They've put in Kolomnas with a new domestic gearbox. (but less power than the MTUs would have had)
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79 posters
Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°676
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
20385 was going to have MTUs.
They've put in Kolomnas with a new domestic gearbox. (but less power than the MTUs would have had)
They've put in Kolomnas with a new domestic gearbox. (but less power than the MTUs would have had)
Admin- Posts : 2926
Points : 3798
Join date : 2009-07-10
- Post n°677
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom wrote:20385 was going to have MTUs.
They've put in Kolomnas with a new domestic gearbox. (but less power than the MTUs would have had)
The Kolomnas have been failures with constant breakdowns, intense vibrations, faulty sensors, failed hydraulic power, broken crankshafts... problems too long to list. The ships cannot even go into reverse and not fit for open seas. Still waiting on that gearbox... as if that will magically fix the problems. The whole range of engines is in prototype stage, another decade before it could be proven and a bunch of shells with no reliable engines.
hoom- Posts : 2352
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Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°678
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
WTF are you talking about?
There were big problems with 20380 engines initially but its been said several years ago that they figured out an issue with the exhaust installation, re-designed & reworked, I'm not aware of major issues since.
Last year two of the 20380s went to Gulf of Aden & back then after short stop a jaunt around the British Isles without any sign of engine issues.
They have made several forays out into the North Atlantic last couple of years.
Gremy has the new gearboxes, they were installed same time as the engines back in 2016.
Its literally in video moving around under its own power today.
There is no reverse on 20385 because Gremy has variable pitch props -> not needed.
There were big problems with 20380 engines initially but its been said several years ago that they figured out an issue with the exhaust installation, re-designed & reworked, I'm not aware of major issues since.
Last year two of the 20380s went to Gulf of Aden & back then after short stop a jaunt around the British Isles without any sign of engine issues.
They have made several forays out into the North Atlantic last couple of years.
Gremy has the new gearboxes, they were installed same time as the engines back in 2016.
Its literally in video moving around under its own power today.
There is no reverse on 20385 because Gremy has variable pitch props -> not needed.
Admin- Posts : 2926
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Join date : 2009-07-10
- Post n°679
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
What are you talking about? If they had fixed the problems years ago there would be a dozen of each type in service as the state armaments plan stipulates.
hoom- Posts : 2352
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Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°680
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
I'm talking about gearboxes that do exist & ships that go on long voyages without problems in recent years.
You're talking about the situation for this class of years ago as if there have been no changes or improvements.
There have been.
You're talking about the situation for this class of years ago as if there have been no changes or improvements.
There have been.
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°681
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
I'm curious about the greebly bits in the top part of the mast
(crop from one of above pics)
Looks like some kind of optical gear, possibly DIRCMs type stuff?
Subtle convex curvature of most of the antenna covers I think implies air-cooled?
At least thats what was said about Type 054C vs D.
Edit: as ever a whole slew of pics at http://bastion-karpenko.ru/20385-gremyshii-190421-1/ and http://bastion-karpenko.ru/20385-gremyshii-190421-2/
'Dat profile
Haven't seen a good rear angle before
(crop from one of above pics)
Looks like some kind of optical gear, possibly DIRCMs type stuff?
Subtle convex curvature of most of the antenna covers I think implies air-cooled?
At least thats what was said about Type 054C vs D.
Edit: as ever a whole slew of pics at http://bastion-karpenko.ru/20385-gremyshii-190421-1/ and http://bastion-karpenko.ru/20385-gremyshii-190421-2/
'Dat profile
Haven't seen a good rear angle before
Hole- Posts : 11122
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Join date : 2018-03-24
Age : 48
Location : Scholzistan
- Post n°682
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°683
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Thats a good comparison shot thks
Yeah I guess its probably mainly just that, hadn't noticed there weren't conventional EO balls elsewhere
There are the normal periscopes on the bridge wings.
Looks like a large sensor top (equivalent to the ball next to Furke?), 2 smaller ones below (Bagira for the Ak-630s?).
Model vs Reality comparison & Profile collage via Charly015 http://charly015.blogspot.com/2019/04/en-mayo-se-botara-la-primera-corbeta.html
Yeah I guess its probably mainly just that, hadn't noticed there weren't conventional EO balls elsewhere
There are the normal periscopes on the bridge wings.
Looks like a large sensor top (equivalent to the ball next to Furke?), 2 smaller ones below (Bagira for the Ak-630s?).
Model vs Reality comparison & Profile collage via Charly015 http://charly015.blogspot.com/2019/04/en-mayo-se-botara-la-primera-corbeta.html
Admin- Posts : 2926
Points : 3798
Join date : 2009-07-10
- Post n°684
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom wrote:I'm talking about gearboxes that do exist & ships that go on long voyages without problems in recent years.
You're talking about the situation for this class of years ago as if there have been no changes or improvements.
There have been.
If there have been improvements then they should be entering active service like hotcakes... where is that?
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°685
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
If there are no gearboxes how is Gremy starting sea trials?
If the engines are unreliable why are wee seeing 20380s doing long & frequent patrols?
I didn't claim production is fast.
I'd certainly like to see a lot more built and more quickly.
If the engines are unreliable why are wee seeing 20380s doing long & frequent patrols?
I didn't claim production is fast.
I'd certainly like to see a lot more built and more quickly.
GarryB- Posts : 40553
Points : 41055
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
- Post n°686
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Well if engines and gearboxes are new surely the sensible thing is to get a couple into the water and then sail around a lot with them and work out any bugs or problems and issues so there is some certainty that the design and more importantly the manufacturing is solid before making them in large numbers...
Admin- Posts : 2926
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Join date : 2009-07-10
- Post n°687
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom wrote:If there are no gearboxes how is Gremy starting sea trials?
If the engines are unreliable why are wee seeing 20380s doing long & frequent patrols?
I didn't claim production is fast.
I'd certainly like to see a lot more built and more quickly.
Do you see them doing long and frequent patrols? I seem to recall the Baltic Fleet commanders being fired because the four Project 20380s had not deployed to the Mediterranean or Indian Ocean a single time in nine years, they had a low combat readiness and suffered numerous accidents and fires.
hoom- Posts : 2352
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Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°688
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Yes I do.
Look back through the thread, as I said 2 of them went to Persian Gulf and back last year then after a short break went out round the British isles.
There have been several other patrols mostly by pairs out into North Atlantic.
Long range patrols are not what 20380s should be doing though, they're supposed to be short range ASW guards, I'd rather see them doing lots of short patrols.
Look back through the thread, as I said 2 of them went to Persian Gulf and back last year then after a short break went out round the British isles.
There have been several other patrols mostly by pairs out into North Atlantic.
Long range patrols are not what 20380s should be doing though, they're supposed to be short range ASW guards, I'd rather see them doing lots of short patrols.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
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- Post n°689
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Hoom is right, corvettes are not supposed to do long range patrols, especially not alone
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- Post n°690
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Let me quote Papa, "At least they go the rust right" Holy mother of God that amount of oxide.
Admin- Posts : 2926
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Join date : 2009-07-10
- Post n°691
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom wrote:Yes I do.
Look back through the thread, as I said 2 of them went to Persian Gulf and back last year then after a short break went out round the British isles.
There have been several other patrols mostly by pairs out into North Atlantic.
Long range patrols are not what 20380s should be doing though, they're supposed to be short range ASW guards, I'd rather see them doing lots of short patrols.
They didn't make it into the Med until the end of 2017 and have gone no further. They have a range of 4000nm, with a replenishment ship they are expected to patrol the Med and the Indian Ocean which is why the Baltic Fleet commanders were fired.
These shortcomings include the unsatisfactory performance of Baltic Fleet minesweepers during exercises that took place in August 2015, combined with a low level of combat readiness among the fleet’s newest ships. The fleet’s four Project 20380 Steregushchiy class corvettes have not deployed to the Mediterranean Sea or Indian Ocean a single time in the nine years since the first of the ships was commissioned into the fleet. Furthermore, the ships have had more than their share of accidents and fires.
https://russiamil.wordpress.com/2016/06/29/baltic-fleet-commanders-fired/
Isos- Posts : 11603
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Join date : 2015-11-06
- Post n°692
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Militarov wrote:[im://bastion-karpenko.ru/kartinki/20385_GREMYSHII_190421_2_08.JPG[/img]
Let me quote Papa, "At least they go the rust right" Holy mother of God that amount of oxide.
Why don't they use aluminium made structure ? Isn't it the new material for light ships ?
They didn't make it into the Med until the end of 2017 and have gone no further. They have a range of 4000nm, with a replenishment ship they are expected to patrol the Med and the Indian Ocean which is why the Baltic Fleet commanders were fired.
Steregouchys needs to be used like Israeli uses their corvettes. Near the shores, fast, coordinated with each other and with air force to destroy any threat out there.
Not alone in the middle of pacific or mediteranean. That's a job for destroyers.
Admin- Posts : 2926
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- Post n°693
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Isos wrote:
Steregouchys needs to be used like Israeli uses their corvettes. Near the shores, fast, coordinated with each other and with air force to destroy any threat out there.
Not alone in the middle of pacific or mediteranean. That's a job for destroyers.
We must maintain presence so you work with what you have. Corvettes is what we got.
Isos- Posts : 11603
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- Post n°694
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
You also have 3 Grigorovitch but Black sea is very hot right now so they keep them there. But once syrian war and Ukrainian conflict are finished we may see them replaced by Gremyashy and variants.
Admin- Posts : 2926
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- Post n°695
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Isos wrote:You also have 3 Grigorovitch but Black sea is very hot right now so they keep them there. But once syrian war and Ukrainian conflict are finished we may see them replaced by Gremyashy and variants.
The engine situation with Grigorovitch is even worse. The engines in service are black listed by Ukraine and the M90FR expected next year from Rybinsk is behind schedule.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
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- Post n°696
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Isos wrote:..........
Why don't they use aluminium made structure ? Isn't it the new material for light ships ?
......
Ask British Navy veterans from Falkland War what they think about aluminium hulls and their combustibility
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- Post n°697
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
Isos wrote:
Why don't they use aluminium made structure ? Isn't it the new material for light ships ?
Aluminium is okay for smaller displacement ships and fast craft, however for bigger ships it has issues with long term fatigue of material and its melting point is fairly low, read it burns. So marine and construction steels are still the way to go. LCS for an example is made mostly from marine steel on top of aluminium skeleton superstructure.
GarryB- Posts : 40553
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Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
- Post n°698
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
LCS for an example is made mostly from marine steel on top of aluminium skeleton superstructure.
Mixing metals in a salt water environment... not a great idea....
hoom- Posts : 2352
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Join date : 2016-05-06
- Post n°699
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
And in the several years since then things have improved.Vladimir79 wrote:They didn't make it into the Med until the end of 2017 and have gone no further. They have a range of 4000nm, with a replenishment ship they are expected to patrol the Med and the Indian Ocean which is why the Baltic Fleet commanders were fired.
https://russiamil.wordpress.com/2016/06/29/baltic-fleet-commanders-fired/
I'm not saying there are no problems and everything is hunkydory.
There are plenty of problems and I'm pretty sceptical that the Zaslon radar system on 20385 is going to be working well out of the box.
I'm saying 20380s have been much more active recently and 20385 has its engines and gearbox, both of which you said haven't happened but actually have.
Admin- Posts : 2926
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- Post n°700
Re: Project 2038.0: Steregushchy Corvette
hoom wrote:20385 has its engines and gearbox, both of which you said haven't happened but actually have.
I never mentioned 20385, I said Grigorovich which is Project 11356.