Russian Naval Aviation: News

Militarov wrote:

sepheronx wrote:Ka-60 will be kinda hard since right now Russia is just getting its production of VK-2500 going for its current helicopters Ka-52 and Mi-28.  The current ones used for it are French and based from a contract back in 2011 but obviously that wont work now.  So Ka-60 development for military purposes will be pushed back for a couple more years to improve the VK-2500 to Mark III in order to get it powerful enough for the Ka-60.

Well they mentioned K-226 navalised variant but i am not fan of that idea. Mi-14 restart project was also mentioned but its still too big for certain ships, that new replacement for Ka-27 family is also an option but it wont be ready for some years most likely.

Russia's next naval (ASW) helicopter options:

1. Ka-52
2. Ka-31
3. Ka-60
4. New design

Also the Mi-14 can be a good option to take into account in the selection process, surely in the new units there are interesting updates.

Actually they would need 2, depending on ship size. Ideally that new Ka-31 replacement we keep hearing about + Ka-60.

Ka-60 will be kinda hard since right now Russia is just getting its production of VK-2500 going for its current helicopters Ka-52 and Mi-28. The current ones used for it are French and based from a contract back in 2011 but obviously that wont work now. So Ka-60 development for military purposes will be pushed back for a couple more years to improve the VK-2500 to Mark III in order to get it powerful enough for the Ka-60.

sepheronx wrote:Ka-60 will be kinda hard since right now Russia is just getting its production of VK-2500 going for its current helicopters Ka-52 and Mi-28.  The current ones used for it are French and based from a contract back in 2011 but obviously that wont work now.  So Ka-60 development for military purposes will be pushed back for a couple more years to improve the VK-2500 to Mark III in order to get it powerful enough for the Ka-60.

GarryB wrote:
The Ka-27 is the current ASW helo, the Ka-29 is the current troop transport helo, and the Ka-52 is the potential new attack/CAS/AShW helo.

Actually they would need 2, depending on ship size. Ideally that new Ka-31 replacement we keep hearing about + Ka-60.

The Ka-60 looks interesting, but it is a light 2.5 ton payload helo.

GunshipDemocracy wrote:

Militarov wrote:

sepheronx wrote:Ka-60 will be kinda hard since right now Russia is just getting its production of VK-2500 going for its current helicopters Ka-52 and Mi-28.  The current ones used for it are French and based from a contract back in 2011 but obviously that wont work now.  So Ka-60 development for military purposes will be pushed back for a couple more years to improve the VK-2500 to Mark III in order to get it powerful enough for the Ka-60.

Well they mentioned K-226 navalised variant but i am not fan of that idea. Mi-14 restart project was also mentioned but its still too big for certain ships, that new replacement for Ka-27 family is also an option but it wont be ready for some years most likely.

what is wrong with 226?  Ka-226 is not bad option for  small missile/patrol ships. Eventually accompanied by drones like Fregat. About Mi-14 is silence now I guess is dropped out from top priority list now...

Russian Helicopters confirmed that a next-generation naval helicopter is being developed with funding from the Russian Ministry of Defense. During a press briefing that preceded the eighth annual HeliRussia exposition taking place this week, the company also discussed modifications to the existing line of Kamov naval helicopters.

“We have long been lobbying for development of a next-generation rotorcraft for the navy. Today, the R&D effort is ongoing. Kamov has completed the outline design. The project awaits decisions by the defense ministry,” said Andrei Shibitov, deputy general manager for manufacturing and innovations at Russian Helicopters. He declined to confirm previous reports that a first flight could occur in 2018.

Shibitov also played down previous reports that new naval rotorcraft will be based on the Kamov Ka-226 or the Ka-60. “This is a principally new platform with indigenous engines,” he said. But the design will not be made public until the defense ministry permits it, he added.

The Ka-60 medium-lift helicopter first flew in 1998, as a potential replacement for the Mil Mi-2 series. Prototypes were subsequently displayed on various occasions. But although the Ka-60’s two NPO Saturn 1,300-hp RD-600V turboshafts gained certification in December 2003, no production orders were forthcoming. The Ka-60 then provided the basis for a civilian version (designated Ka-62), which was displayed in mockup form from 2012. After repeated delays it made its first flight on April 26, 2016. The Ka-62 would be powered by a pair of Turbomeca Ardiden 3G engines each developing 1,680 hp.

At the press briefing, Andrei Boginsky, deputy minister for industry and trade, said that the French engine is economical and could be license-produced in Russia. But he also suggested that a foreign engine is not acceptable for “certain customers,” presumably meaning the Russian military. Boginsky said that the RD-600V still provides an alternative, if it can be “reworked for higher performance and suitability to both military and civilian customers.” A higher-power version of the Russian engine that produces 1,500 hp is being developed.

Shibitov mentioned the major ongoing modification and refit program for the Ka-27/28/29/31 series being performed at the Russian Helicopters KUMAPE plant in Kumertau. The Russian Navy’s Ka-27 is being modernized as the Ka-27M involving replacement of the radar and antisubmarine warfare suite, enabling use of the Kh-35 antiship missile and modern torpedoes. The Navy conducted Ka-27M operational trials in 2012-2013, and approved the new radar. The modernized helicopter is expected to serve for another 10 to 15 years.

The Ka-28 and Ka-31 are export versions, and the Ka-29 is a land-attack version for support of the marines. The Ka-31 is in service with the Indian and Chinese navies. An improved radar has been fitted to the Ka-31, for longer-range detection range of sea-skimming cruise missiles, resulting in the Ka-31R version. Kamov has also produced a few Ka-31SV versions, for over-land applications such as the location of artillery fire. To date, no firm orders for either new version of the Ka-31 have been announced.

JohninMK wrote:What was so special about the Mi-14 compared with something like a Sea King or other sea optimised medium lift helicopter?

MOSCOW (Sputnik) – The Russian Defense Ministry plans to renew the production of Mi-14 Haze nuclear-capable amphibious anti-submarine helicopters, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said Thursday.

“Yes, work is already being done in regard to this issue,” Borisov told RIA Novosti at the HeliRussia-2016 exposition in Moscow.

The production of the Mi-14s was halted in 1980 and were removed from service in 1996 apparently under US pressure.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20160519/1039881389/russia-military-helicopter.html#ixzz496TELiyf

George1 wrote:Russian Helicopters Developing New Shipborne Chopper to Replace Ka-27

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20160512/1039501009/russian-helicopters-new-replace-ka27.html#ixzz48TZu02Dm

George1 wrote:Russia's next naval (ASW) helicopter options:

1. Ka-52
2. Ka-31
3. Ka-60
4. New design

http://sputniknews.com/military/20160514/1039618244/russian-navy-ka52-ka60.html

Austin wrote:New Russian Naval Helicopter Previewed
by Vladimir Karnozov
- May 17, 2016, 7:28 AM

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2016-05-17/new-russian-naval-helicopter-previewed

The Ka-28 and Ka-31 are export versions, and the Ka-29 is a land-attack version for support of the marines. The Ka-31 is in service with the Indian and Chinese navies. An improved radar has been fitted to the Ka-31, for longer-range detection range of sea-skimming cruise missiles, resulting in the Ka-31R version. Kamov has also produced a few Ka-31SV versions, for over-land applications such as the location of artillery fire. To date, no firm orders for either new version of the Ka-31 have been announced.

Dima wrote:

Austin wrote:New Russian Naval Helicopter Previewed
by Vladimir Karnozov
- May 17, 2016, 7:28 AM

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2016-05-17/new-russian-naval-helicopter-previewed

From the above article

The Ka-28 and Ka-31 are export versions, and the Ka-29 is a land-attack version for support of the marines. The Ka-31 is in service with the Indian and Chinese navies. An improved radar has been fitted to the Ka-31, for longer-range detection range of sea-skimming cruise missiles, resulting in the Ka-31R version. Kamov has also produced a few Ka-31SV versions, for over-land applications such as the location of artillery fire. To date, no firm orders for either new version of the Ka-31 have been announced.

In the case of Syrian conflict I was thinking how to track the terrorists firing their projectiles and was thinking we need to have a airborne Zoopark like stuff probably based on a baloon or something like that. Didn't knew Kamov had such a variant.

http://survincity.com/2011/08/a-rare-photograph-of-the-first-prototype/

George1 wrote:Russia's next naval (ASW) helicopter options:

1. Ka-52
2. Ka-31
3. Ka-60
4. New design

http://sputniknews.com/military/20160514/1039618244/russian-navy-ka52-ka60.html

eehnie wrote:

George1 wrote:Russia's next naval (ASW) helicopter options:

1. Ka-52
2. Ka-31
3. Ka-60
4. New design

http://sputniknews.com/military/20160514/1039618244/russian-navy-ka52-ka60.html

For me the strongest option is the Ka-52, and the second best would be the Ka-31 (variant of the Ka-27).

Not sure if I see the Ka-60/62 as a combat helicopter. Surely I would not order it. In the current ships that have helicopters, there is not need of an smaller (and less powerful) combat helicopter. And in the current ships that have not helicopters, if there is some space, but is not big enough for a Ka-52 or a Ka-31, it is likely to be used for drones of different role and size.

About new designs, I would rule out to begin the design of new projects of combat helicopters that are not unmanned.

eehnie wrote:In my comment combat helicopters was refered to all the forms of combat roles, including ASW.

Of course there are smaller helicopters doing this role but are fairly less powerful, and even more fragile. I do not see advantages of their use. Also I would expect the number of ships that currently have not space for a Ka-31 or Ka-52 but have space for a Ka-60 to be very small. The difference of size is not as big, and the coaxial rotor design of the Ka-31 and Ka-52 reduces the rotor diameter from what would be necessary for its size.

To see it approximately with some numbers from the public data:

Rotor diameter:
14.50m Ka-50/52
14.50m Ka-31
13.50m Ka-60/62

Disc area diameter (the diameter of the total area sweept by the main rotor of an helicopter):
20.51m Ka-50/52 (330.3m2 disc area)
??.??m Ka-31 (I found no data but must be almost the same than for the Ka-50/52)
13.50m Ka-60/62 (143.1m2 disc area)

This want not to be a precise calculus of the space needed by helicopter, but maybe enough to have a proper idea about the space required by every model.

Surely the Ka-60/62 can have more advantage in operational costs (by moving less weight), and it is useful for some non-combat roles like transport operations where is not needed as big takeoff weight. But in shipborne combat roles to use the Ka-60/62 would lead likely to lower shipborne air power by ship except in very few cases.