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Actually can F22 score even 50% against an F15 WVR? I seriously doubt.
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TR1
medo
Austin
Werewolf
magnumcromagnon
Indian Flanker
Hannibal Barca
nemrod
IronsightSniper
Admin
ahmedfire
Viktor
sepheronx
Stalingradcommando
Stealthflanker
GarryB
lulldapull
21 posters
Su-30MK vs USAF Fighters
Hannibal Barca- Posts : 1457
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Hannibal Barca- Posts : 1457
Points : 1467
Join date : 2013-12-13
nemrod wrote:Many US are braged that during this exercice F-15, F-16, F-22 bested indian Su-30MKI.
The excerpts of US swaggering are here : http://vayu-sena.indianmilitaryhistory.org/exercise-red-flag-su-30mki-comparison-fornof.shtml In fact, every US fates is always subject to controverisies. The reality is far to be as shinning as US used to present.
Here is Indian version
http://in.rbth.com/blogs/2014/03/10/dissecting_a_dogfight_sukhoi_vs_usaf_at_red_flag_2008_33623.html
As you notice the results are far to be shinning, and here you realize that US once they confront an adversary with the same force, the results are pitables. I don't mean that US military, or personnel staff are not competent, not at all, they are very professional. But each wars they waged, obliged US leaders to create a coalition and US leaders ensured that they are at least 10 vs 1 against a poor isolated country.
Most of the iraqi fighters downed, were downed because they fled to Iran, and not in engagement. Because, I doubt in that case F-15 could best a Mig-29 with a good pilot.
Against Serbia in 1999, US and Nato have nearly 900 aircraft, and Serbia was inside a hard embargo, lack of spare parts, few Mig were able to fly.
The wars occured in Iraq, and in Serbia will be the lasts for US, next wars will be very very harder.
I would be courious if now US dare a war against Syria, as Russia, is decided more than never to help syrian army.
This time, it won't be a happy end for US, but happy end for us.....
Haven't we the right to laugh in front of the arrongances's collapse ?
Such a prophetic post. My respect and a delayed plus vote:)
Indian Flanker- Posts : 159
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Despite what that F-15 pilot Terrance Fornoff said , actually Indian Flankers did not lose any 1-on-1 dogfights with the F-15 Eagles. According to IAF insiders and eyewitnesses the final score was 20:0 in favour of the flanker.
The only minus area for the Indians was that that the Indian planes were shot down by SAMs, but it also must be remembered that they were operating without any datalink support as well as no EW counter measures.
The only minus area for the Indians was that that the Indian planes were shot down by SAMs, but it also must be remembered that they were operating without any datalink support as well as no EW counter measures.
magnumcromagnon- Posts : 8138
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Indian Flanker wrote:Despite what that F-15 pilot Terrance Fornoff said , actually Indian Flankers did not lose any 1-on-1 dogfights with the F-15 Eagles. According to IAF insiders and eyewitnesses the final score was 20:0 in favour of the flanker.
The only minus area for the Indians was that that the Indian planes were shot down by SAMs, but it also must be remembered that they were operating without any datalink support as well as no EW counter measures.
...Don't worry, India will never have to prove it's MKI's of FGFA T-50's are superior to American F-15's, F-16's, F-22's, F-35's in combat. Instead India will defeat my fellow Americans in the United States in the educational, engineering, and scientific fields...a take over of America via *drum roll* STEALTH!!!1! *ZING*
Last edited by magnumcromagnon on Sun Apr 06, 2014 9:50 am; edited 1 time in total
GarryB- Posts : 40560
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Actually can F22 score even 50% against an F15 WVR? I seriously doubt.
The F-15 is still a very capable aircraft and as long as the F-15 could survive an AMRAAM attack it would always come down to WVR combat where all the expensive advantages of stealth mean nothing... stealth wont stop 20mm cannon shells and the F-15 currently has high off boresight AIM-9X missiles and helmet mounted displays... something the F-22s lack surprisingly... they are snipers and only have pistols for self defence.
US training shows time and time again that an experienced pilot who knows what they are doing and has flown F-15s and F-16s and knows what they can or cannot do can beat one in a very modest aircraft like an F-5.
Indian Flanker- Posts : 159
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Indian MKIs have already proved themselves as they have whacked the US F-15s and F-16s everytime these two sides have done DACT ACMmagnumcromagnon wrote:...Don't worry, India will never have to prove it's MKI's of FGFA T-50's are superior to American F-15's, F-16's, F-22's, F-35's in combat.
I get your drift bro, and yes I know we Indians are very talented, beware YANKSInstead India will defeat my fellow Americans in the United States in the educational, engineering, and scientific fields...a take over of America via *drum roll* STEALTH!!!1! *ZING*
Werewolf- Posts : 5931
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Indian Flanker wrote:
Indian, German, Israeli, and Pakistani pilots are amongst the best when it comes to 1-on-1 dogfighting.
US, UK, French and Russian pilots are also up there.
If I recall as IMF, India will overpass US, but behind China in the economic area in near future. Consequently, India will be very well placed in order to confront China.
I find it a little bit funny to claim Germany, India, Israel and Pakistani are better in dogfights than US,UK and Russia.
Especially Pakistan, the Air Force that is completely incompetent to secure its own Air Space from american killer drones, Pakistan isn't even near the capability of the rest and YFI Germany sucks bad, half the eurofighters are not even in combat ready status, waiting for upgrades since several years.
nemrod- Posts : 839
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Werewolf wrote:
I find it a little bit funny to claim Germany, India, Israel and Pakistani are better in dogfights than US,UK and Russia.
Especially Pakistan, the Air Force that is completely incompetent to secure its own Air Space from american killer drones, Pakistan isn't even near the capability of the rest and YFI Germany sucks bad, half the eurofighters are not even in combat ready status, waiting for upgrades since several years.
To Werewolf.
Noone said pakistanis are better than european or russian, neither anyone. But we point out that giving the fact that the scale of number of candidates, more you have choice, better your selection will be.
In recent past India was considered among very poor countries, limiting its ability to have good pilots, nowadays this assertion, it is completly false, India will be -as we've seen in posts above- one of the main air force in the world, if not the best.
Few words about israelis.
This assertion is not true. If you see, and study seriously what's happenned during israeli-arabs conflit, in air battle, you will see how it is false.
... Israeli,... pilots are amongst the best when it comes to 1-on-1 dogfighting.
Israel has always been provided by the western' state of the of art technology, and fighters bombers, meanwhile it is not the case for the arabs, neither US, or Soviet Union, or Russia -this is the only one thing that i reproach to Russia- provided the same weaponery. Each time regarding arabs technology is a step below than israelis. Simply because if the russians provide nowadays Su-35, or Mig-35, Israel will disapear.
It is easy to claim yourself as an ace, when inside your f-15 c, you can down with BVR Mig 21, or Mig 23 BN -this fighters are not equiped with sensor, or detector against missiles shot-. However, when soviets provide in the end 1983 Mig 23 ML syrian air force, this weapon shift quickly the balance in favour of Syria.
Furthermore, I think it is more shining when a syrian Mig-21' pilot downed -end of seventies-successfully a F-15 above Lebanon. I think it is more comptetent when I listen, or heard an Iraqi pilot inside Mig 25 avoid nearly 10 air to air missile launched by F-15.
Back to our subject Israelis, the myth of "elected people" does not resist to the reality, if US and most of western countries are not behind Israel, for a longtime Israel would have disapeared.
Israelis pilots are not shinning, however, it is possible that, few israelis pilots could be considered as good pilots, but certainly far to be the best pilots.
However, Indians, and chinese could be considered as among the best pilots, because the selection in India is very hard, and maybe the hardest in the world, consequently they could have among the best pilots. I don't mean that german, french, russian, arabs, iranian, US are not good pilots, on contrary.
But more the range number of selection is great, more you have the best chance to get the best pilots, mostly, if you can afford it. India, as China are among richest countries nowadays. Consequently, they could have the best pilots in the world.
Austin- Posts : 7617
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Raptor vs. Flanker from the Malaysian side.
MAN: Turning and burning with the best
MAN: Turning and burning with the best
The Royal Malaysian Air Force and the United States Air Force engage in an air combat exercise called Cope Taufan. Haris Hussain joins the ‘furball’
“FIGHT’s on! Fight’s on!”
‘Mogwai’ immediately picks up his target off the port side. He’s chugging along at a fairly fast clip. Together, the closure speed of both aircraft is nudging north of 900 knots.
As the two fighters merge and pass within an eyelash of each other in a blur of black and grey, Mogwai doesn’t even have time to flinch as he rolls the jet, yanks the control stick back into his gut and reefs his big fighter into an eye-wateringly tight left turn.
G-forces rip into his body and Mogwai sucks in a lungful of oxygen as he cranes his neck to keep his adversary, a United States Air Force Lockheed Martin F-22A Raptor, square in his sights.
He works the throttles and makes constant changes to the engine settings. His eyes are fixed on the target but one eyeball is cocked to the airspeed reading on his heads-up display (HUD). At this turn rate, he’s bleeding off airspeed and energy like they’re going out of style. Dogfighting is all about energy management.
The two jets are in a classic turning fight at 15,000 feet (4.57km) over the air combat range in Grik, Perak. Mogwai and ‘Smegs’, his weapons systems officer (whizzo in RMAF parlance), are flying the Royal Malaysian Air Force’s latest and most capable aircraft, the Sukhoi Su-30MKM Super Flanker multirole fighter.
Outside, the twin nozzles of their thrust-vectoring Lyulka AL-31FP engines crank up at a crazy angle and Mogwai begins to “walk up” the nose of his huge fighter onto the Raptor’s centre fuselage.
Up front, Mogwai eyeballs the Raptor, which is also blessed with thrust-vector control, but only in the pitch plane. The target designator box (TDB) on his HUD is locked onto the stealth fighter. The trick now is for Mogwai to bring the “pipper” or gunsight square inside the TDB before he can squeeze off a shot. In the back seat, Smegs provides a running commentary of the unfolding fight.
“Makan dia! Makan dia, beb! Lagi! Lagi! Lagi!” Smegs yells into the hot mike in his Ulmer oxygen mask. His job is that of part tactician, analysing the threat picture, part cheerleader, pushing his pilot on, and as an extra pair of eyes for Mogwai.
This particular evolution is a 1v1 (one-versus-one) engagement, which calls for the employment of short-range air-to-air missiles or guns. The Raptor is armed with the AIM-9M Sidewinder heat-homer and an internal, six-barrel, Gatling-type 20mm M-61A Vulcan cannon. The Super Flanker is carrying the super-agile Vympel R-73 Archer air-to-air missile and has the 30mm, single-barrel Gsh-301 cannon embedded in the starboard leading edge root extension (LERX).
Launching off from Fightertown RMAF Butterworth, this is the second engagement for the two fighters as part of the biggest air combat exercise in the country. Called Cope Taufan, the joint biennial exercise between the RMAF and the USAF is primarily to enhance bilateral training in a realistic environment, ramp up combined readiness, and improve interoperatability between the two fighting forces. In the first “hop” earlier, the advantage went to the Sukhoi boys. Because both aircraft were still hauling bags of gas, the exercise director gave the go-ahead for another fight.
‘GUNS,GUNS,GUNS!’
The outcome of a dogfight hinges on a number of things — the aircraft’s aerodynamic and engine performance, fuel load, the position of the sun, the individual aircrews’ learning curve and the ability to adapt and react to a fluid and rapidly changing set of circumstances. The advantage enjoyed by one aircrew could be lost and shift over to the adversary in the blink of an eye. A gun track can last only one or two seconds. Miss that shot and you’re toast.
Just as Mogwai is close to getting a gun solution on the Raptor, the USAF pilot rolls his jet level and pitches the nose up in a high-G manoeuvre. Vortices stream from his wing root as moisture is literally squeezed from the air. The American plugs the afterburners on his twin Pratt and Whitney F-119 turbofan engines and his nozzles belch out tongues of blue flame. He goes vertical and grabs sky like a homesick angel.
“Pacak! Pacak! Dia pacak, bai!” screams Smegs, as he instinctively grabs the speed handles on his instrument panel in anticipation of the onslaught of Gs. Pacak, in RMAF fighter lingo, is to go vertical. Mogwai sees the move but he’s nanoseconds too late. The Raptor has so much excess thrust that by the time Mogwai bangs on the throttles and selects Zone 5 on the afterburner, he and Smegs might just as well have been talking to themselves because the Raptor is looong gone...
STEEP LEARNING CURVE
Back on the ground, the RMAF pilots whom Life&Times spoke to said the training and experience they received in the two weeks of Cope Taufan was invaluable.
“The objective of these types of exercises is not to see who wins or loses. It’s more of an opportunity for us to learn new things and expand our mission scenarios and capabilities. It also gives us a chance to validate our procedures,” said a Super Flanker pilot.
Sometimes, they have to make things up as they go along. For instance, fighter pilots use what is called EM or energy manoeuvring charts to figure out how best to tackle an adversary.
“We had EM charts on the F-15s but had nothing on the Raptors, since it is still highly classified. So we had to rely on other sources, go online and even make educated guesses based on the aircraft design to come up with a plan to capitalise on its weaknesses,” added the Sukhoi driver.
“There were a lot of things that we learnt from the Americans. The use of large force employment, planning of strike packages and, overall, how to use our forces effectively were some of the lessons we learnt from Cope Taufan,” added an F/A-18D Hornet pilot with No 18 Squadron, based in Butterworth.
A MiG-29N fighter pilot with the famed Smokey Bandits squadron, home ported in RMAF Kuantan, summed it up best.
“Bro, both sides’ learning curve went right through the roof. On the first day! We both went home with a mutual and healthy respect for each other’s capabilities. And to have these (USAF) guys say that we were s*** hot is the biggest compliment you could give a fighter jock.”
Note: For security reasons, the call signs of the aircrew are fictitious and the engagement is a composite of several dogfights as recounted by RMAF pilots.
Star attractions
THE star attractions for this edition of Cope Taufan were undoubtedly the United States Air Force’s Lockheed Martin F-22A Raptor and the Royal Malaysian Air Force’s Sukhoi Su-30MKM Super Flanker multirole fighter.
For the Americans, the Su-30 is an exotic beast, blessed with immense power and agility.
The Russian type’s nose-pointing ability, thanks to its thrust-vector and fly-by-wire flight control system, is second-to-none.
If there’s one aircraft that can pose a serious threat to the USAF in the air-to-air arena, it would be this baby.
On the flip side, the prospect of going head-to-head with the world’s only fully operational, fifth-generation stealth fighter sent RMAF pilots into a tizzy. Many were itching to go up against this much-vaunted fighter. Although the results of the engagements were classified, it was learnt that several RMAF jet jocks acquitted themselves well against the Raptor.
The F-22As are from the 154th Wing, Joint Base Pearl Harbor-Hickam, Hawaii and are the only Air National Guard unit equipped with the type. They were joined by a number of Boeing F-15C Eagles from the 131st Fighter Squadron, 104th Fighter Wing, Barnes Air National Guard Base, Massachusetts, and other support units.
While RMAF pilots had tangled with the Eagles in previous exercises, Cope Taufan 2014 was the Raptors’ first outing in Southeast Asia.
Cope Taufan is a biennial large force employment exercise designed to improve the US’s and Malaysia’s combined readiness.This year’s edition from June 9-20, collectively involved close to 1,000 personnel.
medo- Posts : 4343
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So, according to this article Malaysian Su-30MKM is practically in pair with F-22A in dogfight, although it have weaker engines than domestic Su-30SM and Su-35. Considering, that equipment in domestic Su-30SM is better than in export Su-30MKI/MKM, not to say about Su-35, producing enough big number of Su-30SM and Su-35 (like 200 each) will be enough to neutralize F-22A in USAF. PAK FA will have even better capabilities and will together with Su-30SM and Su-35 create excellent defense of Russian air space.
I think, if F-22A win over Su-30MKM in this exercise we would already see in medias, how F-22A shot down Su-30MKM in exercise and how much better it is than anything Russia produce.
I think, if F-22A win over Su-30MKM in this exercise we would already see in medias, how F-22A shot down Su-30MKM in exercise and how much better it is than anything Russia produce.
TR1- Posts : 5435
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The engines are identical to domestic SM.
medo- Posts : 4343
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TR1 wrote:The engines are identical to domestic SM.
This is somehow strange, considering that in that case Su-27SM and Su-30M2 have more powerful engines AL-31FM1 than Su-30SM, specially when AL-31FM1 is available with TVC. Maybe it have the same designation AL-31FP, but the engine itself could be more powerful one. Su-30SM is heavier than Su-30M2, so it need stronger engines, specially because it is domestic fighter.
TR1- Posts : 5435
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Yep, I can only guess they did it for reasons of cost and speed of delivery.
They reported they were buying FP for the SM order however, so I am 100% sure it is an identical set.
TBH thrust is not as interesting to me as much as engine life and MTBO. I don't think FP is as good as newer engines like 117S, but it is mounted on an airframe with obviously much increased service life than vanilla Flanker. Weird combination, but I guess the price makes up for shorter engine life.
They reported they were buying FP for the SM order however, so I am 100% sure it is an identical set.
TBH thrust is not as interesting to me as much as engine life and MTBO. I don't think FP is as good as newer engines like 117S, but it is mounted on an airframe with obviously much increased service life than vanilla Flanker. Weird combination, but I guess the price makes up for shorter engine life.
max steel- Posts : 2930
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After 6 Years, IAF’s Sukhoi-30 will visit United States next April.
US ambassador Richard Verma while speaking at the Defence Services Staff College in Wellington, Tamil Nadu. said the Indian air force would be participating in air exercises code-named Red Flag and hosted by the US in April at Nellis Air Force Base in the state of Nevada. India would be taking part in the exercises after a gap of six years, he said.
8
Near realistic Red Flag Exercise will be held at the Nellis Air Force Base in the deserts of Nevada. Red Flag exercise is usually held every three months for a duration of around two weeks, and it generally involves NATO allies of the US.
India last time had sent eight SU 30 MKIs of the elite 20 Squadron, along with two IL 78 midair tankers and one IL 76 heavy lift aircraft along with 91 officers and 156 other ranks. The contingent covered a distance of 19000 km after leaving the home base of Pune.
SU 30 MKIs flew nearly 140 sorties while the IL 78 and Il 76 flew 26 missions each at the last Red Flag Exercise and first-time participation of formidable Russian-built Sukhoi in a US air force exercise created lot of curiosity among USAF personnel and media but IAF did not disclose the full potential of the SU 30 MKIs, as secrecy of some of the systems and their operations had to be maintained.
Expect another scandalous video to appear judging
max steel- Posts : 2930
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Over to Alaska | Ex:RedFlag
IAF’s SU-30 MKI
IAF’s C-17
IAF’s SU-30 MKI
IAF’s C-17
max steel- Posts : 2930
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F-22 versus Su-30 MKI
After flying through Bahrain, Egypt, France, Portugal and Canada, 12 Indian Air Force aircraft, including the Russian origin Su-30 MKI, reached the United States to take part in the prestigious Red Flag air exercise.
The planes, which arrived in Eielson Air Force Base in Alaska, will take part in the exercise starting on April 28 and will undertake war games along with NATO forces.
Four each of Sukhois and deep penetration Jaguars, two C-17 transport plans and two mid-air refuellers IL-78 travelled through Bahrain, Egypt, France, Portugal and Canada before finally reaching Alaska.
The air exercise, which will last till May 13, is seen as a complex and advanced network centric operation — the toughest test for flying machines and men.
This is the second time that India is participating in such an exercise after 2008.
Due to high costs, the Indian Air Force had decided to take part in the exercise once every five years. It was scheduled to take part in the 2013 edition but the exercise was cancelled by the US following budget cuts.
After flying through Bahrain, Egypt, France, Portugal and Canada, 12 Indian Air Force aircraft, including the Russian origin Su-30 MKI, reached the United States to take part in the prestigious Red Flag air exercise.
The planes, which arrived in Eielson Air Force Base in Alaska, will take part in the exercise starting on April 28 and will undertake war games along with NATO forces.
Four each of Sukhois and deep penetration Jaguars, two C-17 transport plans and two mid-air refuellers IL-78 travelled through Bahrain, Egypt, France, Portugal and Canada before finally reaching Alaska.
The air exercise, which will last till May 13, is seen as a complex and advanced network centric operation — the toughest test for flying machines and men.
This is the second time that India is participating in such an exercise after 2008.
Due to high costs, the Indian Air Force had decided to take part in the exercise once every five years. It was scheduled to take part in the 2013 edition but the exercise was cancelled by the US following budget cuts.
Godric- Posts : 802
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has the F-22 actually been in any combat ... i've seen news of them being deployed never being used
max steel- Posts : 2930
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Yes F-22 was used by US in operation Inherent Resolve in Iraq against ISIS where F-22 was used to drop bombs.
nemrod- Posts : 839
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As U guess Iam not a fan of this feudalist and barbaric -middle age- regime of Pakistan, nevertheless, truth should be said. If indeed there are many competent pakistanis pilots, this is sure, the fact that US drone kill thousands of civilian pakistanis could not be done without the agreement between US governement, and so called "governement" of Pakistani. A bunch of drug dealers. Saying this it is obvious that more you have candidates, if you have money, U have surely among the best pilots. Pakistan has much applicants, but has no money, the stream of dollars comes from arabian Gulf states.Werewolf wrote:
Especially Pakistan, the Air Force that is completely incompetent to secure its own Air Space from american killer drones, Pakistan isn't ...
True and false. True because the complexity of Eurofighters engines, and avionics are very, very well advanced and need constant upgrades. If you see it is the same problem for the Rafale, F-15, F-22 etc...and SU-30 MKI. Indians used to complain because they could fly only 40% of their fleet of SU-30 MKI. It is far better than the availabilty of F-22's fleet that could not exceed in the best cases 20%.Werewolf wrote:
...and YFI Germany sucks bad, half the eurofighters are not even in combat ready status, waiting for upgrades since several years.
Werewolf wrote:
I find it a little bit funny to claim Germany, India, Israel ....US,UK and Russia.
What it amazed me when we used to mention israelis pilots among the best of the world beside the greatest nations. Mostly because Israel had never won by itself. Except the surprise attack of june 1967. In 1948, as in 1973 western pilots and americains fought with Israel. It is evident, Israel is a small state at most few millions, in few sample U cannot have the best pilots, because your possibilty of choice is restraint. it is clearly impossible to have the best pilots, except if Meshaa did miracles....But talking about Israel we are never far of legends.
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Reportedly they dropped JDAMs on empty buildings as far away as possible from any Syrian operated anti-aircraft and then hurried off home again. If the SAA had had a chance, I think they would have taken it, had the aircraft come within firing range.Godric wrote:has the F-22 actually been in any combat ... i've seen news of them being deployed never being used
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rare
Exercise Red Flag
The IAF Team Sets Course Back at the end of a ‘Perfect Flag’
Red Flag Alaska 16-1, which was an advanced aerial combat training exercise hosted at Eielson Air Force Base, Alaska (a successor to the previous COPE THUNDER exercise series) held in the Alaska region, concluded on 14 May 16. The main phase of the exercise had commenced on 28 Apr 16 with a mix of combat and support elements participating from IAF, USAF and USN. Over the last decade, IAF has been actively participating in various operational exercises hosted by various countries wherein its capabilities has been pitted against the best air forces in the world. While referring to the overall exercise plan and objective Red Flag Alaska 16-1 the Team Leader Gp Capt H Assudani said, “(the) Objective of this inter-continental deployment was not only to showcase IAF capability in undertaking Integrated Air Ops but also to imbibe operational lessons from the exercise engagements which will help us add more teeth to our overall war waging capabilities”.
The exercise is played under multiple simulated scenario designed to provide realistic settings. The overall demarcation is between Red Force (simulated as the Defensive force component fighting to protect own airspace and assets) and the Blue Force (simulated as the Offensive composite package). The Red Forces was mainly constituted by the 18 Sqn Aggressor Sqn flying the F-16s. The IAF along with the other USAF (F-15, F-16, F-22) and USN (F-18) constituted the Blue force. During the exercise IAF also flew as a part of the Red Force alongside the Aggressors which was a first of its kind.
The Exercise saw the IAF’s potent SU-30 MKI aircraft participating in Offensive Counter Air Ops in which they provided Escort cover to the strike elements. Apart from this, the IAF Jaguars DARIN II undertook integrated strike missions dropping practice bombs over the world renowned JPARC Air to Ground Range). Both these fleets performed their roles exceptionally well. There were three missions commanded by Indian Airforce in this exercise. Mission commanders of both the Jaguars and Su 30s were involved in planning, execution and conduct of debrief. One of the missions was commanded by Sqn Ldr Sidhu, who while speaking on the mission said that “it was a great opportunity to lead all the coalition forces. It gives one an immense satisfaction when all the participants execute the briefed plan which becomes a success”.
While talking about the IAF in the red flag exercise Lt Col Brian Toth, Chief operations officer of 354 operations group said “ The IAFs participation has been extremely good from my perspective. For most nations it takes an exercise or two to step up to meet the requirements of a Mission commander. The IAF has been mission commander three times and also performed the package commander roles and they have done a tremendous job”.
During the exercise a set of Red Flag team formed the `white Force’ & using high tech instrumentation and mission debrief tools were used to evaluate the performance of the participants in an objective and logical manner. The White Force watched the entire exercise in real time on tactical displays in the operations room on ground. Kill removal (removal of the pilots and aircraft assumed shot by the enemy) made the exercise more realistic.
The temperatures were sub-zero during a large part of the exercise which posed a challenge to the maintenance team. The team kept all the aircraft fully serviceable and mission capable at all times. It is noteworthy that despite the challenging environment, the maintenance team ensured 100% serviceability of all platforms throughout the four weeks. Lt Col Clarence McRae, the RED FLAG-Alaska 16-1 Expeditionary Forces Maintenance Group commander said "RED FLAG-Alaska provided all of the participants a fantastic opportunity to train with members of the Indian Air Force. The exchange of lessons learned and best practices with our partners in the Indo-Asia-Pacific region have enabled us to strengthen our partnership and signifies our commitment to this area of operations. The professionalism of the IAF airmen made bolstering our countries' relationship easy and helped provide realistic combat training for all participants". The Senior Engineering Officers of the IAF units were happy with the comprehensive IAF technical practices which are well defined and meticulous. Adherence to these have ensured a high tarmac availability that allowed aircrew to perform their missions. Wg Cdr Pratyush Anand, SEO of SU-30 Sqn said, “out of box thinking of the technicians has earned praise from all quarters. The participating airmen got an opportunity to see a variety of aircraft and this exposure and interaction with other fleets will go a long way in evolving our own practices”.
In the closing address Col William Culver 354th Fighter Wing Vice Cdr said ”this was one of the best Red flags I has seen. I compliment the exceptional standards displayed by the IAF and am amazed to see all the ten aircraft IAF had brought (4 Su30s, 4 Jaguars and 2 IL-78s) maintaining 100% serviceability for the entire four weeks and their aircraft flying on all days as per plan”.
Wg Cdr Saumitra Tamaskar Exercise Director said “Having set out with well-defined objectives, the IAF contingent’s effort over the past month has ensured that they take back important lessons which will help undertake operations across a wide and diverse spectrum and meet any future challenges”.
The Contingent will start their de-induction phase on 14 May 16 and are planned to return to India in the last week of May 16. The Su-30s will additionally participate in exercise ‘Desert Eagle II’ with UAE Air Force on their way back.
Exercise Red Flag
The IAF Team Sets Course Back at the end of a ‘Perfect Flag’
Red Flag Alaska 16-1, which was an advanced aerial combat training exercise hosted at Eielson Air Force Base, Alaska (a successor to the previous COPE THUNDER exercise series) held in the Alaska region, concluded on 14 May 16. The main phase of the exercise had commenced on 28 Apr 16 with a mix of combat and support elements participating from IAF, USAF and USN. Over the last decade, IAF has been actively participating in various operational exercises hosted by various countries wherein its capabilities has been pitted against the best air forces in the world. While referring to the overall exercise plan and objective Red Flag Alaska 16-1 the Team Leader Gp Capt H Assudani said, “(the) Objective of this inter-continental deployment was not only to showcase IAF capability in undertaking Integrated Air Ops but also to imbibe operational lessons from the exercise engagements which will help us add more teeth to our overall war waging capabilities”.
The exercise is played under multiple simulated scenario designed to provide realistic settings. The overall demarcation is between Red Force (simulated as the Defensive force component fighting to protect own airspace and assets) and the Blue Force (simulated as the Offensive composite package). The Red Forces was mainly constituted by the 18 Sqn Aggressor Sqn flying the F-16s. The IAF along with the other USAF (F-15, F-16, F-22) and USN (F-18) constituted the Blue force. During the exercise IAF also flew as a part of the Red Force alongside the Aggressors which was a first of its kind.
The Exercise saw the IAF’s potent SU-30 MKI aircraft participating in Offensive Counter Air Ops in which they provided Escort cover to the strike elements. Apart from this, the IAF Jaguars DARIN II undertook integrated strike missions dropping practice bombs over the world renowned JPARC Air to Ground Range). Both these fleets performed their roles exceptionally well. There were three missions commanded by Indian Airforce in this exercise. Mission commanders of both the Jaguars and Su 30s were involved in planning, execution and conduct of debrief. One of the missions was commanded by Sqn Ldr Sidhu, who while speaking on the mission said that “it was a great opportunity to lead all the coalition forces. It gives one an immense satisfaction when all the participants execute the briefed plan which becomes a success”.
While talking about the IAF in the red flag exercise Lt Col Brian Toth, Chief operations officer of 354 operations group said “ The IAFs participation has been extremely good from my perspective. For most nations it takes an exercise or two to step up to meet the requirements of a Mission commander. The IAF has been mission commander three times and also performed the package commander roles and they have done a tremendous job”.
During the exercise a set of Red Flag team formed the `white Force’ & using high tech instrumentation and mission debrief tools were used to evaluate the performance of the participants in an objective and logical manner. The White Force watched the entire exercise in real time on tactical displays in the operations room on ground. Kill removal (removal of the pilots and aircraft assumed shot by the enemy) made the exercise more realistic.
The temperatures were sub-zero during a large part of the exercise which posed a challenge to the maintenance team. The team kept all the aircraft fully serviceable and mission capable at all times. It is noteworthy that despite the challenging environment, the maintenance team ensured 100% serviceability of all platforms throughout the four weeks. Lt Col Clarence McRae, the RED FLAG-Alaska 16-1 Expeditionary Forces Maintenance Group commander said "RED FLAG-Alaska provided all of the participants a fantastic opportunity to train with members of the Indian Air Force. The exchange of lessons learned and best practices with our partners in the Indo-Asia-Pacific region have enabled us to strengthen our partnership and signifies our commitment to this area of operations. The professionalism of the IAF airmen made bolstering our countries' relationship easy and helped provide realistic combat training for all participants". The Senior Engineering Officers of the IAF units were happy with the comprehensive IAF technical practices which are well defined and meticulous. Adherence to these have ensured a high tarmac availability that allowed aircrew to perform their missions. Wg Cdr Pratyush Anand, SEO of SU-30 Sqn said, “out of box thinking of the technicians has earned praise from all quarters. The participating airmen got an opportunity to see a variety of aircraft and this exposure and interaction with other fleets will go a long way in evolving our own practices”.
In the closing address Col William Culver 354th Fighter Wing Vice Cdr said ”this was one of the best Red flags I has seen. I compliment the exceptional standards displayed by the IAF and am amazed to see all the ten aircraft IAF had brought (4 Su30s, 4 Jaguars and 2 IL-78s) maintaining 100% serviceability for the entire four weeks and their aircraft flying on all days as per plan”.
Wg Cdr Saumitra Tamaskar Exercise Director said “Having set out with well-defined objectives, the IAF contingent’s effort over the past month has ensured that they take back important lessons which will help undertake operations across a wide and diverse spectrum and meet any future challenges”.
The Contingent will start their de-induction phase on 14 May 16 and are planned to return to India in the last week of May 16. The Su-30s will additionally participate in exercise ‘Desert Eagle II’ with UAE Air Force on their way back.
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Isos
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You do not know many things so pls stop posting this trash here. In close combat like 1V1 in guns only combat, Su-30MKI has fucked Rafale hollow. In BVR combat Rafale has scored over Su-30MKI due to the OSF and proud engine exhaust of SU-30MKI which make it visible to Rafale systems from a fairly long range. But in all those BVR combats, Rafale was flying clean and Su-30MKI did not use its radar. Let us wait for the day when a loaded Su-30MKI meets a loaded Rafale in combat with no limitations in use of radar and missiles. I can tell you that you will find yourself as stupid that day as USAF found itself after the disintegration of German wall w.r.t Russian missile tech.
A post of a guy on indian forum about Garuda exercice. Is this true ? does anyone have informations about the results ?
edit: the guy is called vstol jockey and according to some guys from a french forum that follows his discussions he is MoD adviser.