Russian Liberal Opposition

GarryB wrote:

-why should but r not critical of all propaganda-it's a 2way street.

Bad propaganda is... you have a competent leader who is denying use cheap and easy money to be made asset stripping your country and screwing its people over like we have done with so many countries before.- u just described Putin who allows his oligarchs to rape the country!

Bias is all over ur posts (with minimal critical thinking where it should be applied, not with personal attacks & syllogysms & exaggerations u r so good at), which must take all sides of a given issue into account.

So you are saying I should give Nazis a fair go because maybe I just don't understand what their real message is. Maybe the KKK are just people who want to be loved and cuddled and are misunderstood too...-read Beyond Good & Evil

-he later paid taxes but Putin didn't like his back talk & ruined his life.

So eventually he did what everyone else gets very little choice in doing and followed the law and being a criminal made things tough for him... well that is a surprise.... breaking the law, becoming a criminal, and then suffering for that... isn't that how the real world works?- FYI, in the 1990s there, no business could succeed by following the law from the Socialist USSR era.
Putin 1st financial crime was in St Petersburg when he embezzled $ from exports; as the French say: u get hungrier as u eat. He applied laws against others that crossed him & his buddies but not to himself; as a de-facto Tsar, he is above the law.
The shock and horror is that this is not what happens in the west..- the Russians in Russia don't live in the West, & have to survive in their present situation. & could care less about Western abuses.

- not every rich person, & it wasn't easy to trace & took a long time to uncover everything.

But Putin is the boss... he is in charge... he is murdering people in the UK with military grade nerve agents and interfering in elections around the world for the last 10 years at least... surely anyone who made any money in Russia would need to pay tribute to the boss... that is how such things work don't you know...-generalizing again! certain people who made certain amount$!

.-they would've  used other pretexts w/o Navalny, the West has many options, so don't blame it on him only.

Putin knows he is no threat but he brings other idiots out of the woodwork, and I am sure they are recording names and faces and links to the west...-if it was so, he wouldn't be taping his denials on that Palace & finally getting Rotenberg to claim its ownership. If he was the real owner, why not come out sooner?

.- just look at his wristwatches & suits, & he has a lot more in his collection that r worth more than all of his incomes put together.

What makes you think they are his. Even the most basic TV programme has a wardrobe section that dresses everyone in appropriate costumes.... do you think presidents have to dress themselves?- he isn't a poor actor like Zelensky was. In fact, he is a lot richer than Trump & Reagan put together. ur straw grasping is ridiculous & becoming annoying!
..are you going to say the limo is his too? How about the aircraft he flys around in?- stop interrogating me, I already posted info. on his non-gov. vehicles that r registered under different owners, but under his control.

- most Russians want him gone to, for their reasons that were building up for the last 20 years.

There was nothing close to 50% of the Russian population at any of those protests... closer to 1%, and it is not clear they were all pro Navalny... I have seen some people who were supporting Putin.-they were all anti-Putin, & those who hesitate will join them as the regime can only act with more oppression.

-where is any evidence of Russian democracy?

Every few years they have a vote for the last 30 odd years. They have more parties and candidates than the US does so more of a democracy than the US... which is not really saying much at all.- u omit the fact that many were prevented from registering, incl. Navalny who was put in legal trouble by the orders from above. Not bad for being democratic!

The only democracy of sorts that ever existed there was in Novgorod that was never occupied by the Mongols & which Moscow brutally crushed.

Well if that is the only democracy that ever existed then can we stop wasting time talking about such shit.
Western so called democracies have used their money and power and secret services to undermine more real democracies than those pretending to be democracies that make up the west.-pl. rant about them on other treads- this 1 is about Russian Lib. Opposition, in case u forgot.

-Navalny is too famous now; recall that even mighty Brezhnev's KGB couldn't do much to Solzhenitsyn & Sakharov.

Surely his fame is what makes him worth killing, because murdering him would be a statement to all of Putins enemies that no one is safe... or are you trying to say Putin is too scared to kill him now that his poisoned underpants scheme has failed...   -then, some1 will kill Putin for sure. PM Stolypin was way better statesman but still got shot. Perhaps if he lived, Russia would be a stable constitutional monarchy now.

- by the same token, Putin would benefit a lot more from his death & from blaming it on the West or anti-Kadyrov Chechens.

Benefit in what way? With him dead the west wont stop doing what they are doing...-do u have ADD? I was talking about Nemtsov's death.

-they r not his media;

So medias job is to push an agenda and they are not responsible for telling anyone elses story... get your own new network.
So why do you blame RT and Sputnik for being Putins mouthpieces... isn't that just him having his say... or as president of Russia he is not allowed a voice?-he got too much voice, so much that people had to take to the streets from the RFE to Kaliningrad in freezing temperatures.

-the Russians care, it's their $ that were wasted on it, + the tax $ used to guard that palace with FSO- if it's oligarchs to enjoy, then they should pay for it.

What taxpayers money... they have been wrong about everything so far, why do you think they might be right about the funding?-the FSO is financed by the gov., i.e. the taxpayers of all kinds; many young people have 2-3 jobs to support their parents &/ grandparents receiving low pensions; all those age groups r among the protesters.

-Russia won't collapse w/o Putin, get that idea out of ur head!

The west is hoping for that... expecting that...- if they do, they r morons- how will they handle several new states with nukes? they were lucky when Ukraine & Kazakhstan gave their nukes to Russia.  

- so u wish the West to suffer?

the west has forgotten what real suffering is, yet deals it out on a day to day basis... yes... the west does need to suffer.- it already does with Covid-19/20, refugees, climate change, riots, & moral decline.

isn't NZ a part of it?

Yeah, but being at the arse end of the world and not on the best terms with the US we do have a bit of leeway... you will notice we are rather more diplomatic in our conversations with China... it is simply about respect... something most of the west has forgotten sadly.- perhaps if it becomes a new Chinese colony/province, along with Australia, it'll be shielded better, but that time is too far off...

It could be a good site to build another big palace for Putin, & where he could enjoy using his yachts & local girls!

He deserves a better palace than we could afford to build him.- I would love to see ur pic greeting him at the airport & kissing his boots!

- r u a political strategist? if so, go earn some $ & donate it to Putin's United Russia Party instead of wasting time on a forum.

Have I upset you?-yes, with stupid ?s & insinuations like these.

-a brave thing to do indeed;

Well he knows the poisoning bullshit was all bullshit so there was no risk at all... he knew he broke the rules and he knew he was going to jail and the protests at his arrest were planned before he arrived.
I believe the word is traitor.- u r full of crap up to ur ears to believe all this trash.

he also knows that trying to killing him now will cost Putin a lot more than it did before.

He knows Putin knows he is not worth a bullet. People die in custody all the time... and get raped too...- then, why return & make his wife a widow& his 2 daughters orphans?

- no, he now lives in jail, on gov. $. If/when he gets out, he'll have enough $ w/o any from abroad.

Hopefully the penalties for his new crimes can be financial. It makes more sense to take money from this idiot and set him free than waste a prison cell for this moron and give him time to write a book or some such crap.-no, Putin is afraid that out of jail he'll lead the opposition. U can bet I know his thought process a lot better than u do.

Today, the Russians deserve some1 different & better than Putin, his FSB, riot police, courts, media & oligarchs have to offer.

Putin is just the head. When Putin leaves the FSB and police and courts and media and rich people will remain the same... they don't change... in Russia and in the US and everywhere else.- dead wrong: the elites & their law enforcers change with the regime they supported. Yeltsin & Putin r transitory figures, just like Andropov & Gorbachev were.

-Putin & his advisers were so concerned, they changed the constitution not for his own benefit-that was last on his mind-but to allow his voters the opportunity to exercise democracy; how generous on their part!

Russia has had almost 30 years experience with that American written bullshit constitution... I am surprised and a little disappointed they didn't change it sooner and rather more radically.- FYI, his plan was to unite with Belarus & become a head of the new state, but Lukashenko wanted also to be that head & rotate with PM position, like Medvedev did. Changing the constitution was an emergency measure to keep Putin in power, not to improve the lives of Russians.  

-2 wrongs doesn't make it right;

That is the opposite of the ends justify the means...-were those Nazi generals plotting to kill Hitler to save Ms of lives not justified? a while ago I saw a man holding a sign saying "Putler- Kaput!"

if Putin rule was so good, then his  media and riot police better be more professional & stop defending a lost cause.

If putin is so bad he will be replaced next election.- even if it would happen, the people had had enough of him to wait till 2024.

- it'll be Ms as time goes by & more people take a stand in their future.

Navalny isn't their future... he doesn't even want to be.- their better future as they see it is w/o Putin, & Navalny wants to be their future president. stop mincing words!  

Who r u to claim that Putin is the best for Russia till 2024 or 2036?

Someone in the west who has taken an interest in Russia over these last few decades and seen what a miracle Putin has achieved in a relatively short space of time. -Lenin & Stalin also pulled impressive miracles, but cost Ms of lives; that's why it wasn't a miracle but a natural event that the USSR imploded, costing more lost lives. If Putin stays, the country will stagnate just like it did under Brezhnev, if not worse.

Those who live there could care less what GB or any1 else says on this English language forum.

But they should listen to you?- no, they have others they know to listen to & I'm not their advisor. STOP PERSONAL ATTACKS!!!!!

- it's their fight, not French or American, & whom their ancestors defeated & kicked out in 1812 & 1918-19.

You are claiming the Russian police are barbaric, and I am making the point that vastly more people got killed in the US and France than protesting in Russia...- 1 life lost is too many; the Putin regime must self-liquidate ASAP or there will be more strife & possibly a civil war, & that's the bottom line.
the west blaming everyone else for the things happening in the west...- & u r blaming the West for everything bad that happens in Russian power dynamics! look for a log in ur own eye before pointing a speck in mine!

Tsavo Lion wrote:“We cannot influence the lawlessness perpetrated by this judge”: what are the judges of Navalny known for?[/url]

Vann7 wrote:
I really think the one that need to be arrested is Putin for being so incredibly weak and incompetent

u just described Putin who allows his oligarchs to rape the country!

-read Beyond Good & Evil

- FYI, in the 1990s there, no business could succeed by following the law from the Socialist USSR era.

Putin 1st financial crime was in St Petersburg when he embezzled $ from exports; as the French say: u get hungrier as u eat. He applied laws against others that crossed him & his buddies but not to himself; as a de-facto Tsar, he is above the law.

- the Russians in Russia don't live in the West, & have to survive in their present situation. & could care less about Western abuses.

-generalizing again! certain people who made certain amount$!

.-if it was so, he wouldn't be taping his denials on that Palace & finally getting Rotenberg to claim its ownership. If he was the real owner, why not come out sooner?

- he isn't a poor actor like Zelensky was. In fact, he is a lot richer than Trump & Reagan put together. ur straw grasping is ridiculous & becoming annoying!

- stop interrogating me, I already posted info. on his non-gov. vehicles that r registered under different owners, but under his control.

-they were all anti-Putin, & those who hesitate will join them as the regime can only act with more oppression.

- u omit the fact that many were prevented from registering, incl. Navalny who was put in legal trouble by the orders from above. Not bad for being democratic!

.-pl. rant about them on other treads- this 1 is about Russian Lib. Opposition, in case u forgot.

-then, some1 will kill Putin for sure.

PM Stolypin was way better statesman but still got shot. Perhaps if he lived, Russia would be a stable constitutional monarchy now.

.-do u have ADD? I was talking about Nemtsov's death.

-he got too much voice, so much that people had to take to the streets from the RFE to Kaliningrad in freezing temperatures.

-the FSO is financed by the gov., i.e. the taxpayers of all kinds; many young people have 2-3 jobs to support their parents &/ grandparents receiving low pensions; all those age groups r among the protesters.

- if they do, they r morons- how will they handle several new states with nukes? they were lucky when Ukraine & Kazakhstan gave their nukes to Russia.

- it already does with Covid-19/20, refugees, climate change, riots, & moral decline.

- perhaps if it becomes a new Chinese colony/province, along with Australia, it'll be shielded better, but that time is too far off...

- I would love to see ur pic greeting him at the airport & kissing his boots!

-yes, with stupid ?s & insinuations like these.

- u r full of crap up to ur ears to believe all this trash.

- then, why return & make his wife a widow& his 2 daughters orphans?

no, Putin is afraid that out of jail he'll lead the opposition.

U can bet I know his thought process a lot better than u do.

.- FYI, his plan was to unite with Belarus & become a head of the new state, but Lukashenko wanted also to be that head & rotate with PM position, like Medvedev did. Changing the constitution was an emergency measure to keep Putin in power, not to improve the lives of Russians.

-were those Nazi generals plotting to kill Hitler to save Ms of lives not justified?

a while ago I saw a man holding a sign saying "Putler- Kaput!"

.- even if it would happen, the people had had enough of him to wait till 2024.

- their better future as they see it is w/o Putin, & Navalny wants to be their future president. stop mincing words!

-Lenin & Stalin also pulled impressive miracles, but cost Ms of lives;

that's why it wasn't a miracle but a natural event that the USSR imploded, costing more lost lives.

If Putin stays, the country will stagnate just like it did under Brezhnev, if not worse.

- no, they have others they know to listen to & I'm not their advisor. STOP PERSONAL ATTACKS!!!!!

- 1 life lost is too many;

the Putin regime must self-liquidate ASAP or there will be more strife & possibly a civil war, & that's the bottom line.

& u r blaming the West for everything bad that happens in Russian power dynamics! look for a log in ur own eye before pointing a speck in mine!

Big_Gazza wrote:

Tsavo Lion wrote:“We cannot influence the lawlessness perpetrated by this judge”: what are the judges of Navalny known for?[/url]

Pfftt... the embezzler is finally jailed for his theft (should NEVER have been given a suspended sentance) and the dishonest prick can only whine about the judges?

Enjoy the food in prison you traitorous mongrel Say hello to Big Ivan the cross-dressing faggot rapist. I understand you'll be sharing a cell with him. Maybe you should invest in a soap-on-a-rope?

Poor little TL. His idol is nothing but a 2-bit liar and thief.

GarryB wrote:

u just described Putin who allows his oligarchs to rape the country!

Rich people make money easier than working people... it is an established fact of economics... putin has the choice... either let some rich Russians invest and make money in Russia, or let rich Americans and rich poms and other rich foreigners invest and make money and take it out of the country. Like most leaders he chooses the first option... hilarious you even vote considering the first thing US presidents do when they get elected are always tax breaks for the rich...-I didn't vote in years, & but Trump, that disgusting scum, deserved to be voted out.

-read Beyond Good & Evil

No.- then read this: The decision in the Navalny case - the self-overthrow of the authorities is in full swing

- FYI, in the 1990s there, no business could succeed by following the law from the Socialist USSR era.

Yeah, the rich people and the criminals had all the power... like they do everywhere.-and Putin grew from small to big criminal once he got power.

- the Russians in Russia don't live in the West, & have to survive in their present situation. & could care less about Western abuses.

If they saw the shit that happens in the west they would realise what a prize they have in Putin and that they will keep voting for him for as long as he wants to stand for president. The west is worse that what you claim happens in Russia... except the good things done for Russians does not happen in the west...- the Hebrews in Egypt had a good life too before, & compared to spending 40 years in the desert, but it was worth it to be free & be able to lead their own lives. Just because Putin does things ona  different scale, it doesn't mean that he should be kept in power to continue his reign of corruption, intimidation & terror. Give a small man a lot of power & he looses his head flaunting it while developing a mania of greatness.

-generalizing again! certain people who made certain amount$!

So not all of it is corruption...-right, Navalny also made $ in legit. business & his FBK reports all of its income & spending; only now he got accused of embezzling.

.-if it was so, he wouldn't be taping his denials on that Palace & finally getting Rotenberg to claim its ownership. If he was the real owner, why not come out sooner?

Why come out at all... he has nothing to come out to that prisoner.- he's in a damage control mode after his FSB failed to kill him & got caught with its pants down.

- he isn't a poor actor like Zelensky was. In fact, he is a lot richer than Trump & Reagan put together. ur straw grasping is ridiculous & becoming annoying!

You are the one claiming he is a closet billionaire and making ridiculous accusations pulled straight from your ass.-no, from FBK investigations that u refuse to accept!

- stop interrogating me, I already posted info. on his non-gov. vehicles that r registered under different owners, but under his control.

If they are not registered in his name then they are not his.-the house I live in belongs to my landlord, but if I or some1 else pay rent, it's mine, & he can't enter it w/o my permission, while I don't even need a title to it in my name. Others paid & still pay for that palace building, furnishings, repairs, maintenance, & security. If u can't see the truth staring in ur face & comprehend it, perhaps it's better that u stop repeating the same shallow mantra above like a stuck recording.

-they were all anti-Putin, & those who hesitate will join them as the regime can only act with more oppression.

No they wont. Putin had nothing to do with the courts sentence, -how do u know that? all the facts says the opposite; he thinks he must persecute him-see the above clip. who else would benefit from keeping him behind bars? certainly not those ordinary Russians that Putin rules on behalf of & with help by his propagandists tries to look like is concerned about their well being above all else.
which was totally predictable, and perfectly normal... or do you think rich and famous people should be above the law?-Navalny isn't that rich, & became more famous after his poisoning & return In that case why are you complaining about Putin... you seem to think he is both rich and famous so surely he can do as he pleases?-he does, & tries to cover his ass to look 100% clean.

- u omit the fact that many were prevented from registering, incl. Navalny who was put in legal trouble by the orders from above. Not bad for being democratic!

Just like his illegal rallies to stir up trouble and show police actions against his idiots, he is hardly going to bother filling out the registration forms properly for a political party he can't be bothered doing the work to put together and lead... that takes real work and is not fun and entertaining for him... he has the attention span of a teenager. Follow the rules and you get to do what you want... breaking the rules means he doesn't have to bother doing any actual work but gets him all the attention he wants.- u have a very idealistic view of the RF realities. keep ur rosy glasses on, but stop lecturing me.

.-pl. rant about them on other treads- this 1 is about Russian Lib. Opposition, in case u forgot.

Western intel agencies are pivotal to this thread... they support and create and sustain Russian (gay) lib opposition.-w/o the local opposition, they won't make any difference. Navalny is a lot smarter than Putin & his kill teams; the elites will soon make their own pivot towards him before turning their backs on a fresh political corpse.

-then, some1 will kill Putin for sure.

I am sure they try every day... and seem about as successful as they were with Castro.- either way, the writing is on the wall; he has many enemies all over the Globe & good luck to him with his judo skills.

PM Stolypin was way better statesman but still got shot. Perhaps if he lived, Russia would be a stable constitutional monarchy now.

Nah, they'd be speaking German.- wrong, the German colonists in Russia all got Russified & many of their descendants who left the USSR came back. the Germans have no stomach to swallow Russia.

.-do u have ADD? I was talking about Nemtsov's death.

Do you have ADD... with him dead they haven't stopped doing what they are doing... there is no one the west can kill that will make the west stop doing what it is doing. Even Putin getting killed and they will continue doing what they are doing... the west  is the scorpion.-Nemtsov was a big threat to his throne & had to be eliminated, regardless of consequences.

-he got too much voice, so much that people had to take to the streets from the RFE to Kaliningrad in freezing temperatures.

He is the only leader on the planet that has open question sessions with the general public where he talks to the Russian people and the world about issues that matter to THEM. Western politicians will talk about what they are interested in but not usually what their populations care about.- PR! In the old days, folks would go to the capital to present their grievances in person. talk is cheap, esp. when the lower officials ignore his decrees; if the system was efficient, there would be no need for that kind of troubleshooting. r u calling it normal?

That alone makes him a good president.- like the kind & benevolent Tsar that "didn't know" what his boyars were doing to the people. I remember the same thing when Andropov policies failed & were scaled back/stopped, many blamed the local party bosses, not him.

-the FSO is financed by the gov., i.e. the taxpayers of all kinds; many young people have 2-3 jobs to support their parents &/ grandparents receiving low pensions; all those age groups r among the protesters.

With Putin gone the next on the wheel of choice is the commies... do you think they will fix things?-they'll be in a coalition with other parties, if at all. Time will tell!

- if they do, they r morons- how will they handle several new states with nukes? they were lucky when Ukraine & Kazakhstan gave their nukes to Russia.  

Of course they are morons... are you not getting that yet?

Break Syria because we don't like Assad. Break Libya because Gaddafi wont do as we tell him. Break Iraq because we have wanted to kill Saddam for some time. Invade Afghanistan... it was already broken but after 20 years of US rule and billions and billions of dollars, the place is worse than when they went in there.
Now they want to break Iran.
When they invaded Iraq they scrambled to capture the oilfields before all the equipment and systems were damaged... don't worry about the people holed up in the cities... we don't care about them...
Do you think they would care about the Russian people?
Breaking up Russia eliminates it as a threat so its resources can be stolen or bought cheaply and they can focus on breaking China and then India when they grow too big for their boots.- if u think that Navalny doesn't know all that, it's ur other deep mistake.

- it already does with Covid-19/20, refugees, climate change, riots, & moral decline.

It is in denial about all of those things... Russian hackers and Chinese government negligence is blamed for all those things...-PR for domestic consumption!

the reality is that money can change even the greenest most liberal leftie.... and the more money the more conservative and right wing they become...-Navalny could give lectures in W. Europe/US/Canada Aus/NZ & earn more $ than in Russia, even as its president, but still came back as he's a liberal politician now.

- u r full of crap up to ur ears to believe all this trash.

He got a suspended sentence for a crime. - FYI, that sentence since elapsed.
He was therefore essentially under house arrest which he openly flouted repeatedly for months before he got a sore tum tum. He then left the country. -thanks to being poisoned by FSB who then illegally tempered with evidence they got from cops twice.

- then, why return & make his wife a widow& his 2 daughters orphans?

He is no chess master. You give him way more credit than he deserves.-I can say u r giving more credit to Putin than he deserves!

no, Putin is afraid that out of jail he'll lead the opposition.

In 2.5 years time the western media will have forgotten him and moved on. His lack of interest in creating an actual political party..-why not staying as an independent candidate? a party may still form around him or his successor.

U can bet I know his thought process a lot better than u do.

You assume he thinks about what he is doing.-if was brain dead, he wouldn't be in power.

.- FYI, his plan was to unite with Belarus & become a head of the new state, but Lukashenko wanted also to be that head & rotate with PM position, like Medvedev did. Changing the constitution was an emergency measure to keep Putin in power, not to improve the lives of Russians. 

Rubbish, uniting with Belarus was an idea, but was not going to happen suddenly nor any time soon. -& Putin got burned on it; hence the need for new constitution with old presidential terms annuled.

-were those Nazi generals plotting to kill Hitler to save Ms of lives not justified?

They tried to kill hitler because they thought hitler was making bad decisions and would lose them the war. They didn't want to kill hitler to save millions of lives, they wanted to kill hitler to try to win the war... it was a good thing they failed.-wrong: they wanted to save Ms of german lives by making peace with UK & US to better negotiate with, & defend against the USSR.

a while ago I saw a man holding a sign saying "Putler- Kaput!"

So ignorant and dyslexic... why do you mention him? Was it creepy joe biden?-
the association is Putin=Hitler & Kaput in German is "finished, worn out, dead". A Russian in Vladivostok was holding it. These attitudes r not new there.

.- even if it would happen, the people had had enough of him to wait till 2024.

Tough shit. That is how democracy works bitches...-for it to really work, Putin must go!
Maybe Trump needs to stage his own Coup in the US and get some real democracy there?..-he tried it & that train is gone; good riddance!

- their better future as they see it is w/o Putin, & Navalny wants to be their future president. stop mincing words!  

He runs an anti corruption website and is currently in jail... he does not want to be president... too much work.-u seem to know what others want, just don't expect me to buy that.

-Lenin & Stalin also pulled impressive miracles, but cost Ms of lives;

Which makes what Putin has done billions of times more valuable and useful and admirable.- if given a chance, he would kill Ms to stay in power.

that's why it wasn't a miracle but a natural event that the USSR imploded, costing more lost lives.

The USSR imploding wasn't Putins fault.- I never implied that. Oh, I forgot, u r from down under & can't be blamed for having different logical in/abilities!

If Putin stays, the country will stagnate just like it did under Brezhnev, if not worse.

The whole worlds economy is stagnating... something called covid... you might have heard of it.-Putin's rule will add more stagnation & degradation.

You should be more worried about the US... how are its finances looking?- the US $ has an amazing ability to recover, unlike other currencies. if there's a political will, there is a way. there r professional stimulators of the economy here that earn their keep.

So you are telling me and others on this forum what Russia should do and how they should vote, but it is a personal attack on you to suggest I think you think Russian people should follow your advice?- no, it's up to them what to do, I'm just presenting my take & commenting on the situation.

- 1 life lost is too many;

Then Biden needs to be replaced... 5 people were murdered by riot police in Washington... that is five too many in the nazi state that the US has become..-no, Trump would make it a Nazi state. As I said, I'm not going to discuss internal US issues here.

the Putin regime must self-liquidate ASAP or there will be more strife & possibly a civil war, & that's the bottom line.

But nobody has been killed in these Russian protests. -only so far, recall those in Belarus!

Hole wrote:https://www.stalkerzone.org/who-is-responsible-for-stirring-up-anti-putin-protests-in-russia/

miketheterrible wrote:

Hole wrote:https://www.stalkerzone.org/who-is-responsible-for-stirring-up-anti-putin-protests-in-russia/

This was good investigative journalism.

I wonder if the Russian intelligence services was involved in aiding out obtaining the information?

Either case, Ukraine should be punished.  That nation is a thorn in Russia's behind.

Tsavo Lion wrote:46 trillion rubles, or 609 billion dollars - this is exactly how much Putin's geopolitical failures cost the Russians, which brought nothing but the illusion of opposition to the West for Russia itself. Read on the site: https: http://novyny.24tv.ua/skilki-kremlyu

AlfaT8 wrote:

Tsavo Lion wrote:46 trillion rubles, or 609 billion dollars - this is exactly how much Putin's geopolitical failures cost the Russians, which brought nothing but the illusion of opposition to the West for Russia itself. Read on the site: https: http://novyny.24tv.ua/skilki-kremlyu

I'm getting a 404 error and the video doesn't have captions, but looking at the quote i gotta ask, how did Russia's "geopolitical failures" cost around the level of America's yearly total defense budget, not Russia's, but America's.

I need to see the math on this one.  

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:Anyway, it is fully possible that the blogger that got arreated the other day will get another longer sentence, this time for treason, before the current one expires...

Tsavo Lion wrote:No, it's not over yet, & Navalny isn't the only problem for Putin.


[Ret. FSB officer Gennady Gudkov - on the actions of the security forces at the latest protest actions[/b][/url]

One online commenter pushed the conversation still further with a rival theory, arguing that “the main problem is that Russians have a different sense of Navalny’s worth than you.”...

Tsavo Lion wrote:A bill on sanctions against the Russian Federation due to Navalny submitted to the US Congress

Certain oligarchs close to Putin will have their assets seized abroad. It's about time!