[quote="nero"]
Big_Gazza wrote:Russia was not involved in any way in the NK fiasco. Pashinyan had his mouth stuffed full of Natostani cock and refused to ask Russia for help.
It is beyond me why Russia should have involved itself into the conflict. They had similar relations with both Azerbaijan and Armenia. It was Armenia and specifically the government of Pashinyan that was trying to destroy bilateral relations between Russia and Armenia.
that's complete utter non sense.. just a pure lie. Armenia is a nation Russia defend with its own army and have a base there , to stop turkey and azerbaijan from expanding. it was azerbaijan who shutdown the russian helicopter , not armenian.. Russia and armenia have a defense pact.. there is no defense pact between Russia and Azerbaijan. there are no military bases of russia in azerbaijan.
and before pasha was prime minister of armenia , the previous one , was very pro russia as puppet as any politician can be, and Azerbaijan attacked armenia and killed armenian soldiers and putin did not blinked an eye. Nagornos karabahs see themselves as armenians , they both sare same religion and similar culture and traditions.. Azerbaijan in the other hand is a muslim state under the influence of turkey. Armenia and russia shares common goals , azerbaijan and russia not , turkey wants to restore the ottoman empire to counter Russia , and azerbaijan shares that same goal.
To think that Russia just allowed Turkey + Israel + Azerbaijant to attack armenia and they don't come to their help is non sense. those TOR defenses that were utterly destroyed with russians officers inside , where not doing tourism , they were there aiding armenia fight azerbaijan..
i repeat again, it was Azerbaijan who shot down the russian attack helicopter and they did it
in armenian airspace.. so with friends like this who needs enemies?
Azerbaikan and Russia are NOT friends , anyone who believe that have to be suffering from a brain disfunction.. Russia and azerbaijan are only regional neighbors that choose to cooperate in some issues ,but thats it .. russia relations with azerbaijan are similar to russia relations with turkey.
they only work in the things they have interest and thats it. this is where their relationship ends.
turkey and azerbaijan likes weapons and russia sell them.. Azerbaijan is not a friend of Russia , and armenia is much bigger than just 1 person , even if he is a soros puppet or not.. is irrelevant . Russia will not develop a foreign policy ,only based on 1 person alone, armenians gets russian citizenship , have same orthodox religion and they all teach russian in their schools ,this is how close they are , and they are part of russia security zone , while there is no security deals at all with turkey or azerbaijan. . Azerbaijan is merely a light version of turkey ,with a persian twist. And russia military now knows ,that azerbaijan and turkey are allies , very close allies and that they both at the same time high potential enemies of Russia and that they russian army will likely need to fight them in case of a major war with NATO start.
So Russia was involved in the NK -Russian disaster , and if you think that azerbaijan shut down the Russian attack helicopter and destroyed Russia s-300s , TORS and even their iskanderns inside armenia territory for nothing ,then you are in total delusion. Russia was facing war in the nagorno karabah conflict ,for helping armenia to hold nagorno karabah , is as simple as that ,and they got humiliated big time there , because their soldiers were unable to defend armenia over armenia territorial issues , that see nagorno karabah as their land ,but for lipservice reasons ,don't openly say is their land. But in their hearts nagorno karabah is armenian land.
Without Russia support ,armenia will have been destroyed completely ,and over run ,and it was this help of Russia to armenia ,this involvement of russia in the conflict ,the reason azerbaijan attacked
russia air defenses and killed russian pilots.. So stop spreading bs , Russia was involved in the conflict of NK and helping armenia to hold , by giving them all air defenses they asked ,logistics ,intelligence ,electronic warfare ,to give them a chance to hold the attack and FAILED to help armenia to hold ,they were forced to retreat . So in other words Russia was put under submission in that conflict , Russia had to negotiate the end of the conflict ,from a position of weakness.. and it was this failure of russian hardware to push back azerbaijan and turkey expansion in armenian historical lands, was encouraged erdogan ,to know seek another conflict with russia ,this time in ukraine .
even erdogan is saying will help ukraine recover crimea..
So don't lie , azerbaijan is not a friend of russia , aliyev is only an erdogan puppet , another opportunistic backstabber , with ambitions of restarting the ottoman empire.
facts for you.
-Russia army was hand to hand aiding armenia to hold their historical lands.
they used their private contractors ,but they were all of them under communications with russia minister of defenses.. so russia was aiding armenia and failed to hold ,those attack drones and suicide drones were too effective against russia air defenses , once they destroy most armenian defenses , aiding nagorno ,armenian-nk lines collapsed.
-azerbaijan directly attacked the russian base in armenia ,a few times , there are videos of that too.
it was only a warning limited attacks , and russia air defenses shot down their ballistic missiles.
-turkey spy planes ,given by NATO and israel ,where jamming russia radars and hardware in the russian base another fact. in a clear act of war . this is all documented in russian websites and russia did not shot it down .
-armenia main and official territory was bombed with ballistic missiles and attack drones , armenian civilians died too, and this was an act of war and russia was under obligation of a security pact to come in defense of armenia ,and join the war officially versus the agressor ,but putin pretended that nothing happened.
So trying to downplay it all ,as a "nagorno failure" when 100% of their hardware was russian one,
very modern hardware ,and russia was fully helping armenia to hold versus azerbaijan attacks over nagorno is not only dishonest , but ridiculous. Russian army don't need to be physically present in nagorno to help them ,they could help from distance ,shooting down turkey and israel drones , but they were. and the proof is that russian media RT was also present there in nagorno, right in the front line ,so special forces spetnas from russia had to be providing protections to their media staff and also providing intelligence to armenia of azeri positions. Russia military was fully aiding armenia to hold, the attacks of azerbaijan on what they consider their land too , and they failed in this ,and the best putin could do ,is negotiate territory for peace from a position of weakness. Even the Russian navy was involved in aiding armenia , with intelligence and guiding their missiles on azerbaijan les ,of every plane that take off from baku. Russia was a major big loser in that war , because now the credibility of russian army as unbeatable force in question. all russian enemies nows how russia can be defeated and will use the nk conflict as reference for future wars.
Had Russia did not had nukes , turkey and nato will have over run armenia and syria already.
Those russian airdefenses can be neutralized by coordinated drones attacks , but to stop a nuke is a more complicated thing. so russia will have to return to the drawing board and design something else , to prevent any other defeat to nato and israeli drones ,which is what azerbaijan was really using , turkey only assembly the hardware but is NATO and israeli hardware what defeated russia air defenses. so russia will need to modernize their air defenses for more modern wars , drone wars ,using mobile laser defenses , and automatic radars guided anti air artillery and far more effective electronic warfare than the one russia have ,since even russia EW was destroyed at times.
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