Project 11356: Admiral Grigorovich

Isos wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:
Admiral Grigorovich passed trough English Channel en route to Sevastopol:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/11/navy-shadow-russian-frigate-through-uk-waters/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/news/2016/05/11/97590133_frigate-large_trans++gsaO8O78rhmZrDxTlQBjdLdu0TL-Cg_AMOUqySXmFgU.jpg

Given the age of Royal Navy ship in that photo I thing we all might be selling Russian Navy a bit short...

And you can still read some stupid things like " russia is 20  years behind in terms of technology" ...

Yup, you usually see photos of latest and the greatest ships in the fleet but most of the work is usually done by mid-age vessels like this one.

Dutch Navy pic of "Admiral Grigorovich" sailing through North Sea

Its a fine looking ship indeed.

Bastion-Karpenko had a different toned story about the escort: (Google translate)

May 8 in the area of ​​the Strait of Great Belt commander of a patrol ship "Admiral Grigorovich" performing mezhflotsky transition from the Baltic to the Black Sea Fleet, congratulated channel VHF Victory Day crew of the frigate URO naval forces of Great Britain "Iron Duke» (Iron Duke), walking on a parallel course.
In his message, the Russian sailors paid tribute to British citizens in the victory over fascism.
In turn, May 9, the crew of the English ship congratulated on VHF personnel "Admiral Grigorovich" Victory Day.
When the divergence in accordance with maritime tradition, the crews signal flags wished each other a happy voyage.
Press service of the Western Military District

That could be some kind of euphemism for the flag equivalent of flipping the bird though I guess

Naval Today: "The Russian Navy will commission the second Admiral Grigorovich-class frigate Admiral Essen on May 27, Yantar Shipyard announced May 23.

Admiral Essen will be transferred to the Russian Navy a day before the flag-raising ceremony, Yantar added."

Are they going to put all 3 frigates in the black sea ?

Do they use russian engines ?

Isos wrote:Are they going to put all 3 frigates in the black sea ?

Do they use russian engines ?

All 6 actually, looks likely they decided to do intelligent thing and wait for Russian engines for latter 3.

PapaDragon wrote:

Isos wrote:Are they going to put all 3 frigates in the black sea ?

Do they use russian engines ?

All 6 actually, looks likely they decided to do intelligent thing and wait for Russian engines for latter 3.

Weren't they thinking of exporting the latter three?

DB1234 wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Isos wrote:Are they going to put all 3 frigates in the black sea ?

Do they use russian engines ?

All 6 actually, looks likely they decided to do intelligent thing and wait for Russian engines for latter 3.

Weren't they thinking of exporting the latter three?

Yeah. But they did not decide what to do for now, options are still open either wait for Russian engines, get Chinese as stopgap or sell them to India with actual originally intended engines as they would get delivered most likely as it wouldnt be used by Russians.

Galleries:



http://www.maltashipphotos.com/productfile.asp?ProductID1=14276&PRODUCTCAT1=Frigates

http://www.maltashipphotos.com/productfile.asp?ProductID1=14277&PRODUCTCAT1=Frigates

http://www.maltashipphotos.com/productfile.asp?ProductID1=14275&PRODUCTCAT1=Frigates

Militarov wrote:...........

Yeah. But they did not decide what to do for now, options are still open either wait for Russian engines, get Chinese as stopgap or sell them to India with actual originally intended engines as they would get delivered most likely as it wouldnt be used by Russians.

Selling them would dumbest possible move, I don't know why they even consider it.

It would only give profit to Ukraine, deprive Russia of 3 already built full sized warships, provide media fodder to Kiev and their pimps and make Russians look like incompetent fucking morons.

I won't even apologize for my language on this issue, this is common sense.

PapaDragon wrote:

Militarov wrote:...........

Yeah. But they did not decide what to do for now, options are still open either wait for Russian engines, get Chinese as stopgap or sell them to India with actual originally intended engines as they would get delivered most likely as it wouldnt be used by Russians.

Selling them would dumbest possible move, I don't know why they even consider it.

It would only give profit to Ukraine, deprive Russia of 3 already built full sized warships, provide media fodder to Kiev and their pimps and make Russians look like incompetent fucking morons.

I won't even apologize for my language on this issue, this is common sense.

I'm not an expert but they could buy german engine. Even if they chose Ukrainian it's not that bad, we all know that russia depends on them for lot of stuff.
Ukrainians are not evil, they have an extremist gov that came in power because Ukraine is a poor country and US put lot of money to support the actual gov.

However 6 Grigorovitch is a lot for the Black sea fleat if we consider that their is Moskva there. 4 would be good and send 2 in pacific fleet because there are more and more military activities there.

Isos wrote:..................

I'm not an expert but they could buy german engine. Even if they chose Ukrainian it's not that bad, we all know that russia depends on them for lot of stuff.
Ukrainians are not evil, they have an extremist gov that came in power because Ukraine is a poor country and US put lot of money to support the actual gov.

However 6 Grigorovitch is a lot for the Black sea fleat if we consider that their is Moskva there. 4 would be good and send 2 in pacific fleet because there are more and more military activities there.

Moskva is due for total overhaul soon and rest of the fleet was not updated in decades, they definitely need at least those 6 ships. Possibly lot more than 6.

And Black Sea/Med are small enough for this class to still be very useful. Pacific on the other hand would need nothing less than Gorshkov class. Compared to East Asia Navies Turkish Navy is insect.

PapaDragon wrote:

Isos wrote:..................

I'm not an expert but they could buy german engine. Even if they chose Ukrainian it's not that bad, we all know that russia depends on them for lot of stuff.
Ukrainians are not evil, they have an extremist gov that came in power because Ukraine is a poor country and US put lot of money to support the actual gov.

However 6 Grigorovitch is a lot for the Black sea fleat if we consider that their is Moskva there. 4 would be good and send 2 in pacific fleet because there are more and more military activities there.

Moskva is due for total overhaul soon and rest of the fleet was not updated in decades, they definitely need at least those 6 ships. Possibly lot more than 6.

And Black Sea/Med are small enough for this class to still be very useful. Pacific on the other hand would need nothing less than Gorshkov class. Compared to East Asia Navies Turkish Navy is insect.

I would send Moskva in the pacific and replace it with a single gorshkov. The black sea fleet is small for it (build to attack carrier... not Turkish corvettes) , they already have Bastion-P that cover all of it.
They are planning new small Karakurt to replace small ships so the rest of the fleet will be updated. Even Molnyas with 16 Uran could be good their (they need just one year to build them).
With the crisis in Syria and Moskva's overhaul I agree 6 Grigorovitch are needed but in peace time 4 is enough.
Maybe add some Steregoushchi with their Paket-nk to counter Turkish subs and assist kilo's in that role.

Isos wrote:I'm not an expert but they could buy german engine. Even if they chose Ukrainian it's not that bad, we all know that russia depends on them for lot of stuff.
Ukrainians are not evil, they have an extremist gov that came in power because Ukraine is a poor country and US put lot of money to support the actual gov.

The issue is not diesel engine, we are talking about gas turbines. Germany is not in the scene of gas turbines. There are three major players in the marine gas turbines that power the navies and they are the US (GE), Ukraine (Zorya, courtesy Russian/Soviet designed aviation gas turbines. Others like MotorSich has made a living all these decades till now out of Klimov designed helicopter engines. Marine gas turbine scene will change in next 5-10 years in Russia's favor since Russia seems to have learned some lessons. The hard way!) and UK (RR, not major player, mostly limited to RN ships).

Almost all the post 1990s frigates from France, Spain, Italy, Germany, US etc use the LM2500.

However 6 Grigorovitch is a lot for the Black sea fleat if we consider that their is Moskva there. 4 would be good and send 2 in pacific fleet because there are more and more military activities there.

6 is just adequate, but I'd prefer not less than 12-18 ships for Black sea fleet so that 4-6 ships are always available for Indian Ocean deployments (its under Pacific Fleets area, but still) when needed.

Weren't they thinking of exporting the latter three?

If the google translates were correct, Banderastan stated they wouldn't supply engines even for export regardless of whether India actually expressed any interest in buying them (I didn't see any public statement but maybe they had privately) -> keep for Black Sea Fleet but delayed till Russian engine availability, which I think is really for the better.

1* Slava, 6* Grigorovich, 6* Buyan-M, 6(?) 22800 and the 6* subs is a pretty solid fleet vs pretty anaemic with only 3* Grigorovich.
Were any of the 2038x supposed to be going to Black Sea?

hoom wrote:

Weren't they thinking of exporting the latter three?

If the google translates were correct, Banderastan stated they wouldn't supply engines even for export regardless of whether India actually expressed any interest in buying them (I didn't see any public statement but maybe they had privately)  -> keep for Black Sea Fleet but delayed till Russian engine availability, which I think is really for the better.

1* Slava, 6* Grigorovich, 6* Buyan-M, 6(?) 22800 and the 6* subs is a pretty solid fleet vs pretty anaemic with only 3* Grigorovich.
Were any of the 2038x supposed to be going to Black Sea?

I think the 2038s are going to Baltic and Pacific

Real nice pic of Essen off Balancer forums


Interesting that the UKSK is right at the rear of the raised section, looks very much like there is room for a 2nd module to go in there.

The price of Admiral Essen is 13 650 240 000 Rubles. Or $205 mln in today's conversion ratio. And a 5 year warranty.

Isn't it supposed to have 3*12 shtill ? On the picture we can see just 2*12 shtill, where is the 3rd VLS ?

Isos wrote:Isn't it supposed to have 3*12 shtill ? On the picture we can see just 2*12 shtill, where is the 3rd VLS ?

24 SAM and 8 SShM VLS

franco wrote:

Isos wrote:Isn't it supposed to have 3*12 shtill ? On the picture we can see just 2*12 shtill, where is the 3rd VLS ?

24 SAM and 8 SShM VLS

Well, someone should change its wikipedia page !! It's written 3*12 shtill.

I think the Wiki number is based off this display model


Though that also has Palash and there is also a model showing the 24 cells


I'm kinda hoping for a mid-life upgrade to 36 Shtil & 16 UKSK
Edit: correct to 3*12...

Admiral Essen has officially entered service: http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160607/1443966248.html