The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

Khepesh wrote:Uploaded today and probably very recent of ukrops tanks on the move. Presumably from Kharkov. ukrops said they would repair 200 T-80 and I am very very skeptical about that. Here we see one company and I would be surprised if they managed to field more than one battalion. First video shows Bulats, second video is T-80BV

IS really obvious to me.. the Americans invested too much billions $$$ money in Kiev already ,in overthrowing its democracy and replacing it for a Repressive fascist state they can control. And now funding the war of Kiev , to let it slip now and allow Ukraine to peace with Russia...with them losing control over it..  Neither Europe Union have enough political will to pressure US to stop its provocations against Russia and its criminal proxy war arming delinquents and private military to bomb civilians in eastern Ukraine..   So means US Gov will try any thing ,any trick ,any tactic ,to get Russia and Ukraine to Fight...  The previous report shows how even Americans use brainwashing techniques ,and mantras to convince Ukrainians that Russia is at war with them and they need to fight them..

So what provocations we have not seen yet? that Americans will be perfectly happy
to suggest Ukraine to do ?

-They first start a major full scale artillery assault against civilians population.
hospitals ,Schools  ,Shelters of civilians.. to provoke a Russian federation response.
-When the Rebels fight back.. they could start false flags where civilians on their side killed
and kiev declaring a full scale war on rebels and Russia..
- then with Americans provided Long Range Artillery they could start bombing Crimea..
but also start attacking Russians peacemakers in Transnistria ,that have NOTHING to do
with the ukraine conflict.. simply to provoke Russia into a direct war with Kiev..
-The the start of the use of Chemical weapons provided by @American Eagle terrorist Government.. on civilians population..
- then Russia will be forced to use its Airforce to strike any pro American forces in Ukraine that are bombing Russian territory cities.

And as soon Russia use it Airforce ,is when False Flags will start to show , you will see Nuclear Reactors bombed or Terrorist attacks against civilians in Ukraine ,kiev controlled zones,making it look ,it was Russia Airforce who did it..that their missiles "failed its target" and landed on civilian places.

The whole thing will be setup from start.. by American Government to get Ukraine and Russia
into a full scale war.. this is achieved with third party forces ,that shoot at both sides to keep the conflict going ..while giving US an excuse to justify for pressure on Europe for stop trading
with Russia..  The ultimate goal is to provoke Russia to invade Ukraine in a total war ,in a long war and justify the pressure on Europe to stop trading with Russia.. Is nothing more than cut all economic relations between Europe and Russia.. So that americans companies can sell their liquid Gas and isolate Russia from the west.. also to damage Putin image for their failing economy and for failing to defend Eastern Ukrainians and Crimeans or casualties of their soldiers..

How to Stop the war in Ukraine.. can only happen in 2 ways..

1)That Europeans Pressure USA to stop the war in Ukraine..threatening to leave NATO
and/or threaten to lift all Sanctions to Russia and form an economic alliance with Russia..
IF US do not stop its Games/illegal proxy war in Ukraine against Russia.

2)or that Russia takes the fight directly to the Americans and start shutting down US satellites
and if they do not get the message ,then start sinking their warships..Submarines a limited use of Force against US military really important assets.  

Unless there is serious negative political /military /economical consequences for the american terrorist government ,they will continue pushing the war in Ukraine.. since they will see they have nothing to lose in trying.. since Europe do nothing. is as simple as that.. and i think the #1 option is the best one ,than Russia starting a direct war with Americans ,that could end both nations using nuclear weapons until both cease to exist.  That will really end the myth of American Exceptionalism and myth of being untouchable and all powerful .

Im really convinced than an alliance of Europe and Russia is the only way to save this planet
from Egomaniacs Americans who think they should rule the world.. and tell every other
"whats good for them" and dictate to anyone what to eat ,how to live , and control every thing in your lives.

Really is far better than Europe Union lose the "American friendship" and experience a huge economic recession and becomes Rebellious than to see Millions of Idiots like @american-eagle killed in US cities ,in a nuclear war ,that can potentially spread to millions killed in Europe too and threaten the entire world ,with a total destruction of world economy.

Im convinced that when American Government/its Senate and Congress, notice the European Union is serious and is ready to split and cut relations with them, regardless of economic consequences.. they will back down and give up its "strategic games" in Ukraine withing hours , and demand kiev to implement fully the Minsk2 agreements they agreed and signed. US gov still will have the option anyway to move to another country not in Europe to try destabilize RUssia again.

Germany and France with vast majority of European Union have the tools to give A lethal Blow to American Imperialism by strongly opposing US militarization of the Ukrainian conflict with actions .. And lifting all sanctions on Russia and starting a new strong Economic and technological and military Alliance with Russia with only give diarrhea the American elite the sole idea of it ,and will become a civilized nation again..

Vann, a war between Russia and US could break out without the use of nuclear war - during ww2 both sides fought basically for survival but neither used chemical weapons. A hypothetical NATO-Russia war would not be a everything-or-nothing conflict but a limited war over control of a single country - exchanging nuclear blows over some poor backyard of Europe simply isn't worth it.

I Imagine such limited war in a manner simialr to Korean war - there would be American "volunteers" fighting for Ukrainian side and Russian "volunteers" on Novo side. Forces involved would be rather small and would not exceed 4-5 divisions at each side.

Walther von Oldenburg wrote:Vann, a war between Russia and US could break out without the use of nuclear war - during ww2 both sides fought basically for survival  but neither used chemical weapons. A hypothetical NATO-Russia war would not be a everything-or-nothing conflict but a limited war over control of a single country - exchanging nuclear blows over some poor backyard of Europe simply isn't worth it.

I Imagine such limited war in a manner simialr to Korean war - there would be American "volunteers" fighting for Ukrainian side and Russian "volunteers" on Novo side. Forces involved would be rather small and would not exceed 4-5 divisions at each side.

American volunteers would have to dig deep and hard, for purely topographical reasons. There's nothing stopping Russia from pulling a Zelenopolje time and again. Cross the border a couple of metres, fire a full complement of ordinance, retreat, enjoy. Americans for cultural reasons will stand out. This is why there's little fret to arm or shoulder Ukraine in this mess.

4-5 divisions is actually the whole of the Ukraine's effective army. It's bound to be overly visible when you pop out a second army overnight. Furthermore deploying 40 to 80K soldiers, even gradually, is bound to attract attention. Those 4 divisions are going to need hardware, hardware that Ukropia hasn't got.

Walther von Oldenburg wrote:Vann, a war between Russia and US could break out without the use of nuclear war - during ww2 both sides fought basically for survival  but neither used chemical weapons. A hypothetical NATO-Russia war would not be a everything-or-nothing conflict but a limited war over control of a single country - exchanging nuclear blows over some poor backyard of Europe simply isn't worth it.

I Imagine such limited war in a manner simialr to Korean war - there would be American "volunteers" fighting for Ukrainian side and Russian "volunteers" on Novo side. Forces involved would be rather small and would not exceed 4-5 divisions at each side.

Any limited war with Americans by Russia needs to be done with a really Strong response..
Any Timid or weak response could only encourage the war to escalate. . But don't listen to me.
Listen Putin previous open Interview , where the President of Russia ,himself told about ordering
its nuclear forces to deploy in combat position ,when American warship was closing to Crimea.

For Russia to continue with a proxy war ,if Russian cities are attacked directly by Ukraine with
Americans supplied weapons.. it will only encourage Americans to continue supplying more weapons.. Thats why you need to stop it with a real lethal response ,not to ukraine but to Americans.. like Sinking a warship..but it wil not be strong enough the message if done by just a torpedo.. it had to sent a real strong message.. that paralize the world.. Something like a Cuban missile crisis.. that wake up all American zombie citizens of what their government terrible mistake in messing with Russia in Ukraine,that will provoke a major war with RUssia if they continue..   Any weak response will encourage Americans to continue fueling the conflict
because they will feel "they can handle it" and keep things under control.  Only when the American egomaniac congress feels fear and no longer control of anything ,lose Control of Europe and could not predict Russia response ,and fear the worse ,is when they become reasonable human beings..

All said.. i really think most people will be surprised to see Russia being the first to use
tactical nukes with a small nuclear warhead. Against US military bases or navy ,if for example Ukraine that is under American control ,does something really stupid ,and use cruise missiles supplied by Americans against Crimea and many civilians die... The Americans cannot say they have nothing to do it with.. if the weapon used were supplied by them. and Russia will respond to that in the same way as if american did the attack...  This is why I think ,you saw the Show
of Kerry in Sochi.. to "try to distance" from Ukraine actions.. is was just PR relations to the american citizens to distance from Ukraine conflict in front of cameras.. when their Government is the one that controls kiev actions and policies. Without US help. .Ukraine will receive zero new loans and go bankrupt. and this is not mentioning how the CIA controls the Right Sector ,that they can use to overthrow Poroshenko if he is not obedient..to American policies. then he could be replaced over night.. or killed by his own security guards that are not ukrainians but american citizens.. So effectively Poroshenko is a Face in kiev and nothing else.. Ukraine policies
are controlled by Americans..and this have been confirmed by defectors from the SBU not long ago.. how American supervisors are everywhere ,and Ukrainians cannot move without them checking them..

Too quiet for too long. Something strange is definitely happening.

Flagship Victory wrote:Too quiet for too long. Something strange is definitely happening.

European Union ,lead by Germany and France do have the power to stop the war... all they need
to do is an ultimatum to Americans ,that either they pressure Poroshenko and kiev to end the war
and return to Minsk-2 for real... or they will lift all Sanctions on Russia and start an economy alliance with Russia and start sanctions on Ukraine. very simple but Powerful and effective.
It will leave Ukraine and Americans isolated in the conflict..and US cannot maintain Ukraine economy.. Ukraine without Europe is toast.. it cannot pivot to any place if Europe and Russia stop trading with them..

I think Ukrop attack is imminent, I wish Novorossians good luck in repelling the Ukrop aggressors and liberate the whole of Ukraine from American occupation forces

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Ukrops litterally trashed the reputation of the T-64, now they're going to shit on the T-80 holy cow, these people don't understand when enough is enough. As I said before, even if they put all available engines on their t-80, they're likely to have at best about 50 tanks rolling. There haven't been new compatible engines with the t-80 since 2009.

the engines don't sound healthy ... they are actually T-80Bs with a crude upgrade nowhere near the standard of the Russian T-80BV .. what version of Era are they equipped with ?? how degraded is it knowing Ukraine it was made in the 1980s

+1 Godric.

USSR in several decades turned an overgrown farm into a country that manufactured aircraft carriers, heavy aircraft and space grade rockets. All gone in record time....

They used to make this for heavens sakes:

PapaDragon wrote:
+1 Godric.

USSR in several decades turned an overgrown farm into a country that manufactured aircraft carriers, heavy aircraft and space grade rockets. All gone in record time....

They used to make this for heavens sakes:

The Soviet Union made the AN-225. Adding to that, Antonov was Russian.

But I am fumbling for tubes.

Even if Ukrops attack with a massive tank force, it won't guarantee anything. The war in Lebanon showed how Israeli tanks were sitting ducks for Kornets that Hezbollah used. I don't have the exact number on how many the IDF lost but it was enough to make them retreat. That's the IDF, highly trained force. The VSU are lightyears from that. Good equipment in the hands of idiots is a recipe for disaster.

I also agree that we're days maybe a few weeks away from war now. Godspeed to the NAF.

PapaDragon wrote:
+1 Godric.

USSR in several decades turned an overgrown farm into a country that manufactured aircraft carriers, heavy aircraft and space grade rockets. All gone in record time....

They used to make this for heavens sakes:

It goes to show that Russia was the driving force behind the USSR, and once Ukraine became independent it devolved into a xenophobic backwater, and a human cesspit of all things unspeakable...the Banderasites are the non-Islamic equivalent of ISIS!

Good article on FortRuss even if contradicting itself in places

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/08/is-donbass-on-verge-of-new-offensive.html

My thoughts, Ukranian army is not significantly better but worse overall, despite some units having improved

Stalemate will not last forever, forces are stretched thin, and another defeat for the UAF would allow the NAF to breakthrough and exploit. Everybody is pessimistic and thinking about positional warfare, but I think they are wrong, as wrong as last year when the Novorussians were cornered and predicted to last just 2 weeks more, when they were on the verge of encircling the Ukranian forces.

On the Ukrops offensive, of course there have been delays and postponements due to hesitation on part of Poroshenko and the junta, but the inertia will carry them forward, they have no choice but to attack.

kvs wrote:

Neutrality wrote:Even if Ukrops attack with a massive tank force, it won't guarantee anything. The war in Lebanon showed how Israeli tanks were sitting ducks for Kornets that Hezbollah used. I don't have the exact number on how many the IDF lost but it was enough to make them retreat. That's the IDF, highly trained force. The VSU are lightyears from that. Good equipment in the hands of idiots is a recipe for disaster.

I also agree that we're days maybe a few weeks away from war now. Godspeed to the NAF.

I doubt that even with 90,000 troops and 450 tanks the Kiev regime forces will be stellar performers this time around.  I expect
them to have better organization but the NATO puppet masters cannot fix the fact that all the conscripts want to be
somewhere else and the Right Sector tards are tards.   So it is likely we are going to see some sort of false flag.

Actually I would like them to.field those numbers, so NAF could attack the huge logistic chain that would require.The logistics have been the achilles heels of UA. Sustained combat has shown how badly organized the UA is.

posted in error

Neutrality wrote:Even if Ukrops attack with a massive tank force, it won't guarantee anything. The war in Lebanon showed how Israeli tanks were sitting ducks for Kornets that Hezbollah used. I don't have the exact number on how many the IDF lost but it was enough to make them retreat. That's the IDF, highly trained force. The VSU are lightyears from that. Good equipment in the hands of idiots is a recipe for disaster.

I also agree that we're days maybe a few weeks away from war now. Godspeed to the NAF.

True. Just look at Saudis in Yemen. They regularly lost all ground battles with Houtis although they have the most modern western equipment.

Godric wrote:
the engines don't sound healthy ... they are actually T-80Bs with a crude upgrade nowhere near the standard of the Russian T-80BV .. what version of Era are they equipped with ?? how degraded is it knowing Ukraine it was made in the 1980s

I would say that the first three are real BV by looking at the bricks on the side of the turret over the smoke dischargers, which is the normal BV position. The others have no smoke dischargers and the box on the side in the normal B position were the dischargers are on a BV. It would be interesting to know if the bricks even have their explosive charge, unless canibalised from other tanks, as the factory that makes the explosive is in Donetsk, the chemical factory that ukrops throw Tochka at.

Detailed briefing by Basurin about what is thought may happen. The video has captions


And the map behind him


90000 men
450 tanks
2500 BMP/BTR
5 Tochka-U launch systems
230 MLRS
1050 artillery pieces and mortars
3500 assorted AT weapons

The map is really just a possibility and shows everything that could happen, not what will happen as ukrops could not really launch that many major assaults at the same time with any hope of success, well, they can try....

When?....

Just by taking a look at "Group A" one can already see how delusional these idiots really are. A war literally on the Russian border? Something like that has already happened and shells killed a Russian citizen AFAIK. We all know how Russia responded. If they pull the same shenanigans with Group A I'm 100% confident they will face the same fate.

PS: Anyone got a topological map of the current territory under NAF control?

Khepesh wrote:Detailed briefing by Basurin about what is thought may happen. The video has captions


And the map behind him


90000 men
450 tanks
2500 BMP/BTR
5 Tochka-U launch systems
230 MLRS
1050 artillery pieces and mortars
3500 assorted AT weapons

The map is really just a possibility and shows everything that could happen, not what will happen as ukrops could not really launch that many major assaults at the same time with any hope of success, well, they can try....

When?....

Classic 'by the book'. 4 armies gathered all along the lines with a fifth as mobile reserve held back to reinforce success. If the orcs attack it's going to be a rough time for NAF. I have no doubts that the orcs will throw every piece of arty they have in to the fray at the very beginning including their Tuchka systems. I doubt the racket will waken OSCE from their slumbers nor will it wake EUUS until NAF goes on the offensive, then you will see a panicked run for Moscow yet again. If the situation with NAF gets really bad I'm wondering if the North Wind will blow or will there be a concerted attack from RAF to stop the carnage and restore some order in Novorossiya. Time will tell but you can bet the sanctions we'll get out of this will be pretty strong. I've watched 'the west media' preparing their populaces for just this event for the last three months, each week the crescendo of noise from the media steadily increasing in regards to the 'threat from Russia and Putin'.

Now Patrushev "secretary of Russian Security Council" is blaming Kiev for trying to solve the situation in Donbass through military means. Basically everyone who is involved in this conflict, both directly and indirectly, have expressed more or less the same thing. I guess when there's smoke there's fire and we're close to things turning hot again.

It just occured to me that the upcoming battle - if it takes place - will be among the largest battles post-1945 - and comparable to some smaller ww2 battles

I just hope that NAF performs well.

If I was Putin, I would redeploy an armored division to NAF and that division would form mobile reserve - going into action wherever the situation is the most critical.

So with this huge Army stacked against NAF , is this end of Road for their Struggle ?

What does West Germany . France has to say about it , I am sure their satellites and intel would have notified them about this huge army.

Khepesh wrote:Detailed briefing by Basurin about what is thought may happen. The video has captions


And the map behind him


90000 men
450 tanks
2500 BMP/BTR
5 Tochka-U launch systems
230 MLRS
1050 artillery pieces and mortars
3500 assorted AT weapons

The map is really just a possibility and shows everything that could happen, not what will happen as ukrops could not really launch that many major assaults at the same time with any hope of success, well, they can try....

When?....

Does Ukraine has those numbers in the junkyards even (the APC numbers might have been plausible all things taken to consideration BEFORE this Situation and then some). Tanks are probably all they actually got. This is surreal.