The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

JohninMK wrote:

auslander wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:Anyone know where are Givi and Motorola? They quit?

Ya know, I put both your accounts on ignore along with Dforce for a reason, that reason being if all three of your brains, that's assuming you three have a brain, were dynamite, combined you wouldn't have enough to blow one nostril.

Don't know how I did it but somehow I opened this post. If I ever meet your father I'm going to belt him right square in the mouth for not using a Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company Heavy Duty Dual Layer Acid Dipped Flame Thrower Umbrella Tip Condom, spermicide, germicide, douche, rhythm method, abstinence, withdrawal method, vasectomy, tube tie, wire tie, benzine, amputation, whatever, anything to avoid producing you.    

You in a pensive, laid back, reflective mood this afternoon?

Yeah, been writing and editing all day, decided to take a break and nose around the forum. Actually, compared to how this very early morning went I'm pretty calm and gentle.

After this whole ordeal, I think Belarus is going to be fine. Hence why Russia and belarus uped cooperation with russian airforce base.

They will make attempts, but Belarus intelligence and security forces seem to be in check.

auslander wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:Anyone know where are Givi and Motorola? They quit?

Ya know, I put both your accounts on ignore along with Dforce for a reason, that reason being if all three of your brains, that's assuming you three have a brain, were dynamite, combined you wouldn't have enough to blow one nostril.

Don't know how I did it but somehow I opened this post. If I ever meet your father I'm going to belt him right square in the mouth for not using a Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company Heavy Duty Dual Layer Acid Dipped Flame Thrower Umbrella Tip Condom, spermicide, germicide, douche, rhythm method, abstinence, withdrawal method, vasectomy, tube tie, wire tie, benzine, amputation, whatever, anything to avoid producing you.    

Ladies and gentlemen...The Wordsmith.

PapaDragon wrote:

auslander wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:Anyone know where are Givi and Motorola? They quit?

Ya know, I put both your accounts on ignore along with Dforce for a reason, that reason being if all three of your brains, that's assuming you three have a brain, were dynamite, combined you wouldn't have enough to blow one nostril.

Don't know how I did it but somehow I opened this post. If I ever meet your father I'm going to belt him right square in the mouth for not using a Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company Heavy Duty Dual Layer Acid Dipped Flame Thrower Umbrella Tip Condom, spermicide, germicide, douche, rhythm method, abstinence, withdrawal method, vasectomy, tube tie, wire tie, benzine, amputation, whatever, anything to avoid producing you.    

Ladies and gentlemen...The Wordsmith.    

Shucks, the boy just rubbed me the wrong way when I accidentally opened his post. I had to wash my eyes after looking at said post and as an act of contrition and self flagellation I'm drinking my last weissen, with lemon as an added punishment. I humbly accept your accolades in regards to my paltry attempts at humor.

Looks like NAF took a day off yesterday. Only 19 attacks wounding 1 Maidan soldier.

Minsk 2 dies when scheduled elections break down in October. Looks like both sides are in the final stages of preparing for renewed fighting in October.

auslander wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

auslander wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:Anyone know where are Givi and Motorola? They quit?

Ya know, I put both your accounts on ignore along with Dforce for a reason, that reason being if all three of your brains, that's assuming you three have a brain, were dynamite, combined you wouldn't have enough to blow one nostril.

Don't know how I did it but somehow I opened this post. If I ever meet your father I'm going to belt him right square in the mouth for not using a Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company Heavy Duty Dual Layer Acid Dipped Flame Thrower Umbrella Tip Condom, spermicide, germicide, douche, rhythm method, abstinence, withdrawal method, vasectomy, tube tie, wire tie, benzine, amputation, whatever, anything to avoid producing you.    

Ladies and gentlemen...The Wordsmith.    

Shucks, the boy just rubbed me the wrong way when I accidentally opened his post. I had to wash my eyes after looking at said post and as an act of contrition and self flagellation I'm drinking my last weissen, with lemon as an added punishment. I humbly accept your accolades in regards to my paltry attempts at humor.

Maidan confirms no local elections in Donbas in October as specified in Minsk 2. We are guaranteed Minsk 2 dies in October, if not already. Without Minsk 2, there is no need for any ceasefire.

http://www.voanews.com/content/ukraine-cancels-upcoming-local-polls-near-combat-zone/2938552.html

Since Minsk 2 is dead, there is no need for OSCE to stay around in Donbas. Bye bye, you won't be missed.

Cowboy's daughter wrote:

auslander wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

auslander wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:Anyone know where are Givi and Motorola? They quit?

Ya know, I put both your accounts on ignore along with Dforce for a reason, that reason being if all three of your brains, that's assuming you three have a brain, were dynamite, combined you wouldn't have enough to blow one nostril.

Don't know how I did it but somehow I opened this post. If I ever meet your father I'm going to belt him right square in the mouth for not using a Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company Heavy Duty Dual Layer Acid Dipped Flame Thrower Umbrella Tip Condom, spermicide, germicide, douche, rhythm method, abstinence, withdrawal method, vasectomy, tube tie, wire tie, benzine, amputation, whatever, anything to avoid producing you.    

Ladies and gentlemen...The Wordsmith.    

Shucks, the boy just rubbed me the wrong way when I accidentally opened his post. I had to wash my eyes after looking at said post and as an act of contrition and self flagellation I'm drinking my last weissen, with lemon as an added punishment. I humbly accept your accolades in regards to my paltry attempts at humor.

+1, excellent post. Said what needed saying.

I was always puzzled by why the Ukrainians needed to build a fence on the Russian border as it would have zero effect on the Russian army from invading. While instead it is designed to keep the millions of starving Russian refuges out trying to gain access to a prosperous Ukraine. The sanctions against Russia would soon lead to a total collapse of it's economy and starvation for it's population... who knew!!!

https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://politobzor.net/show-63312-ordy-rossiyskih-bezhencev-rvutsya-na-ukrainu.html&usg=ALkJrhiGpyPJZ_h67N3IKgDeCh2VVXLDvQ

franco wrote:I was always puzzled by why the Ukrainians needed to build a fence on the Russian border as it would have zero effect on the Russian army from invading. While instead it is designed to keep the millions of starving Russian refuges out trying to gain access to a prosperous Ukraine. The sanctions against Russia would soon lead to a total collapse of it's economy and starvation for it's population... who knew!!!

https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://politobzor.net/show-63312-ordy-rossiyskih-bezhencev-rvutsya-na-ukrainu.html&usg=ALkJrhiGpyPJZ_h67N3IKgDeCh2VVXLDvQ

The fence is an easy sell to the West so that Kiev can get its sticky hands on more money. Wonderful opportunity, construction contracts.

We can safely say Minsk 2 is already dead. Maidan refused to give special status as specified in Minsk 2. Maidan refused to hold local elections as specified in Minsk 2. Heavy weapons is fair game.

Flagship Victory wrote:We can safely say Minsk 2 is already dead. Maidan refused to give special status as specified in Minsk 2. Maidan refused to hold local elections as specified in Minsk 2. Heavy weapons is fair game.

Then, finally Porosheko break Minsk 2. Not surprised at all, he is ... enough to do this. But many people in theorical NATO countries want not this war and will not follow the ... leaders.

A rather strange Fort Russ aticle.
http://fortruss.blogspot.ca/2015/08/tank-airlift-explains-why-there-are-no.html

August 30, 2015
Translated from German by Tom Winter
"It is a new provocation against the territorial integrity of the free and democratic Ukraine by the well-known deviousness of the Russians." As the first freely elected president of Ukraine, Petro Poroshenko sent word at a press conference, that three Russian aircraft carriers have been brought in to the port of embattled eastern Ukrainian Donetsk, each with 30 of the latest Russian bombers of type Sukhoi T-50.

Furthermore, Moscow had set up an airlift of tanks in the separatist regions. Ten transport aircraft, Antonov 225 Mrija, are in use, that bring in another load of tanks every two hours.

Remember when I posted a link to El Murid's blog about "Ryazan" commander's death? There was little information available and only Rusvesna.su out of all major news sites wrote about it. A personal friend of Eduard Gilazov wrote a very long post, the first part out of three about his findings of the fate of the commander of "Ryazan". As you can read in other posts from the same author, Gilazov is missing, but according to a close source of the author - he has been killed. His forced disappearance seems to have been planned before hand and either his friends from "Ryazan" were involved or the "Ministry of State Security" of DPR. Though that's only my own opinion, as the author only posted information but doesn't want to point at anyone yet.

Full article, a very long read, but quite detailed: http://achtungpartisanen.ru/eduard-gilazov

eehnie wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:We can safely say Minsk 2 is already dead. Maidan refused to give special status as specified in Minsk 2. Maidan refused to hold local elections as specified in Minsk 2. Heavy weapons is fair game.

Then, finally Porosheko break Minsk 2. Not surprised at all, he is ... enough to do this. But many people in theorical NATO countries want not this war and will not follow the ... leaders.

Minks-2 is backed and signed by Ukraine ,Russia ,Germany ,France and backed by United Nations security ,including US.. Poroshenko cannot back down from it.. he is doomed.. Minsk-2 agreements is like an International Law that Ukraine needs to obey.. they can only delay it but cannot refuse to implement it.. if they refuse and the date line expire.. France ,Germany backed by the majority of Europeans , can send a military peace maker force to separate Ukrainian forces from Rebel forces.. Americans will be unable to find an excuse to justify Ukraine not supporting Minks-2 agreement. in Short Poroshenko is doomed.. He and the parliament of Ukraine have no way out of avoiding to UN international signed agreement.  

This means that Russia have many ways to pressure Ukraine to obey the Minks-2 if Germany
and France do not quit.. as they are doing ..they well know that if they quit.. they will leave the door open for Americans to push for a major war. Between Ukraine and Russia ,that could include Americans and Poland and baltic states.. and this is not mentioning the possibility of the
Nazis or CIA blowing the nuclear reactors in Ukraine something that will affect all Europe sooner or later..  End of Story ukraine cannot quit of Minks-2. it can only delay it..

But Germany and France and Russia with the help of Hungary and other European countries have the justification to create a united military peace keeping force that will invade from Rebels controlled borders Ukraine and push the Ukraine army away..  

What im saying is that France and Germany do have a very strong legal framework and most of Europe that support Minks-2.. to Force Ukraine to obey the cease of fire.. using either economical sanctions ,denying any integration to Ukraine to Europe or association until it end the war or simply using a military force peace keeping mission with the support of Russia..
this mission only job will be to separate both sides and remove all the weapons from the buffer zone.   Americans will have no valid arguments to support Ukraine if Poroshenko say they will not support minks-2 .  It can only say Russia is the one breaking it.. but Russia can counter that by saying lets send a peace keeping military force of all Europe and Russia to separate both sides.. and Obama will have no valid argument to oppose that. Because again Minks-2 is backed by United Nations security counsil ,so is international law the minks-2 pact.

yes.. Ukraine can launch another attack.. yes Ukraine can say all they want..but NO they cannot refuse to obey mink-2.its needs to be implemented now or later ..and there is no option for not
implementing it.. in the end Kiev will see itself isolated in Europe , and they will be forced to Implement the minks2 agreement.. Through European pressure or Economic Sanctions or military force.  

There is only one thing.. only one that could justify Poroshenko to not implement mink-2.. and that is that Russia declare war against Ukraine and invades them.. but that is not going to happen. Russia will just continue providing low level support to Rebels undercover and Ukraine will have no excuse to escape the mink-2 international agreement.

Because Germany and France doesn't look like backing down.. and are effectively pressuring
Poroshenko to stop the war ..the only other thing Americans can do is start pressuring Germany
and France to retreat to not interfere in their games ,proxy war against Russia. So keep and eye
on Terrorist Attack in Germany and France.. attacks on their tourism.. keep an eye on American Banks blackmail to France and Germany , with billions dollars fines under any excuse. Biggest Bank in Germany is from israel.. so keep an eye of unrest and economic warfare that will start on France and Germany.. that will be Americans trying to pressure them to back down from pressuring Kiev in implementing Minks-2 . and not interfere in their objectives of creating a major war in europe ,with Russia in the opposite side.

If i were going to bet.. after the last meeting ,where France and Germany twisted the hands of Poroshenko ..my bet is Ukraine is doomed it cannot avoid minsk2 ,will be forced to implement it.. and Americans will have to back down in their atemps to use Ukraine to separate Europe from Russia. you only have to look at Putin ,smiling all the time today in Sochi with medvedev
doing exercises .. Russia already won the war in Ukraine.. without invading it . just with low level support to rebels.

The Great Stephen Cohen on Meaning of Merkel-Poroshenko (Audio Podcast)

Nation contributing editor Stephen F. Cohen and John Batchelor continue their weekly discussions of the new cold war.

This installment focuses on different but related recent developments.

According to Cohen, by summoning Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko to Berlin, German Chancellor Angela Merkel, and French President François Hollande made clear that the US-backed government in Kiev, not Moscow, is blocking implementation of their Minsk plan for negotiating an end to the Ukrainian civil war.

http://russia-insider.com/en/merkel-poroshenko/ri9397

it looks like patience and pressure are the tactics that Putin ,Germany and France have
to force Ukraine to backdown.. but also force amerians back down too.. The visit of Kerry to Sochi with Nuland showing up too..speaking about supporting Minks-2  and passing it to the security counsil of UN ,was the nail in the coffin to any strategy to not support minks-2.  
Again Poroshenko cannot refuse to implement Minsk-2.. he can only delay it.. but that will only
increase the pressure against him from all Europe.. he will not be able to hold for long ,with every day everyone in Europe demanding him to stop the war. Specially because Ukraine future
depends highly on its relations with France and Germany.. If France and Germany stay firm ,
with minsk2 and Russia , Ukraine cannot avoid its implementation.  If 2015 pass and Ukraine continue delaying it.. you will see France and Germany and other European countries start economic sanctions against Ukraine, and or creating a military peace force with the backup of United nations with Russia to force ukraine implement Minks-2 and withraw its heavy weapons from the buffer zone agreed. This will be catastrophic for Americans foreign policy.. the last thing they want is a military alliance of France and Germany and other european countries with Russia.. ,to separate both sides on the conflict.and with americans again completely ignored..

Only thing Americans can do now is delay it , and remove poroshenko.. but they will never
have a valid argument to claim mink2 is not valid anymore and no longer ukraine needs to implement it. Im really convinced France ,Germany and Russia have all the cards on their side
to force Ukraine to obey.. and Americans have nothing.

Vann7 wrote:
this mission only job will be to separate both sides and remove all the weapons from the buffer zone.   Americans will have no valid arguments to support Ukraine if Poroshenko say they will not support minks-2 .  It can only say Russia is the one breaking it.. but Russia can counter that by saying lets send a peace keeping military force of all Europe and Russia to separate both sides.. and Obama will have no valid argument to oppose that. Because again Minks-2 is backed by United Nations security counsil ,so is international law the minks-2 pact.

I didn't see any mention of a peacekeeping force in UNSC resolution 2202

Therefore, the US can veto a draft resolution of sending of a peace keeping military force to Ukraine.

Erk wrote:

Vann7 wrote:
this mission only job will be to separate both sides and remove all the weapons from the buffer zone.   Americans will have no valid arguments to support Ukraine if Poroshenko say they will not support minks-2 .  It can only say Russia is the one breaking it.. but Russia can counter that by saying lets send a peace keeping military force of all Europe and Russia to separate both sides.. and Obama will have no valid argument to oppose that. Because again Minks-2 is backed by United Nations security counsil ,so is international law the minks-2 pact.

I didn't see any mention of a peacekeeping force in UNSC resolution 2202

Therefore, the US can veto a draft resolution of sending of a peace keeping military force to Ukraine.

They can do that and discredit themselves too.. but they cannot save Ukraine from European
sanctions. neither Ukraine will get more loans from Europe..Ukraine future depends on European relations and its integration. and if Europeans tells them.. No association and economic relations until the war stopped , Ukraine will have no choice than to Obey and fully implement mink-2 and give autonomy to Donetk and Lugansk.  

Europe United its majority have much more power than they credit themselves.. they can not only twist Ukraine hands but Americans too.. Russia do not have such power only Europe united the majority .Americans cannot isolate themselves from Europe.. they will back down if France and Germany with most of Europe stand firm with mink-2 implementation. Americans will be unable to carry Ukraine economy.. it cannot help Detroit and its other bankrupt states.. less they can help Ukraine. Ukraine way out of its economic collapse
and disbanding in many countries depends on France and Germany and Europe support. in short
Ukraine is doomed.. I don't see any way or strategy that kiev or americans can use to avoid
the implementation of mink-2 if Europe stand firm with it.. (and they should, the other alternative is world war 3) and no way for kiev,to get away from giving Donetsk and Lugansk
a strong autonomy ,with their rights to have their own security and own governor ,and doing 100% of what Europe wants.

Only thing Kiev can do ,to avoid Minsk is provoke Russia into war..So later they can say ,
they cant implement it..because Russia is bombing them. But It looks all this games will not work .. Europe knows is Ukraine the one seeking any excuse to not implement Minks and it will
be impossible for Ukraine to get away of it.. This is similar to a NATION debt to the IMF.. you can delay paying it..but you cannot refuse to pay..not possible. Even soviets cannot refuse to pay their debts to the west. Because doing that will get you isolated completely from the world trade. Ukraine will not survive as a country a single month with a total European Blockade on its economy.. and this will not affect Europe at all ,since they do not need anything from Ukraine.
IF france and Germany that is backed by most of Europe ,stand firm with Minks-2.. Ukraine is doomed.  the way i see it.. Putin have done a checkmate to Obama and Poroshenko at the same time..   Minks-2 is mostly a Putin plan for peace.. and is really well thought ,im sure it will be used in books in diplomacy in politics.. Is a trap that allows kiev to recover Donetks and Lugansk without firing a single shot.. and all they need to do is to recognize the rights of minorities in Ukraine and give Donetsk and Lugansk autonomy.  essentially this reforms will lead the way to completely reverse of the coup in kiev by Americans..and put in power a pro Russian president again in Ukraine.  

So what are American options? Allow Russia to take most of ukraine territories the Crimean way , without firing a shot.. if they continue fueling the war ?   Or allow Minsk-2 to happen and reverse the coup..and restore democracy in Ukraine ,kicking the nazis from power and turn Ukraine into a neutral nation? as it was before the coup?  either way ,is a lost for Americans.
they will lose the control of Ukraine if they continue sponsoring the war.. or they will lose the control of ukraine if they allow Ukraine to become a democracy again. Nuland nazis will not win any election in a real transparent elections with rights for all minorities.

You might not see it now.. but by the end of year you will see a different Ukraine that the one today.. either completely disbanded in several republics and Russia taking most of it without invading ,(this is if americans continue fueling the conflict..) or Ukraine finally ending the war..and giving autonomy to the rebels. This is because Germany and France will not back down
and will block any attempt of americans to use Ukraine to provoke a major war between Europe and Russia. They fully understand that it will be far worse if allows americans to provoke a major war.. and that it will be Europe and not USA  the ones that will have to pay the biggest price.

The major irony in all this.. is that American Government is risking a lot more of losing Ukraine
forever if continue pushing the war. US government is risking creating a major Rebelion against them and losing the control of most of europe too...  This is dangerous for US policy and its imperialism.  American policy in Ukraine and its General Propaganda of "Russian aggression"
and militarization of Russian borders..and fueling the Violence in Ukraine can provoke Europe
to become closer to Russia.. and this is the opposite of what they intended..  This already happened at the political level in Mink-2.  You saw how germany and France cooked a peace deal in Ukraine and not included Americans anywhere on it..  and they are really
mad of that.. This does not looks good for US world leadership and will only encourage for Rebellion in Europe from other countries to oppose US policies openly too ,just like France and Germany have done..

I know many hate merkel ,but at least she have shown a lot of courage in opposing Openly Obama aid to ukraine with weapons in open public.. that was a major rejection to US policies.
and is not rare to listen now major Dissaprobal of US policies in Ukraine..from European leaders.
it was one Former German Top politician ,forgot its name  who told "fuck American Imperialism" and was published everywhere..and in one of the latest NATO major meeting in Brusels..after they end , italy president goes and receive Putin in opposition of the isolation of Russia..  This is not good for US image..  and its attempts to get Europe to cut relations with Russia. American policies in Ukraine are effectively turning Europe close to an Open Rebellion towards their policies.. and driving Europe more closer to Russia.. and this is good news for Russia and terrible news for USA.. They are getting the opposite of what they intended to create in the Ukraine revolution. Merkel openly supporting the idea of a free economic trade between Europe and Russia..or speaking in public about an European Army? to defend their interest?  All this looks like Rebelion to me.. to american interest.  Its too early to say..  i will wait to the end of year for a final conclusion of Ukraine.. but so far until now .. looks like Putin strategy is working ..albeit unfortunately civilians are being killed..  yet the alternative to this will be worse.. that is
Russia invading Ukraine and creating a full scale war. and allowing Kiev and Americans to get the unity in the world they need against Russia .

from Russia Insider.. comments section. about germany and France summoning Poroshenko
for Minsk-2 full implementation and Poroshenko all nervous smiles and showing submission.


The Great Stephen Cohen on Meaning of Merkel (summoning )Poroshenko (Audio Podcast)

from Guest:

The US 'overplaying its hand' is an understatement. This may very well be the most serious of Washington's geopolitical blunders of the recent past and become the tipping point for an entire spectrum of global realliances. Good going, Washington. This one will go down in the history books with a chapter all its own.

http://russia-insider.com/en/merkel-poroshenko/ri9397

Just like that user.. i totally agree.. This look really bad if not terrible ,for American foreign Policy and world leadership ,of losing the control of its allies in Europe..in failing to the EU united against Russia.. you have for a second or third or 4th time , Germany and France summoning the white house man big man in Ukraine Poroshenko ,to reprimand him and pressure him to
implement Minks-2 and without Americans being present.. All this only encourage other European countries to become more Independent and defend their interest even if they oppose
the American ones. This of course is really good for Russia.. since it will make it more difficult
for US to demonize Russia and isolate them . and will also serve not only to encourage better relations with Russia but also create a "new Team" in Europe of policy makers to solve international conflicts and without Americans being present there.

Khepesh wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Amount of credit you give to Ukraine is astounding.

Ukrainians are already eating shit sandwiches and amount of it in their diet will only be increasing.

Sooner this becomes new normal the better. Ukrainians still hope to have some form of life worth living in their lifetime. These hopes must be snuffed out.

Ukraine must not be salvaged. Fact that it was allowed to exists in it's current form after WW2 all this time is a miscarriage of justice.

Someone already said here: entire Ukraine is not worth life of one NAF soldier.

And honestly, how amateurish do you think Russian military leadership is? The moment first NATO field kitchen is seriously slated for deployment in Ukraine, NAF will unload amount of fire on ukrops that will make Midlle East look like kindergarten. Winter 2014 will be good old days.

Lot smarter, experienced and lot, lot better informed people than us are in charge of this.

Also, public opinion of the world is already shitting on Russia so do not hope for any change in that department. They never stopped shitting on Russia and never will. Everyone is aware of it except Russians it seems...

That something like "normal" relations are maintained is disturbing, but it rather suggests that Ukraine will not be allowed to totaly collapse, but become dependent. America pumped huge amounts of money into Japan and Germany after the war to the extent that both countries are essentially owned by America, as well as still occupied. I hear the argument that America cannot support 40 million in Ukraine, and do not believe it. Sure "Joe public" will not like it, but they can do it to a level that will stop total collapse. Russia says it wants a stable Ukraine, American simply wants Ukraine, both positions suggest that Ukraine will not collapse and any wait will be rather long. If NATO airmobile brigades land at Lvov, who will hit them? or if they land as close to the front as Dnepropetrovsk. As the PR against Russia can hardly get worse, then surely there is nothing to loose by going further. More sanctions can be applied, SWIFT may be stopped, but the existing sanctions hurt western companies at least as much as Russian, and I suspect more so. I really do not see any major reasons to wait as I do not see Ukraine collapsing.

Khep you know I like you, but there's no logic into pumping even 20 billion a year in Ukraine without getting back Donbass fully. Ukraine has collapsed, it just doesn care anymore. The country is a corpse and living out of thin air. There wre enough people that mentionned how the UAH was overperforming for months because of the Holy Spirit. I you think this is a country that can continue being a beggar and have a future, you watch out for the next decade. The only way for Ukraine to survive, is like Serbia, to give up on both Donbass and Crimea. Serbia was even further "partitionned" back in 2006. Think about how worse it could get for it.

So what's the difference between the decentralization plans of Poroshenko and the federalization project?

EDIT: Nevermind, I just read the text and it's laughable. Poroshenko will have power to appoint and fire organs of self-rule which means he has absolute control over who rules there and who doesn't. Essentially he just widened his power over the oblasts and their administrations.

Fucking piece of shit scumbag shits all over Minsk II again. Where are you Dforce? Please share some insight with me. Indulge me.

Several hundred activists are storming the Rada right now after the vote for decentralization: http://top.rbc.ru/politics/31/08/2015/55e42b829a79475bb304c754

I wonder what they are storming the Rada for. Is it because the idea of "decentralization" pisses them off or because they dislike the fact that Poroshenko just broadened his presidential power over the country?

Erk wrote:A rather strange Fort Russ aticle.
http://fortruss.blogspot.ca/2015/08/tank-airlift-explains-why-there-are-no.html

August 30, 2015
Translated from German by Tom Winter
"It is a new provocation against the territorial integrity of the free and democratic Ukraine by the well-known deviousness of the Russians." As the first freely elected president of Ukraine, Petro Poroshenko sent word at a press conference, that three Russian aircraft carriers have been brought in to the port of embattled eastern Ukrainian Donetsk, each with 30 of the latest Russian bombers of type Sukhoi T-50.

Furthermore, Moscow had set up an airlift of tanks in the separatist regions. Ten transport aircraft, Antonov 225 Mrija, are in use, that bring in another load of tanks every two hours.

A key word at the very beginning... a satire. In other words the whole thing is a joke.
Donbas does not have a port nor do the Russians have 3 aircraft carriers. There are also not 90 T-50's.
There are not 10 An-225 flying into a non operational airport in Donbas every 2 hours unloading tanks.

Neutrality wrote:Several hundred activists are storming the Rada right now after the vote for decentralization: http://top.rbc.ru/politics/31/08/2015/55e42b829a79475bb304c754

I wonder what they are storming the Rada for. Is it because the idea of "decentralization" pisses them off or because they dislike the fact that Poroshenko just broadened his presidential power over the country?

The Radical Party had called for this which is why Porky had criminal charges brought against it's leaders late last week. The Radical party military wing is Azov.

Neutrality wrote:So what's the difference between the decentralization plans of Poroshenko and the federalization project?

EDIT: Nevermind, I just read the text and it's laughable. Poroshenko will have power to appoint and fire organs of self-rule which means he has absolute control over who rules there and who doesn't. Essentially he just widened his power over the oblasts and their administrations.

Fucking piece of shit scumbag shits all over Minsk II again. Where are you Dforce? Please share some insight with me. Indulge me.

Similar to the local elections in the Donbas section of Minsk2 as viewed by Poroshenko. Only pro-maidan parties and candidates are acceptable to run under the supervision and control of the Ukrainian government. Democracy in action indeed. Of course the Americans have already stated they support both of these views.

Apparently theres been an explosion at the rada building and 15 people are injured according to RT

Edit: now they say it was a hand grenade and five injured.

Would this not be deemed a terrorist attack in the west?