Economy of China:

Bit of a contradiction in terms really.... western economy experts... who would listen to their advice considering the state most western economies are in today... keep borrowing and spending... it wont be a problem till I am out of office and so why should I care?

It is also a clear mobilisation against China... why else would western "experts" of any kind care about Chinas economy...

Who woulda thought that (((Fractional Reserve Banking))) always lead from a scam to a collapse?

China Plans $230 Billion Fiscal Stimulus Package As Slowdown Worsens


July's batch of macroeconomic data from China painted a troubling picture of slumping domestic demand, giving way to an unexpected interest rate cut earlier this week. Now there are more plans for stimulus in the form of fiscal, a move that Beijing could make to shore up its faltering economy, Bloomberg reported.

The China Securities Journal reported Thursday that local governments could issue an additional 1.55 trillion yuan ($229 billion) in special debt and bonds to drive infrastructure investment.

The third quarter "will be an important window for sales of additional local government special bonds," Zhang Yiqun, a member of the Society of Public Finance of China, said, quoted by Shanghai Securities News.

The newspaper also cited Luo Zhiheng, chief economist at Yuekai Securities, who noted the sale of the special bonds might also be brought forward and utilized in the fourth quarter of this year. .......

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/china-plans-230-billion-fiscal-stimulus-package-slowdown-worsens

I hope I don't have to spell it out. The list includes Sinopec, PetroChina and China Life, bytheway.

China's economy will be fine. So long as they got the manufacturing base and the population, they can sell to themselves. But since they cornered the entire worlds market for general every day goods and even to a large extent, semiconductors - there is little that can be done. China could lose a lot of money, but they will still be just too big.

Chinese money fleeing US markets is not a Chinese economy collapse... it is self defence to prevent the US raping them in case some conflict happens.

These companies are pulling their money and investments out of a country known for stealing such things... it is the US market that will suffer... who is going to move 300 billion dollars into the market to return it to what it was before?

Bet you it wont be Russia or any other country that doesn't want to have its money stolen.

GarryB wrote:Chinese money fleeing US markets is not a Chinese economy collapse... it is self defence to prevent the US raping them in case some conflict happens.

These companies are pulling their money and investments out of a country known for stealing such things... it is the US market that will suffer... who is going to move 300 billion dollars into the market to return it to what it was before?

Bet you it wont be Russia or any other country that doesn't want to have its money stolen.

Wow Gaz you started making sense in the first paragraph. Taiwan and decreased exposure anyone?

Unfortunately you then got a little too confident and followed it up with the second paragraph. Nobody should ever mention China and being a victim of 'stealing'. Their entire 'miracle' is based off on stealing other people's/companies/countries' shit.

China was being used as a slave labour source by rich powerful western countries who wanted to make lots of shit but didn't want to pay a reasonable wage or give decent working conditions to the people who made their crap.

What ever they steal from those is a good thing as far as I am concerned.

The treatment of the entire world by the west makes anything they do in return fair game as far as I am concerned... I think it is hilarious that the rest of the world sends their poor to Europe to go on welfare and sample the local fare in terms of young women and young men... do you honestly think the Europeans have not been doing that to the rest of the world for the last 500 years and are still doing that today... lots of big fat Germans in Thailand with underage girls hanging around them like flies...

"It's Not Enough": A Deeper Look Inside China's Latest 1 Trillion Yuan Stimulus


A few days ago we mocked the relentless China newsmill, saying that "Every day there are 5 stories about some new imminent stimulus out of China and every day nothing at all happens."

Well, it appears that someone in Beijing heard us because just days later we got not one but two major "stimmy" developments:

The first one hit early on Monday when we learned that to contain the collapse of China's critical housing sector, which at $62 trillion is the world's largest asset class...

Beijing would offer 200 billion yuan ($29.3 billion) in "special loans" to ensure stalled housing projects are delivered to buyers. This new lending program "would make it the biggest financial commitment yet from Beijing to contain a property crisis that’s seen home prices slump and real estate sales plummet, at a time when growing housing market instability also means a growing threat to political stability during the sensitive run-up to the Communist Party’s leadership transition later this year.

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/its-not-enough-deeper-look-inside-chinas-latest-1-trillion-yuan-stimulus

A few days ago we mocked the relentless China newsmill, saying that "Every day there are 5 stories about some new imminent stimulus out of China and every day nothing at all happens."

Well, it appears that someone in Beijing heard us because just days later we got not one but two major "stimmy" developments:

What a bunch of arrogant ... I am sure Xi hangs on their every word and only acts on things they approve... NOT.

The first one hit early on Monday when we learned that to contain the collapse of China's critical housing sector, which at $62 trillion is the world's largest asset class...

Beijing would offer 200 billion yuan ($29.3 billion) in "special loans" to ensure stalled housing projects are delivered to buyers. This new lending program "would make it the biggest financial commitment yet from Beijing to contain a property crisis that’s seen home prices slump and real estate sales plummet, at a time when growing housing market instability also means a growing threat to political stability during the sensitive run-up to the Communist Party’s leadership transition later this year.

This is bloody hilarious... lets criticise China for doing nothing and then lets criticise China for actually doing something about a house market collapse... they are providing loans to ensure stalled housing projects get completed and so the people building houses get some breathing room and end up with houses.

Let us not mention and compare when the shit hit the fan in the US and their housing sector collapsed the US government leaped to the rescue... OF THE FUCKING BANKS... 750 BILLION US dollars went to those banks, and all those home owners lost their houses and were kicked out on the streets by Banks whose CEOs got huge bonus payments that year for not collapsing under the debt they took on but could not cover and had to be bailed out by the government.

So the banks got their money back, the home owners got screwed, and so did the tax payer because not a cent was paid back.... they were monetary donations to the richest people in America despite the fact that it was their fuckup in the first place... they were giving loans to anyone because even if they couldn't pay the loan back the Bank could seize the property and sell it and get their money back, but when the guts fell out of the market they ended up owning houses worth a fraction of what the house loan was for.... so obviously they needed more help than the homeless people they just made homeless, refusing to restructure loans so they could pay them off...

Chinese yuan has lost 11 percent of its value vis a via the USD so far with manufacturing/production suffering, the stock market in serious problems and supply change issues becoming more common.

The Chinese Central Bank has started warning speculators that coming week there will be serious intervention to help maintain the value of the CNY vs. the USD.

sundoesntrise wrote:Chinese yuan has lost 11 percent of its value vis a via the USD so far with manufacturing/production suffering, the stock market in serious problems and supply change issues becoming more common.

The Chinese Central Bank has started warning speculators that coming week there will be serious intervention to help maintain the value of the CNY vs. the USD.

I do not see how this is supposed to be a problem. The weaker the Yuan is the cheaper will be production in China.
China has no issues with external loans and they have more dollars and dollar treasuries than they have liabilities.

There were issues with production in places like Shanghai because of the COVID-19 lockdowns but that is about it. In most cases factories learned to cope with the lockdowns and workers were contained to the production facilities, so production continued.

As for the stock market, all major stock markets have been going down. I lost like 20% on US stocks I had for example. Thankfully I had exited most of my positions last year, I only owned some residual stocks.

lancelot wrote:

sundoesntrise wrote:Chinese yuan has lost 11 percent of its value vis a via the USD so far with manufacturing/production suffering, the stock market in serious problems and supply change issues becoming more common.

The Chinese Central Bank has started warning speculators that coming week there will be serious intervention to help maintain the value of the CNY vs. the USD.

I do not see how this is supposed to be a problem. The weaker the Yuan is the cheaper will be production in China.
China has no issues with external loans and they have more dollars and dollar treasuries than they have liabilities.

There were issues with production in places like Shanghai because of the COVID-19 lockdowns but that is about it. In most cases factories learned to cope with the lockdowns and workers were contained to the production facilities, so production continued.

As for the stock market, all major stock markets have been going down. I lost like 20% on US stocks I had for example. Thankfully I had exited most of my positions last year, I only owned some residual stocks.

"Because a strong dollar is taking out economies like a wrecking ball."

The goal is scaffold their own currency and undercut the USD.

I borrowed the sentence above from this guy bytheway, credits where credits are due.



You are wrong about the production part. Entire ports have been quarantined in the past, same goes for industrial areas. As for Shanghai, they only started implementing these 'production and prevention rules' 6 or 7 weeks into the lockdown. Manufacturing is down, and supply chains are under pressure. The PMI statistics prove it.

The last part is true obvious and will gets much worse. I personally expect a financial collapse which will make 2008 look like a cakewalk. Before the end of the year. Early indicators are that this has already begun - keep an eye on Japan, the UK and Italy.

By now all the self proclaimed China connaiseurs on this board will have heard the news that China is doubling down on its Covid Zero policy - the majority of the members probably grudgingly so. Several economic and population hubs/hotspots have been put back under lockdown.

It's pretty clear that at this stage - no, that they have *always* used the surveillance mechanisms allegedly built up for epidemic prevention as a means of population control and ushering in technocratic feudalism.

However, that framework already stands at this point. So what's going on here?

Is it simply
1. cultural hubris as in Emperor Xi cannot be wrong by default hence they double down instead of changing course
2. A cover up for their faltering economic situation, something nobody can get a truly accurate picture of due to widespread corruption and cooking the books
3. Is it general repetition for the 'real' one - that possibly could have an IFR of 15 percent?
4. Are they using the mayhem and stricter control of population and financial movements to prepare something in the South China Sea/Taiwan?
5. Are they cutting back on their economic output to pull the US with it in its (feigned) demise (couple this to the build up of parallel financial infrastructure through the SCO/BRICS?
6. Any other possibilities?


Only serious responses.

As an aside: the Party recently re-introduced the 'complete community policy', which is a return to the Mao era planned economy. Two initiatives primarily stand out, the state run canteens and the supply and distribution cooperatives.

Chinese exports are still higher than they were pre-COVID when the rest of the world closed down and jacked up their imports of Chinese goods.


There is plenty of evidence that Asians are more susceptible to COVID than other people. These are clear signs this might be a manufactured disease. The Chinese are pretty skeptical about the whole thing especially after their experiences suffering from biological warfare by the Japanese in WW2.

Answer to Why has China been cracking down on private enterprises like Ant Group? by Kanthaswamy Balasubramaniam

https://www.quora.com/Why-has-China-been-cracking-down-on-private-enterprises-like-Ant-Group/answer/Kanthaswamy-Balasubramaniam?ch=15&oid=1477743678703102&share=3d432c19&srid=2uO8F&target_type=answer

Ant Group was running a goddamned Ponzi scheme. They were lending money without being licensed to operate as a bank, and without the necessary reserve capital or insurance.

China can't catch a break... either it is being too hard over Covid or they are not being hard enough and risking spreading it to the rest of the world...

China should already know that western advice is only good for western interests and if they are complaining then you are doing something right.

The economic and strategic effects of this investment by the Chinese must be enormous.

Tony
@Cyberspec1
.
5h
China will build a canal to Southern Thailand to ensure energy and trade security.

At present, China depends on the Malacca Strait, and the slightest congestion in this Strait is at a level that can seriously affect the Chinese economy.

China wants to reduce this risk by building the Kra Canal on an isthmus in southern Thailand. In total, $20 billion will be spent on the project.

That will be interesting.

I do like big infrastructure projects as long as they are realistic.

Hope it pumps a bit of money into the Thai economy too...

This has been discussed for decades. I hope so, but remains to be seen if it will happen.

Rise of China's batteries drives profound changes in global automotive sector, 01.29.2024.

The market has been among the largest in the world for seven consecutive years.

More than a hundred years ago, when Henry Ford revolutionized moderna car production, engineers from all countries turned to the United States. Today, Germany's Volkswagen has sent about 300 employees to China to learn battery manufacturing, Chinese company CATL has helped Ford build a battery factory, and Chinese companies have begun exporting technology and brands to foreign investors. The rise of Chinese batteries is triggering profound changes in the global automotive sector.

Data recently released by China's Ministry of Industry and Informatization shows that China's cumulative exports of power batteries totaled 127.4 GWh in 2023, an increase of 87.1% from the previous year. The market has been among the largest in the world for seven consecutive years. The largest export market is Europe, followed by the United States and Southeast Asia. In addition, in the global installed capacity of the 10 largest power battery companies, six are Chinese.

The energy battery industry has achieved these results due to several competitive advantages. China has achieved the independent production of all major materials for production, such as cathode materials, anode materials and electrolytes, forming a complete chain of power battery industry.

At the same time, the stable quality and relatively low cost of Chinese battery products are particularly well received by automobile companies around the world. In 2020, Germany's Volkswagen became the first foreign car company to invest directly in a Chinese battery manufacturer.

However, in recent years, the US government has erected a "high wall" against China's energy batteries, through political intervention and trade barriers, in an attempt to curb the development of China's emerging sectors. The US initiatives reflect a consistent hegemony and completely violate fair rules of World Trade.

According to an analysis by the International Energy Agency, the United States has virtually no mining or processing capacity for minerals such as lithium, nickel and cobalt and holds less than 5% of the world's production of positive and negative materials for making batteries. If the Chinese product is excluded from the supply chain, the price of electric vehicles purchased by the Americans will increase and deviate from the target expected by the US government. The so-called protection policy of the United States not only harms its own companies and weakens market rules, but also makes the American people pay the bill in the end.

Yandex Translate from Portuguese

https://www.brasil247.com/china/ascensao-das-baterias-da-china-gera-mudancas-profundas-no-setor-automotivo-global

New York Times report highlights BYD's success. 02.13.2024.

More than 80% of BYD's sales occur in China, the largest auto market on the planet.

A recent article published in the New York Times highlights the remarkable success achieved by BYD, a Chinese company that started as a battery manufacturer and later evolved to become a major competitor in the electric vehicle market. In 2007, BYD was viewed with disdain by the auto industry, but today, it has unseated Tesla in global sales of all-electric cars, marking a historic achievement in the industry.

With astonishing growth in recent years, BYD has expanded its operations beyond Chinese borders, establishing assembly lines in countries such as Brazil, Hungary, Thailand and Uzbekistan. In addition, it is poised to lead the Chinese market, predicted to overtake even the Volkswagen Group, consolidating its position as one of the world's leading electric vehicle manufacturers.

More than 80 percent of BYD's sales are in China, the world's largest auto market. This exponential growth is comparable only to that recorded by General Motors after World War II, demonstrating the magnitude of the feat achieved by the Chinese company in a short period of time.

BYD's meteoric rise has sparked interest while also raising questions about the Chinese government's subsidy policies and the impact of these practices on global trade. BYD's rapid expansion in Europe is also under scrutiny, leading to the European Union's investigation into the possibility of tariffs on the Chinese company's products. So while celebrating its successes, BYD also faces the challenge of responding to the concerns and criticisms that accompany its breakneck growth.

Yandex Translate from Portuguese

https://www.brasil247.com/economia/reportagem-do-new-york-times-destaca-exito-da-byd