The Situation in the Ukraine. #10

Airbornewolf wrote:not that its an negative thing, but the moderating on this forum is very patient with people like you.

It is a negative thing; it's becoming harder and harder to take this forum seriously.

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http://lifenews.ru/news/149544

The Kiev regime has launched a counter-offensive along the whole front. This seems to be a move to reduce or
prevent any rebel gains before a "peace deal".

Putin is an idiot if he is actually going to push the rebels to make a deal with the regime. I hope this effort by the
regime fails and turns into a rout.

F-15E wrote:russian terrorist shoots off his Kalashnikov,and then gets punched by his comrade
hahahaha

The "hahahahah" in this post was great.

You can really tell how ass-hurt he is that Russia/Seperatists have an upper hand in the fighting.

Former French President Nicolas Sarkozy who will be running for next elections in france is saying that Russia is right and Obama is wrong.    albeit using different wording..


Former French President Nicolas Sarkozy noted on Saturday that France and Russia are part of a common European civilization, and that Crimea cannot be blamed for choosing to join Russia.



So basically Germany and France oppose Americans fueling the war in Ukraine and even oppose the isolation
of Russia from Europe.. this is a clear and direct opposition to US world hegemony and their attempts to provoke
a war between Europe and Russia..by fueling the conflict in Ukraine. Just not long ago ,Hollande was calling for a new monetary system not so dependent on american dollar.

the Position of France leadership left or right it even gets better..

Read this @TR1.. is not kremling propaganda.. and Putin paid nothing to sarkozy  to say this...

With regard to Crimea's referendum to leave Ukraine and join Russia in March 2014, Sarkozy noted that  "Crimea has chosen Russia, and we cannot blame it [for doing so]." He added that "we must find the means to create a peacekeeping force to protect Russian speakers in Ukraine."  

So there you have it.. even France leaders.. recognize the ethnic cleaning that is happening against Russians
in Ukraine.. this is obvious is not propaganda.. Americans are promoting an ethnic cleansing of Ethnic Russians
and giving weapons to Ukraine and political cover.. so they continue with their warcrimes.  Is a criminal war plain and simple.. Contrary to Chechenia ,where the terrorist were using civilians as human shields.. here you have an army of radicals sponsored by Kiev and US.. that are intentionally targeting civilians , schools , hospitals ,journalist..
as a means of provoke terror on the civilian population and silence the media and force them to flee their homes towards Russia.

http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150207/1017949471.html#ixzz3R6EH0mpf

Of course with Marine Le penn ,takes things to a new level.. ask for France leaving NATO and the EU and she
blames Europe for the civil war in Ukraine and admire Putin tolerance and restrain and searching for peace in such difficult situation.

Can anyone imagine an alliance of France -Germany -Italy and Russia? with the backup of BRICS economies?
That will be incredibly cool ,and will definitively change the way the world operates today..

russian terrorist shoots off his Kalashnikov,and then gets punched by his comrade
hahahaha

Sounds like a headline from CNN...

In the real world that is called a negligent discharge and it happens everywhere people have firearms including the police and the armed forces.

The "hahahahah" in this post was great.

You can really tell how ass-hurt he is that Russia/Seperatists have an upper hand in the fighting.

Or possibly the realisation that when US troops are there that they are going to have to deal with a lot worse than that from the Ukrainian Kiev led forces.

Of course the Pro EU Ukrainian forces are less likely to shoot their US trainers than the Iraqis and Afghans were, they will still be putting themselves at risk... there will be plenty of western Ukrainians that really don't want to fight eastern Ukrainians to become part of NATO and the EU... maybe if enough American "advisers" are killed in "accidents" the problems might resolve themselves.

the CIA and Israelis were very good at arranging accidents for Iranian nuclear scientists... I wonder if the FSB is just as capable...

Brazilian volunteer fighter helping Novorosiya defense..  





And don't miss a new Sochi show.. Putin attended.. and you can see
Lukashenko was also there and with a large face ..

Ukrainian internet trolls are already promising the doom of Russia over the coming supplies of US weaponary to the Ukraine. Like that we'll start getting a much greater amount of coffins coming back to Russia soon.

Some media rags are doing it too.

US weaponary huh.

All these people are living in their own dreams. What friggin US weaponary? What can they possibly provide that would change ANYTHING at all? What great amount of Russian soldiers are there there, to fill coffins? And of those that are there, what could possibly highten the threat to them?

Weapons/equipment are a problem for the Ukrainian military; but it's just one out of the big list that they face, and not the most important by far at that.

I cannot even begin to formulate the words neccessery, to describe how ridiculous and delusional these people are. They literally just create myths for themselves. First the Russian-organized rebellion, Putin's agents everywhere, then their cyborgs at the airport; now they're waiting for what exactly - Javelin ATGMs? How about some M1 Tanks maybe? Yeah, nevermind that the logistical train is completely incompatible - these people know jack about the military or anything else, so why not huh?

If they really want to win the war, or the 'ATO', they should really be more concerned with their collapsing home-front and discontent, complete failure of the latest mobilization drive, increasing partisan activity in the border regions, devaluation of the Hrivnia by about 40% in the last 2-3 days, rapidly impoding economy in general and the IMFs growing reluctance to lend any more money, the Europeans starting to get colder and colder feet about supporting them, sinking morale on the front after a string of recent defeats and set-backs... yah, like all these things are actually more critical for them, then the lack of some ATGMs or whatever.
And really, time these trolls to go themselves to the front. If they really want to win the way - well, the banner is in their hands, as we say in Russian.

In fact screw it, I'll tell you guys.

Recently, just out of curiousity's sake, I accousted one of these Ukrainian trolls on Youtube, who was in the middle of a shouting match with someone or other over something. I really shouldn't have, but I was genuinely interested as to what's actually going on in their minds, and whether it's actually possible to get something productive out of them.

I asked the question:

Me: Why aren't you at the front, hero?

The conversation with this sub-life specimen, then went exactly like this, word for word:

Him: Same question back to you! Why aren't you sucking dick?
Me: No really, why aren't you at the front? After all your country is being 'attacked'. If I myself really believed in such BS, in your place I would have gone.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!!! Aren't you capable of nothing else? Sterile degenarates!
Me: FFS is it really so hard to answer 1 question? I'm not even insulting you, or anything.
Me: You're a lost cause for human reasoning. You live in a world of illusions and rationalize with emotions and make-believe, rather than with hard facts. You better wake up.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!! Putin's calling you up, come and die on Great Ukrainian Land!
Me: No-one's calling me up, I'm from Russia not the Ukraine. It's you who's being called up, to fight on great Ukrainian land. Why aren't you going?
Him: Fool mobilization is also being prepared for you!? Why aren't you fighting!? Well you'll find out when you end up lost in the Donbass!
Me: We don't have any mobilization, I don't know who's been telling you fairy tales. However I know for a fact that in the Ukraine there is mobilization - and that's now a question for you - why aren't you going?
Him: Just you wait!
Me: Fuck, you're a real hero.

These people, these Kiev supporters, are completely irrational. They don't want to accept that the war their beloved Putschists started, to silence the people who didn't agree with their legitimate government being toppled, is crumbling apart and all their efforts, cyborgs, etc... have been for nothing - they've chosen the wrong course, and all they can do is just plug their head deeper and deeper into the sand. Truly retarded people. Truly. My god.

I really do not think there can be peace with them, as horrible as that sounds. A lot more killing and fighting will take place, until they back off, and their propaganda and foaming can be stopped. With each defeat, they just simply grow more desperate, more nationalistic and more aggressive and hateful, the amount of hate they spew against Russians is incredible - but I must say, it's the same on both sides now. Many Russians have nothing but revultion for them, and hate on all Ukrainians too - which is wrong. Blame the people that are to blame, not the ones which aren't.

flamming_python wrote:In fact screw it, I'll tell you guys.

Recently, just out of curiousity's sake, I accousted one of these Ukrainian trolls on Youtube, who was in the middle of a shouting match with someone or other over something. I really shouldn't have, but I was genuinely interested as to what's actually going on in their minds, and whether it's actually possible to get something productive out of them.

I asked the question:

Me: Why aren't you at the front, hero?

The conversation with this sub-life specimen, then went exactly like this, word for word:

Him: Same question back to you! Why aren't you sucking dick?
Me: No really, why aren't you at the front? After all your country is being 'attacked'. If I myself really believed in such BS, in your place I would have gone.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!!! Aren't you capable of nothing else? Sterile degenarates!
Me: FFS is it really so hard to answer 1 question? I'm not even insulting you, or anything.
Me: You're a lost cause for human reasoning. You live in a world of illusions and rationalize with emotions and make-believe, rather than with hard facts. You better wake up.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!! Putin's calling you up, come and die on Great Ukrainian Land!
Me: No-one's calling me up, I'm from Russia not the Ukraine. It's you who's being called up, to fight on great Ukrainian land. Why aren't you going?
Him: Fool mobilization is also being prepared for you!? Why aren't you fighting!? Well you'll find out when you end up lost in the Donbass!
Me: We don't have any mobilization, I don't know who's been telling you fairy tales. However I know for a fact that in the Ukraine there is mobilization - and that's now a question for you - why aren't you going?
Him: Just you wait!
Me: Fuck, you're a real hero.

These people, these Kiev supporters, are completely irrational. They don't want to accept that the war their beloved Putschists started, to silence the people who didn't agree with their legitimate government being toppled, is crumbling apart and all their efforts, cyborgs, etc... have been for nothing - they've chosen the wrong course, and all they can do is just plug their head deeper and deeper into the sand. Truly retarded people. Truly. My god.

I really do not think there can be peace with them, as horrible as that sounds. A lot more killing and fighting will take place, until they back off, and their propaganda and foaming can be stopped. With each defeat, they just simply grow more desperate, more nationalistic and more aggressive and hateful, the amount of hate they spew against Russians is incredible - but I must say, it's the same on both sides now. Many Russians have nothing but revultion for them, and hate on all Ukrainians too - which is wrong. Blame the people that are to blame, not the ones which aren't.

My Ukrainian relatives live in delusion lala land. All sorts of BS is pulled straight from the a** (including historical fiction) to justify everything
the regime is doing. They are hopeless. I can't hate them, but I can't stand their idiocy. I hate their ethno-fascist nationalism with a
rabid passion. They love some state and not the people in it. The state is just some disposable construct that does not deserve this
sort of blind loyalty and subservience. Dying for your people, as the Donbas rebels are doing, is one thing, but dying for some punitive
operation by a state with an illegitimate government is grotesque and obscene.

It's 2015 and we see the same sort of sh*t we saw in during the 1930s. Pathetic and proof that human progress is over hyped.

I really do not think there can be peace with them,

If that is how a Russian neighbour feels I wonder what it feels to be an Eastern Ukrainian.

The irony is that I very much doubt the so called rebels are all pro Russia... I would expect most of them just don't like the coup leaders or the oligarchs currently in Kiev and probably don't want to become part of NATO or the EU... not a surprise there are probably plenty of people already in NATO and the EU that don't want to be there either. That doesn't make them pro Russian or make them want a Russian intervention.

If we listen to what has come out of the latest talks it seems Putin doesn't want any new territory and is talking about the integrity of the Ukraine... except the Crimea of course.

So many want to paint this as a war between Russia and the Ukraine but in actual fact it is ukraine vs ukraine.

the irony is that if it happened in Russia the west would be demanding full autonomy for the separatist regions like they did with Kosovo and Serbia, but instead like they did with georgia and south ossetia and abkhazia they talk about territorial integrity and Russian aggression...

It is pretty clear Russia should look elsewhere for allies and cooperation and should largely separate itself from the west. Make the food import ban permanent, with exceptions in countries like Greece that do not tow the line from Washington.... whether it comes direct from Washington or Brussels.

Vann7 wrote:Former French President Nicolas Sarkozy who will be running for next elections in france is saying that Russia is right and Obama is wrong.    albeit using different wording..


Former French President Nicolas Sarkozy noted on Saturday that France and Russia are part of a common European civilization, and that Crimea cannot be blamed for choosing to join Russia.



So basically Germany and France oppose Americans fueling the war in Ukraine and even oppose the isolation
of Russia from Europe.. this is a clear and direct opposition to US world hegemony and their attempts to provoke
a war between Europe and Russia..by fueling the conflict in Ukraine. Just not long ago ,Hollande was calling for a new monetary system not so dependent on american dollar.

the Position of France leadership left or right it even gets better..

Read this @TR1.. is not kremling propaganda.. and Putin paid nothing to sarkozy  to say this...

Vann7 yet again proves that he's a gullible imbecile.

1.) Sarkozy is the mother of all neo-con Trojan horses, prior to Sarkozy becoming president France was waaaaaaaaaay more independent with the likes of Jacques Chirac refusing to join the Iraq war. The only reason why France is so hawkish on Libya, Syria, and Ukraine is because of Sarkozy implanting and empowering the artificially created neo-con faction in France in to positions of power, in which they wouldn't be there with out Sarkozy's own intervening hand.

2.) Sarkozy's own half-brother's (Olivier Sarkozy) step-father is Frank Wisner Sr. of the C.I.A., and Frank Wisner was no ordinary C.I.A. agent he was in fact the Director of Clandestine Operations for the C.I.A., probably the most important, the most 'dirty' and the most 'slimy' of any major position in the C.I.A. Were talking about a guy who was the head of the largest subversive and destabilization operation in the world! Sarkozy is a Prima Faci case of a puppet of U.S. hegemony being implanted in France.

3.) And most importantly, you seem so high on Sarkozy, you think some empty rhetoric from a empty suit like Sarkozy (who's not in a position of power to actually do and commit to something positive) amounts to siding with Russia on Ukraine? This is the same Nickolas Sarkozy who offered to share France's nuclear weapon stockpile with Germany, take a wild guess what purpose would he propose 'nuclear-sharing' and against what country would the 'nuclear-sharing' agreement be target of?

Surprisingly offense: Sarkozy offered Germany nuclear weapons

Nicolas Sarkozy, the federal government surprised with an unconventional proposal. The president offered Chancellor Angela Merkel and Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier in talks on participation in the French nuclear weapons. Both refused to do so by SPIEGEL information but from unanimous.

Surprisingly offense: Sarkozy offered Germany nuclear weapons

magnumcromagnon wrote:Vann7 yet again proves that he's a gullible imbecile.

Isn't it true that to be human is to be gullible.

Gee... I can understand more Ukrainians not wanting the current government... look at who they are headhunting for government positions...


http://sputniknews.com/politics/20141201/1015374755.html

by....magnumcromagnon


Vann7 yet again proves that he's a gullible imbecile.

1.) Sarkozy is the mother of all neo-con Trojan horses, prior to Sarkozy becoming president France was waaaaaaaaaay more independent with the likes of Jacques Chirac refusing to join the Iraq war. The only reason why France is so hawkish on Libya, Syria, and Ukraine is because of Sarkozy implanting and empowering the artificially created neo-con faction in France in to positions of power, in which they wouldn't be there with out Sarkozy's own intervening hand.

2.) Sarkozy's own half-brother's (Olivier Sarkozy) step-father is Frank Wisner Sr. of the C.I.A., and Frank Wisner was no ordinary C.I.A. agent he was in fact the Director of Clandestine Operations for the C.I.A., probably the most important, the most 'dirty' and the most 'slimy' of any major position in the C.I.A. Were talking about a guy who was the head of the largest subversive and destabilization operation in the world! Sarkozy is a Prima Faci case of a puppet of U.S. hegemony being implanted in France.

3.) And most importantly, you seem so high on Sarkozy, you think some empty rhetoric from a empty suit like Sarkozy (who's not in a position of power to actually do and commit to something positive) amounts to siding with Russia on Ukraine? This is the same Nickolas Sarkozy who offered to share France's nuclear weapon stockpile with Germany, take a wild guess what purpose would he propose 'nuclear-sharing' and against what country would the 'nuclear-sharing' agreement be target of?

Surprisingly offense: Sarkozy offered Germany nuclear weapons

Nicolas Sarkozy, the federal government surprised with an unconventional proposal. The president offered Chancellor Angela Merkel and Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier in talks on participation in the French nuclear weapons. Both refused to do so by SPIEGEL information but from unanimous.

Surprisingly offense: Sarkozy offered Germany nuclear weapons

I know who is SArkozy... Probably better informed than you.. about his relation with Putin.
No need to name calling..  
He lead the war in Lybia.. and also i read he was working for the CIA..
I also know he was behind the assassination attempt of Hugo Chavez.. with a sniper they hired.. and he failed
because of an electronic equipment Russia gave their security ,to detect any sniper withing 3km+
Im also aware he was trying to create a false flag attack in Syria with Chemical weapons , he was the first to suggest
the idea..  
Im also aware his wife/girl plays guitar is really hot and visit Russia for concerts.. even in moments that France was
supposed to be in high tensions with Russian  (a sign he trust in the Russian Government for the security of his women)
Im aware that Sarjozy in Georgia war.. he had to visit medvedev to try to avoid a major confrontation between
USA and Russia.. to calm things down.. and he proposed a cease of fire ..which medvedev saw it as Fair and accepted.. he was the only president in Europe that tried to mediate ,to calm the tensions between Russia and NATO..Clearly shows he have better relations with Russia than you think. If it was the Lithuanian BITCH.. or the Poland or Canadian puppets. they will be instead asking for more weapons for Georgia to fight back Russia. or asking NATO to nuke Russia..

Medvedev and Sarkozy media briefing


Sarkozy also sent a couple of dozen or French special forces to Syria to lead the fight against Assad right there in 2011. but the attack failed and they were captured in Homs in 2012.. and they had to send the french Abassador to Syria and Putin had to mediate to save the ass of the french soldiers captured by Syrian Government in return for France no longer interfering more in Syria.. (which he did more or less). After that the role tune of Sarkorzy changed dramatically in Syria..  Im also aware that when Sarkozy was in trouble with justice in france for corruption ,when no longer he was President ,he went to visit Putin directly in Sochi and talk in private with him for support.  I bet you didn't knew that..     probably financial help or a loan and or asylum in case he is in trouble with justice.

Sarkozy also got in trouble with the US senate for the mistral deal with RUssia.. it was a deal done during his
administration. This means as i told you.. That political leaders can have their own interest too ..that not always are in same direction of Americans leaders. means he cares about france economy..not just his personal one.

You are not aware ,that many of the things European leaders say ,can come directly from the white house handlers.
They are colonies after all. and are always under pressure to be obedient with their masters..

And you are not aware that people change.. that Political leaders can be influenced ..through time..
Who was your enemy one day.. can become your greatest ally in the other..
Medvedev/Putin policy with france leaders have been incredibly patient and tolerant.. and very helpful to the
point of being respectful ,even when interest are opposite.

Sarkozy statements in Public..in favor of Russia ,basically blaming Kiev for the problems in Ukraine.. can really helps to change the mood in Europe ,to become more aligned in the position of Russia. . the need for kiev to stop its criminal war against civilians. IN the same way that baltic states/Poland call for sanctions and more NATO troops increase the tensions in Europe.. in that same way.. the opposite is true..
Any call for ending the war in Ukraine helps.. but when that calls comes from a powerful leader.. even if he told it..
while he was drunk.. it will make HEADLINES around the world  . and IT WILL HELP set the tone in Europe..
to others Europeans nations to DISOBEY USA and NOT SUPPORT the WAR that Americans are trying to start.. against Russia.. but not with americans in the frontline but instead with Europe and Ukraine in the front.

Every nation and every leader have their own interest.. and is not in the interest in the most developed nations
in Europe that Americans try to start a war , there between Russia and them.. He might be a CIA or former CIA
asset.. but he is not a fool..  and only the most Rusophobic Nations in Europe ,like Poland and Baltic States.. are the ones provoling a war with Russia..  The Fact that even a nation like United Kingdom.. have said that do not believe
giving weapons to Ukraine will solve things.. Should be very telling to you.. that USA is almost isolated in the world
in their policy on Ukraine..  They can support sanctions on Russia.. but only the most radical nazi countries in Europe
support a war with Russia.

Putin have a skill ,that very few leaders have.. probably no one.. and that is that he can be brutally practical..
So much that at times he is called a puppet of Israel and the western Neocons and even accused to selling Russians.
But his is simply trying to influence the west with business in any place it could be done ..to divide the alliance against Russia.

A perfect example of that was the Turkey pipeline deal..  He knows NATO can and will use Turkey against Russia
in case of war.. but he also knows Turkey feels betrayed by USA.. and Europe for not welcoming him in the European Union.Another example is how he still do business with NASA.. and helps them to send satellites to space. So he plays his cards ,to try to influence even his enemies in business that can be good for both nations..
France without a doubt.. all major  political leaders , do not want a war in Europe. and trying to avoid it..  It was
Sarkozy who tried to become and intermediary between Russia and USA.. and tried to calm the tensions.. in georgia war.. so i see nothing new here.. They have their interest.. but a world war between Europe and Russia ,with USA on the sidelines selling the weapons is not one of them.

No im not saying Sarkozy is an angel.. ideally will be nicer if all criminals are put in jail..but if Russia can use his
help in moment like this.. it will be foolish for Russia not to accept it.. and not try get him under Russian orbit.
Ideally it will be Awesome if all Europeans leaders were Anti NATO.. and pro RUssia.. but in the real world..
Russia have to use any little thing that could help them..to Stop USA attempt to Isolate Russia from Europe.. or start
a war with Europe.  Marine Le Penn ,Chavez ,Fidel Castro ,Rafael Correa or Cristina Kirchner are the leaders i will like to see ruling in Europe.. that truly cares about their people.. and their independence.. but for now Russia needs to accept any little help they could get from anyone ..to stop USA very hostile ,foreign policy against Russia.

flamming_python wrote:In fact screw it, I'll tell you guys.

Recently, just out of curiousity's sake, I accousted one of these Ukrainian trolls on Youtube, who was in the middle of a shouting match with someone or other over something. I really shouldn't have, but I was genuinely interested as to what's actually going on in their minds, and whether it's actually possible to get something productive out of them.

I asked the question:

Me: Why aren't you at the front, hero?

The conversation with this sub-life specimen, then went exactly like this, word for word:

Him: Same question back to you! Why aren't you sucking dick?
Me: No really, why aren't you at the front? After all your country is being 'attacked'. If I myself really believed in such BS, in your place I would have gone.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!!! Aren't you capable of nothing else? Sterile degenarates!
Me: FFS is it really so hard to answer 1 question? I'm not even insulting you, or anything.
Me: You're a lost cause for human reasoning. You live in a world of illusions and rationalize with emotions and make-believe, rather than with hard facts. You better wake up.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!! Putin's calling you up, come and die on Great Ukrainian Land!
Me: No-one's calling me up, I'm from Russia not the Ukraine. It's you who's being called up, to fight on great Ukrainian land. Why aren't you going?
Him: Fool mobilization is also being prepared for you!? Why aren't you fighting!? Well you'll find out when you end up lost in the Donbass!
Me: We don't have any mobilization, I don't know who's been telling you fairy tales. However I know for a fact that in the Ukraine there is mobilization - and that's now a question for you - why aren't you going?
Him: Just you wait!
Me: Fuck, you're a real hero.

These people, these Kiev supporters, are completely irrational. They don't want to accept that the war their beloved Putschists started, to silence the people who didn't agree with their legitimate government being toppled, is crumbling apart and all their efforts, cyborgs, etc... have been for nothing - they've chosen the wrong course, and all they can do is just plug their head deeper and deeper into the sand. Truly retarded people. Truly. My god.

I really do not think there can be peace with them, as horrible as that sounds. A lot more killing and fighting will take place, until they back off, and their propaganda and foaming can be stopped. With each defeat, they just simply grow more desperate, more nationalistic and more aggressive and hateful, the amount of hate they spew against Russians is incredible - but I must say, it's the same on both sides now. Many Russians have nothing but revultion for them, and hate on all Ukrainians too - which is wrong. Blame the people that are to blame, not the ones which aren't.

So simple to put these trolls in their place. Simply ask: "how do you expect to win against Russia, if you cannot even beat a bunch of pissed off miners and volunteers?" Usually these people cannot think properly and think that an army incapable of fighting off a bunch of civies with weapons, will beat a full fledge military with far more modern equipment. Heck, even M1A1's and Apache helicopters and F-15/16's wouldn't even do a dent for Ukraine.

IF US provide attack drones to Kiev.. in the hundreds.. that can fly at civilian airlines altitude ,it will be ugly for the rebels.. Drones that do not produce much heat.. and hard to shutdown with manpads ,can be a nightmare for the rebels.. They will need many pantsirs defenses everywhere in the front line to counter that.. but also powerful GPS jammers.. to counter NATO GPS artillery.. and lots counter electronics to jam NATO counter artillery radars.  It can make very painful the life of Rebels..without a major support of Russia.. that could make obvious their help.

anyone knows how you can fool .. counter radar artillery? that detect where the enemy is firing artillery ,so that you
can fire back?  What Russia have to counter such equipment?

This is kinda off topic but flamming_python's post reminded me that "we" (here in the west) are often living in our reality regarding the Ukrainian conflict and Russia in general.

There's one thing that really blows my mind: the fact that many (even most?) westerners actually support Kiev's current regime "against" (evil!!!!) Russia. Atleast people who are interested in military matters, international politics and the like. It's like their russophobia knows no bounds. I can imagine that If Russia (or well, ethnically Russians, in this case) would be in conflict with Hell, they'd support Satan himself. And the propaganda works perfectly: small, freedom loving Ukraine is fighting against Russian soldiers and agents! Putin, Hitler of the 21st century is recreating the mother of all evil, the Soviet Union (that luckily was defeated by the freedom loving west). And they buy it. Because when Russia is against something, it must be good, right?

I stopped reading Finnish military forums after the crisis began. Suddenly username likes "Maidan" are amongst the most active. "Ukraine is an inspiration to us all, we are next, let's buy some more American weapons (and join NATO before it's too late)!" Russian economic woes are celebrated and blown out of proportions. Russian "opposition" is the voice of truth. It seems that Russian military developments are not followed closely anymore: nothing is mentioned about the number of weapon deliveries last year, for instance. (I just re-checked it. Nope. And it's a military forum! And Russia is the enemy no 1! Does the truth, Russian military modernization hurt, or why it's suddenly not reported?) According to them Russian military modernization is not going well, they are actually going to straight out collapse. (When the truth is exactly the opposite but somehow these military experts are not aware of that.)  

Oh, and now they are reporting how the Russians are getting "tired of war". Using dubious statistics that have nothing to do with the subject: Russians are more worried about the economy than a year ago... No shit sherlock! And now they are linking articles that state how Russians are increasingly evading draft because of Ukraine. Is that even true, btw? Sigh, I thought that they weren't total idiots. And I'm mentioning all this because I think things have drastically changed, especially after the Ukrainian crisis. It just pisses me off that I can't read mainstream Finnish (or any western) media anymore because of their russophobia, social "media" and discussion boards included. They have no fucking idea what they are talking about. Calm and objective discussion about Russia, especially as a state and a major power is almost non-existent. China and other rising powers are really not mentioned at all!

This forum is of course exactly the opposite, many members are - unsurprisingly - very pro-Russia. And I have to say, in many cases their views about Russia are probably closer to the truth than what I keep hearing here. I'm sick of that demonizing, overly negative BS. I want learn more about Russia and other non-western powers, without any bullshit and you don't get that from the western MSM. As GarryB said (I think), atleast Russia is not a swear word here.

sepheronx wrote:

flamming_python wrote:In fact screw it, I'll tell you guys.

Recently, just out of curiousity's sake, I accousted one of these Ukrainian trolls on Youtube, who was in the middle of a shouting match with someone or other over something. I really shouldn't have, but I was genuinely interested as to what's actually going on in their minds, and whether it's actually possible to get something productive out of them.

I asked the question:

Me: Why aren't you at the front, hero?

The conversation with this sub-life specimen, then went exactly like this, word for word:

Him: Same question back to you! Why aren't you sucking dick?
Me: No really, why aren't you at the front? After all your country is being 'attacked'. If I myself really believed in such BS, in your place I would have gone.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!!! Aren't you capable of nothing else? Sterile degenarates!
Me: FFS is it really so hard to answer 1 question? I'm not even insulting you, or anything.
Me: You're a lost cause for human reasoning. You live in a world of illusions and rationalize with emotions and make-believe, rather than with hard facts. You better wake up.
Him: Cotton-jacket, suck it!!! Putin's calling you up, come and die on Great Ukrainian Land!
Me: No-one's calling me up, I'm from Russia not the Ukraine. It's you who's being called up, to fight on great Ukrainian land. Why aren't you going?
Him: Fool mobilization is also being prepared for you!? Why aren't you fighting!? Well you'll find out when you end up lost in the Donbass!
Me: We don't have any mobilization, I don't know who's been telling you fairy tales. However I know for a fact that in the Ukraine there is mobilization - and that's now a question for you - why aren't you going?
Him: Just you wait!
Me: Fuck, you're a real hero.

These people, these Kiev supporters, are completely irrational. They don't want to accept that the war their beloved Putschists started, to silence the people who didn't agree with their legitimate government being toppled, is crumbling apart and all their efforts, cyborgs, etc... have been for nothing - they've chosen the wrong course, and all they can do is just plug their head deeper and deeper into the sand. Truly retarded people. Truly. My god.

I really do not think there can be peace with them, as horrible as that sounds. A lot more killing and fighting will take place, until they back off, and their propaganda and foaming can be stopped. With each defeat, they just simply grow more desperate, more nationalistic and more aggressive and hateful, the amount of hate they spew against Russians is incredible - but I must say, it's the same on both sides now. Many Russians have nothing but revultion for them, and hate on all Ukrainians too - which is wrong. Blame the people that are to blame, not the ones which aren't.

So simple to put these trolls in their place.  Simply ask: "how do you expect to win against Russia, if you cannot even beat a bunch of pissed off miners and volunteers?"  Usually these people cannot think properly and think that an army incapable of fighting off a bunch of civies with weapons, will beat a full fledge military with far more modern equipment.  Heck, even M1A1's and Apache helicopters and F-15/16's wouldn't even do a dent for Ukraine.

But they think they are fighting against the Russian Army already! How many times has Russia invaded? I've lost count.

Yes... I read that... I assumed it was the artificial colouring they use in the dyes they make ties with...

captured from russian soldiers/mercenaries

F-15E wrote:captured from russian soldiers/mercenaries

Is that is how you and your Fag Buddies entertain the whole day..? trying to find Russian weapons in
Ukraine? Why you don't post the pictures of NATO weapons in Ukraine imbecile? There are as many mercenaries
American and NATO soldiers as volunteers helping the Rebels if not more. Already i gave you evidence of NATO soldiers in Ukraine.. and weapons too..   I bet pathetic Imbeciles like you find nothing wrong with the javelines
missiles that Canada supplied to kiev.. last year.. but go a complain whenever see anything that looks like was
given by Russia..  Hypocrite.

Take a look at the many Americans weapons captured at the Donetsk Airport..  
they told many americans well armed soldiers killed in the airport.. helping Ukrainians.. Look at the nice
Weapons they got..



here evidence of NATO artillery used in eastern Ukraine..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation_id=annotation_3215220679&feature=iv&src_vid=wJYI1MVAHIo&v=AlOoYdvX2Ec

Here one moron like you.. american ..killed in Ukraine by Russian mercenaries/soldiers.  


here according to Donetsk fighters an american pilot.. captured.. in 2014.



Here a report with details of a couple of hundreds Americans killed in Ukraine fighting..  

http://www.globalresearch.ca/cia-fbi-agents-dying-for-illegal-junta-in-ukraine/5383040

As you can see Ukraine is not IRAQ..and americans can be kicked in the ass when fighting capable soldiers with
decent weapons.  

Vann7 wrote:

F-15E wrote:captured from russian soldiers/mercenaries

Is that is how you and your Fag Buddies entertain the whole day..? trying to find Russian weapons in
Ukraine? Why you don't post the pictures of NATO weapons in Ukraine imbecile? There are as many mercenaries
American and NATO soldiers as volunteers helping the Rebels if not more. Already i gave you evidence of NATO soldiers in Ukraine.. and weapons too..   I bet pathetic Imbeciles like you find nothing wrong with the javelines
missiles that Canada supplied to kiev.. last year.. but go a complain whenever see anything that looks like was
given by Russia..  Hypocrite.

Hahaha,you found a glock and then say "Nato is sending weapons in Ukraine bla bla bla",but unlike Russia,we do not send howitzers,tanks etc.

F-15E wrote:

Vann7 wrote:

F-15E wrote:captured from russian soldiers/mercenaries

Is that is how you and your Fag Buddies entertain the whole day..? trying to find Russian weapons in
Ukraine? Why you don't post the pictures of NATO weapons in Ukraine imbecile? There are as many mercenaries
American and NATO soldiers as volunteers helping the Rebels if not more. Already i gave you evidence of NATO soldiers in Ukraine.. and weapons too..   I bet pathetic Imbeciles like you find nothing wrong with the javelines
missiles that Canada supplied to kiev.. last year.. but go a complain whenever see anything that looks like was
given by Russia..  Hypocrite.

Hahaha,you found a glock and then say "Nato is sending weapons in Ukraine bla bla bla",but unlike Russia,we do not send howitzers,tanks etc.

Did you saw the video of artillery NATO munition? how the fuck you think they fire that munition?
plugging it in your between your ass?

I have seen reports of the Rebels capturing all kind of american weapons.. from drones ,to american assault rifles like the video.. to Javelin anti tank missiles captured. and reports of americans killed too in the hundreds..
The only thing i have not seen reports is of NATO tanks and NATO combat planes.. probably because it will be too
difficult for US to hide their help if their military hardware show up in Ukraine.