RUSSIA - INDIA Military Contracts

jhelb wrote:

Pinto wrote:this has become very racist abusive forum gone are the days when mature discussions took place here

Nothing racist. Just that there are too many third world posters in this forum who post third rate stuff.

Look who's talking

Part of the problem is that some times racism is acceptable... it actually comes down to offence.

I remember an old joke by a British comedian who was talking about racism and about there is acceptable racist jokes and unacceptable racist jokes even back then. He said he had heard jokes that were negative and he mentioned them... personally I didn't find them funny at all, but then he started talking about racist jokes that were acceptable like: the one about a black man riding on a train in the UK who pulls the emergency stop cord. So the conductor goes to see him and asked him what the emergency was and the black man said he was sitting on the toilet doing a jobbie and he accidentally flushed the toilet while he was still sitting down. The conductor said that isn't an emergency... you can't pull the emergency cord for that it is only for emergencies, to which the black man replied you would think it was an emergency if it was your dick wrapped around the axle... ha ha ha...

Suggesting black people are good at sport is often accepted... different ethnic groups do develop physically at different rates, though as we can see at professional athlete level they seem to still need the illegal drugs that other ethnic groups use to win so the difference can't be that big... I would suggest that perhaps people of colour in the west found it easier to progress at sport than in commerce and education which results in them dominating some sports but is that racism or is that the racism of the system where some kid from a poor neighbourhood has more chance of playing football than being the CEO of a successful company... considering he spends most of his time running away from trouble I suspect sports is a natural option that does not require a lot of education or help.

We certainly are not going to solve it here.

PapaDragon wrote:

jhelb wrote:

Pinto wrote:this has become very racist abusive forum gone are the days when mature discussions took place here

Nothing racist. Just that there are too many third world posters in this forum who post third rate stuff.

Look who's talking

The guy who literally never posts anything unless there's an opportunity to diss Indians

flamming_python wrote:The guy who literally never posts anything unless there's an opportunity to diss Indians

That prize went to miketheterrible. But then most of what he says about India and other such third world shitholes in true.

jhelb wrote:

flamming_python wrote:The guy who literally never posts anything unless there's an opportunity to diss Indians

That prize went to miketheterrible. But then most of what he says about India and other such third world shitholes in true.

What you fucking talk about retard? I post way more than you ever did, and I provide news, videos and economic details. What did you contribute? Nothing.

You never contribute to a single thing in this site. I'm gonna request you be banned for not only not actually providing any benefit to this site, but being a massive faggot lying cock sucker racist for no reason at all

The difference is that Mike is identifying problems for India that Indians have to deal with... he probably knows hoping for such problems to be fixed any time soon is hopeless, but longer term I think he actually wants it to happen... he wants India to develop and grow and become a better place.

Sadly Jhelb, you are likely to blame their skin colour or religion for their problems meaning there is no chance of prospects for change for the better.

The irony is the that dick head Clapper... at the time head of the CIA said Russians are genetically disposed to be bad people, which is very racist too, and no body present... he was at a senate hearing I seem to recall... no one present objected or called him out for such bullshit.

So even in the centre of the woke universe there is acceptable racism and unacceptable racism, or in this case bigotry because Russian is not really a race.

But then you have to ask is Indian a race?

India once included Pakistan and Bangledesh, does that mean Pakistanis and people from Bangledesh are Indian?

If they used to be Indian and now are not then it is not a race because you can't change races, race does not mean lines and borders on a map... American is not a race either.

Russia, India ink deal on delivery of 600,000 Kalashnikov AK-203 assault rifles

https://tass.com/defense/1371561

Have seen a few websites describing these rifles as being 308 calibre and offering better penetration than small calibre assault rifles, but I think such people are confusing the AK-203 with the AK-308 which is in 7.62 x 51mm calibre.

The AK-203 is essentially an AK-47 but modernised and improved so sights and equipment are easily fitted to the weapon and it has better ergonomics and features.

It is chambered for 7.62 x 39mm which is not a bad cartridge and can be rather effective.

It is important to note the difference between Russia and the US... in the US they fixate with MOA and how small the groups are on target.

The Soviets and Russians are a bit more practical and they zero their rifles and train their soldiers for body hits at combat ranges.

Very simply put a rifle is zeroed at a specific range so the bullets will hit the point of aim at that specific range... if the target is at a different range to what you zeroed your rifle you need to adjust the iron sights before you fire, or you need to aim off to compensate... aim a little lower if the target is closer or a little higher if it is further away.

The difference is that a US soldier with an M16 will be adjusting their sights all the time to ensure they get hits on target, but in practical terms when under fire you don't adjust your sights, you just aim off and accept that your shots wont be very precise any more.

For the Soviet soldier the battle sight range is 300m. With the 7.62 x 39mm calibre round with a 300m zero if you aim at the targets centre chest, you will get a hit whether the target appears at 20m or 400m because the height of the trajectory of the 7.62 x 39mm round does not exceed the top of your head if zeroed at 300m.

So at 300m your bullet will hit to point of aim... centre chest... using the same point of aim a target at 400m you will probably get a hit in the groin belt buckle area, which is going to drop them anyway. As the target moves closer from 300m the point of impact will get higher and higher till it reaches its peak, which will not be above the average soldiers head and then it will drop down again to the chest area at the muzzle.

This means with one iron sight setting and one point of aim you don't need to estimate or guess or aim off... just point and shoot.

Much simpler.

Keep in mind that a target standing 300m away is tiny and looking through Iron sights will be a blur anyway, so aiming at the upper third of the blur is what you will be doing.

(note you can't focus on the target and have the target in focus because it is the front sight that tells you where your bullets are headed as long as you are looking through the rear sights at the front sights and you can't have the front sight and the target in focus at the same time.)

GarryB wrote:Sadly Jhelb, you are likely to blame their skin colour or religion for their problems meaning there is no chance of prospects for change for the better.

Yes! The history of the world since the end of WW-II shows exactly that. With the exception of China and Japan, not a single country in Asia or Africa has become developed. Most developed countries like Russia, EU, US are predominantly White. So race is certainly a factor.

Look at this forum. Show me one colored/dark skinned member who can provide the analysis and insight that a Russian like Mindstorm provides? I'll wager there are more African, Asian members in this forum than Russian or even Anglo Saxon.

GarryB wrote:The difference is that Mike is identifying problems for India that Indians have to deal with... he probably knows hoping for such problems to be fixed any time soon is hopeless, but longer term I think he actually wants it to happen... he wants India to develop and grow and become a better place.

Mike says he is of Russian decent who somehow landed in the West.

Fortunately, the average Russian has zero connection with India. He/She is totally focused towards Europe - perfectly understandable because our culture and history are linked to Europe. Russians see India for exactly what it is - a third world failed state. Just that unlike the Anglo-Saxons Russians do not say it on their face.

India only has nuisance value for Russia. It's economy is 1/5 that of China and so unlike E.U and China they are not even among the top 5 trading partners of Russia.  

They are an ally/partner of the U.S and will definitely backstab Russia whenever they get a chance.

They are unnecessarily picking up fights with Russian allies like China.

They enter Russia illegally. And from Russia they illegally migrate into Finland and Baltic states. Once apprehended they are forced back into Russia and billion of rubles of Russian taxpayers money is spent sending them back.

Shitholes like India and African countries should be avoided by the Kremlin like plague else, they will drag you down to their own level.

Your not even Russian. Russias history with India goes very far back.

But you are too dumb to realize this. You are also aware Russians exist in the west too, no? Like KVS?

**** are you retarded.

Western "whites" have more serious problems than minorities. It is their own rotten elites that are weaponizing
minorities and creating new fake ones (e.g. LGBTXYZ) to divide and conquer. To stop any coherent action from
the proles to limit their never ending thirst for more power. The biggest threat to western "whites" is their own
brainwashed idiocy. Consuming excrement from their fake stream media day in and day out is lethal in the long run.

BTW, western "whites" are racist against other "whites".

Yes! The history of the world since the end of WW-II shows exactly that. With the exception of China and Japan, not a single country in Asia or Africa has become developed. Most developed countries like Russia, EU, US are predominantly White. So race is certainly a factor.

Are you not paying attention.... the US and all of Europe has been fighting the last 10-15 years tooth and nail to retard and stop Russian and Chinese development and growth... both have developed and grown despite extreme measures by the rich white west.

Race is a factor because the rich white west is normally more successful at destroying countries than their recent record suggests, but even then how successful can Iraq or Iran or Syria or Libya be when the west starts wars there to divide up the mineral and energy wealth in those places for itself to gorge on.

White countries are successful because they are ruthless bastards who murder and destroy and you don't know that because they also write the history books, or you justify it by saying black skinned people are worse... but how could we know when they never get the chance. Any black person genuinely interested in peoples rights and freedom and democracy who can't be bribed by the west is murdered because democracies wont stand by while white western countries steal their natural resources.

All this woke BS is hilarious, but nothing like the accountability that needs to be applied and of course it is applied to all the wrong people... former politicians and the 1% never get in the cross hairs of the woke crowd... it is ex sports people and comedians and actors and actresses...

Look at this forum. Show me one colored/dark skinned member who can provide the analysis and insight that a Russian like Mindstorm provides? I'll wager there are more African, Asian members in this forum than Russian or even Anglo Saxon.

And what colour is Mindstorm?

Fortunately, the average Russian has zero connection with India. He/She is totally focused towards Europe - perfectly understandable because our culture and history are linked to Europe. Russians see India for exactly what it is - a third world failed state. Just that unlike the Anglo-Saxons Russians do not say it on their face.

You are entitled to your opinion, but from the other side of the planet I find it very amusing that Russians think they are European when the current lot of europeans are dirt bags and scum I wouldn't even use as toilet paper because I would be afraid of catching something. No offense meant to our European members but lets openly and fairly look at the way europe treats the world in general and Russia in particular and tell me I am wrong.

It is OK... lots of young people everywhere used to look to the US that way... not so much now but still quite popular.

India only has nuisance value for Russia. It's economy is 1/5 that of China and so unlike E.U and China they are not even among the top 5 trading partners of Russia.

It has not tried to damage Russia with economic sanctions and it doesn't repeatedly... daily attack Russia as some caged demented monster that can't control itself like the EU does.

They are an ally/partner of the U.S and will definitely backstab Russia whenever they get a chance.

They have agreements with the US but then Russia has all sorts of agreements with all sorts of countries too... the US is applying diplomatic sanctions against the Olympic games held in China because unspecified crimes against a group in China... no question of sanctions against UAE which is also holding a sports event soon where over 6,000 workers reportedly died getting the venues ready... Russia has ties with UAE... the upgrade of the Pantsir was funded there...

They are unnecessarily picking up fights with Russian allies like China.

The situation between India and China is for each to sort out and unlike the US, Russia knows they can give advice but not orders and should not get involved other than to encourage talks and discourage cold war arms races and stupid petty acts of aggression that just escalate things.

They enter Russia illegally. And from Russia they illegally migrate into Finland and Baltic states. Once apprehended they are forced back into Russia and billion of rubles of Russian taxpayers money is spent sending them back.

Well then you should make them work their passage if that is all true... send them off to Siberia or some place where they are short of manual labour or whatever skills they might have and make them work their passage to get home.

Shitholes like India and African countries should be avoided by the Kremlin like plague else, they will drag you down to their own level.

You are entitled to your opinion, but decades of mismanagement by the British and India should have been heaven on earth, but that was never the plan... it was a resource for an aging empire to funnel money and resources to the old country... it was never meant to develop and grow.

Based on history I would rephrase what you said and say:

Shitholes like Europe and the US should be avoided by the Kremlin like plague else, they will drag you down to their own level and chew you up for resources and fun.... it seems they enjoy destroying countries and consuming their resources and right now they are on the look out for materials used in batteries and of course energy... soon it might be food they want to control.

The west is a bankrupting influence that corrupts and destroys every country they get their claws in to.

BRICSA was all about creating an alternative and it needs to be kept in focus and worked on further... each country has enormous potential and in the future other countries could and should be added.

miketheterrible wrote:Your not even Russian.  Russias history with India goes very far back.

But you are too dumb to realize this.  You are also aware Russians exist in the west too, no? Like KVS?

**** are you retarded.

Regardless of whether I'm retarded or not you certainly are when you make retarded suggestions like "Russias history with India goes very far back".

India's relations with SSR started only from the 60s.

This is another example of why a lot of Indian arms and projects are a waste of money. They keep talking about made in India initiative, yet they can't produce their own small arms, yet waste billions of dollars on projects that run decades late and produce a sub standard equipment. This deal shows exactly what India should be doing, buying rights to produce equipment, it's far better use of money, it's cheaper, quicker, and they end up with a piece of equipment that is fit for purpose and didn't waste billions in research and development. And this deal was actually not bad, at around $1,000 per rifle for export prices as well as production costs rolled into that figure it's not bad.

"In December, Moscow agreed to give Delhi the means to produce 600,000 AK-203 assault rifles to replace the India-developed INSAS rifles used by its army.
Russia has delivered 70,000 AK-203 assault rifles to India to meet the "urgent operational requirement" of the Indian armed forces. In total, Delhi will eventually have 600,000 rifles at its disposal.

A shipment of ready-to-use AK-203 rifles has been delivered as per schedule under the fast-track procurement deal,” sources told Sputnik.

The arms delivery is part of a deal signed between the Indian Defence Ministry and Indo-Russian Private Limited (IRPL) on 19 August 2021. Indo-Russian Private Limited is a joint venture formed in early 2019 to licence-build 601,427 AK-203s for the Indian military.
The AK will replace the indigenously-developed Indian Small Arms System (INSAS) 5.56x45mm assault rifles that have been used by the Indian Army since the mid-1990s. In 2010, the latter was declared "operationally inadequate" by Delhi following the finding of several design flaws.


The IRPL will be manufacturing the guns at the Korwa facility in the northern Indian state of Uttar Pradesh. Prime Minister Narendra Modi inaugurated the facility in 2019 and signed the contract worth $690 million for more than 600,000 rifles."



India Gets First Batch of AK-203 Assault Rifles from Russia to Meet 'Urgent Operational Requirement'

https://sputniknews.com/20220125/india-gets-first-batch-of-ak-203-assault-rifles-from-russia-to-meet-urgent-operational-requirement-1092507856.html

As I have mentioned before, India should of course increase the amount of things made locally... that is just basic common sense, but they should be careful about what they actually produce.

The criteria should be based on how many they actually need... there is no point in licence making Su-30s if they are going to make less than 400 and have no plans to locally design replacements.

With rifles, and MANPADS and ammo and ATGMs and just short range SAMs they should be licence producing them for themselves because they will want enormous numbers of those, and there is potential in the future for collaboration on improved and upgraded versions that suit Indian conditions and requirements.

Like any country however there are influences... their tank has a 120mm rifled gun because of their british influence, who also use rifled guns so they can fire HESH rounds even though they are ineffective these days... even BMPs with cage armour would probably be safe from HESH rounds...

Part of the justification for buying western equipment is diversification in case of sanctions, which is ironic because it is western countries that sanction.

India gets more Russian S-400s– media, 15.04.2022.

New shipment of Russian military gear comes amid US pressure campaign on New Delhi to sever ties with Moscow.

India has received an order of Russian S-400 air defense systems, according to local media, with officials stating the shipments would continue despite Western efforts to force countries around the world to scuttle relations with Moscow over its ongoing military campaign in Ukraine.

The missile platforms arrived in the country by air and sea and have since been deployed in “designated locations,” senior government officials told India Today on Thursday, noting the S-400s are “now operational.”

“We are continuing to receive our consignments without any delays or issues, and the latest consignment of overhauled engines was received a few days ago despite the war [in Ukraine],” one unnamed official said.

Russia is a top arms supplier to the Indian military, which is currently “stockpiling spares and equipment,” the sources added, though they said those efforts may encounter difficulties in the future due to Western sanctions and “banking system restrictions” on Moscow.

The latest shipment comes more than a month into Russia’s military operation in Ukraine, which has triggered a wave of penalties from the United States and its allies. Washington and others have also repeatedly pushed India to end its trade and security relations with Russia, but the pressure has so far had little effect. In addition to the continued arms deliveries, New Delhi also agreed to buy up more Russian oil and coal in recent weeks. Indian and Russian officials have also discussed a ruble-rupee payment mechanism for trade between the countries, bypassing the dollar and the euro.

During an event at the Atlantic Council on Wednesday, US Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen warned that a “unified coalition of sanctioning countries” would not be “indifferent” to nations that “undermine” the penalties on Russia, blasting those still “sitting on the fence.”

India’s acquisition of S-400 technically runs afoul of a 2017 US law, the Countering American Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA), which was passed in response to allegations of Russian meddling in US elections. However, Washington has so far been reluctant to either apply or waive restrictions, keeping the sanctions card at hand in ongoing talks with New Delhi.

Russian officials, however, have insisted shipments from that military deal would continue regardless of Washington’s pressure.

“We don’t foresee any obstacles as regards the supplies of S-400s to India. We have the mechanisms and the routes to continue with this deal unobstructed,” Russian envoy to India Denis Alipov said last month. “Sanctions will not interfere with these deals in any way, whether previous sanctions or newly imposed.”

https://www.rt.com/news/553906-india-russia-missile-system/

such deals will continue to take place irrespective of what other countries says, new payment system may have to be devised for future contracts. Russia india ties are very old and wont be linked by indian govt to ties with other countries including US Govt

Russia supplied $13 billion worth of weapons to India in five years, 02.12.2023.

Head of FSMTC Shugaev: Russia supplied $13 billion worth of weapons to India in five years.

BANGALORE (India), February 13 - RIA Novosti. Over the past five years, Russia has supplied India with weapons worth more than $13 billion, the current portfolio of arms orders from Moscow and New Delhi is over $10 billion, Dmitry Shugaev, director of the Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation of the Russian Federation, told reporters on the eve of the Aero India exhibition.

The exhibition runs from 13 to 17 February in Bangalore (India).

https://ria.ru/20230213/indiya-1851581502.html

This story seems to be growing legs

AZ
@AZgeopolitics
·
4h
"Russia and India have started negotiations on the supply of sets of Su-30 fighter jets for licensed production" - Deputy Head of the Federal Customs Service of the Russian Federation

If India was smart they'd sign a contract with Russia to build Su-30SM's instead of their MKI version with the expensive Israeli and French extras, but they probably won't.

If India was smart instead of mucking around with Rafale to get Meteor, they should just sign up to a joint venture with Russia to make a mach 10 scramjet powered AAM...

The original Indian requirements were essentially for a two seat Su-35 which is what the current model Su-30 upgrade is... but factions within the military will demand diversity...

I am afraid folks that it is not a matter of diversity or technical characteristics of politics.
It is just a pure case of who is the less expensive to bribe.
India was among the most corrupted countries lie forever.
When the EU was serious, multiple EU-based companies faced corruption charges due their operations in India.
How much in favor that changed since, in your sole opinion?

Indians display these traits because they are people of colour. In fact most of these people of colour that you'll come across are involved in some sort of criminal misdemeanor. People of colour genetically pass on their criminal genes to their children.

These coloured people takes tremendous pride in committing crimes against White people and then define these actions as justified. Self-centered, and oblivious to the needs of others, these coloured people like Indians are career criminal and lives by the simple motto of “me, me, me.” Essentially, these people believe that they have the right to commit any acts they desire, because life is all about them – all the time. India has caused billions of $$ of losses to Russia by stealing IPR.

Take this forum for instance - that double digit IQ Indian has created multiple accounts to force his point of view on others, while that single digit IQ Indian finds ways to demonize China with the intention of forcing forum members to believe that Russia is getting a raw deal in its dealings with China.