The Situation in the Ukraine. #10

Lothar von Trotha wrote:Airbornewolf and others
1. NATO must be disbanded and replaced with a military alliance within EU.
2. US troops must be kicked out of Europe and military alliance with US must be limited to some ad hoc cooperation on hot issues - nothing more.
3. Military expeditures must be increased a bit and European defence industry must become independent in all areas
4. Conflicts with Russia must be avoided at all costs. Ukraine should be divided into two spheres of influence, one Russian and one European (but US cannot have anything to do with that)

your point 1:

if i had any control over such things i definatly would push for an EU millitary, including Russia. but NATO's structure and systems in place does not allow an autonomous EU millitary structure. the U.S has a lot of nuclear weapons stored in Europe, and ever since the cold war the U.S strategy is "if we cant have it, no one will". nuclear scorched earth tactics.
this is just for refference, U.S nuclear weapons in europe will undergo modernisation in 2015 by the way.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-plans-first-strike-attack-on-russia-or-china/5384799?print=1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GT-wP5-H2Zg

if there is going to be any attempt to get an U.S influence-free millitary structure inside europe. Germany would have to initiate it, its millitary industry and commercial industry want exactly that so they are on-board. it would take an political party that would rip appart the treaty written by the U.S and the USSR made in the 1990's, removing the limit of germany's active millitary force. an german haubtfeldwebel told me this agreement is still enforced, but by strict supervision of the U.S.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_on_the_Final_Settlement_with_Respect_to_Germany

point 2.

if it was up to me and other's thinking like me we would have assaulted the nuclear weapon storage sites before NATO HQ had an chance to respond. but as thats an matter of fiction currently there are no real options currently to get rid of the yanks from europe. but first steps are being made on the political level, Greece voiced its support of Russia. France's Le Pen, opinions aside. stated several times she intends to leave NATO and close U.S bases and more ties with Russia being EU's natural neighbour. Hungary and Slovakia are nowadays also voicing their "discontent" publicly about leaving the EU/NATO about the anti-russia policy. this is going to take time, but for me personally it feels at least there is deminishing U.S influence.

Point 3

millitary expenditures are indeed a joke. but in regard of EU's millitary industry its doing pretty well actually. France is being an pretty hot-topic in the news with its Mistral-carriers. but thats just one EU millitary-industrial product out of many.
recently, the German Goverment ordered H&K to develop an new MG for its troops. specified to an U.S manufactured 5.56 MM round. H&K did what it was asked by the german government, but it started its own project parallel to the Goverment project. the MG-5, that would have the same modern features as the MG-4 asked by the german government. but would use the standard 7.62 MM round available by world-wide manufacturers. the german millitary ultimatly chose the MG-5, and the MG-4 got shelved.
there is serious competition between EU and U.S weapon manufacturers to the point they can drink the blood of eachother. while the EU politicians do a lot of BlaBla, the EU weapons industry is doing very good business with China. we arent talking about a few 30 mm rounds being sold. but instead entire ships, radar systems, command and control, exocet missiles, AT-missiles like Milan, helicopter engines, ship engines, and EU weapon companies know exactly how to circumvent "sanctions" with China. instead of shipping an complete weapon system they simply ship it in sepparate shipments and put it back together in mainland china before handing it over to Chinese millitary.
some people here might remember of an incident of China with Japan scared shitless when one of their ships got an lock from an EU manufactured Fire control Radar.
both Thales, Rheinmetall and many other EU weapon manufacturers see mountains of gold lying in Russia, in modernising the Russian millitary machine. and it annoys them greatly the Politicians are standing in their way.
and EU's millitary industry is already independent, no question about that. its the U.S weapons industry that has to get their resources from europe in fact. Lockheed Martin imports a shitload of resources from Russia in fact.

point 4, well...i'd be honest here and just say i dont know the solution for Ukraine either.

i really find it horrible to what is done to east ukraine, or having to see normal people lives ruined for the U.S its attempt to grab Ukraine in some NATO Chess-game. and of course the E.U having no problems with all the Nazi flags waving next to NATO flags. the least they could have done is openly condemn the fascists and withdraw support for Kiev.

at this point, i do believe that Ukraine is effectively destroyed as an country. eastern Ukraine and Western Ukraine will never rejoin after this. and i understand. what west Ukraine does doesnt interrest me much, with their Nazi movements and all.... but still, im sure there are people living in West Ukraine that dont agree with what is going on.
and i hope eastern ukraine gets somewhere an chance at normal life again, without anyone outside of their country trying to tell them what to do.

but, yes... in general the U.S should get the hell out of the EU continent and take their damn nukes with them. they can use them up for their damn 4th of july fireworks for all i care.

This is what Germany ,France and most pro peace nations in Europe should declare in public..

<< In light that United States.. continues to ignore our demands to stop provoking Russia into a conflict
with Europe and that continues to fuel the violence in Middle east and in Ukraine. and violating international laws
by interfering in other nations politics and supplying weapons to terrorist or radicals groups causing
many civilians casualties.. we the European Union declare that will leave the
NATO organization immediately and that United states will have X time to remove all their military hardware
from Europe..>>  

Very easy to say.. and very legit.. If USA lose the support of Europe.. is game over for them.. the end of the dollar..
as currency reserve and no longer Americans will be able to lead any war ,any place without Europe permission..
Ie.. cannot enter not even in the mediterranean sea  and neither enter in the baltic sea. That will be a mortal blow
to the american globalist agendas and will sink the US economy , since no longer anyone (but americans) will be trading in Dollars... significantly lowering US GDP to normal levels.. ie .. cut in half.

It will be the end of Financing NGOs and using their economy and banking system influence as a weapon to blackmail other nations. the end also of their control of Internet.. and so and so.  It can be done.. but it requires leaders with a different set of goals and values..

But yes.. US can be kicked from Europe.. if India could kick UK from Europe when it was the world biggest empire without firing a single shot.. just civil
dissobedience and not following orders.. what gandhi called Passive Resistance. The first thing however that will happen ,when any Nation start to leave NATO is terrorist attacks .. and the activation of US  NGOS.. demanding the
president to Resign. Israel for his part will be activating jewish media to call ..for example Marine Le penn a communist.. or a putin puppet. and inventing stories of corruption or how she wants to turn france into communism..
etc. It will be necessary Counter Media in Europe.. for the zionist propaganda.

The best way for france of any european nation to leave NATO is with a referendum ..and get a fool proof system.
that is impossible later to claim it was not fair.. Things like Cameras.. filming all.. but also having representatives of all political parties inspecting everything in every voting place. and more important than anything manual voting.. no computers or machines that could be hacked.. just piece of paper and pencil..with YES or NO write in.. it can be done.

Vann7 wrote:IT is clear Germany and France and many most of europe oppose the war..

Hollande, Merkel go to Moscow to discuss Ukraine without consulting US – report

http://rt.com/news/229783-hollande-merkel-moscow-ukraine/


The question is.. what kind of weapons US can give Ukraine ,that will make Germany and France to rush to kiev and moscow and talk with Poroshenko and Putin to secure a peace deal ,and counter Kerry pushing for war? What kind of weapons could help the kiev fighters to push the NAF fighters away of the devaltsevo cauldron and or Donetsk Airport? Let me remind you ,that if US announce to give weapons to kiev..and such weapons end being not good enough.. their reputation will be in place as an inferior power than Russia.. if Rebels not pushed back.

There was even discussion on the US congress that Ukrainians are not trained to use more advanced weapons ,that they have and that it will take months at least for that training them.  So Obviously If USA give weapons to Ukraine
to help them now.. weapons that ukrainians cannot use or understand how to use now. This means that for sure
it will be americans the ones operating the new weapons they will receive. and such weapons have nervous Germany and France that it could trigger Russia to invade Ukraine with its army.. and or attack USA.. and a major war start.

So what kind of weapons Americans can provide Kiev if US is desperate to show they are doing
something to "help their allies" and tip the balance on the fight.. at least for Devalsevo and Donetsk airport.

Here is my best guess..
1)Tactical mini nukes.. with 1 kiloton power.. enough to wipe 1-5 km distance.
(but something like this will mean  War with Russia)

2)Chemical weapons ...US have very lethal chemical weapons that the Rebels will not be prepared to fight..
no gear.. etc,,

3) Moad Bombs  (perhaps launched from artillery)


4)and or provide incendiary fuel bomb long range artillery guided by GPS..

5)or provide the same bomb Israel used on Syria that melts the ground.. and dig a huge hole.. ideal for destroying
fortifications , bunkers over a large area. .



Looks like Nanothermite bomb.. the same thing US and Israel used to tear down world trade center in 9/11 and blame it on talibals in caves.. later..   .this last one is the most likely weapon that americans dressed as ukrainians will start using against the Rebels.. Very lethal indeed.  

Weapons like that ,(that im sure Russia also have).. is the reason why it should be a good idea for the rebels to fight as close as possible of the Ukrainians. To make it more difficult for the western Anglozionist mafia to target them alone. and have the risk of friendly fire.  

Whatever it is.. Russia needs to be prepared in days for a major coward attack of the exceptional americans ,that could cause major casualties on the Rebels fighting there. . Probably this is why we see reports of Pantsirs in eastern Ukraine..

What is dangerous about this is that US can hide behind the ukrainian army ,use their uniforms and attack not only eastern ukraine with lethal weapons using professional forces ,veterans of their army.. but also Russia.. to provoke
they invade... which is their goal. i predict that we will know what kind of weapons Kiev received in just less than 1 week.  

I don't think Kiev will win,and i don;t think americans expect either that kiev will win the war.. but the western mafia can cause significant damages and casualties on the rebels using all they have at hand even without using nuclear
weapons. Just to provoke Russia to invade.. And casualties on Russian undercover voluntary soldiers that could be helping in the fight.

Does Russia have any of those weapons(or some thing equal to that), especially number 5.

Vann7 wrote:IT is clear Germany and France and many most of europe oppose the war..

Hollande, Merkel go to Moscow to discuss Ukraine without consulting US – report

http://rt.com/news/229783-hollande-merkel-moscow-ukraine/


The question is.. what kind of weapons US can give Ukraine ,that will make Germany and France to rush to kiev and moscow and talk with Poroshenko and Putin to secure a peace deal ,and counter Kerry pushing for war? What kind of weapons could help the kiev fighters to push the NAF fighters away of the devaltsevo cauldron and or Donetsk Airport? Let me remind you ,that if US announce to give weapons to kiev..and such weapons end being not good enough.. their reputation will be in place as an inferior power than Russia.. if Rebels not pushed back.

There was even discussion on the US congress that Ukrainians are not trained to use more advanced weapons ,that they have and that it will take months at least for that training them.  So Obviously If USA give weapons to Ukraine
to help them now.. weapons that ukrainians cannot use or understand how to use now. This means that for sure
it will be americans the ones operating the new weapons they will receive. and such weapons have nervous Germany and France that it could trigger Russia to invade Ukraine with its army.. and or attack USA.. and a major war start.

So what kind of weapons Americans can provide Kiev if US is desperate to show they are doing
something to "help their allies" and tip the balance on the fight.. at least for Devalsevo and Donetsk airport.

Here is my best guess..
1)Tactical mini nukes.. with 1 kiloton power.. enough to wipe 1-5 km distance.
(but something like this will mean  War with Russia)

2)Chemical weapons ...US have very lethal chemical weapons that the Rebels will not be prepared to fight..
no gear.. etc,,

3) Moad Bombs  (perhaps launched from artillery)


4)and or provide incendiary fuel bomb long range artillery guided by GPS..

5)or provide the same bomb Israel used on Syria that melts the ground.. and dig a huge hole.. ideal for destroying
fortifications , bunkers over a large area. .



Looks like Nanothermite bomb.. the same thing US and Israel used to tear down world trade center in 9/11 and blame it on talibals in caves.. later..   .this last one is the most likely weapon that americans dressed as ukrainians will start using against the Rebels.. Very lethal indeed.  

Weapons like that ,(that im sure Russia also have).. is the reason why it should be a good idea for the rebels to fight as close as possible of the Ukrainians. To make it more difficult for the western Anglozionist mafia to target them alone. and have the risk of friendly fire.  

Whatever it is.. Russia needs to be prepared in days for a major coward attack of the exceptional americans ,that could cause major casualties on the Rebels fighting there. . Probably this is why we see reports of Pantsirs in eastern Ukraine..

What is dangerous about this is that US can hide behind the ukrainian army ,use their uniforms and attack not only eastern ukraine with lethal weapons using professional forces ,veterans of their army.. but also Russia.. to provoke
they invade... which is their goal. i predict that we will know what kind of weapons Kiev received in just less than 1 week.  

I don't think Kiev will win,and i don;t think americans expect either that kiev will win the war.. but the western mafia can cause significant damages and casualties on the rebels using all they have at hand even without using nuclear
weapons. Just to provoke Russia to invade.. And casualties on Russian undercover voluntary soldiers that could be helping in the fight.

Does Russia have any of those weapons(or some thing equal to that), especially number 5.

par far wrote:


Does Russia have any of those weapons(or some thing equal to that), especially number 5.      

Yes to 1 to 4.. they have the FOAB bomb.. father of all bombs..  is like American MOAB but 4x times
more powerful  than the super non nuclear bomb they tested.  About the #5  , not sure.. its like a bunker
buster weapon combined with nano thermite.. IF thats the case.. is not a rocket science weapon..
thermite is used for welding..  take a look at rail roads in siberia.. using thermite.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQViDITyIKs

here look how explosive nano thermite can be..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dShGYuU_Wks

looks like a katiuska missile on steroids.. what Israel used in Syria.

On more news.. a must see,  
A recent report of the history of Ukraine.. uploaded just this week..
Is super interesting , and shows how Ukraine Rusophobia began.. and how its language was created.



I knew that Ukrainian was a dialect of Russian..and called little russian.. but didn't knew that there was other languages too ,in western ukraine.. promoted by Poland..

It also show the head of the snake , the first Nationalistic leader in Ukraine , his face show up in Ukraine
currency. and shows the impact that Religion orthodox vs Catholic had in language in Ukraine. and finally shows
very funny/tragic anecdotes that happened to Ukrainians after the collapse of hungarian empire. That professor
really knows how to count in detail the Ukrainian history..  

From Saker... an ukraine soldier who surrender ,told Donetsk government that kiev is planning
a new false flag attack .. mariupol like .. to blame it on the rebels..with the civilians being evacuated..from
devaltsevo pocket by OSCE.

Ukraine prepares a terrorist attack in Debaltsevo




http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/2015/02/ukraine-sitrep-extremely-dangerous.html

I don't see why seps can't pull false flag on Ukraine too. They can infiltrate their nat guard easily.


Some serious shit happened here.
Maybe massive losses on both sides are the reason for new ceasefire

Regular wrote:I don't see why seps can't pull false flag on Ukraine too. They can infiltrate their nat guard easily.


Some serious shit happened here.
Maybe massive losses on both sides are the reason for new ceasefire

Why do you say "on both sides"; why don't you think the Nazi's took almost all the losses? What in the video supports your hypothetical position.

It is just one scene from big picture. It's really unclear to even those on the front. Well according to various separatist sources Ukrs have dug themselves good. That alone gives them advantage no matter how disorganized they are. Strelkov and some others already complained about big losses amongst seps because everything wasn't planned nor fulfilled properly.
Seps would refuse any peacetalks if they weren't exhausted as well. It seems now separatists are working without direct help of Russia, so they might be not decisive as in Ilovaisk.

Source: nearly 200 Balkan mercenaries fighting on Kiev’s side in Ukraine

MOSCOW, February 6. /TASS/. Some 200 mercenaries from Balkan countries are fighting alongside Kiev troops in eastern Ukraine, a military expert familiar with the situation told TASS on Friday.
"Citizens from certain countries of the Balkan region are participating in an armed conflict in Ukraine," the expert said. US private security firm Academi plays the key role in hiring the mercenaries, he said.
Most mercenaries come from Croatia, and also Kosovo, including the former members of the Kosovo Liberation Army, who have an experience in armed actions.
"These mercenaries are mainly acting as part of the so-called volunteer battalions," he said.
"According to some estimates, the overall number of the representatives of the countries of the former Yugoslavia who are fighting on the side of Kiev is around 200," he said.
In September, Amnesty International accused battalion fighters in eastern Ukraine of war crimes, which it said are the result of a failure by the Kiev authorities to bring Aidar and other volunteer battalions under control.

Regular wrote:It is just one scene from big picture. It's really unclear to even those on the front. Well according to various separatist sources Ukrs have dug themselves good. That alone gives them advantage no matter how disorganized they are. Strelkov and some others already complained about big losses amongst seps because everything wasn't planned nor fulfilled properly.
Seps would refuse any peacetalks if they weren't exhausted as well. It seems now separatists are working without direct help of Russia, so they might be not decisive as in Ilovaisk.

Novorussians have agreed to talks before, too, a la Minsk, but that didn't prevent them from going on offensive as in the current one. After all, isn't it that this war is all about the Novorussians being extremely charitable towards the Nazis?

What peace talks are you referring to? I haven't heard of any. All I've heard is that the Novorussians have instituted an evacuation of the remaining civilians to whatever side that the want to go to.

Ukie's "Ambulance" vehicle are armoured and the interior is exactly similar to troop transporters

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/1908195_429953773823210_1364363771340051979_n.jpg?oh=7914a795174dd61d7c078f0aad42d945&oe=55944082&__gda__=1432858947_746f6db71142a533fabb4551c021fc26

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10959296_429953777156543_7452508858709988216_n.jpg?oh=ae58c1c215cdb175d3121d199b6ea0db&oe=5561108C&__gda__=1432774149_49f7576c51d9f04433678cabbf45babf

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10410109_429953760489878_2551183784420839697_n.jpg?oh=af5656d2758bcc8b14855652c697c4c4&oe=555B1B93&__gda__=1431245391_5be5deb546cdc574b6b35d0a11804611

Kyo wrote:Source: nearly 200 Balkan mercenaries fighting on Kiev’s side in Ukraine

MOSCOW, February 6. /TASS/. Some 200 mercenaries from Balkan countries are fighting alongside Kiev troops in eastern Ukraine, a military expert familiar with the situation told TASS on Friday.
"Citizens from certain countries of the Balkan region are participating in an armed conflict in Ukraine," the expert said. US private security firm Academi plays the key role in hiring the mercenaries, he said.
Most mercenaries come from Croatia, and also Kosovo, including the former members of the Kosovo Liberation Army, who have an experience in armed actions.
"These mercenaries are mainly acting as part of the so-called volunteer battalions," he said.
"According to some estimates, the overall number of the representatives of the countries of the former Yugoslavia who are fighting on the side of Kiev is around 200," he said.
In September, Amnesty International accused battalion fighters in eastern Ukraine of war crimes, which it said are the result of a failure by the Kiev authorities to bring Aidar and other volunteer battalions under control.

This is why Russia needs private military(I think they already have some) and they need to be supported financially and given the resources they need. Having a pretty well oiled private military company can come in really handy.

Regular wrote:I don't see why seps can't pull false flag on Ukraine too. They can infiltrate their nat guard easily.

Basically you are saying Separatist and Russia (that monitors their actions and Donetsk/Lugansk policy) will use false flags and kill civilians to gain political advantage.  You obviously know more than anyone that the separatist DONT NEED any criminal false flag operation ,to proof a point.. Since KIEV ALONE is discrediting themselves every day.. day after day.. by shelling cities..  You obviously know that for near 1 year , Kiev army have been killing civilians almost every day and that those things have done NOTHING to make Europe condemn kiev of warcrimes... The ODessa Massacre did nothing , hundred burned alive.. the mass graves found of civilians tortured and killed in formed kiev zones did nothing ,for europe to condem kiev of warcrimes.. and MH-17 did nothing..  instead is all
blamed in Russia.. they are the only ones sanctioned.  for all evil happening in eastern Ukraine..

And now you suggest that the Rebels could have the "brilliant idea" to murder civilians ,in one specific zone ,that is the center of more fighting,for political advantage , completely ignoring how civilians are being killed all over Donetsk and Lugansk every day.. and it helps in NO way    the separatist ,to get any supoort from Europe ,for the reason that is kiev the one committing the crimes.


in more news..

RT journalist come under sniper fire ,and civilians attacked and wounded when being evacuated in the devaltsevo zone.

RT Correspondents Come Under Fire in East Ukraine



http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150206/1017881187.html

Oh wait that was another "false flag" by Russian government..and putin ,  for sure those images tell you too
they are also good actors showing sadness and fear for their lives.

but guess what.. just like any other time.. it will be business as usual.. Kiev is never blamed for anything ,never sanctioned ,never pressured to stop their criminal war ,and this new attack will do NOTHING to help the pro Russian side to get any justice or support for anyone in UN or Europe or anyone in the world ,other than Russia.

It is just one scene from big picture. It's really unclear to even those on the front. Well according to various separatist sources Ukrs have dug themselves good. That alone gives them advantage no matter how disorganized they are.

That will give no advantage if they are encircled and cannot receive supplies and food.. All the separatist needs to do
is let them starve to death.. the cease of fire was requested to evacuated the civilians ,once the civilians evacuated
the kiev forces no longer will have human shields to hide.. and their entire place burned. In other words they are
pretty much screwed and their digging will not save them from the toxic smoke and fire ,and neither will help when they are out of munition and food. they will have to surrender. In other words only Europe and a Cease of Fire can save them ,unless outside forces manage to break the encirclement using NATO heavy weapons.

higurashihougi wrote:Ukie's "Ambulance" vehicle are armoured and the interior is exactly similar to troop transporters

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/1908195_429953773823210_1364363771340051979_n.jpg?oh=7914a795174dd61d7c078f0aad42d945&oe=55944082&__gda__=1432858947_746f6db71142a533fabb4551c021fc26

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10959296_429953777156543_7452508858709988216_n.jpg?oh=ae58c1c215cdb175d3121d199b6ea0db&oe=5561108C&__gda__=1432774149_49f7576c51d9f04433678cabbf45babf

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10410109_429953760489878_2551183784420839697_n.jpg?oh=af5656d2758bcc8b14855652c697c4c4&oe=555B1B93&__gda__=1431245391_5be5deb546cdc574b6b35d0a11804611

Good job exposing the truth on this, I also was reporting Kiev was doing this 4 days ago. It's disgraceful that they will go this far.

Looks like Kerry hasn't committed to giving weapons to Kiev...yet...probably because Russia threatened to leave the MTCR agreement and probably to sell long range cruise missiles to Venezuela and other countries not liked by the Pentagon/CIA/U.S. State Dept.





...This thread has been rather gloomy, here's some photoshop's to lighten up your mood:














...And my favorite!

NATO is already supplying lethal weapons to Ukraine since last year.. reports exist of
JAvelin missiles ,NATO artillery,drones, and NATO assault rifles.White phosporous munition ,
the question is not whether or not they are doing it.. but if they will take their support to a new level.. and start supplying more dangerous (non nuclear) weapons but of mass destruction , Cruise missiles ,ballistic missiles ,chemical weapons ,biological weapons..  that could be targeted against civilians..too.  Im not a aware of all very heavy weapons that NATO could give Ukraine that have Germany and France worried.. if anyone can elaborate. feel free to discuss.


in more news..
More kiev warcrimes..  perhaps another putin/separatist false flag ..  

Donetsk family crippled by war: Mother injured, one son killed, 2nd remains critical

Vann7 wrote:NATO is already supplying lethal weapons to Ukraine since last year.. reports exist of
JAvelin missiles ,NATO artillery,drones, and NATO assault rifles.White phosporous munition ,
the question is not whether or not they are doing it.. but if they will take their support to a new level.. and start supplying more dangerous (non nuclear) weapons but of mass destruction , Cruise missiles ,ballistic missiles ,chemical weapons ,biological weapons..  that could be targeted against civilians..too.  Im not a aware of all very heavy weapons that NATO could give Ukraine that have Germany and France worried.. if anyone can elaborate. feel free to discuss.


in more news..
More kiev warcrimes..  perhaps another putin/separatist false flag ..  

Donetsk family crippled by war: Mother injured, one son killed, 2nd remains critical

If there is a ceasefire, hoefully most of the civilians are taken out of the war zone. Sucks to see kids injured or killed. This Kiev government is just a bunch of jewish zionst bastards.

Surprise! Ceasefire has already been broken, and surprise again the finger is pointing towards Kiev:

Vann7 wrote:

Regular wrote:I don't see why seps can't pull false flag on Ukraine too. They can infiltrate their nat guard easily.

Basically you are saying Separatist and Russia (that monitors their actions and Donetsk/Lugansk policy) will use false flags and kill civilians to gain political advantage.  You obviously know more than anyone that the separatist DONT NEED any criminal false flag operation ,to proof a point.. Since KIEV ALONE is discrediting themselves every day.. day after day.. by shelling cities..  You obviously know that for near 1 year , Kiev army have been killing civilians almost every day and that those things have done NOTHING to make Europe condemn kiev of warcrimes... The ODessa Massacre did nothing , hundred burned alive.. the mass graves found of civilians tortured and killed in formed kiev zones did nothing ,for europe to condem kiev of warcrimes.. and MH-17 did nothing..  instead is all
blamed in Russia.. they are the only ones sanctioned.  for all evil happening in eastern Ukraine..

And now you suggest that the Rebels could have the "brilliant idea" to murder civilians ,in one specific zone ,that is the center of more fighting,for political advantage , completely ignoring how civilians are being killed all over Donetsk and Lugansk every day.. and it helps in NO way    the separatist ,to get any supoort from Europe ,for the reason that is kiev the one committing the crimes.

Why target civilians? Infrastructure, police, their higher ups, army. Maybe it's already happening. Loads of blue on blue incidents in UAF at the moment:)

According to CyberBerkut, Ukraine gets weapons from the US & resells them in the Middle East:

Ukraine secretly selling weapons to the United States to Syria

IF you ask me.. this is not very good for the USA Empire..



The whole thing (war and violence and civilians killed ) happening in Ukraine is precisely to do the opposite.
That is to split Europe from Russia and cut their relations.. ie.. A new COLD WAR.  and there you see is
that small table , France and Germany working together with Putin to solve the problems in Ukraine that
the americans are fueling there. and they discuss how to end the conflict without americans
invited there  

Then you have the UK defense secretary saying recently that giving weapons to ukraine will only make things
worse. Basically if you come to the conclusion .the exceptional Americans Government are being isolated in
the world ,in their actions in Ukraine , you will be correct.  

Thats crazy thing if you ask me.. No longer US is taking the leadership in solving world conflicts..  
I will fall from the chair if France again made it public that Sanctions needs to be lifted against Russia. it will be
a major slap in the face of US neoliberals chickenhawks . Im sure Europe suspect , that the US goals in Ukraine
is to get Russia into a fight with Europe through Ukraine conflict. and that the above meeting without consulting americans is signs of Rebellion in Europe towards US plans to provoke Russia into a war.

Putin, Hollande, Merkel talks on Ukraine ‘constructive’, possible document in progress – Kremlin

http://rt.com/news/230123-putin-hollande-merkel-talks/

If the cease fire holds..it will be a major slap in the face of US gov.. and a major defeat for their containment
of Russia. IF not.. still it shows what is the opinion of Europe about the Ukraine war.. they don't want it and
neither they support US fueling the violence. France also in public have said supplying weapons to Ukraine will solve
nothing.  Officially speaking US gov are isolating itself in the world for their actions in Ukraine.   I don't remember
any other time in history such clear split between US and Europe.

Event like this ,should not be underestimated. This encourage in Europe disobedience in other nations.. to say
NO Thanks..,whenever US Gov policy , is against the interest of European Countries . Now if Only Marine Le penn
win the elections ,that will truly take things to a new level.. the split of France from NATO and an starting very close relations with Russia.

Ukrainian soldiers are using a captured russian army t72b

^^^
That the best you got? 8000+ Ukrainians are trapped in the cauldron, silly propaganda displays wont save their sorry rear-ends!

I don't know about the tank..it could be or not..  but the food.. you have to know ,that Russia humanitarian help to Ukraine includes Russian army Food for civilians...  It can last for years and easy to carry.   Even the Ukraine army
when surrendered and move to Russia ,were given that same food in the picture.  

I do think that RUssia is helping the Rebels.. but the food argument is silly. Most civilians are very likely
provided with that food. The tank looks in good conditions too.. looks like abandoned one without combat.

here @F-15 in case you believe that only Russia is helping .. go and see your lovely american "patriots" fighting in Ukraine ,helping kiev in the genocide of civilians.

This one was killed..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4DpPr9xy5U

here 400 americans blackwater/academi in Ukraine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ki5alr1vzwM

and this one recently was caught in mariupol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPa97gS0xHc

check here polish mercenaries helping kiev criminal war.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqStlAt3ODc

There are thousands Americans/Europeans fighting for Kiev in Ukraine.. and Poroshenko does not hides that..
they welcome anyone who wants to help them ,and give them ukraine citizenship who helps them in their criminal war.. In the Airport many NATO weapons were caught.. and Polish mercenaries killed. So trying to pretend that Russia is the only one in the outside that send/allow mercenaries to helps in the fight is not only dishonest but pure bullshit.

NATO weapons tons on videos too one here..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ki5alr1vzwM

For the only reason NATO does not provide tanks or combat jets to Ukraine is for the bad image in
public Business relations that will create if their military hardware fails and destroyed easily by the rebels.