Russian monuments

KiloGolf wrote:

George1 wrote:

KiloGolf wrote:

George1 wrote:Most Russians support idea of Stalin monuments, poll shows

I doubt that poll is accurate. Stalin was Georgian communist barbarian, that killed far too many people to not deserve public toilets named after him.

its not like this friend. Stalin won WWII.. how can not be highly respected by Russian public?

Stalin won nothing.

The Allies together fought and won the war. In fact when Stalin was polishing Hitler's Maschinengewehr and supplying him with raw materials and minerals (for over a good year in WW2), it was down to countries like the UK, Canada, Australia/New Zealand, Greece, Yugoslavia and so on to try fight back that maniac and his axis allies.

Communists were infamous in sitting out the war at the very crucial beginning and appeasing Hitler at the start. They will always be remembered for that. Stalin is no exception.

Wow, you are so deluded that it makes one cringe. So you think that the 80% of Nazi Germany's war resources, including soldiers,
expended on the eastern front are some sideshow? That the vaunted North African real sideshow "won" the war? Perhaps
Italy was central to defeating the axis. And for sure the Pacific theater was 100% responsible for the loss of Nazi Germany even
though there was basically zero resource link between Germany and Japan.

Please spread some more thick and rich NATO revisionist drivel in a Russian forum, troll.

http://akarlin.com/2009/05/victory-day-special-myths-of-eastern-front/

kvs wrote:Wow, you are so deluded that it makes one cringe.    So you think that the 80% of Nazi Germany's war resources, including soldiers,
expended on the eastern front are some sideshow?   That the vaunted North African real sideshow "won" the war?   Perhaps
Italy was central to defeating the axis.    And for sure the Pacific theater was 100% responsible for the loss of Nazi Germany even
though there was basically zero resource link between Germany and Japan.  

Please spread some more thick and rich NATO revisionist drivel in a Russian forum, troll.

http://akarlin.com/2009/05/victory-day-special-myths-of-eastern-front/

Very few Russians are Stalin's apologists. Feel free to be one of them.

PS. Allies won the war, that includes Soviets. I didn't say western Allies only. But it was a joint victory in Europe, and an American victory in the Pacific.

Earlier you were talking about 1939-41, I assume? It made sense for the Soviets. For one thing, the Red Army wasn't ready at the time, as the Winter War and Operation Barbarossa showed. And it's not like the Soviets didn't try to slow down/stop Germany earlier, but it didn't work out. Geopolitics. The Munich agreement, Polish "deals" with Germany to carve of Czechoslovakia, etc. can also be very conveniently forgotten.

Secondly, even in the Pacific the Soviet invasion of Manchuria contributed quite heavily to the surrender of the Japanese. Also, the Chinese forced tied-up a considerable amount of Japan's resources.

The Russian (mixed) support for Stalin makes sense due to WW2 (or rather, the Great Patriotic War). It's perfectly understandable. Western propaganda has also conveniently forgotten how many Western countries commemorate many more or less "questionable" figures. Like them, Stalin was a victor of history, and he's certainly that in Russia (and in many other places in the former USSR), despite the Soviet Union collapsing decades after his death.

And the cold war era Western propaganda has made it worse. Anatoly Karlin has actually written about this. The so-called Russian liberals and that cold era propaganda exaggerated Stalin's crimes. "Muh Stalin killed 60 million people. He was actually worse than Hitler." (Spoiler alert: he didn't, he wasn't.) So Stalin is of course often used in anti-Russian propaganda. Russian support for Stalin is a counter reaction to all of that.

https://www.unz.com/akarlin/tribal-stalinism/

Kimppis wrote:Earlier you were talking about 1939-41, I assume? It made sense for the Soviets. For one thing, the Red Army wasn't ready at the time, as the Winter War and Operation Barbarossa showed. And it's not like the Soviets didn't try to slow down/stop Germany earlier, but it didn't work out. Geopolitics. The Munich agreement, Polish "deals" with Germany to carve of Czechoslovakia, etc. can also be very conveniently forgotten.

Secondly, even in the Pacific the Soviet invasion of Manchuria contributed quite heavily to the surrender of the Japanese. Also, the Chinese forced tied-up a considerable amount of Japan's resources.

The Russian (mixed) support for Stalin makes sense due to WW2 (or rather, the Great Patriotic War). It's perfectly understandable. Western propaganda has also conveniently forgotten how many Western countries commemorate many more or less "questionable" figures. Like them, Stalin was a victor of history, and he's certainly that in Russia (and in many other places in the former USSR), despite the Soviet Union collapsing decades after his death.

And the cold war era Western propaganda has made it worse. Anatoly Karlin has actually written about this. The so-called Russian liberals and that cold era propaganda exaggerated Stalin's crimes. "Muh Stalin killed 60 million people. He was actually worse than Hitler." (Spoiler alert: he didn't, he wasn't.) So Stalin is of course often used in anti-Russian propaganda. Russian support for Stalin is a counter reaction to all of that.

https://www.unz.com/akarlin/tribal-stalinism/

Stalin wasn't Russian he was Georgian and communist. Whoever equates Stalin to Russia is a retard, across the board.

As should be obvious, I'm not a fan Stalin. But to be fair, I think Stalin viewed himself as Russian. I guess you could call him Georgian-Russian or something. It's all about the Great Patriotic War (+ the liberal propaganda and cold war era historiography), when it comes to the Russians and their views on him.

Stalin did continue to send materials to Germany.... materials Germany had paid for... why wouldn't they deliver goods paid for?

And it is amusing that you suggest those heroic western allies fought alone for a year... the western allies appeased Hitler as much as anyone else did... in fact poland even took advantage of Germanys expansion to expand itself in several areas, but Poland is just a victim.

Stalin approached Poland and the UK for an alliance... neither responded... Poland preferring to trust the european germans rather than the half asian communist Soviets.

the US continued to supply material to Germany too...

BTW can we have our people back... if the US won the war in the Pacific then our guys were clearly not needed... especially for the first bit when the Americans were not even involved.

GarryB wrote:Stalin did continue to send materials to Germany.... materials Germany had paid for... why wouldn't they deliver goods paid for?

And it is amusing that you suggest those heroic western allies fought alone for a year... the western allies appeased Hitler as much as anyone else did... in fact poland even took advantage of Germanys expansion to expand itself in several areas, but Poland is just a victim.

Stalin approached Poland and the UK for an alliance... neither responded... Poland preferring to trust the european germans rather than the half asian communist Soviets.

the US continued to supply material to Germany too...

BTW can we have our people back... if the US won the war in the Pacific then our guys were clearly not needed... especially for the first bit when the Americans were not even involved.

Poland took part in snatching parts of Czechoslovakia when Germany went for Sudetia in there. They are no saints. The US are not an example to follow when it comes to their stance to Germany. But neither is the USSR. 1939 and 1940 were not easy years for some countries. USA and USSR skipped the war then.

Alyosha Monument, Monument of the Defenders of the Soviet Arctic during the Great Patriotic War.
"Spectacular and affecting
30+ metres high, on a promontory overlooking the city, the docks and the fjord. Built where the female antiaircraft gunners resisted the Luftwaffe.
A good place to pause and consider the enormity of what happened here and to get an overview of the modern city.
Popular for wedding photos."

"Impressive
One can see the Alyosha Monument from just about anywhere in Murmansk. Its soldier looms over you as it looks to the horizon. And as you get closer to it, its massive size and height exudes the strength that I think its designers wanted to convey.

Impressive."

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_Review-g298501-d3447313-Reviews-Alyosha_Monument_Monument_of_the_Defenders_of_the_Soviet_Arctic_during_the_Great_.html

https://fotografersha.livejournal.com/950761.html

Buran model installed in Sochi

But neither is the USSR. 1939 and 1940 were not easy years for some countries. USA and USSR skipped the war then.

The UK and most of the west helped the opposition to the reds in the russian civil war... what possible reason would the Soviets have to help France or the UK?

If hitler had just taken western europe and starved the British out then Stalin would have done nothing to help... the British were never his allies, and the main reason Hitler got into power and was followed so widely in Germany and Austria is because Britain and France and the US treated Germany like WWI was Germanys fault and treated her very unfairly after that war. Letting Germany get revenge is hardly any skin of the nose of the Soviet Union...

In the end the Germans attacked the Soviets instead of the British and the British did what Stalin would have done... nothing while the Germans and Soviets wore each other out... it couldn't have gone better for the British if they had planned it that way... it would not surprise me if they didn't have a hand in getting Hitler to fixate on living space in the east to push him that way.

Many in the west don't understand Stalins hesitation when the germans invaded, but lets face it... the paranoid purges and British duplicity... why would you not think it was a British plot... another one against the Soviets... not the first time... not the last time...

BTW nice to see the Buran get some pride of place... derided in the west as just a space shuttle copy... ironically if there was a space shuttle design that might have worked this was it.

GarryB wrote:BTW nice to see the Buran get some pride of place... derided in the west as just a space shuttle copy... ironically if there was a space shuttle design that might have worked this was it.

Funnily enough neither was a shuttle, they were both orbital nuclear bombers.

Original shuttle concept by NASA envisioned small vessel launched from an airplane but they couldn't get the funds for it (or anything else after Apollo was done)

So they shopped around for money and Pentagon got involved with their cash and design "input"

Once Soviets saw it they realized instantly that there was only be reasonable purpose for something like that and it was neither crew, cargo or reusability. It was nuclear war.

So they made improvements​ on NASA's design and developed Buran

Results of a survey on the need to open a monument to Joseph Stalin in Moscow: 85 percent - "For"



https://i-korotchenko.livejournal.com/1481008.html

Like him or loathe him, he had an enormous influence on Russia past present and future.

Memorial erected in Idlib for Russian pilot killed in Syria

The Russian Army erected a memorial to the pilot, Roman Filipov, in the place where he parachuted after his plane was hit in the Idlib Governorate.

The incident dates back to February 3, 2018, when he was bombing a group of jihadists in the Idlib countryside.
Instead of surrendering to the jihadists after he parachuted from his falling aircraft, Filipov chose to engage the swarming militants instead of surrendering to them.
The statue was erected on a small hill in the middle of an olive grove, where traces of bullets are still found.
The terrorist groups targeted the Su-25 bomber, with pilot Filippov on board, from portable air defense systems.
The pilot tried to keep the affected aircraft in the air, and was able to inform the command about the missile attack on his plane.
Filipov jumped by parachute after losing control of the bomber and landed in an olive grove in Saraqib that was under the control of militant groups, as he fought an asymmetric battle.

The Russian Ministry of Defense said that when he found himself surrounded by terrorists, as the distance between them diminished, he detonated a bomb with is last words being: “This is for you guys!”

Monuments to MiG-21 and Yak-38 aircraft will be repaired in Murmansk and Volgograd. 

In Volgograd, the preparatory stage of restoration of the MiG-21 memorial aircraft installed on Kachintsev Street has begun, reports Volgogradskaya Pravda.

Monument to the MiG-21 fighter was installed in Volgograd in 1973 in honor of the 30th anniversary of the victory in the Battle of Stalingrad. The MiG-21 plane in the square on Kachintsev Street has not been updated for a long time. Under the influence of time and external factors, chips, cracks and flakes appeared on the pedestal. The pedestal lost several facing plates from the side opposite the roadway. The monument was vandalized several times.

During the restoration, the contractor's specialists will dismantle the reinforced concrete base of the pedestal, and a new one will appear in its place. Metal elements of the monument will be treated with anti-corrosion compounds. At the final stage, the pedestal will be lined, and commemorative plaques will be placed in the same place.

The Yak-38 memorial plane installed in Murmansk on the territory of school No. 57, named after the Hero of Russia pilot Timur Apakidze, will be restored by the beginning of the school year. This is reported by the Interfax-North-West agency with reference to the Deputy Chairman of the Murmansk Council of Deputies Mikhail Belosheev.

Specialists of the contractor company will dismantle the reinforced concrete base of the pedestal, and a new one will appear in its place. Metal elements of the monument will be treated with anti-corrosion compounds. At the final stage, the pedestal will be lined, and commemorative plaques will be placed in the same place.

The monument will be painted, the site will be laid out with new tiles, the lawn will be landscaped. The issue of restoration of the memorial plaque is also being resolved. Work has already begun as part of a comprehensive program to renovate the monument.

The school was named after the Hero of Russia, Aviation Major General Timur Apakidze in 2002 "for his great work in the field of military-patriotic education". At the same time, the school opened a museum of the history of naval aviation, the only such school museum in the Murmansk region.

Installation of a panel dedicated to the Ministry of Emergency Situations at the Davydkovo metro station under construction in Moscow

It is not weird. The visuals are aesthetically appealing. It is a form of art and politics does not delete this fact.
It also descends from the Greco-Roman reliefs.

The sculpture "Soviet Belarus", removed in the 90s, will be restored at the Belorusskaya metro station in Moscow.

Source: 

One of the most original monuments of the Yak-38 is located in the Primorsky Territory in the city of Artem

What a clever way to mount it.... well done...

The memorial "Knyaz Alexander Nevsky with his squad" was opened in the Pskov region

The Rzhev Memorial to the Soviet Soldier is a Russian memorial park located in the Rzhevsky District of the Tver Oblast. The park is dedicated to the Battles of Rzhev. Opened on May 9th, 2020.
The idea to build the memorial came from veterans of the war who collectively wrote to the Committee of the Union State of Russia and Belarus and to scouts of the Russian Military Historical Society in 2017 asking them to create a monument in honor of the diamond jubilee of the victory.
The monument features a bronze 25-metre statue of a soldier in the Red Army standing on a 10-metre mound. On the road leading to the mound, there are images of soldiers on broken walls situated on both sides, as well as the names of those who were killed in action during the battle. Around 34 million rubles were allocated to the monument from the regional government, alongside the 650 million rubles allocated by the Union States, the budget of the Russian government, and private donations. The construction of the monument was also financed and supported by organizations such as Lukoil.

Making these monuments is an excellent way to show respect, but what is even better is to not rush to war.

The heroes of WWII never wanted to be heroes... they wanted to be farmers and doctors and teachers and all sorts of other things till WWII was thrust upon them by politicians too stupid to realise what they were doing.

It is interesting that Russia is building these massive and impressive monuments and the west is tearing theirs down.


...you don't show respect to the fallen by building only monuments, you show respect by making war the absolute last option... a lesson Russia has clearly learned with its international behaviour and a lesson the more civilised and advance and richer west needs to learn again.