Russian Navy: Status and News #5

Isos wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

flamming_python wrote:I didn't even realize there was still a Sverdlov-class that hasn't been long ago scrapped

Yikes!

Scraping a museum ship kinda defeats the whole purpose of having a museum ship in the first place

If it doesn't make money and cost too much to stay afloat they will use it as a practice target.

Would be nice to see what a zirkon could do against an empty armored ship.

It's a museum ship, why would you use it as a practice target?

And what useful information could be gained from using Zircon on it? No ship in service has armor

They brought a few out of retirement to test the idea of naval gunfire support for landed forces... obviously on a much smaller scale than the US with their Iowa class battleships.

The naval 152mm guns obviously lacked range to be effective, which is probably why the navy got involved in the Coalition gun programme.

A 70km range guided shell is rather more valuable due to its low cost and high persistence... a naval 152mm gun could probably fire at more than 20 rounds a minute with each shell independently guided to a particular ground coordinate... the ammo handling equipment on a ship should allow a much better rate of fire than any land based vehicle.

Plans to extend firing range to 180km would make them even more attractive and useful, while being 152mm calibre it has plenty of room for all sorts of guidance systems to be used... the width alone allows for a rather efficient HEAT warhead to be used against the heaviest armour as well.

The obvious bonus is that money spent developing these new rounds leads to benefits for both the navy and the army who will both be using this ammo and these guns.

The Bereg 130mm coastal defence gun could benefit from the range boost and accuracy and will increase the numbers of shells the navy will acquire making it even more affordable.

Some sort of unified Navy coastal plus Army long range theatre artillery vehicle could be developed for special operations.

The Bereg is a group of vehicles designed to protect coastlines from enemy landing forces... a few gun vehicles and command vehicles and accommodation vehicles like a self contained mobile artillery force... something similar could be designed for the Army for use in conflicts like Syria... imagine a precision artillery strike able to hit targets anywhere inside a circle 360km across within a few minutes.

In Vietnam the US used fire bases, where artillery could support operations near them within the range of the tube artillery. With a range of 180km these vehicles could deliver precision fire 24/7 fairly cheaply and effectively... they have GLONASS guided munitions.... it would not be that hard to add laser homing seekers to their noses so the unit that called in the strike could lase the target they are having problems with ...

A few remained in service until the early 90s as modified command ships until they were scrapped.

Careful... saying they were made in to command ships might lead to someone here claiming they will operate VSTOL fighters from them....

Sorry... couldn't resist...

PapaDragon wrote:

Isos wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

flamming_python wrote:I didn't even realize there was still a Sverdlov-class that hasn't been long ago scrapped

Yikes!

Scraping a museum ship kinda defeats the whole purpose of having a museum ship in the first place

If it doesn't make money and cost too much to stay afloat they will use it as a practice target.

Would be nice to see what a zirkon could do against an empty armored ship.

It's a museum ship, why would you use it as a practice target?

And what useful information could be gained from using Zircon on it? No ship in service has armor

As a museum ship it needs to attract visitors which need to pay to see it. No vistor no money and you even loose money on maintaining it. Then the easy way to get ride of it is to sunk it.

Arkeigh burkes are full of kevlar. Thry are not easy to sink.

Isos wrote:As a museum ship it needs to attract visitors which need to pay to see it. No vistor no money and you even loose money on maintaining it. Then the easy way to get ride of it is to sunk it. ...

If one day visitors are ever barred from visiting this ship and paying for tickets and they enforce that ban for at least a decade then a need to dispose of the ship might possibly arise

Disposal however would most certainly be done by selling it for scrap because high quality steel pays good money

What they definitely will not do is to use it as target especially since no useful information can be gained because no ship in service today has armor

Isos wrote:...Arkeigh burkes are full of kevlar. Thry are not easy to sink.

Prepare to have your mind blown: kevlar is not metal, it's fabric

This is how kevlar looks like:

Kevlar is a strong fabric but still not strong enough to hold back an anti ship missile.

Normally it is present to stop spalling... where near penetrations result in layers of armour on the inside of the armour plate where the impact occurred results in flakes of metal flying off the inner armour plate and bouncing around inside the target.

The British kept their rifled tank guns specifically because of the HESH round which was a large soft HE round that flattened against an armoured target and then exploded. The shockwaves passed through the armour... no matter how thick... and caused spalling which could kill the crew and start fires with ammo and fuel without penetrating the armour.

Spall liners were used to counter that effect... and 100 years ago if they had kevlar armour they could have used it on bolted and riveted tanks to prevent bolts and rivets bouncing around inside the tank at lethal speeds when the armour was hit by solid rounds that nearly penetrated the armour.

The Kevlar is not used as armour in itself, just used to stop spall and fragments from being so lethal with an impact and should not really be counted as armour.

The 5.45x18mm Soviet pistol bullet has the power of a .22lr rimfire rifle round and its pointed bullet can penetrate 32 layers of kevlar armour... armour that would stop a much bigger heavier slower round like a 45 or a softnose round...

Isos wrote:As a museum ship it needs to attract visitors which need to pay to see it. No vistor no money and you even loose money on maintaining it. Then the easy way to get ride of it is to sunk it.

Don't be a luddite. The Kutuzov is one of the few surviving examples of an armoured big-gun cruiser anywhere on the planet. Its a priceless piece of Russian military history. Next you will want to scrap the Aurora?

As an ex-Brit I was always utterly disgusted that the kiddie-fiddler toffs who run the place couldn't find the money to preserve even one of the RNs great dreadnoughts, yet the Yanks have several. I'm glad the russians had the sense to preserve one of the Sverdlovs.

https://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12331191@egNews

The Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation, Army General Sergei Shoigu, presented an annual report at the meeting of the Collegium of the Ministry of Defense (excerpts from his speech):

Regarding the Russian Navy:

The Navy received 7 surface shps, 10 combat vessels, 10 support ships and vessels.

The Navy received two submarines, including the leading nuclear submarine of the Borey-A project, "Prince Vladimir" , armed with Bulava ballistic missiles with a modern complex of means to overcome missile defense, it was accepted into the Navy

As for the number of coastal missile systems, "Ball" and "Bastion" this year reached 74% of the need.

A motorized rifle division and a coastal missile brigade have been formed into the Navy's combat composition.

The headquarters of the Black Sea Fleet was rebuilt with a deep modernization of the control systems.

In Makhachkala, items from the Caspian Flotilla's military infrastructure were commissioned, including the mooring front.

At its main base, Kaspiysk, the discharge of the north and south breakwaters with a length of about three kilometers has been completed.


The use of advance financing makes it possible to solve the problem of shortage of funds for the construction of ships in the distant sea area and to guarantee a reduction in the delivery time of modern aircraft.

Currently, the construction of 16 and the modernization of 19 surface ships in the distant sea area is underway, and next year state contracts will be signed for another 6.

In total, taking into account current state contracts, the total number of warships built and modernized in the far-sea area will be 41 units.


The Navy conducted a large-scale interspecific exercise "Ocean Shield".

The group created has demonstrated the ability to effectively carry out tasks to protect our national interests in the waters of three oceans and nine seas, including the Northern Sea Route.

The ships and vessels of the Navy made 140 cruises to all the strategically important areas of the World Ocean, 122 visits and commercial stopovers were made to the ports of 28 foreign countries.

At the MTO point of the Navy in Tartus, the reconstruction and modernization of the barracks and the housing stock and the material and technical base were carried out.


For 2021 it is planned:

Nuclear forces: Adopt two nuclear-powered submarines from the Borey-A project: Prince Oleg and Generalissimo Suvorov, equipped with Bulava ballistic missiles, into the fleet

Conventional forces: Adopt 4 submarines, 6 surface ships, 22 combat and support vessels in the Navy

From all this it follows:

Apparently, the SSGN "Kazan" will not be accepted before the end of the year but in early 2021

In 2021 6 submarines will be received;

- 2 SSBN class Borey Pr. 955A: "Principe Oleg" and "Generalissimo Suvorov"
- 2 SSGN class Yasen Pr. 885M: "Kazan" and "Novosibirsk"
- 2 SSK class Varshavyanka Pr. 636.3 (Improved Kilo): "Magadan" and "Ufa"

With the exception of "Kazan", everyone else will go to the Pacific Fleet, which will mean a significant increase in the combat capacity of this formation.[/b]

In accordance with the plan for the rotation of the forces of the Mediterranean grouping of the Russian Navy, on December 24, 2020, the Admiral Grigorovich frigate of project 11356R of the Red Banner Black Sea Fleet of the Russian VIF passed the Bosphorus Strait heading towards the Syrian shores.

Repaired nuclear submarine "Leopard" removed from the boathouse

SOURCE

On December 25, 2020, the Department of Information and Mass Communications of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation reported that, as the Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Navy, Admiral Nikolay Evmenov, announced , “in Severodvinsk, the Zvezdochka Ship Repair Center has completed the slipway stage of repair and modernization of the project 971 Leopard nuclear submarine . The submarine was withdrawn from the shipyard's main boathouse to complete work at the enterprise's pier. I received a report on the successful implementation of the operation to withdraw the nuclear submarine Leopard from the boathouse. "

"The nuclear submarine Leopard has become the first ship of the third generation, the medium repair and deep modernization of which is carried out at the shipyard of the Severodvinsk ship repair center" Zvyozdochka "as part of the program to maintain the required level of combat readiness of the group of multipurpose nuclear submarines of the Navy", - said Admiral Nikolai Evmenov.

“By the moment of withdrawal from the boathouse by forces of“ Zvezdochka ”and counterparties, replacement of electronic weapons, control systems, communications, navigation, hydroacoustics, BIUS was carried out. As part of the modernization, it is envisaged to expand the used models of missile and torpedo weapons, reduce the acoustic signature of the ship, improve the habitability for the crew, and the characteristics of the operational reliability of the submarine. The completion of the repair and modernization works will be carried out afloat at the wall of the outfitting embankment of the enterprise, ”emphasized the Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Navy, Admiral Nikolai Evmenov.

It must be at the level of Yasen now but without the VLS.

stuff moved to talking bollocks thread in general chat section...

https://www.russiadefence.net/t8421p575-talking-bollocks-thread-3

Deliveries of ships and vessels for the Navy in 2020

Continuing program of modernization of the naval fleet . This year, the shipbuilding industry has delivered several dozen ships and vessels of various classes, having fulfilled most of the established plans. In addition, measures are being taken to solve urgent problems, a technological reserve for the future is being created and new ships are being laid.

General indicators

On December 11, the naval command revealed the preliminary results of the outgoing year. By that time it was built and handed over to the fleet approx. 40 pennants of different classes are submarines, warships and boats, as well as auxiliary vessels of different classes. At the time of publication of that information, four more warships were expected to be delivered, and by now three of them have been included in the fleet.

This year, the ships and vessels ordered under the current State Arms Program for 2011-2020 were handed over. Its goal was to increase the share of modern models in the armed forces to 70%. At the beginning of the year, it was reported that by that time the share of new samples in the Navy had reached 63%. Obviously, the delivery of more than 40 orders and the delivery of other systems will further increase this figure.

Underwater update

Submarine construction continues for several major projects. However, this year the fleet received only two submarines, and the delivery of the next several has been postponed to 2021. In addition, several new ships of different classes and designs are expected next year.

In June, the Northern Fleet included a new strategic submarine missile carrier "Knyaz Vladimir" pr. 955A "Borey". This is the fourth SSBN of the new project in the Navy and the second for the KSF.

In October, the Pacific Fleet received its second diesel-electric submarine, project 636.3. The ship "Volkhov" joined the existing "Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky" and is preparing to solve training and combat missions. The transfer of the third submarine of this series is expected next year.

For the surface fleet

The main news in the context of the renewal of the surface forces was the long-awaited acceptance into the fleet of the first serial frigate, project 22350 - "Fleet Admiral Kasatonov". Due to this, since July 2020, the Northern Fleet has two ships of this type. Receiving the third, Admiral Golovko, is expected next year.

On December 25, the newest corvette "Hero of the Russian Federation Aldar Tsydenzhapov" pr. 20380 was accepted into the Pacific Fleet. This is the seventh ship of its project and the third one in the KTOF. By the end of the month, the surface forces of the latter will receive another corvette, built according to a similar project.

In November, the third small missile ship, project 22800, Odintsovo, was handed over to the Baltic Fleet. The next ship of this series is planned to be delivered in a year. At the same time, the series is gaining momentum. Five ships of this project are being completed at the wall and preparing for testing at once, and one more will be launched in the near future.

At the end of November, the Black Sea Fleet took over the third patrol ship, project 22160, Pavel Derzhavin. In the near future, the fourth building will be launched, which is planned to be completed and tested by the end of next year.

On December 23, the handover ceremony of the second large landing ship, project 11711, took place. After several years of testing, "Petr Morgunov" was transferred to the KSF; he will serve along with the lead "Ivan Gren". This completes the construction of ships on the base project 11711. New BDK will be built according to the updated project.

On December 26, the Pacific Fleet received another mine defense ship Yakov Balyaev, built on Project 12700. This is already the fifth minesweeper of its type - and the first ship of a new generation within the KTOF.

During the year, significant numbers of boats of various types and for various purposes were transferred to several naval formations. In particular, within the framework of the third contract, the delivery of boats of project 03160 to the Baltic Fleet is being carried out. It was delivered three units from July to November and new pennants will appear in the near future.

Until the end of this year, the fleet plans to accept only one combat ship. Recently state tests were completed by the lead corvette of project 20385 - "Thundering". Right now, the ship is being prepared for delivery to the customer and for raising the flag. Like a number of other new products this year, it will go to KTOF.

Auxiliary composition

In March, the Northern Fleet received a new auxiliary / oceanographic vessel "Akademik Aleksandrov" pr. 20183. The ship with a displacement of 5.5 thousand tons is intended for research and search and rescue operations, is capable of carrying deep-sea vehicles and can carry various cargoes. KSF already has one such vessel, and for several years a unified weapons transport of the project 20183TV has been serving as part of the KTOF.

The Hydrographic Service of the Navy received two new vessels this year. These are the small vessel of the project 19910 "Nikolay Skosyrev" and the large hydrographic boat of the project 19920 "Alexander Makorta". Three more similar BGKs are in a high degree of readiness, and they may be commissioned in the near future. In addition, two large boats, project 23040G and one project 23370G, passed state tests. All these vessels will be distributed between the Northern, Baltic and Black Sea fleets.

In February, the Black Sea Fleet received the small tug of the project 23470 "Sergey Balk". The next vessel of this type, "Andrey Stepanov", has been tested and is preparing to be handed over to the customer.

A significant number of auxiliary vessels of several classes and types are at various stages of construction and testing. Some of these orders will be delivered during the next 2021, while others are expected later.

Backlog for the future

For the further development of the Navy, new systems, components and technologies are needed. In this context, promising weapons attract the greatest attention. So, in the future, various warships of the Navy will be able to get a new hypersonic anti-ship missile "Zircon". This product is being successfully tested, and the next launches took place recently. Defense industry sources report successful completion of the 2020 test program.

The deployment of the new missile system will begin in the near future. The missile is compatible with universal launchers, which seriously expands the range of potential carriers. The latter are considered ships and submarines of several types of modern construction, as well as modernized ships of old projects.

Over the past few years, military shipbuilding has faced the problem of the lack of imported propulsion systems. At the end of November, the United Engine Corporation handed over to the shipbuilders the first M55R unit intended for installation on the new frigate of project 22350. The appearance of this product will allow the construction to continue and the planned 5-7 ships to be transferred to the fleet.

With an eye to the future, new ships and vessels are laid, incl. recent projects. The main news in this area came in June, when the laying of two universal amphibious assault ships, project 23900, took place. Also this year frigates and corvettes, submarines of various classes and numerous auxiliary vessels were laid.

Work continues

During this year, shipbuilders handed over to the navy more than 40 combat and auxiliary units of different classes. Several more pennants are expected in accordance with naval traditions - "under the herringbone". In general, from the point of view of updating the ship composition, the outgoing 2020 can be considered successful. It will leave a noticeable mark in the form of new ships and vessels that can serve for several decades.

The implementation of the current plans was not easy and in some cases faced the already known difficulties. Only recently it was possible to solve the problem of import substitution of propulsion systems, after long years of waiting, an end was put in the disputes around the UDC, the topic of cutting plans for the construction of ships, etc., was repeatedly raised. One of the consequences of such difficulties was the shift in the delivery dates of individual ships.

However, the fleet and industry have coped with some difficulties and are now dealing with other tasks that are urgent and aimed at the future. On the whole, 2020 ends successfully, and the next year, 2021, promises new important events.

A detachment of warships of the Red Banner Pacific Fleet of the Russian Navy in Indonesia

On December 17, 2020, a detachment of warships of the Red Banner Pacific Fleet of the Russian Navy as part of the flagship of the Pacific Fleet of the Guards Order of Nakhimov, the missile cruiser Varyag of project 1164 Atlant, the large anti-submarine ship Admiral Panteleev of project 1155 and the medium sea tanker Pechenga, took part in the joint Russian-Indonesian naval exercises RUSINDO-20, held in the Java Sea.






Prior to this, a detachment of KTOF warships of the Russian Navy made a business call at the port of Tanjung Perak (Surabaya, Indonesia). During the stay, the KTOF ships replenished their water and fuel supplies.





https://dambiev.livejournal.com/2173443.html

https://iz.ru/1105912/dmitrii-boltenkov/na-khod-vpered-kakimi-resursami-obladaiut-boevye-korabli-vremen-sssr

Not bad for a country where the Navy is ranked after SRF, Army and Air Force.

And that is just the beginning, a very difficult one by the way. They have 6x 22350 in construction, with plans of delivering one per year, plus 2 additional ones contracted just waiting to be laid down, next year 2 x 885M, 2 x 955A, 1 x 22350, 2 x 20380 should be delivered. It is questionable if they are going to deliver 5 x nuclear submarines in one year (Belgorod is also scheduled for 2021), but the pace is very different from what we saw at the beginning of this century. For 2022, the Kuznetsov and Nakhimov should return to service as the capital ships of a renewed oceanic fleet, which besides will be by then equipped with Tsirkon. Plus the 949 and 971 returning to service, also adapted for the missile, the 20385 having solved the engine problems, Poliment-Redut operational... in five years it will be difficult to recognise the VMF.

Indeed, but lots of work to do... they need to start on destroyers now and finalise a design they can build and test the guts out of and then get into production too and that will essentially just leave cruisers and CVNs left for them to work on for the future...

Right now producing new corvettes and new frigates to build up the local Russian fleet makes more sense than rushing making CVNs before they even have new destroyers to go anywhere with them.

Will be very interesting to see what upgrades they have applied to the Kuznetsov... the talk of catapult support for aircraft will be interesting to see because I don't think it is conventional... the terminology was vague and ambiguous...

Clearly the idea is to work on the conceptual aspects of new ships and weapons, that require calm and quality of resources above all, while the industrial aspects of currently produced ones are sorted out. And since industrial aspects demand quantity of resources and the accumulation of work in a proper sequence, they cannot be hurried. That is why Rakhmanov said no carrier before 15 years, because that is what it takes to bring the industry (all the industry and not just shipyards) up to speed, substitute old Soviet ships, manage to produce subs, frigates and corvettes with closed eyes and only then, when all those topics are under control and a realistic planning can be established, tackle the task of creating the core of the oceanic fleet in the progression 22350M -> 23560 -> CVN, since it makes no sense to create carriers and then realize you don't have ships and subs for their escort. For most of this decade the VMF will be limited in the type of missions they can perform in the open ocean, but I think they will manage to have a say thanks to Tsirkon, Nakhimov + Kuznetsov and the SSGNs

Arrow wrote:Russia already dominates the seas that surround it. In the Black Sea, Baltic Sea, Ochocki, Barents, Kaspisjkie. And especially in the Arctic. It does not need CVN for the Arctic because Russian bases are within its reach. Russia is planning to build 8 powerful icebreakers for its domination in the Arctic.
The question is whether in the future they will focus on aircraft carriers groups or, as Mindstorm claims, on a dispersed fleet?

Again, carriers are not for the near sea zone, so no point in discussing that. A single MiG-31K will make anyone think twice before doing anything silly closer than 2,000 km from Russia. But to keep presence and stabilise a situation in a distant country, to replenish military bases abroad and in conclusion to increase the number of allies they need a navy that is self protected and self sustained at big distances of the homeland, and that can sail to any point of the world ocean without being more of a liability than an asset for Russia. So, they need the oceanic fleet.

In my humble opinion: the "distributed lethality" is a capacity the VMF has already satisfactorily implemented and Tsirkon will only make that lethality overwhelming for the next 5 to 10 years. What they are missing are big hulls with the needed sea keeping, autonomy, magazine depth, air power and systems needed to sustain operations in distant areas of the world ocean.