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Project 955: Borei class SSBN

GarryB

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Post n°451

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

GarryB Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:13 pm

No.

They are making 8 Boreis... if they put 20 missiles in the damn things then 160 missiles with.

Bulavas are described as SLBMs with 6-10 warheads per missile... do the maths.

Assuming 6 warheads per missile and 16 missiles per boat that is 768 warheads.

Assuming 10 warheads per missile and 20 missiles per boat that is 1600 warheads.

A little hint... the new Start treaty limits each side to 1200-1500 warheads each, which means about 400 warheads per branch of the nuclear triad, so even with 16 launch tubes they will be carrying more like 3-4 warheads per missile in their subs.

Arrow

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Post n°452

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Arrow Tue Nov 21, 2017 3:18 am

20 launcher is better option. You can quickly increase your strategic arsenal. The USA has much more launchers in SLBM and ICBM.
Russia has no money for many SSBNs. Borey A with 16 launchers is a big mistake.

So Borey-A has 16 launcher or 20? Any photo ?

PapaDragon

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Post n°453

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

PapaDragon Tue Nov 21, 2017 3:58 am

Borei-B has 20 SLBMs.

Who said it has 16?

Arrow

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Post n°454

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Arrow Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:03 am

We are talking about Borey-A.

Peŕrier

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Post n°455

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Peŕrier Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:11 am

I think too that, dimensions-wise, those devices on the horizontal rudder could house a trailed sonar or whatever device.

About hull forms, if I'm right that is the first hull built from scratch.

So the exception should be considered the first hulls, built around sections meant for older vessels, not this one.

At last. about the doors, some of them are likely just seacocks. I.e. valves ingesting sea water for any possible need, from desalinization to cooling, up to ballast tanks filling and discharging.

I think it is likely that every single function has its own seacock's design, engineered specifically to perform a single specific duty, discretion being the first and foremost requirement in a SSBN.

walle83

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Post n°456

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

walle83 Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:13 am

Well all sources I have seen about the 955A(U) has said that the submarine will carry 20 SLBMS. I gess we soon will find out.

hoom

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Post n°457

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

hoom Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:27 pm

At last. about the doors, some of them are likely just seacocks

Oh, I know, probably for reactor coolant water.
But you know, big new Russian missile sub with some unusual doors, what more perfect opportunity is there for using that quote jocolor

PapaDragon

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Post n°458

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

PapaDragon Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:41 pm

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 F9E6WFIhnh6HCFm6M_GhC9OGh6wG2BSCiD_0midKpn8

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 Borei-A_hatches

http://www.hisutton.com/Borei-A.html

Orocairion

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Post n°459

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Orocairion Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:24 pm

Wasn't the sail supposed to be different too?

Arrow

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Post n°460

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Arrow Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:41 am

So only 16 launcher.

PapaDragon

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Post n°461

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

PapaDragon Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:43 am

Orocairion wrote:Wasn't the sail supposed to be different too?

Maybe, maybe not, no photos available yet.

Arrow wrote:So only 16 launcher.

Still speculative since no full images have surfaced.

START treaty is a hassle but if they get the production speed right it won't hurt to have more subs with fewer missiles from strategic standpoint.

Wait and see.

Cyberspec

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Post n°462

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Cyberspec Wed Nov 22, 2017 1:22 pm

Putin has hinted that Russia might abandon the new START if the US leaves the INF treaty

Arrow

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Post n°463

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Arrow Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:20 am

Still speculative since no full images have surfaced. wrote:

No speculation since 2013

http://russianforces.org/blog/2013/02/project_955a_submarines_to_car.shtml

George1

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Post n°464

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

George1 Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:22 am

Details about the nuclear submarine cruiser "Knyaz Vladimir"

The well-known resource "Covert Shores" very quickly issued its analysis on the main nuclear submarine missile cruiser of strategic design 09552 "Prince Vladimir", withdrawn from the shed JSC "Production Association" Northern Machine Building Enterprise "on November 17, 2017. Authors of the resource analyzed the available photo and video images and came to a number of conclusions.

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 O-fp5mz6tls0Vc6IqEXnJXxcLl_ZLBzc1zgv4LD6xqtiQUHzyd4ain22KruZc01MNoQjhzbHuRUaJuF0bURFgIbh4fU9g1etPLgVNverO6M

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 O-fp5mz6tls0Vc6IqEXnJXxcLl_ZLBzc1zgv4LD6xqtiQUHzyd4ain22KruZc01MNoQjhzbHuRUaJuF0bURFgIbh4fU9g1etPLgVNverO6M

We only note that, according to unofficial information, the fencing of the retractable devices of the new SSBN is somewhat different from the one cited in the diagram (c) hisutton.com

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 O-fp5mz6tls0Vc6IqEXnJXxcLl_ZLBzc1zgv4LD6xqtiQUHzyd4ain22KruZc01MKTda3OsGwgxwCBNQ70meFjDPg9sf9rNukTusFD42KQg

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 O-fp5mz6tls0Vc6IqEXnJXxcLl_ZLBzc1zgv4LD6xqtiQUHzyd4ain22KruZc01MKTda3OsGwgxwCBNQ70meFjDPg9sf9rNukTusFD42KQg

The authors of the resource counted 16 missile silos on the boat, which refutes earlier assumptions that the upgraded SSBNs will carry 20 submarine-launched ballistic missiles (SLBMs) (with) hisutton.com

The official designation of the main nuclear submarine strategic missile cruiser Knyaz Vladimir (plant number 204) of the modified project 955A (project 09552, code Borey-A) was made at the Northern Sea Route in Severodvinsk on July 30, The construction is carried out under a separate contract between USC and the Ministry of Defense of Russia N / 1/2/0368 / GK-12-DGOZ dated May 25, 2012. The actual building of the ship is being carried out on the NSR since 2009.

Also on May 25, 2012, the Ministry of Defense of Russia with USC for the construction of four serial ARPKSNS project 955A (09552, "Borey-A") with factory numbers 205 , 206, 207 and 208, now the construction of serial ships of this project "Prince Oleg" (serial number 205, officially laid July 27, 2014), "Generalissimo Suvorov" (plant number 206, laid down on December 26, 2014 ), "Emperor Alexander III" (serial number 207, laid December 18, 2015) and "Prince Pozharsky" (factory number 208, incorporated on December 23, 2016).

Earlier, the SMP carried out the construction and transferred to the Russian Navy the first three project 955 (09551, Borey) - K-535 Yuri Dolgoruky (plant number 201, transferred to the Russian Navy on January 10, 2013), K-550 Alexander Nevsky plant number 202, transferred to the Russian Navy on December 23, 2013) and K-551 "Vladimir Monomakh" (serial number 203, transferred to the Russian Navy on December 19, 2014).

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2972268.html

KomissarBojanchev

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Post n°465

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

KomissarBojanchev Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:07 am

So the Borei has fewer missiles than the Ohio, and there are far fewer Boreis than the Ohios. Are there any really definitive advantages to the Ohio, apart from vague "next generation" explanations? I know everything is top secret, but can there be an educated guess? Can we expect the Borei to be multiple times quieter and a much deeper diver than the ohio? Also is the Borei magnetically detectable like the Ohio? Faster? Far better countermeasures? I really hope that the Borei A is completely superior to the Ohio in absolutely every technical category, including the SLBMs.

Did they decide to not increase the number of bulavas on the borei-A because it would delay the building even more?

Tsavo Lion

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Post n°466

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Tsavo Lion Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:32 am

I posted this in another thread, but it's relevant here too:
New Skyph (Skif) sea bottom ICBM:

http://svpressa.ru/war21/article/186921/?cba=1 skif
They can put them in the Okhotsk Sea too. Cheaper than old Delta III/IVs & Borey SSBNs that also can safely deploy there & in the Arctic only. If these new ICBMs deployed in sufficient #s, at least some of the subs already built could be converted to SSGNs, perhaps eliminating the need for a few new Yasen SSGNs.

The same goes for new Borey SSBNs which can dive deeper & whose BMs have longer range than the Ohio SSBNs:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4990018/russia-vladimir-putin-nuclear-submarine-borei-knyaz-navy/

Orocairion

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Post n°467

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Orocairion Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:03 am

Seems that the sail was indeed modified

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2978815.html

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 5X5aTU7

George1

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Post n°468

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

George1 Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:13 am

The presumed appearance of the 09552 nuclear submarine missile cruiser

Based on the results of the first publication on November 27, 2017, having worked with photo and video materials, the image of the SSBPP-09552 was slightly modified. What is interesting in general on the appearance of the new project "Boreas"?

- all-steered rudders of direction;
- "washers" on the rear horizontal rudders;
- in the "washers" the exhaust path of the extension antenna GAS and, possibly, the antenna of the communication system;
- The increased size (in comparison with ПЛАРБ пр.955) the propeller;
- the modified structure of the hull (due to the fact that the elements of the submarine are not used pr.971);
- the modified design of the fencing of sliding devices ("felling") - is probably caused by world experience and more modern research of the flow around objects;
- Side torpedo tubes (presumably);
- The new SAC.

Of course, I will post more clarification because it is necessary to give due tribute to the regime - there are practically no interesting and complete images of the boat on the network.

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2978556.html

Tsavo Lion

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Post n°469

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Tsavo Lion Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:34 am

More on the tail section: http://www.janes.com/article/75992/images-of-russian-project-955a-ssbn-reveal-design-changes

PapaDragon

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Post n°470

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

PapaDragon Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:16 am

George1 wrote:The presumed appearance of the 09552 nuclear submarine missile cruiser

Based on the results of the first publication on November 27, 2017, having worked with photo and video materials, the image of the SSBPP-09552 was slightly modified. What is interesting in general on the appearance of the new project "Boreas"?

- all-steered rudders of direction;
- "washers" on the rear horizontal rudders;
- in the "washers" the exhaust path of the extension antenna GAS and, possibly, the antenna of the communication system;
- The increased size (in comparison with ПЛАРБ пр.955) the propeller;
- the modified structure of the hull (due to the fact that the elements of the submarine are not used pr.971);
- the modified design of the fencing of sliding devices ("felling") - is probably caused by world experience and more modern research of the flow around objects;
- Side torpedo tubes (presumably);
- The new SAC.

Of course, I will post more clarification because it is necessary to give due tribute to the regime - there are practically no interesting and complete images of the boat on the network.

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2978556.html

From the article:

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 19 4943054_original

Tsavo Lion

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Post n°471

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Tsavo Lion Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:52 am

More details: https://iz.ru/677556/ilia-kramnik/novyi-borei

Arrow

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Post n°472

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Arrow Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:00 pm

Only 16 SLBM, old reactor.

Big_Gazza

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Post n°473

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

Big_Gazza Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:50 pm

Arrow wrote:Only 16 SLBM, old reactor.

Its an improved serial build of the initial Norei batch, updated with tweaks. What did you expect?

jhelb

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Post n°474

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

jhelb Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:25 pm

Popular Mechanic's latest article about the Borei class subs.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/navy-ships/amp13990706/russias-new-missile-submarine-sure-looks-familiar/

KiloGolf

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Post n°475

Re: Project 955: Borei class SSBN

KiloGolf Sun Dec 03, 2017 3:27 am

Big_Gazza wrote:

Arrow wrote:Only 16 SLBM, old reactor.

Its an improved serial build of the initial Norei batch, updated with tweaks. What did you expect?

It seems Russia is unable to produce well-armed SSBNs. 16 SLBMs is way too low, and that high number of torpedo tubes seems a bit useless. Also I'm not so sure about the procured numbers, way too low.

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