be compatible with MiG-29SM. They could also equipp them with SOLT-25 from Su-25SM3. I doubt Serbia have money for Solt-25, but SVP-24 would be excellent upgrade package and it is combat proven.

They are mentioning modernisation, however various sources claim different things, as there is another offer for Belarus MiGs. So modernisation standards are big unknown.

Regarding Orao, major issue is almost unexisting spare parts base for such long service time. There is no point in prolonging service life for something you cant keep flying.

Cockpit of Serbian MiG-29A (L-18). I would like to ask, if those MiGs went through any deeper modernization or they only change old radar screen with new MFD?

medo wrote:

Cockpit of Serbian MiG-29A (L-18). I would like to ask, if those MiGs went through any deeper modernization or they only change old radar screen with new MFD?

Just some cockpit layout changes, nothing remarkable or deep.

Militarov wrote:

medo wrote:I hope all Serb MiG-29 fighters will be upgraded to MiG-29SM standard and becomming fully multirole, like Myanmar will do. MiG-29SM is also equipped with new data link and SATNAV.

Regarding J-22 Orao, I think Serbia could modernize them with Gefest SVP-24, what will give to J-22 SATNAV and new data link and will be compatible with MiG-29SM. They could also equipp them with SOLT-25 from Su-25SM3. I doubt Serbia have money for Solt-25, but SVP-24 would be excellent upgrade package and it is combat proven.

They are mentioning modernisation, however various sources claim different things, as there is another offer for Belarus MiGs. So modernisation standards are big unknown.

Regarding Orao, major issue is almost unexisting spare parts base for such long service time. There is no point in prolonging service life for something you cant keep flying.

I agree with you the aircraft are getting old and lack of parts and cost to restart they would be better buying armed multirole Yak-130 than pursuing upgrades etc on Orao it would probably be cheaper and the Yak-130 will be in service in larger numbers for many years to come so no risk of parts shortage. I also doubt the comment made in the article "Experts came to a conclusion that the service life of the jet can be extended to up to 40 years and possibly for another eight years, so in that way Orao can serve up to 48 years,” i would highly doubt such an aircraft would last that long especially considering funding and parts and would such an aircraft be any good in 40yrs?

d_taddei2 wrote:

Militarov wrote:

medo wrote:I hope all Serb MiG-29 fighters will be upgraded to MiG-29SM standard and becomming fully multirole, like Myanmar will do. MiG-29SM is also equipped with new data link and SATNAV.

Regarding J-22 Orao, I think Serbia could modernize them with Gefest SVP-24, what will give to J-22 SATNAV and new data link and will be compatible with MiG-29SM. They could also equipp them with SOLT-25 from Su-25SM3. I doubt Serbia have money for Solt-25, but SVP-24 would be excellent upgrade package and it is combat proven.

They are mentioning modernisation, however various sources claim different things, as there is another offer for Belarus MiGs. So modernisation standards are big unknown.

Regarding Orao, major issue is almost unexisting spare parts base for such long service time. There is no point in prolonging service life for something you cant keep flying.

I agree with you the aircraft are getting old and lack of parts and cost to restart they would be better buying armed multirole Yak-130 than pursuing upgrades etc on Orao it would probably be cheaper and the Yak-130 will be in service in larger numbers for many years to come so no risk of parts shortage. I also doubt the comment made in the article "Experts came to a conclusion that the service life of the jet can be extended to up to 40 years and possibly for another eight years, so in that way Orao can serve up to 48 years,” i would highly doubt such an aircraft would last that long especially considering funding and parts and would such an aircraft be any good in 40yrs?

Well.. in theory you could keep them flying for another 10 years, however you would need to make many parts literally on order, many abroad in UK or France, or Romania as we dont have production capabilities anymore... absurd. Would cost millions and millions.

On other hand we dont have money for new aircraft either at this point. So yeah...

The first two MiG-29s from Russia arrived this evening in Serbia aboard an An-124, with 6 due to arrive by Friday and should be shown on Oct.20, this according to serbian media. Understandably the folks at mycity-military are extatic.
So any more details, what standards will they be, and what about the MiG-29s and Buks from Belarus, any news on that front?
(tbh i was expecting the traitorous american puppets in neighbouring countries to block the passage of the An-124...what route did it took?)

mack8 wrote:The first two MiG-29s from Russia arrived this evening in Serbia aboard an An-124, with 6 due to arrive by Friday and should be shown on Oct.20, this according to serbian media. Understandably the folks at mycity-military are extatic.
So any more details, what standards will they be, and what about the MiG-29s and Buks from Belarus, any news on that front?
(tbh i was expecting the traitorous american puppets in neighbouring countries to block the passage of the An-124...what route did it took?)

Belarus - Poland - Slovakia - Hungary

'
Even though religiously avoid local media I am pretty sure that Serbian liberals are eating their own shit in frustration right about now....

PapaDragon wrote:'
Even though religiously avoid local media I am pretty sure that Serbian liberals are eating their own shit in frustration right about now....

If I correctly understand you, how so? Is the president of Serbia and his government not a bunch of liberals?

BM-21 wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:'
Even though religiously avoid local media I am pretty sure that Serbian liberals are eating their own shit in frustration right about now....

If I correctly understand you, how so? Is the president of Serbia and his government not a bunch of liberals?

You just accidentally stumbled on one of the reasons why I avoid local media

I'll just add that in the deep disgusting rotten center of Belgrade there are things lurking and trying to claw their way to the top that make Masha Gessen look like god-fearing conservative

You ain't seen degenerate traitor until you've seen Serbian degenerate traitor 

As for Serbian politics I'll let someone else fill you in

I care more about hardware than people