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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    BKP
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  BKP Sun Jun 28, 2015 1:42 am

    ^ "THE UNITED STATES does not want a war with Russia, it simply feels that it has no choice.

    If the State Department hadn’t initiated a coup in Ukraine to topple the elected president, Viktor Yanukovych, then the US could not have inserted itself between Russia and the EU, thus, disrupting vital trade routes which were strengthening nations on both continents..."

    Hmm... sounds like something Mike Whitney might write.  Wink
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  BKP Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:28 am

    Mike E wrote:So ironic that the Transfer of Crimea was practically illegal and illegitimate, yet the West blames Russia for retracting its' "gift".

    The 100%, sure-fire way for me to start a fight on mp.net was to call bullshit on what is probably the USA's most fundamental and cherished myth, a myth that also happens to be dead wrong, IMO. And that is the idea that the US government is ultimately a force of moral good in the world of geopolitics. So when, for instance, the US government causes 500k Iraqi children to starve to death through embargo, well, we are to take it for granted that it was meant for the ultimate good. Sure, "mistakes" are made sometimes; mistakes that may even happen kill hundreds of thousands or millions of people, but we should never question that it was done with good intentions at heart.

    Well, my argument always was the the US does these things to secure and protect power and influence, and that the utility of power and influence lies in insuring profit; lots and lots of profit for a well-connected few, that is. The elite. All the morality stuff is a cover story, hokum for us ignorant rubes that comprise the teeming masses.

    So, US policy does not have any real basis in morality or law. Those things will either be upheld and trumpeted, or ignored and discarded, depending on their usefulness within particular circumstances. The only true and enduring goal of US foreign policy is, again, massive profits for a select few.

    It all sounds like conspiracy theory BS when stated plainly like that, but I'm hardly the first, last, or most prominent person to ever do so. US Marine Major General Smedley butler plainly said all of this in a concise book he wrote in 1935 entitled "War is a Racket." The things he said back then are no less valid today; they're probably even more so, actually. Butler was one of the most decorated soldiers in US history. He was twice (!) awarded the Medal of Honor, and also received the Brevet medal, which is the highest decoration specific to the Marine Corps.

    Still, a lot of Americans will go ape-shit when you say this stuff. On mp.net I'd instantly be called "retard" by at least a dozen morons.  cheers
    </rant>
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:50 am


    Nikolai Starikov It's hard to be Putin



    The above video explain also ,the strategy of Putin In Ukraine.. that is
    the reverse of the coup by Americans in kiev by small steps..
    kvs
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  kvs Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:19 am

    Regular wrote:
    Flagship Victory wrote:Russia says USSR transfer of Crimea from Russia to Ukraine was illegitimate.

    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/russian-prosecutor-generals-office-says-decision-on-making-crimea-part-of-soviet-ukraine-in-1954-illegitimate-392175.html
    Russia inherited all rights and responsibilities from Soviet Union and thus it makes Russia responsible for illegal transfer of Crimea to Ukraine SSR in 54. It's sanction material here we are talking about pirat

    All countries that recognized the secession of Ukraine with Crimea included were violating basic legal principles. Their recognitions
    mean exactly nothing. This includes Yeltsin's comprador regime.

    The same goes for Abkhazia and South Ossetia in Georgia. The act of recognition of a seceding state with rank disregard for the
    illegal abolition and forced inclusion of autonomous republics is a gross abuse of human rights. It leads directly to ethnic wars and
    this should fall under the Nuremberg Conventions as an act of war.

    Your argument is ludicrous.
    The Mule
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  The Mule Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:51 am

    I don't see how the legality of the Crimea transfer in 1954 matters today since Russia recognized Ukraine's borders in 1991.

    Russia can, however, refer to the principle of self-determination in international law (which they did in March 2014 after the referendum). But that's a different argument.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Erk Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:42 am

    The Mule wrote:I don't see how the legality of the Crimea transfer in 1954 matters today since Russia recognized Ukraine's borders in 1991.

    Russia can, however, refer to the principle of self-determination in international law (which they did in March 2014 after the referendum). But that's a different argument.
    As the article said, it's not good enough for Russia to recognize the borders. To change the status of the autonomous republic, it needed a referendum
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  chinggis Sun Jun 28, 2015 10:48 am

    [quote="Vann7"]
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    There is no need for victory. Kiev gets support because its a proxy against Russia.
    As long as Russia is perceived as a threat to European ambitions, Kiev will continue to receive support.
    Of course, whether it will be enough is another question.


    Is a proxy war indeed.. US vs Russia..  And americans will continue backing kiev no matter
    what with weapons and mercenaries.. etc.. There is a small little thing however.. called
    Economy. Not even Americans can sustain 40 millions Jobless Ukrainians with a failed economy.
    Even the Georgian Former president/Pm who hates Russia.. and now governor of Odessa.. told
    to the public ,that if.... just IF the Ukrainian Economy do not default..and economy start now growing.. that in 20 years.. from now Ukraine will be on the same economically level ,that
    Yakunovych was before he was removed from power. This means that not even the biggest
    Russian Georgian Hater have any faith in the Economic future of Ukraine.. the bets are that Ukraine will disband in many parts.. Once its Economy officially defaults ,and the war continue
    to the end of year. This means that Americans will be unable to hold Poroshenko in Power any
    longer with everyone without a job and energy prices 500% higher and inflation about same.
    People will simply will have not even enough money to eat... and this is when the major disaster
    will start.. when people go to the streets.. and Riots starts for food.. And Hours Long Lines for bread in Kiev.  Neither US or Kiev ,no matter who is in power will be able to continue a war under such conditions.. and thats when call for independence will start IN Odessa and Kharkiv and many other cities.. No army will go an fight for free.. ie.. if not paid.. and no civilian will
    maintain loyalty and patriotism to their nation flag.. if their family is starving ,while Poroshenko and everyone in Power is filthy Rich.

    So Russia will take Ukraine without firing a single Shot..  People will Rebel internally against
    kiev and Russia will be supplying weapons to them to hold their cities and open new Fronts.


    Vann7, excellent post. With this post you are mark good points in strategic and global geopolitical thinking.
    medo
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  medo Sun Jun 28, 2015 10:57 am

    chinggis wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    There is no need for victory. Kiev gets support because its a proxy against Russia.
    As long as Russia is perceived as a threat to European ambitions, Kiev will continue to receive support.
    Of course, whether it will be enough is another question.


    Is a proxy war indeed.. US vs Russia..  And americans will continue backing kiev no matter
    what with weapons and mercenaries.. etc.. There is a small little thing however.. called
    Economy. Not even Americans can sustain 40 millions Jobless Ukrainians with a failed economy.
    Even the Georgian Former president/Pm who hates Russia.. and now governor of Odessa.. told
    to the public ,that if.... just IF the Ukrainian Economy do not default..and economy start now growing.. that in 20 years.. from now Ukraine will be on the same economically level ,that
    Yakunovych was before he was removed from power. This means that not even the biggest
    Russian Georgian Hater have any faith in the Economic future of Ukraine.. the bets are that Ukraine will disband in many parts.. Once its Economy officially defaults ,and the war continue
    to the end of year. This means that Americans will be unable to hold Poroshenko in Power any
    longer with everyone without a job and energy prices 500% higher and inflation about same.
    People will simply will have not even enough money to eat... and this is when the major disaster
    will start.. when people go to the streets.. and Riots starts for food.. And Hours Long Lines for bread in Kiev.  Neither US or Kiev ,no matter who is in power will be able to continue a war under such conditions.. and thats when call for independence will start IN Odessa and Kharkiv and many other cities.. No army will go an fight for free.. ie.. if not paid.. and no civilian will
    maintain loyalty and patriotism to their nation flag.. if their family is starving ,while Poroshenko and everyone in Power is filthy Rich.

    So Russia will take Ukraine without firing a single Shot..  People will Rebel internally against
    kiev and Russia will be supplying weapons to them to hold their cities and open new Fronts.


    Vann7, excellent post. With this post you are mark good points in strategic and global geopolitical thinking.

    True, that Ukraine will go bankrupt in few months. Believe me, US will orchestrate a new coup against Poroshenko and replace him with ultranazi Jarosh. Than Ukraine will become fully nazi state to repress any rebellion against US installed regime and to continue with war. Unfortunately it is on Novorussian army to liberate Ukraine from nazis, to defeat ukronazis on the battlefield and to marsh against Kiev. Only then the rest of Ukrainians will be able to throw this pro-US junta from power and peace will be achieved in divided Ukraine.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Rodinazombie Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:04 am

    Good post ^^^

    I wonder how proud those idiots who were jumping on the maidan now are about what they have done to their country.

    I have no doubt that poroshenko and co will at some point fall, its a guarantee that the US cant keep its stooges in power indefinitely, especially when the people will realise just who they are really working for. Does anyone know of anything that porky and the rabbit have done to benifit their country since stealing power?

    Russia will prevail, but its just at what cost to the people of novorossia that worries me and whether or not the people responsible for these crimes will be brought to justice.


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    Post  Rodinazombie Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:12 am

    medo wrote:
    chinggis wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    There is no need for victory. Kiev gets support because its a proxy against Russia.
    As long as Russia is perceived as a threat to European ambitions, Kiev will continue to receive support.
    Of course, whether it will be enough is another question.


    Is a proxy war indeed.. US vs Russia..  And americans will continue backing kiev no matter
    what with weapons and mercenaries.. etc.. There is a small little thing however.. called
    Economy. Not even Americans can sustain 40 millions Jobless Ukrainians with a failed economy.
    Even the Georgian Former president/Pm who hates Russia.. and now governor of Odessa.. told
    to the public ,that if.... just IF the Ukrainian Economy do not default..and economy start now growing.. that in 20 years.. from now Ukraine will be on the same economically level ,that
    Yakunovych was before he was removed from power. This means that not even the biggest
    Russian Georgian Hater have any faith in the Economic future of Ukraine.. the bets are that Ukraine will disband in many parts.. Once its Economy officially defaults ,and the war continue
    to the end of year. This means that Americans will be unable to hold Poroshenko in Power any
    longer with everyone without a job and energy prices 500% higher and inflation about same.
    People will simply will have not even enough money to eat... and this is when the major disaster
    will start.. when people go to the streets.. and Riots starts for food.. And Hours Long Lines for bread in Kiev.  Neither US or Kiev ,no matter who is in power will be able to continue a war under such conditions.. and thats when call for independence will start IN Odessa and Kharkiv and many other cities.. No army will go an fight for free.. ie.. if not paid.. and no civilian will
    maintain loyalty and patriotism to their nation flag.. if their family is starving ,while Poroshenko and everyone in Power is filthy Rich.

    So Russia will take Ukraine without firing a single Shot..  People will Rebel internally against
    kiev and Russia will be supplying weapons to them to hold their cities and open new Fronts.


    Vann7, excellent post. With this post you are mark good points in strategic and global geopolitical thinking.

    True, that Ukraine will go bankrupt in few months. Believe me, US will orchestrate a new coup against Poroshenko and replace him with ultranazi Jarosh. Than Ukraine will become fully nazi state to repress any rebellion against US installed regime and to continue with war. Unfortunately it is on Novorussian army to liberate Ukraine from nazis, to defeat ukronazis on the battlefield and to marsh against Kiev. Only then the rest of Ukrainians will be able to throw this pro-US junta from power and peace will be achieved in divided Ukraine.


    Good, let them. Let ukraine become even more of a totalitarian regime, let the world see how far the US is prepared to go, how dirty its willing to get its hands by supporting such animals in order to pursue its goals of 'democracy'.

    I think its more likely that they would replace porky with the rabbit, since he is their boy though.

    ExBeobachter1987
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    Post  ExBeobachter1987 Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:19 am

    Rodinazombie wrote:I think its more likely that they would replace porky with the rabbit, since he is their boy though.

    I doubt it. Poroshenko's power base in Ukraine is much stronger than Yats'.
    They can't replace him with the latter without increasing costs for themselves, something they try to limit as much as they can.
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    Post  higurashihougi Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:26 am

    Rodinazombie wrote:Good, let them. Let ukraine become even more of a totalitarian regime, let the world see how far the US is prepared to go, how dirty its willing to get its hands by supporting such animals in order to pursue its goals of 'democracy'.

    Well at least we can roughly see how far the West has been going till now

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    Last edited by higurashihougi on Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:28 am; edited 1 time in total
    TheArmenian
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    Post  TheArmenian Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:26 am

    There are 2 alleys that lead to Poroshenko's replacement:

    1- Replacement by the USA:
    The White House in Washington runs things like corporations: Any manager that is not performing up to their expectations gets sacked. The question is: Is Poroshenko's performance as per their expectations?

    2- Replacement by the people:
    People will make a new revolution based on their living standards. The question is: How much more decline in their living standards can the average Ukrainian handle?
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    Post  auslander Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:48 am

    TheArmenian wrote:There are 2 alleys that lead to Poroshenko's replacement:

    1- Replacement by the USA:
    The White House in Washington runs things like corporations: Any manager that is not performing up to their expectations gets sacked. The question is: Is Poroshenko's performance as per their expectations?

    2- Replacement by the people:
    People will make a new revolution based on their living standards. The question is: How much more decline in their living standards can the average Ukrainian handle?

    I don't think we'll see a revolution in orcland no matter how bad it gets. Remember, the populace is unarmed while the gangs of orcs are heavily armed. Why do you think all those strapping young men running around every city and town are not at 'the front' to assist in the 'victory'? They, like the brown shirts and the black shirts of not too many decades ago, are in place to make sure no one disturbs the New Order.

    If orcland does disintegrate then the western half if not more is up for grabs and you can rest assured that various EU members will claim their share in the name of 'protecting the civilians' from the rampant pro Russian hordes and and they will be backed by NATUSA troops. Bingo, NATO/US has their bases on the RF borders, just not quite as far east as they want.

    The fly in all this ointment is Greece. EU/IMF/ECB is making noise that Greece can not leave EU or the euro without the permission of EU, read US. If Greece attempts to leave without permission that act may lead to some kind of actual force being applied to Greece to keep her in EU. EUSA is fearing mightily that if Greece leaves there will be an immediate influx of Russian tourists by the tens of thousands, some being actual real tourists but the nightmare for EUSA is some of the tourists will stay in Greece, the tough looking ones with short hair and above average physical condition.
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    Post  TheArmenian Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:08 pm

    auslander wrote:I don't think we'll see a revolution in orcland no matter how bad it gets. Remember, the populace is unarmed while the gangs of orcs are heavily armed. Why do you think all those strapping young men running around every city and town are not at 'the front' to assist in the 'victory'? They, like the brown shirts and the black shirts of not too many decades ago, are in place to make sure no one disturbs the New Order.

    Agreed. The "guardians of the revolution" will try to suppress any uprising. If there is a revolution, it will be a very bloody one. Success is not guaranteed.

    auslander wrote:If orcland does disintegrate then the western half if not more is up for grabs and you can rest assured that various EU members will claim their share in the name of 'protecting the civilians' from the rampant pro Russian hordes and they will be backed by NATUSA troops. Bingo, NATO/US has their bases on the RF borders, just not quite as far east as they want.

    Indeed. Actually that will be a defeat for the West/US/NATO since Russia would get the maximum it could get out of this whole Ukraine mess.
    In addition, some instability and problems may start to appear in various East European countries.

    auslander wrote:The fly in all this ointment is Greece. EU/IMF/ECB is making noise that Greece can not leave EU or the euro without the permission of EU, read US. If Greece attempts to leave without permission that act may lead to some kind of actual force being applied to Greece to keep her in EU. EUSA is fearing mightily that if Greece leaves there will be an immediate influx of Russian tourists by the tens of thousands, some being actual real tourists but the nightmare for EUSA is some of the tourists will stay in Greece, the tough looking ones with short hair and above average physical condition.
    Call them "polite tourists".




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    Post  Neutrality Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:32 pm

    Rodinazombie wrote:
    I wonder how proud those idiots who were jumping on the maidan now are about what they have done to their country.  

    They are so proud that alot of them ended up in Russia or Poland.

    auslander wrote:The fly in all this ointment is Greece. EU/IMF/ECB is making noise that Greece can not leave EU or the euro without the permission of EU, read US. If Greece attempts to leave without permission that act may lead to some kind of actual force being applied to Greece to keep her in EU. EUSA is fearing mightily that if Greece leaves there will be an immediate influx of Russian tourists by the tens of thousands, some being actual real tourists but the nightmare for EUSA is some of the tourists will stay in Greece, the tough looking ones with short hair and above average physical condition.

    Lovely description Very Happy
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    Post  ExBeobachter1987 Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:36 pm

    Neutrality wrote:They are so proud that alot of them ended up in Russia or Poland.

    Living in the EU was their goal all along, not improving their country as much as possible.
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    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:55 pm

    The new Uniforms offered to Ukraine ARmy.. lol1



    They wanted to be Europeans no ?   Wink

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    Last edited by Vann7 on Sun Jun 28, 2015 1:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  Regular Sun Jun 28, 2015 1:00 pm

    kvs wrote:
    Regular wrote:
    Flagship Victory wrote:Russia says USSR transfer of Crimea from Russia to Ukraine was illegitimate.

    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/russian-prosecutor-generals-office-says-decision-on-making-crimea-part-of-soviet-ukraine-in-1954-illegitimate-392175.html
    Russia inherited all rights and responsibilities from Soviet Union and thus it makes Russia responsible for illegal transfer of Crimea to Ukraine SSR in 54. It's sanction material here we are talking about pirat

    All countries that recognized the secession of Ukraine with Crimea included were violating basic legal principles.   Their recognitions
    mean exactly nothing.   This includes Yeltsin's comprador regime.

    The same goes for Abkhazia and South Ossetia in Georgia.   The act of recognition of a seceding state with rank disregard for the
    illegal abolition and forced inclusion of autonomous republics is a gross abuse of human rights.  I

    Your argument is ludicrous.  
    Don't You see pirat smiley?
    It leads directly to ethnic wars and this should fall under the Nuremberg Conventions as an act of war.
    Oh I agree. But it's a thin ice we are standing on when it comes to what's recognizable and not. Soviet Union loved to redraw borders, incorporate and stir the shit up between SSR. Ukraine pure example how it was stitched together. And conflicts like 888 war were pretty much set on it's path back in the day of Georgian SSR.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sun Jun 28, 2015 1:10 pm

    Rodinazombie wrote:
    medo wrote:
    chinggis wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    There is no need for victory. Kiev gets support because its a proxy against Russia.
    As long as Russia is perceived as a threat to European ambitions, Kiev will continue to receive support.
    Of course, whether it will be enough is another question.


    Is a proxy war indeed.. US vs Russia..  And americans will continue backing kiev no matter
    what with weapons and mercenaries.. etc.. There is a small little thing however.. called
    Economy. Not even Americans can sustain 40 millions Jobless Ukrainians with a failed economy.
    Even the Georgian Former president/Pm who hates Russia.. and now governor of Odessa.. told
    to the public ,that if.... just IF the Ukrainian Economy do not default..and economy start now growing.. that in 20 years.. from now Ukraine will be on the same economically level ,that
    Yakunovych was before he was removed from power. This means that not even the biggest
    Russian Georgian Hater have any faith in the Economic future of Ukraine.. the bets are that Ukraine will disband in many parts.. Once its Economy officially defaults ,and the war continue
    to the end of year. This means that Americans will be unable to hold Poroshenko in Power any
    longer with everyone without a job and energy prices 500% higher and inflation about same.
    People will simply will have not even enough money to eat... and this is when the major disaster
    will start.. when people go to the streets.. and Riots starts for food.. And Hours Long Lines for bread in Kiev.  Neither US or Kiev ,no matter who is in power will be able to continue a war under such conditions.. and thats when call for independence will start IN Odessa and Kharkiv and many other cities.. No army will go an fight for free.. ie.. if not paid.. and no civilian will
    maintain loyalty and patriotism to their nation flag.. if their family is starving ,while Poroshenko and everyone in Power is filthy Rich.

    So Russia will take Ukraine without firing a single Shot..  People will Rebel internally against
    kiev and Russia will be supplying weapons to them to hold their cities and open new Fronts.


    Vann7, excellent post. With this post you are mark good points in strategic and global geopolitical thinking.

    True, that Ukraine will go bankrupt in few months. Believe me, US will orchestrate a new coup against Poroshenko and replace him with ultranazi Jarosh. Than Ukraine will become fully nazi state to repress any rebellion against US installed regime and to continue with war. Unfortunately it is on Novorussian army to liberate Ukraine from nazis, to defeat ukronazis on the battlefield and to marsh against Kiev. Only then the rest of Ukrainians will be able to throw this pro-US junta from power and peace will be achieved in divided Ukraine.


    Good, let them. Let ukraine become even more of a totalitarian regime, let the world see how far the US is prepared to go, how dirty its willing to get its hands by supporting such animals in order to pursue its goals of 'democracy'.

    I think its more likely that they would replace porky with the rabbit, since he is their boy though.  


    I think if there is someone next in line, it might be the rabbit also. I would like to know the FACTS about his background and his parents' backgrounds, but there is little or nothing I can find online. It seems to be scrubbed clean.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Vann7 Sun Jun 28, 2015 1:35 pm

    medo wrote:
    True, that Ukraine will go bankrupt in few months. Believe me, US will orchestrate a new coup against Poroshenko and replace him with ultranazi Jarosh. Than Ukraine will become fully nazi state to repress any rebellion against US installed regime and to continue with war. Unfortunately it is on Novorussian army to liberate Ukraine from nazis, to defeat ukronazis on the battlefield and to marsh against Kiev. Only then the rest of Ukrainians will be able to throw this pro-US junta from power and peace will be achieved in divided Ukraine.


    If Poroshenko replaced in a coup.. the new Government will NOT have the legitimacy
    of majority of Ukrainians and this will disband the army and police, you will see factions
    try to do their coup too.. and a civil war will start. Americans will not be able to hold power
    in kiev if majority of Ukrainians without food and coups continue fighting for money and power
    in Kiev..  You will see lots of defections and regular Ukraine army fighting Right Sector..

    Riots for food and goods in all cities for the few business opearting will completely destroy ,totally Ukraine as a nation.. it will become a 40 million Refugees Nation.. that will flee in mass
    to Russia or Europe for better future. thats when the RUssian Army will take Ukraine without firing a shot.. it will go there with Belarus and other former soviet republics to restore order..
    and organize new elections.

    Best Americans can do is finance the Ukraine Army with a misery.. but their families and the
    lack of hope for their nation will not allow US and the west to keep united Ukrainians. So the question is when will Ukraine start collapsing?  my bet is by the end of year ,or max next summer we will see a completely disbanded nation.. The only chance Ukraine can survive
    as a country is that the west tell their puppets in kiev to stop the war in Ukraine and implement MInsk-2... which essentially if fully implemented ,it will reverse the coup in Ukraine.. allowing
    Pro RUssian Rebels to hold control of their cities under a special Autonomy. This however will not solve the economic problems of Ukraine will only delay things..

    The only thing that can save Ukraine as a country is a real genuine peace between kiev and Russia. and that the Right Sector and all volunteer ultra nationals disbanded and its leaders put in jail. and that Russian language adopted again in Kiev and pro Russian politicians allowed in Kiev RAda parliament . That will be the De-nazification of Ukraine.. and a major defeat for all
    Ultra nationals in Ukraine.

    So pretty much Americans/US gov color revolution in ukraine is doomed.. there will be no NATO in Ukraine. The only thing left that the west can do.. to damage Russia.. is to do a Samsom option.. that is if Ukraine will not be for NATO..then it will not be for anyone.. and CIA squads
    start blowing all Nuclear reactors in Ukraine.. and completely destroy Ukraine business.. so later Russia will be forced to Deal with that..and use a big part of their budget to evacuate
    30 to 40 millions Ukrainians and give them shelter.. that indeed will be expensive for Russia
    but definitively will be the end of the war at least.. But if american do this.. it will seriously
    damage their relations with Europe.. So my best guess is US could try for another year to continue the war..in hopes Russia will be forced to invaded Ukraine and later blamed with their media for every civilian killed or accident. as was the malasyan plane incident. blamed on Russia.
    medo
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  medo Sun Jun 28, 2015 1:55 pm

    The coup will be done by nazis, who already have control over police and army as well as their own military units. US doesn't care about legitimacy and about Ukrainian people. They only care, that war will continue.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:22 pm

    USA embassy in Kiev pelted with bloody meat, June 25th | Eng Subs


    PapaDragon
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  PapaDragon Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:30 pm

    Kiev Fails to Provide Soldiers With Military Training, Sends Them to Death


    Ukraine is trying to mobilize as many soldiers as possible and send them to fight in the country’s East. However, due to the lack of proper military training, Ukrainian soldiers are dying in large numbers on the battlefield, Jacques Frere said in French magazine Nations Presse.


    http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150628/1023946976.html


    Only about one-third of Ukrainian recruits have a basic understanding of what real warfare is. When on the frontline, these soldiers simply become cannon fodder in the face of enemy fire, Frere said.

    "After only three months of short military training, they [Ukrainian soldiers] are sent straight to military units, fighting against militia," Frere said, as cited by the French magazine.

    Since the start of the military conflict in Donbass, the Ukrainian Army has lost about 10,000 soldiers dead and twice that many wounded. Some 50,000 soldiers are incapable of fighting for various medical reasons. These numbers don't include soldiers who deserted from the army, the author said.

    "At this pace, one more year and the army of Poroshenko will cease to exist," Frere said.

    Last week, it was reported that over 10,000 soldiers have deserted the army since the start of the war in Donbass in April 2014. So far, the Ukrainian parliament announced six waves of mobilization.

    People have been protesting against the mobilization. Many flee the country to avoid being drafted. As many as 1.3 million Ukrainian draftees currently reside in Russia alone.

    The Ukrainian military conflict started in April of 2014, when the Kiev authorities started war against self-defense pro-independence forces in Donbass, who rejected the legitimacy of the Kiev government that came to power after an illegal coup in February 2014.    


    'Another day nearer the battle
    So drink up, lads and look brave.
    For another day nearer the battle
    Is another day nearer the grave.'


                                      Imperial Guard drinking song, Warhammer 40k   Twisted Evil lol1
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16 - Page 27 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  PapaDragon Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:33 pm


    In a dictionary, next to a phrase "collective suicide" you can see Ukrainian flag...  Twisted Evil

    Ukraine Masses Troops on Border With Transnistria

    Ukraine continues to mass troops and heavy weapons on the border with Transnistria on the pretext that the self-proclaimed republic may launch a military campaign against Ukraine, Russian media reported on Saturday.

    http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150628/1023940592.html

    “It looks like the Kiev authorities  want to picture themselves as encircled by enemies, ready to attack,” a representative of the Transnistrian KGB told Russia’s Zvezda TV channel.

    “That we may have a war here tomorrow is hard to say, but we are not ruling out a Ukrainian provocation either…They could use for this purpose one of their many small private armies which refuse to take any orders from Kiev,” the official added.

    On June 22, the deputy foreign minister of the Transnistrian Republic, Vitaly Ignatyev, said that Ukraine was moving its troops towards the borders of the self-proclaimed republic, sandwiched between Ukraine and Moldova.

    “The situation here is very bad… Economic production is going down, foreign trade is shrinking, the security situation is equally alarming with our Moldovan partners holding military drills with NATO and the Ukrainian pressure mounting every day,” Ignatyev said.

    He also mentioned the curbs Kiev has imposed on the transit of  Transnistrian nationals and citizens of Russia, almost 200,000 of whom currently live in Transnistria.

    “They haven’t been able to travel to Russia via Ukraine for more than a year now. They have to move across Moldova, but Chisinau is creating problems too, along with economic sanctions,” Ignatyev added.

    The newly appointed governor of Ukraine’s Odessa region Mikheil Saakashvili earlier announced plans to reinforce Ukraine’s border with Transnistria.

    "We have two major tasks — to reinforce the border and curb corruption. Drug and weapons trafficking across this border means nothing good," Saakashvili told a news conference in Odessa.

    He also blamed the Transnistrian authorities of destabilizing the situation in Ukraine.

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