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    Tu-160 "White Swan"

    Isos
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    Post  Isos Mon Nov 05, 2018 2:10 pm

    archangelski wrote:
    Tsavo Lion wrote:
    Well you claim the Tu-22 and Tu-22M are the same because they both have wings and a single vertical fin and two engines and crew in the front...
    I never did, only that the 1st influenced the 2nd & it was derived (evolved) from the 1st. They learned from their mistakes to design & produce it.
    Later, 12 years after the B-1 appeared in the USA, they produced the TU-160. I have no doubt that they borrowed many ideas from it:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockwell_B-1_Lancer

    The Tu-160 is an evolution of Myasischev's M-18 project of the sixties.

    Tu-160 "White Swan" - Page 26 TLdOKfJ

    During cold war US and USSR tested hundreds of design for all type of aircraft. They came to same conclusions for lot of details that's why some are very similar like tu-160 and B-1 and sometime they came to different conclusions for exemple su-27 and f-15.

    Soviet/Russian always work on their hardware to be well suited for their doctrines/environment. They can't really copy anything from the west as every equipment US has would not fit in russian military. Su-57 for exemple could have been much more stealthy than f-22 but that's not their goal.
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    Post  GarryB Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:28 am

    I never did, only that the 1st influenced the 2nd & it was derived (evolved) from the 1st. They learned from their mistakes to design & produce it.
    Later, 12 years after the B-1 appeared in the USA, they produced the TU-160. I have no doubt that they borrowed many ideas from it:

    You admit to not being an expert and then you make some claims about something.

    You have no doubt they borrowed some ideas... really?

    And what sort of research have you done on the subject... perhaps if you actually took the time to look at the designs Tupolev and even Sukhoi came up with during the development period of the Tu-160 you would perhaps be in a better position to decide who judged whom.

    But they also studied the B-1 project for comparison.

    Of course based on your logic then we can state categorically that the F-15 and the F-18 are based on the design of the MiG-25 in the sense that they are twin engined fighters with two vertical tails and two side by side jet engines with conventional wings and tail surfaces... would that be right?

    The B-1B is a bomber... and without inflight refuelling it is a theatre bomber comparable to the Tu-22M3M.

    The Tu-160 is a strategic cruise missile carrier.

    There are very clear copies made by the Soviet Union and they make no bones about it when it happens... the AA-2 AAM, the Tu-4 bomber, the shape of the Space Shuttle was also copied.

    Of course if you listen to "experts" in the west they copied everything, which is juvenile and simply wrong.

    If you want us to accept that Tupolev studied the B-1 programme then you have to admit that the makers of the B-1B also studied the Soviet bomber development programmes and copied parts of them too.
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    Post  Tsavo Lion Tue Nov 06, 2018 12:22 pm

    ..the F-15 and the F-18 are based on the design of the MiG-25 in the sense that they are twin engined fighters with two vertical tails and two side by side jet engines with conventional wings and tail surfaces... would that be right?
    Yes, the F-15 was developed as a response to the MiG-25 which was thought to be a dog fighter, not interceptor, before the 1975 Belenko defection. The F-18 is based on the F-16; its twin tails r for better stability during carrier ops.
    The B-1B is a bomber... and without inflight refuelling it is a theatre bomber comparable to the Tu-22M3M. ..
    If you want us to accept that Tupolev studied the B-1 programme then you have to admit that the makers of the B-1B also studied the Soviet bomber development programmes and copied parts of them too.
    The B-1 trials started 12 years before the TU-160 as a strategic bomber before becoming the B-1B theater bomber & it can carry more ordinance than even the B-52.
    I have no doubt the US intell knew of & provided the M-18 & other projects data to US designers. A case in point: the TU-126 AWACS appeared 10 years before the US had its counterpart, which was based on the idea of having rotating radome on top of the fuselage:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-126
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_E-3_Sentry

    The USAF has Foreign Technology Division within the National Air and Space Intelligence Center to monitor & evaluate what others r doing:
    https://archive.org/stream/CIADocuments/CIA-329_djvu.txt
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Air_and_Space_Intelligence_Center  
    https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/some-most-secretive-work-will-done-new-nasic-building/yac4b7k9LwWywMFf8IiQZP/

    So, it's 2 way street!
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    Post  JohninMK Thu Nov 08, 2018 5:53 pm

    Unusual view

    Tu-160 "White Swan" - Page 26 DrYImpXWoAEWaoU
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    hoom


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    Post  hoom Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:33 pm

    It is a great angle but sadly thats a render/CGI.
    Would love to see an actual photo of that angle.

    Edit:
    The F-18 is based on the F-16
    Nope, YF-17 was the direct competitor to YF-16 which won, YF-17 later developed into F-18.
    Hole
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    Post  Hole Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:42 pm

    Two Tu-160´s landed in Venezuela.

    https://tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/201812102045-hnu2.htm
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Mon Dec 10, 2018 7:13 pm

    Hole wrote:Two Tu-160´s landed in Venezuela.

    https://tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/201812102045-hnu2.htm

    *Somewhere in the universe Rogozin is smiling*
    GunshipDemocracy
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:51 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:

    *Somewhere in the universe Rogozin is smiling*

    he flies actually to USA now, not in Tu-160 tho lol1 lol1 lol1



    Hole wrote:Two Tu-160´s landed in Venezuela.

    just friendly visit after US DDG was passing by Vladivostok, just coincidence.
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Tue Dec 11, 2018 2:51 am

    lads news form the morning: da Free Bacon reports:


    https://freebeacon.com/national-security/russia-dispatching-blackjack-bombers-venezuela/

    Russia Dispatching Blackjack Bombers to Venezuela


    Nuclear-capable jets to bolster leftist Maduro regime


    Russia is deploying nuclear-capable Tu-160 Blackjack bombers to Venezuela this week as part of an increasingly provocative pattern of bomber training flights, according to American defense officials.

    At least two Blackjacks will fly from a strategic forces air base in Russia to Venezuela as part of a series of training exercises that will include long-range refueling, said officials familiar with Russian plans for the flight.

    The bomber foray to South America will be Russia's seventh training flight for Blackjack bombers in the past three months.

    Mark Schneider, a former Pentagon official and specialist on the Russian military, said Tu-160 flights are unusual and increasing.

    "There were six announced Tu-160 flights of the ‘provocative' type during the last three months, which is a lot," Schneider said.

    The most recent incident took place near Norway in late October when Tu-160s were shadowed by British and Norwegian jet fighters over the Barents Sea.

    Additionally, Russian forces utilized both Tu-160 and Tu-95 bombers during a recent strategic nuclear forces drill, and the Defense Ministry announced that the recent Ocean Shield exercise in the Mediterranean involved Blackjacks that were described by the Russian defense ministry as involving undisclosed new tactics.

    "The announced Tu-160 flight over the North Pole is also unusual as well as clearly aimed at us," Schneider said. In August, two Blackjacks flew to the North Pole.

    The Pentagon is expected to closely monitor the Blackjacks because of their potential to fire nuclear-armed cruise missiles at U.S. targets. A Pentagon spokesman could not be reached for comment Sunday.

    +++

    Maduro said Moscow also promised to help modernize Venezuela's military.

    Defense ministers from the two countries met in Moscow last week and agreed that Russian air force and naval forces would continue to use Venezuelan ports and airports.

    +++

    "Normally in December they release a lot of information about their plans for the nuclear Strategic Missile Force. I expect they will make this as threatening as possible. I believe there will be more provocative bomber flights."



    so US fashingtonian  regime doesnt like nukes near its borders?  I thought they consider nukes near other borders OK. But best is: Venezuelan bases or Russian ships and aviation  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil
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    Post  hoom Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:55 am

    just friendly visit after US DDG was passing by Vladivostok, just coincidence.
    Off Topic but didn't see it discussed elsewhere, does anyone have the faintest idea what Russian territorial water claims in the Sea of Japan the US disputes? Suspect
    I couldn't find any info about such a thing & as far as I can see Russian claims are more conservative than the Japanese claims.

    It could just be a geographically challenged US spokesman fail at referencing the Kuriles but thats over 1000km away in the Sea of Okhotsk...
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    Post  GarryB Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:25 pm

    does anyone have the faintest idea what Russian territorial water claims in the Sea of Japan the US disputes?

    Well another factor there is that Russia has actually signed that international agreement, but the US has not...   ... a bit like Israel screaming that Iran is not following the rules regarding nuclear weapons.... hahahaha.

    Even better that fat dick Pompeo said Russia would be better to spend such money on solving problems of poverty in Venezuela... hahaha... 1/3rd of the US's yearly budget of war could stop starvation and poverty in Africa... what a dick.
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    Post  hoom Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:48 pm

    Only candidate I could find other than Kuriles is possibly the VTS traffic control scheme which controls areas outside Territorial water
    Tu-160 "White Swan" - Page 26 Raionrsuds1024
    But its not a territorial claim & I don't think its anything unusual internationally.
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    Post  Tsavo Lion Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:09 pm



    https://iz.ru/822366/ilia-kramnik/pereletnyi-sostav-pochemu-tu-160-okazalsia-v-venesuele


    Last edited by Tsavo Lion on Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:31 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : add link)
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    Post  hoom Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:49 pm

    Mother of God!  Shocked
    The pilots have helmets and jumpsuits
    Tu-160 "White Swan" - Page 26 2orjsp

    Russian planes 2000km from US, such aggression!
    US garrison troops Defensively taking Freedom selfies at the border of occupied Estonia, Democracy! Russia should stick to stuff going on inside its borders (except all those bases it has there, those should be moved away from NATO borders ...& military exercises, Russia should hold those somewhere other than Russia where they're not near US bases)
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    Post  Tsavo Lion Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:26 am

    Valenzuela, Cuba, & Syria r unsinkable a/c carriers for Russia just like Britain, Guam, Diego Garcia & Japan r for the USA. Fair & square!


    Last edited by Tsavo Lion on Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:17 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  GarryB Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:47 am

    They are also vulnerable weak countries that the west normally crushes without a second thought for their resources... or in the case of Cuba... just for fun...

    A Russian presence will provide security and stability so they can work out their problems and sort things out without the evil hand of the US stroking their valuable commodities with its clawed hands.
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    Post  Hole Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:15 am

    Would be nice to see a cruise missile test.
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:43 pm

    Russian Tu-160 ten hours spent in the sky over the Caribbean Sea


    Venezuelan Su-30 and F-16 fighters accompanied them at certain stages.
    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/5906175

    Hole wrote:Would be nice to see a cruise missile test.

    when having joint Cuban-Venezuelan-Russian exercises - free arctic penguins lol1 lol1 lol1
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    Post  Tsavo Lion Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:27 am

    Russia will deploy a military base in the Caribbean
    http://www.ng.ru/politics/2018-12-11/1_7460_cariby.html?print=Y
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    Post  Hole Thu Dec 13, 2018 3:51 am

    https://tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/201812130350-4vkj.htm

    Cockpit Video.
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    Post  hoom Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:44 pm

    Spectacular as they are Russia really needs to rein back on these excessively close shots of takeoff/landings (2:01) before someone gets killed &/or causes a crash.

    I mean there is something over 4m clearance under the wing but she's darts out actually underneath the wingtip there.
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    Post  GarryB Thu Dec 13, 2018 11:32 pm

    She is not really heavy enough to do much damage.... a bit of blood on the wingtip... I doubt she would even scratch it...

    And from her perspective it is not really worth it... I mean the Blackjack already has its first kill with cruise missiles in Syria, so her death would not really be significant...

    Bit of a crosswind and she could easily have become part of the aircrafts paintwork.... ignorance is bliss... is it not?

    After flying 10,000km I am sure the pilot will be crisp and ready and react instantly to avoid her of course...

    But of course pompeo is an arse... the job of the Blackjack is to fly long distances to the other side of the planet to attack targets in the Americas... it is the opposite of a waste of money... it is money well spent that is totally relevant to the primary mission of the aircraft...
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    Tu-160 "White Swan" - Page 26 Empty Flight of the Tu-160 Bombers Blackjacks aviation aircraft of the Russian Air Force to Venezuela

    Post  Ivanov673 Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:41 am

    Full video:

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    Post  George1 Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:31 am

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    Post  GarryB Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:34 pm

    Some very nice videos of Blackjacks inside and out.

    Interesting that this blackjack seems to be not an upgraded model, which I would assume had replaced the dial instruments with multifunction displays by now.

    On the outside, the afterburner flame is white, which is interesting because the very similar engines in the Backfire are blue... similar size, similar weight, similar thrust, similar performance, but different colour AB flame...

    That footage of the Blackjack taking off was impressive... those AB flames were enormous...

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