Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


+23
Singular_trafo
GarryB
Hole
George1
Scorpius
AlfaT8
medo
lancelot
GunshipDemocracy
Swgman_BK
andalusia
PhSt
Rodion_Romanovic
flamming_python
caveat emptor
JohninMK
thegopnik
sepheronx
Isos
Belisarius
zepia
kvs
Kiko
27 posters

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    lancelot
    lancelot


    Posts : 3147
    Points : 3143
    Join date : 2020-10-18

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  lancelot Wed Jul 26, 2023 10:22 pm

    Those builders sure work quick. The outer construction of what was supposed to be the 28nm fab north of Nm-Tech in Zelenograd is nearly finished.

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Image72

    Who knows what they will put inside the building though. They clearly must have some plan, since the construction continued, and was even sped up, when a lot of people speculated that because of lack of machine tools they would stop the project.

    I also found this curious notice on the Crocus Nano website.

    http://crocusnano.com/en/to-the-attention-of-the-media
    03 July
    TO THE ATTENTION OF THE MEDIA
    Crocus Nanoelectronics LLC (the Company) is a manufacturer of integrated circuits and electronic components on 300mm wafers with design standards of 90/65nm for the final production cycle. The main products of the Company were magnetoresistive memory, integral passive components, interposers (connectors) and magnetic sensors.

    Until 2021, the Company provided services of development of technological processes and production services to foreign and Russian companies.

    In the end of 2021, the Company took part in a major technological project, transferring all its production equipment and its unique technological team of Russian specialists to that project.

    Currently, the Company is implementing a plan approved by its owners, which plan assumes fulfillment of certain business tasks. The Company expects to fulfill the indicators set forth in the plan.

    The management of the Company assesses the Company’s state as suitable for continuing operation up until its full integration into the new technological project.

    Additional information will be disclosed once conditions under the laws of the Russian Federation for restricting access to Company-related information cease to exist.

    GarryB, flamming_python, xeno, kvs, GunshipDemocracy, Sprut-B, gc3762 and like this post

    Kiko
    Kiko


    Posts : 3870
    Points : 3946
    Join date : 2020-11-11
    Age : 75
    Location : Brasilia

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  Kiko Fri Aug 04, 2023 1:29 am

    Russian NtechLab delivered face recognition system to 220 Indian cities 08.03.2023.

    The Russian company NtechLab has delivered a face recognition system to 220 cities in India.
    Liana Meliksetyan, international commercial director of NtechLab, told about this, as TASS informs.

    It is noted that these systems will be used for exams in schools in India. 

    “At the first stage, NtechLab supplied licenses for the use of a face recognition system for 5 thousand video surveillance cameras,” the message says.

    Earlier, NtechLab announced that a neural network would appear in Russia to search for pets .

    It was also reported that a silhouette recognition system is being introduced in the Moscow region.

    https://russian.rt.com/world/news/1183409-indiya-rossiya-sistema

    GarryB, flamming_python, xeno, GunshipDemocracy, gc3762 and Belisarius like this post

    PhSt
    PhSt


    Posts : 1456
    Points : 1462
    Join date : 2019-04-02
    Location : Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  PhSt Fri Aug 04, 2023 4:10 am

    lancelot wrote:Those builders sure work quick. The outer construction of what was supposed to be the 28nm fab north of Nm-Tech in Zelenograd is nearly finished.


    Even before the start of the SMO, Western narrative has always been about Russia not having the know how and capacity to build equipment that manufactures chips like the fabs of TMSC in Taiwan. I always wondered how a country like Russia which has the industrial capability to build space rockets, nuclear subs, has its own aviation industry etc, and  yet has to rely on mostly western technology and fabs to manufacture their chips, perhaps the former Soviet Union didn't invest enough efforts in this area but still one would imagine it shouldn't take this long for Russia to catch up with major fab manufacturers and develop its own indigenous chip manufacturing capability.

    Of course, most of the talk about Russia lagging in this field could also be a product of NATO disinformation, hopefully these new fab factories on Russian soil give Russia what it needs to be on par with its NATO adversaries.

    sepheronx, kvs, gc3762 and Belisarius like this post

    AlfaT8
    AlfaT8


    Posts : 2488
    Points : 2479
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  AlfaT8 Mon Aug 14, 2023 1:11 pm

    Tell me kvs.

    flamming_python, kvs and PhSt like this post

    kvs
    kvs


    Posts : 15847
    Points : 15982
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Turdope's Kanada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  kvs Mon Aug 14, 2023 2:10 pm

    The MHz figure for a processor reflects its architecture and is not an intrinsic metric like many think it is. Short pipeline, wide designs
    such as the VLIW Elbrus will have intrinsically smaller clock rates because they have more complexity in every pipeline stage that obviously
    take longer to execute. Long pipeline processors such as the Pentium 4 have simpler stages that take less time to execute. The
    CPU component scale obviously matters, but for the same fabrication process the above applies.

    I believe the Elbrus was not subjected to the sort of mask layout optimization that Intel achieves with its processors which it produces
    at its own fabs. MCST was contracting TSMC for production of 28 nm parts and used library transistor layouts (at the first organizational
    level above individual transistors). So the clock frequency is not as high as it could be.

    Anyway, the Russian government should have helped overcome the super high costs of fabrication development and infrastructure if
    it wanted self-sufficiency. The costs are the reason that AMD and other companies have gone "fabless". The small Russian market plus
    legacy problems made imports "optimal" from an economics point of view.


    flamming_python, GunshipDemocracy, Rodion_Romanovic, Sprut-B, PhSt and lancelot like this post

    sepheronx
    sepheronx


    Posts : 8834
    Points : 9094
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 35
    Location : Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  sepheronx Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:08 am

    Just a note

    If Russia was failing in semiconductors, then they wouldn't be actively developing semiconductors and microprocessors. Instead, new facility for 28nm is near completion, they are opening a new facility for 200mm wafers production, and now gazprombank and others are (as of june) switching to using elbrus microprocessors and Linux OS and should be finished by 2025. That's just MCST mind you. There are others.

    GarryB, kvs, Sprut-B, PhSt, lancelot, Kiko and Broski like this post

    AlfaT8
    AlfaT8


    Posts : 2488
    Points : 2479
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  AlfaT8 Wed Aug 16, 2023 12:58 pm

    Any news on Quantum computing developments in Russia?
    GarryB
    GarryB


    Posts : 40515
    Points : 41015
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  GarryB Thu Aug 17, 2023 3:39 am

    The shift in sanctions will force Russians to invest in their own production, and western sanctions will force rich Russians to invest in the Russian economy instead of exotic places in Europe and the US.

    We have not seen Russian production of modern sophisticated weapons suddenly stop... in fact it has increased massively, so while children of all ages who want a new gaming computer might have limited options the rest of us will be fine... and China is also suffering the same pressure from the west so they will be funding their own solutions as well.

    Actually a bit of cooperation with China where it is agreed both with fund and both will develop and both will share the results might be a good thing moving forward.

    In the shorter term if they develop things faster then Russia could buy from them until their own projects start to deliver at a useful rate and vice versa... Russian production can be bought in the Chinese market and the Russian market could get a lot of its consumer goods from Chinese and Russian companies.

    PhSt and Broski like this post

    GunshipDemocracy
    GunshipDemocracy


    Posts : 6165
    Points : 6185
    Join date : 2015-05-17
    Location : fishin on Stalin´s Strait between Mexico and Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  GunshipDemocracy Thu Aug 17, 2023 8:21 am

    GarryB wrote:The shift in sanctions will force Russians to invest in their own production, and western sanctions will force rich Russians to invest in the Russian economy instead of exotic places in Europe and the US.

    .

    it's true with state's owned companies with oligarchs it might be different they still transfer billions abroad and still living in London of in the USA. Friedman, Aven- alpha bank - "isreali businessmen" yet suckign billions from Russia, Volozh not even Russian citizen cofounder os Yandex -israeli kazakh businessman,

    Prokhorov USA isreali businessman- so about "Russian industrialists" - all money to west and almost everyone Israeli citizenship with friends like this you dont need really enemies. No wonder they were for Russia weak and buying form west - they can exploit resoruces and not becoming "US Isreali" oligarchs. All in family isnt it?

    I hope Putin survives their pressure and forces some to reinvest in Russia or at least flee to their beloved Israel. While building own pro Russian business class wanting to invest n Russia.

    sepheronx, GarryB, flamming_python, Sprut-B, PhSt, Broski and Belisarius like this post

    kvs
    kvs


    Posts : 15847
    Points : 15982
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Turdope's Kanada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  kvs Thu Aug 17, 2023 12:07 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:Any news on Quantum computing developments in Russia?

    Russia is "behind" in terms of the number of qubits that its experimental prototypes have.  

    https://thequantuminsider.com/2023/07/25/russian-company-presents-16-qubit-quantum-computer/

    1) There are no general purpose quantum computers and all of them today are similar to analog computers which are
    functional only for specific algorithms.   You can't write up a source code, compile it and run it.  

    2) Quantum computers look like ternary systems but the 3rd state is continuous.   If a general purpose computer can
    be developed it will likely have a ternary instead of binary logic basis.   (https://arxiv.org/pdf/2204.01000 discusses
    this issue and other issues such as the sensitivity of quantum computers to corruption.)

    3) Russian efforts today are to develop quantum communication networks for data protection.   You always hear
    about how quantum computers can crack any password, but this is rather meaningless since you can't interface
    a quantum computer with a regular computer this way.   A quantum computer can't guess the right password
    which you can enter into a regular computer to gain access.   Quantum computers can be used to crack encryption
    which is a different problem akin to translation of Mayan hieroglyphs.  

    There is way too much hype around quantum computers.   People talk as if they are practical and the revolution
    is around the corner.   Let's wait until an actual general purpose quantum computer is developed.

    sepheronx, GarryB, flamming_python, AlfaT8, GunshipDemocracy, zardof, Sprut-B and like this post

    Scorpius
    Scorpius


    Posts : 1569
    Points : 1569
    Join date : 2020-11-06
    Age : 37

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty so while children of all ages who

    Post  Scorpius Thu Sep 07, 2023 3:59 pm

    GarryB wrote: so while children of all ages who want a new gaming computer might have limited options the rest of us will be fine...

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Image

    This is the composition of my PC, which I updated in October 2022. I did not have any problems with the selection of components. Since last fall, the availability of components has not deteriorated.

    GarryB, kvs, GunshipDemocracy and lancelot like this post

    sepheronx
    sepheronx


    Posts : 8834
    Points : 9094
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 35
    Location : Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  sepheronx Thu Sep 21, 2023 4:49 pm

    Since this thread is about Russian semiconductor development, and not Chinas, is there any other news? Last I heard is MCST is proposing a Elbrus B processor - advanced high power processor on older nodes. But of course Mash and others shit on the idea and say it won't result in anything.

    Maybe at first Russia should try and buy Chinas lithography equipment until they finish making their own?
    kvs
    kvs


    Posts : 15847
    Points : 15982
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Turdope's Kanada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  kvs Thu Sep 21, 2023 4:56 pm

    If China wants to sell it, then OK. But as with the war time, it is better to bite the bullet and develop your own stuff. Russia had a drone
    production/design issue but since the SMO this seems to have removed the bottleneck. The same is true for lithography machines. Russia
    has had the scientific and engineering ability for decades but money was the valve that frustrated the realization of this potential. Now there
    are no more excuses and the precious (inflating away) money needs to be spent. Going to China is like going to the NATzO west. It is a
    cheap "solution". Russia obviously needs its own fabrication equipment since Russia is not a banana republic and outsourcing is not good for
    its security and technology development.

    Rodion_Romanovic, thegopnik, Hole and Broski like this post

    sepheronx
    sepheronx


    Posts : 8834
    Points : 9094
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 35
    Location : Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  sepheronx Thu Sep 21, 2023 5:03 pm

    I agree. It's just there is so little news on Russian production that it's rather scary. I have been rummaging through Russian sources and most are just in doomer mode but nothing else.
    GunshipDemocracy
    GunshipDemocracy


    Posts : 6165
    Points : 6185
    Join date : 2015-05-17
    Location : fishin on Stalin´s Strait between Mexico and Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  GunshipDemocracy Thu Sep 21, 2023 7:20 pm

    sepheronx wrote:I agree. It's just there is so little news on Russian production that it's rather scary. I have been rummaging through Russian sources and most are just in doomer mode but nothing else.

    perhaps because it's military production and has to be kept top secret?

    GarryB, Rodion_Romanovic and thegopnik like this post

    thegopnik
    thegopnik


    Posts : 1822
    Points : 1824
    Join date : 2017-09-20

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  thegopnik Thu Sep 21, 2023 8:37 pm

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:I agree. It's just there is so little news on Russian production that it's rather scary. I have been rummaging through Russian sources and most are just in doomer mode but nothing else.

    perhaps because  it's military production and has to be kept top secret?

    its pretty much this, the drone production and different miniature versions of them suggest they have found a way. They are even silent about the number of kamikaze drones they have.

    GarryB, GunshipDemocracy and Rodion_Romanovic like this post

    lancelot
    lancelot


    Posts : 3147
    Points : 3143
    Join date : 2020-10-18

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  lancelot Thu Sep 21, 2023 10:27 pm

    sepheronx wrote:I agree. It's just there is so little news on Russian production that it's rather scary. I have been rummaging through Russian sources and most are just in doomer mode but nothing else.
    See my prior post on the construction being done north of the Angstrem-T aka NM-Tech fab.
    It was originally planned to be a 300mm wafer diameter 28nm process pilot production facility. And they haven't stopped building the thing.
    So they must be planning to get the tools and process from somewhere.

    It takes at like 2 years to get a new chip design done at an existing fab. 2 years to build a fab. another 2 years to ramp it up.
    There hasn't been enough time to fix existing issues with semis.

    sepheronx, kvs, GunshipDemocracy and Broski like this post

    sepheronx
    sepheronx


    Posts : 8834
    Points : 9094
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 35
    Location : Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  sepheronx Fri Sep 22, 2023 2:49 am

    I'm also thinking of current fabs. But I'm thinking it's a lot what gunship said as well.
    thegopnik
    thegopnik


    Posts : 1822
    Points : 1824
    Join date : 2017-09-20

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  thegopnik Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:17 am

    So 2028-2029 fingers crossed Russia will have 28nm chip production started?

    https://russianelectronics.ru/2023-09-19-litograf2028/

    In Sarov, they promise to present the first "import-substituting" demo-lithograph in 2 years. But why?

    19.09.2023 Electronics market Russian market Microelectronics News, Articles
    Scientific Director of the National Center for Physics and Mathematics, Academician of the Russian Academy of Sciences Alexander Sergeev said that the "alpha machine" will be ready within two years, and the version for microelectronics enterprises - in another three years. The X-ray lithograph is planned for a 28-nm process technology, but at first they will show only 90 nm.

    The first demonstration sample of the Russian lithograph for the production of microcircuits will be ready within the next two years, and within five years, scientists plan to produce an industrial version of the installation. This was told to TASS by the scientific director of the National Center for Physics and Mathematics, Academician of the Russian Academy of Sciences Alexander Sergeev.

    "We plan to make a machine within two years, it is called an "alpha machine", which will confirm the correctness of the chosen technology and demonstrate a working lithograph. And then the next version will be manufactured, one that will be a complex, < ... > by the fact that it will be possible to put it at the enterprise of the microelectronic industry, "said Sergeev, noting that Russia has almost all the competencies so that such an industrial version of the domestic lithograph appears in five years.

    The main task of the alpha machine is to demonstrate that all the fragments of the technology work together, and not separately, the academician noted: "This is both a source of X-ray study, and X-ray optics that correctly projects on a photoresist, these are photoresists and a positioning system with nanometer accuracy." Moreover, Sergeev specified, the target resolution of 28 nm will not be obtained immediately.

    "Of course, this does not mean that in two years there will be a resolution of 28 nanometers. It will improve gradually. And not due to the fact that we will introduce some new technologies - we will demonstrate the technologies immediately, but due to the fact that the work will be honed. <... >I think it will be great if we demonstrate with these new technologies in two years the 90 nanometers that we now have, but already in the coordinated work of all systems," he said. According to the academician, the project to create a lithograph is financed by Rosatom from its investment programs, and this project is actively supported by the government of the country.

    Lithography (from the Greek "lithos" - stone and "grapho" - I write, draw) is one of the most widely used technologies for obtaining nanostructures. Initially, lithography was a printing method in which prints are obtained by transferring ink under pressure from a flat printing plate to a smooth surface. Lithography in micro- and nanoelectronics is the formation of a relief pattern in a special sensitive layer — a resist — on the surface of a silicon substrate. The pattern repeats the geometry of the chip.

    To do this, a thin layer of material is applied to the silicon substrate, from which a pattern must be formed. A photosensitive material is applied to this layer - a photoresist, which is irradiated through an optical system and a photomask - a mask. It is an enlarged stencil of the projected pattern. After subsequent processing of the photoresist, a given pattern remains on the plate. The shorter the wavelength of radiation, the smaller the size of the resulting elements of the picture. In the process of manufacturing chips, the operation of photolithography on one plate is repeated many times, and each new image must be very accurately aligned with the previous one.

    As the ex-employee of the Zelenograd NIIME, who wished to remain anonymous, told the editorial board of VE, the project, which is announced by Academician Sergeev, looks very utopian and is unlikely to be implemented in its intended form. "Russia, as usual, is looking for its own, unique path, ignoring many years and multibillion-dollar experience in the research and production of world microelectronics. X-ray lithography has long been recognized by the world community as a dead-end branch of the development of microelectronics. Yes, it, with certain efforts and with a number of significant limitations, allows you to make nanometer structures, but any more or less mass production becomes fatally expensive and provides an unacceptably low KVG (yield ratio - ed.). World science has long passed this path and solved the problem of mass photolithography with technical standards of 28 nm (and even 22, 14 and 10 nm) using the usual "cheap" ultraviolet radiation with a wavelength of 193 nm, using various tricks. And for the transition to even finer technical processes, which the academician does not even stutter about on the future domestic X-ray lithograph, the so-called EUV lithography has been successfully developed and applied, which uses hard ultraviolet light with a wavelength of 13.5 nm, which is close to the X-ray range, but is still considered ultraviolet light and easier to use. After all, X-ray lithography uses soft X-rays with a wavelength of 0.5-5 nm, where completely different physics works and completely different materials are used. Moreover, the development of EUV lithography took more than a dozen years and cost a hard-to-calculate number of tens of billions of dollars spent by the world's top chipmakers with tens or even hundreds of thousands of highly qualified specialists, which Russia simply does not have now. And there's nowhere to get them."

    "The 20-year lag of domestic microelectronics," the VE source continues, "cannot be so simply, at the snap of sleek government fingers or by the efforts of the respected, but incompetent in microelectronics Rosatom, to reduce even at least 15 years (the same desired 28-nm process technology was introduced by Intel back in 2009). Domestic developments in X-ray lithography have been known for more than a quarter of a century, but "things are still there." And for good reason! Also, do not forget that the current practically achievable limit of X-ray lithography is considered to be sizes of the order of 5-10 nm, while EUV lithography has already mastered 3-4 nm for mass production and work is underway on 1-2 nm. In addition, the proposed 28-nm X-ray domestic lithograph will not be able to produce microprocessor and memory chips with hundreds of millions and even more so billions of transistors. That is, you don't even have to stutter about any competitiveness of such chips, your own telecommunications stuffing, computers, AI chips, smart robots, etc. His destiny is single prototypes of microcontrollers of a low degree of integration for military and, possibly, special space applications. Even China, oppressed by anti-chip sanctions, has already overtaken us in its own microelectronic developments and technologies for a fatal number of years, which we have no way to reduce in the foreseeable future.

    "As the famous Russian song says, "I blinded him from what was, and then washed his hands with soap for a week," an independent specialist in microelectronics concludes about the prospects of this project.


    Assuming based on the last 2 paragraphs the negative guy is considered an ex-employee because he got fired suggests russia be like everyone else with UV lithography instead of X-ray lithography although smaller than UV was never practical for production because of costs and what the actual size limits are based on experiences of the failures of the west, but like photonic radars, thermal resolution at long ranges, etc maybe Sergeev did find a solution or will find a solution to make x-ray lithography as beneficial as UV?

    GunshipDemocracy likes this post

    thegopnik
    thegopnik


    Posts : 1822
    Points : 1824
    Join date : 2017-09-20

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  thegopnik Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:43 am

    https://tehnoomsk.ru/archives/8945?ysclid=lmu63szwmx319260977

    On June 2, 2023, Mishustin paid a working visit to the city of Sarov. There he visited the branch of Lomonosov Moscow State University and the Institute of Laser Physics Research.

    As a result of the trip, Mishustin gave a number of instructions, including those related to the scientific developments of the Sarov National Center for Physics and Mathematics. Thus, the Ministry of Industry and Trade and the Ministry of Economic Development need to work out Rosatom's proposals for several projects.

    The first concerns the creation of a domestic X-ray lithograph and production technologies for its use.
    The second is a photonic component base and photonic computing modules based on it, including for high-performance computing, ultrafast telecommunications and radio photonics.
    The third involves the creation of control and navigation systems in near space based on optical and X-ray technologies.
    The deadline for the execution of orders is August 30, 2023.

    I did not find the specifics of these instructions in the information field, but it is clear that the X-ray lithograph project continues its development.

    Let me remind you that on March 10, 2023, a seminar was held in Sarov, at which Nikolai Ivanovich Chkhalo, Head of the Department of Multilayer X-ray Optics of the Institute of Physics of Microstructures (IPM) of the Russian Academy of Sciences, presented the report "EUV lithography: principles, state and roadmap for development in Russia".


    After his speech, answering the question of what is the reason for his recent promotion of the classical X-ray lithograph and the information silence about the phototemplate-free one, Nikolay Chkhalo said that within the framework of research it was not possible to create one of the two key technologies that did not exist in the world - MEMS mirrors.

    The second key technology that needed to be created for the first time in the world was a four-hundredfold X-ray lens. It was possible to create it.

    Read more about all this in my March article.
    Read more about the project of a classic X-ray lithograph in my article "The project of a high-performance lithograph that went to Chernyshenko's office".
    Thus, as far as I understand, now we are talking about a classic X-ray lithograph. Well, in the fall we are waiting for specifics.

    GunshipDemocracy likes this post

    GarryB
    GarryB


    Posts : 40515
    Points : 41015
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty russian semiconductor stuff

    Post  GarryB Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:07 am

    I agree. It's just there is so little news on Russian production that it's rather scary.

    It would not be in Russias interests to talk about such things, whether they are bypassing the sanctions or developing their own capabilities, it does not benefit Russia for the west to know what is happening.

    The west is already regretting banning Chinese access because they are developing their own capacity and are cutting the west off from an enormous market of customers... many of which have the money to buy their products in volumes that would be very profitable.

    If their 28nm lithography tool was in series production, you would see sales of foreign lithography tools drop like a stone, but the opposite has been happening.

    I disagree... China is not an all their eggs in one basket sort of country, they would keep buying what they can buy because even when they develop their own production capacity it might be limited and it might have problems starting out so keep on buying what you can while you can makes sense and when their own technology compensates and exceeds what they can buy from the west then it makes sense to stop buying and start exporting to allies like Russia and Iran and North Korea whom the west has cut off too.

    China has the money and the skills and the talent to make pretty much anything the west makes, and more important they have the money at a time when the west is being stretched so if China makes a few breakthroughs it is possible the Chinese might make a leap forward that the west cannot match for some time to come which means advantage China.

    But this is relevant to this thread because the west is doing the same to Russia and I would think Russia and China should cooperate to a certain level to help each other develop independence from the west and solve their own problems.

    It probably makes more sense for China to invest more because they have an enormous internal market so the money spent is worth it for them when it comes to production volumes and they already put chips into hardware produced by western countries in China.... putting Chinese chips will just mean more of the profit goes to Chinese instead of Dutch or Taiwanese oligarchs.

    kvs and GunshipDemocracy like this post

    George1
    George1


    Posts : 18514
    Points : 19019
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  George1 Mon Sep 25, 2023 1:52 pm

    NOTE: Chinese stuff moved here: Chinese Science and Technology

    sepheronx, GarryB, owais.usmani and Kiko like this post

    Kiko
    Kiko


    Posts : 3870
    Points : 3946
    Join date : 2020-11-11
    Age : 75
    Location : Brasilia

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  Kiko Thu Sep 28, 2023 5:45 pm

    An innovative technology for the production of gallium oxide plates has been developed in Moscow, 09.28.2023.

    Russian plates are half the price of imported ones due to new technology that eliminates the use of rare and expensive material.

    There is currently a shortage of fourth-generation semiconductors on the market, and the development can completely eliminate it. Potential buyers will be all global manufacturers of electronic products and devices.

    The use of gallium oxide is complicated by the iridium crucible required to create it, which greatly increases the cost of the final product. Domestic development eliminates the use of iridium and makes it possible to reduce production costs by 3-7 times.

    Now the price of one 100-mm plate made in Japan is approximately $6,400, while the projected cost of the Russian product will not exceed $3,000.

    The scope of development is wide: from the military industry and power electronics to renewable energy and photonics.

    Now the capital's Rokor company is in the final stages of preparation for mass production of single-crystal gallium oxide wafers. Specialists have already carried out research and development work. It takes 1.5 years to fully introduce a product to the world market.

    Unique technological equipment, as well as the impossibility of directly repeating technological regimes at the crystal growth stage, gives the company a competitive advantage for the next 5-8 years.

    https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/154275/

    GarryB, dino00, kvs, GunshipDemocracy, thegopnik, lancelot and Broski like this post

    thegopnik
    thegopnik


    Posts : 1822
    Points : 1824
    Join date : 2017-09-20

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  thegopnik Mon Oct 09, 2023 6:34 pm

    https://www.ruselectronics.ru/news/25444-roselektronika-importozamestit-klyuchevye-elektronnye-komponenty-dlya-kriticheski-vazhnoy-apparatury/

    Ruselectronics Holding of Rostec State Corporation has completed the development of operational amplifier chips for industrial electronics. The novelty will make it possible to replace such foreign-made components in the maintenance of existing equipment, including those engaged in critical industries, as well as in the creation of new products. Serial production of domestic products will begin in 2024.

    An op-amp is a universal unit on the basis of which many different electronic components can be built. This device takes weak signals and amplifies them to a level suitable for processing by other circuit elements or instruments. Such components, for example, are part of various medical equipment, measuring and industrial equipment, and video communication systems.

    Russian amplifiers ensure the interchangeability of foreign ECB in terms of form factor and characteristics and can be supplied in blister tape for automated assembly on a printed circuit board.

    The creation of domestic amplifiers was carried out by NPP Pulsar, which is part of Ruselectronics, on the initiative of the Ministry of Industry and Trade of Russia. The products developed at the enterprise are analogues of the AD8041, AD8042 and AD811 components manufactured by the American company Analog Devices.

    "Sanctions pressure and negative changes in supply chains have raised the issue of prompt repair and maintenance of electronics for various purposes. Foreign ECBs are used by pacemakers, life support equipment, a variety of sensors and controllers, and industrial alarms. We managed to create a product that is not inferior in quality to foreign amplifiers and does not differ in price, which was a difficult task in the conditions of multi-million production of foreign components. After reaching its design capacity, NPP Pulsar expects to occupy at least 30% of the Russian market in the segment of broadband high-frequency operational amplifiers," said Sergey Borovoy, General Director of NPP Pulsar.

    At the moment, the company is completing the assembly of a pilot batch, and it is planned to deploy serial production in mid-2024.


    https://www.ruselectronics.ru/news/25443-predpriyatie-roselektroniki-v-2-raza-uvelichilo-proizvodstvo-svchmoduley-dlya-radiolokatsii-i-naviga/

    The Nizhny Novgorod Research and Production Enterprise "Salyut" of the Ruselectronics Holding (part of the Rostec State Corporation) has increased the production of ultra-high-frequency modules for radar, radio navigation and telemetry systems. The modernization of production became possible thanks to the Industrial Development Fund (IDF), which provided a preferential loan in the amount of 185 million rubles. The total investment in the project amounted to about 250 million rubles.

    With the help of the IDF, SPE Salut purchased modern measuring and processing equipment, including metalworking.

    Thanks to the new equipment, the production capacity of Ku-band synthesizers and receiver modules has doubled to 480 units per year, which will cover the increased market demands.

    "The creation of high-performance full-cycle microwave factories is the most important component of the country's technological independence. Salut has all the necessary competencies for the production of Ku-band synthesizers and receiver modules – from development to serial production. Products are in high demand on the market today, and the volume of orders is growing. Thanks to the IDF loan, we have equipped the production sites with modern equipment, which has made it possible to increase the volume of microwave modules for various radar and navigation systems," said Alexander Bushuev, General Director of SPE Salyut.

    The bank guarantee of NPP Salut to secure the fulfillment of obligations under the loan agreement was provided by Novikombank.

    Ku-band synthesizers and receiver modules are used to create oscillations and emit these oscillations in space in the form of electromagnetic waves. The key customers of the products are the leading Russian enterprises of radio electronics.


    https://www.ruselectronics.ru/news/25431-roselektronika-sozdala-pervye-otechestvennye-fotomoduli-na-kristalle-dlya-vysokotochnogo-oruzhiya/

    Ruselectronics Holding of Rostec State Corporation has developed a line of matrix photomodules based on silicon crystals. They "see" objects at any time of the day and are able to form both black-and-white and color images. The novelty, created entirely from Russian components, can be used as part of video monitoring systems, scanning, as well as for pointing high-precision weapons.

    Each module consists of a die containing a photosensitive matrix, a 10-bit analog-to-digital converter, and a signal generator controlled by a data interface (SPI). To obtain a color image, a Bayer RGB filter is applied to the surface of the matrix. The device generates a picture with a resolution of 1280x1024 pixels, which allows you to display details with high clarity.

    The new Russian modules are characterized by low power consumption of 60 mV and "see" in the range of 400-900 nm, which meets the requirements of the Ministry of Defense for such products. This allows you to use these photodetectors to obtain a high-quality image at any time of the day.

    The modules were created by specialists of NPP Pulsar (part of Ruselectronics) at the initiative of the Ministry of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation.

    "When creating photodetectors, we managed to achieve up-to-date photovoltaic characteristics at the level of foreign analogues, using only Russian components. The technical solutions found will be used in the modernization of existing and the development of new video systems for military and civilian purposes. In particular, by the end of 2023, NPP Pulsar plans to present a miniature camera for computer vision based on these modules," said Sergey Borovoy, General Director of NPP Pulsar.

    The photomodules are created using the technology of complementary metal-oxide-semiconductor structure. This is currently the most common technology for building integrated circuits using field-effect transistors with an insulated gate and channels of different conductivity. A distinctive feature of such circuits is extremely low power consumption in static mode and high performance.

    GarryB, dino00, xeno and mnrck like this post

    sepheronx
    sepheronx


    Posts : 8834
    Points : 9094
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 35
    Location : Canada

    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  sepheronx Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:12 am

    So apparently China has allowed the sale of Loongsun processors to Russia and the Russian government approved further funding for lithography development and advancements. But in current time most chips will rely on 90nm for mass produced, 65 for fair use and loongsun processors for everything else and possibly also open up request for Russian chips of newer design in China.

    Will take time before Russia advances here

    GarryB, GunshipDemocracy and Rodion_Romanovic like this post


    Sponsored content


    Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2 - Page 4 Empty Re: Russian Electronics: Semiconductor and Processors #2

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sun Nov 17, 2024 10:25 pm