Russian special military operation in Ukraine #21

GarryB wrote " Why do you think it needs to be urgent? There is no rush... HATO was in Afghanistan for 20 years to save it and still failed, Russian has barely started... " we can not compare the two situations easily . Ukraine is near peer adversary , increasingly supported by NATO , and able , though with a little delay , to start using complex Rocket system . It is an industrial country with nuclear technology and satellite tech . Russia was not supporting the Taliban against America in Afghanistan with weapons at all , unlike America now supplying Ukraine , against Russia . In Afghanistan America needed a long war , to satisfy the MIC . Russia is not driven by MIC .


Also war is costing twenty billion Dollars per day for Russia . And many troops and possibly conscripts needed by Russia ; and further conscripts and using reserves were sanctioned recently . Huge cost of war , when reserves estimated at 650 billion USD . US alone spends ten times more on military , today heard they are sending some F16 . Did they think at first , send 777 or F16 ? No of course not . But they saw the slow pace , and lack of response , so they got hopeful and gathered around and built up the pressure slowly . They dream of a long proxy war . Weaken Russia and give it a boiling frog treatment . As I said , the side with the smaller resources , can not be the Turtle in the race .

Good to see drones being used ( Lancet ) for use by Rockets and artillery . Although Himars is mobile and will need laser homing by bomber aircraft . Also Odessa operation is best done by marine landing , using landing craft , instead of amphibious Tank operation across side River estuaries . On the other side of every Estuary is a Ukraininan with a weapon . Tanks are also much more expensive than landing craft . Once landing zone is cleared , a landing can take place and city taken . There won't be enough Harpoons to destroy hundreds of thousands of landing craft moving fast across water . No need for large landing craft ship carriers . The landing craft can go from Crimea direct to Odessa , on own power . Satellite info useless by yanks . Tactics have no defence . A force of 30,000 infantry can travel on 1000 landing craft . Cost per craft about £ 10000 . Total cost 10 billion , half the total daily cost of war for Russia .

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_craft

More Buryats on the move.
https://t.me/mapsukraine/1064

nomadski wrote:GarryB wrote " Why do you think it needs to be urgent? There is no rush... HATO was in Afghanistan for 20 years to save it and still failed, Russian has barely started... " we can not compare the two situations easily . Ukraine is near peer adversary , increasingly supported by NATO , and able , though with a little delay , to start using complex Rocket system . It is an industrial country with nuclear technology and satellite tech . Russia was not supporting the Taliban against America in Afghanistan with weapons at all , unlike America now supplying Ukraine , against Russia . In Afghanistan America needed a long war , to satisfy the MIC . Russia is not driven by MIC .


Also war is costing twenty billion Dollars per day for Russia . And many troops and possibly conscripts needed by Russia ; and further conscripts and using reserves were sanctioned recently . Huge cost of war , when reserves estimated at 650 billion USD . US alone spends ten times more on military , today heard they are sending some F16 . Did they think at first , send 777 or F16 ? No of course not . But they saw the slow pace , and lack of response , so they got hopeful and gathered around and built up the pressure slowly . They dream of a long proxy war . Weaken Russia and give it a boiling frog treatment . As I said , the side with the smaller resources , can not be the Turtle in the race .

Good to see drones being used ( Lancet ) for use by Rockets and artillery . Although Himars is mobile and will need laser homing by bomber aircraft . Also Odessa operation is best done by marine landing , using landing craft , instead of amphibious Tank operation across side River estuaries . On the other side of every Estuary is a Ukraininan with a weapon . Tanks are also much more expensive than landing craft . Once landing zone is cleared , a landing can take place and city taken . There won't be enough Harpoons to destroy hundreds of thousands of landing craft moving fast across water . No need for large landing craft ship carriers . The landing craft can go from Crimea direct to Odessa , on own power . Satellite info useless by yanks . Tactics have no defence . A force of 30,000 infantry can travel on 1000 landing craft . Cost per craft about £ 10000 . Total cost 10 billion , half the total daily cost of war for Russia .

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_craft

Maybe you want to check some of the numbers you quote again.

I've expected good news on Iranian drones, but it seems that some people in Russian MIC and MOD really go out of their way to stop that. Pity, as several hundred drones would speed up operation.

Belisarius wrote:More Buryats on the move.
https://t.me/mapsukraine/1064

T72B3 is in good supply

Not sure why limb questioned this evidenced by video in July of mass T72b3 movement

Ofc wishful thinking stipulates that T62 was for Russian forces, when the militia is better off using an easier platform for semi professional volunteers

caveat emptor wrote:I've expected good news on Iranian drones, but it seems that some people in Russian MIC and MOD really go out of their way to stop that. Pity, as several hundred drones would speed up operation.

There are tons of drones, everyday we see lancet and Kub used

What is the point of such a comment

Why would Russia a premier producer of drones , use Iranian systems which no serviceman is trained on?

The Russian army are professionally trained on domestic produced radio control modules and systems that are implemented across the forces and similar on systems like KUB, Lancet, Inokhodets, Orlan, and other such systems

The controls and interface also use not only similar controls, but similar terminology and Cyrillic abbreviations

So it makes no sense to do this

Arkanghelsk wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:I've expected good news on Iranian drones, but it seems that some people in Russian MIC and MOD really go out of their way to stop that. Pity, as several hundred drones would speed up operation.

There are tons of drones, everyday we see lancet and Kub used

What is the point of such a comment

Why would Russia a premier producer of drones , use Iranian systems which no serviceman is trained on?

The Russian army are professionally trained on domestic produced radio control modules and systems that are implemented across the forces and similar on systems like KUB, Lancet, Inokhodets, Orlan, and other such systems

The controls and interface also use not only similar controls, but similar terminology and Cyrillic abbreviations

So it makes no sense to do this

The footages of bigger drones like Orion or Forpost are sporadic. Very few have been released.

Armed one present in very low numbers. IMO less than 10. Orion is barely delivered and Forpost-R that can use weapon entered service not long ago.

Most of russian drones are orlan 10 and other very small zala uav.

Suicide drones are being used but again in low amount.

Russian are lagging behind in drones. Even if they have some good ones, they still lack numbers and strategy for them.

The factory for Orion was finished only this year, few mo.th ago so the production is not yet at full speed. They will also have to solve issues concerning importation and replacement of electronics. That may need a reengibeering of the drones.

Regular wrote:VDV even in Gostomel went in light, only with extra underwear, toothbrush and light mortars, ATGMs. BMD/Sprut would do nothing. Their light armour actually cause many avoidable attrition later on as they operated just like mech. infantry against much heavier and numerous enemy.

Buggies, quads, ATMGs, self loading mortars on light vehicles, light aa systems, helicopter support -  that’s what the boys need. Strongest part of VDV is their infantry and that should be focus. No point to have troops using BMD in Ukraine when BMP-2/3 is much better vehicle. Nona/vena on other hand… these are very nice systems

An example from the Second World War:


http://michalw.narod.ru/index-SynowieMazowsza.html


I think the specialty of the VDV should be to operate more like partisans or special forces troops.

Turning them into "light armor troops" might not be the most optimal thing to do.

Caveat emptor wrote " Maybe you want to check some of the numbers you quote again.:rofl:" well I quoted the high number ( on purpose ) , I found on internet . The low number I found was 400 million USD per day . Still not cheap . Perhaps the reserves number of 650 billion USD is reliable ? Still with lowest estimate , the war can be funded for a couple of years only . Remember foreign currency reserves were confiscated , amount of 350 billion ? And revenue from oil and gas and Gold export also less or at best the same . So still economic reason favours a short war . Only a careless person would aim for a long war . You plan for a shortest war . But misfortune may extend the war .

I know there's a website trying to keep track of Russian equipment losses, but what about Ukrainian ones? I heard there was one doing both? Does anyone know of any? Thanks!

46 oambr and 18 obmp - today these units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine will be missing about a hundred fighters.

They tried to break through the river Ingulets, they were killed.

We also note that the Armed Forces of Ukraine continue to increase the personnel in the industrial department of Nikolaev.

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Asshole hohols launched a bonzai charge into kherson

Fucking disastrous

This banderite fanaticism is unreal

Ark wrote " The controls and interface also use not only similar controls, but similar terminology and Cyrillic abbreviations " the point of obtaining Iranian drones , goes beyond immediate military advantages . It allows Iran and Russia to increase military cooperation that may increase in the future . The Russians ordered some French ships recently . They could have made these themselves . But considerations are of a bigger  political  nature . Writing on controls are not a problem .

dionis wrote " I know there's a website trying to keep track of Russian equipment losses, but what about Ukrainian ones? I heard there was one doing both? Does anyone know of any? Thanks! " the Nazi regime should be seen as a proxy of NATO . Therefore losses of NATO should be calculated compared to their economy or reserves of military budget .

Arkanghelsk wrote:

There are tons of drones, everyday we see lancet and Kub used

What is the point of such a comment

Why would Russia a premier producer of drones , use Iranian systems which no serviceman is trained on?

The Russian army are professionally trained on domestic produced radio control modules and systems that are implemented across the forces and similar on systems like KUB, Lancet, Inokhodets, Orlan, and other such systems

The controls and interface also use not only similar controls, but similar terminology and Cyrillic abbreviations

So it makes no sense to do this

Point is that they dont have enough medium and heavy recon and strike platforms. And Iranian drones would be a quick and fast solutions untill they can ramp up enough domestic platforms.

nomadski wrote:


Caveat emptor wrote " Maybe you want to check some of the numbers you quote again." well I quoted the high number ( on purpose )  , I found on internet . The low number I found was 400 million USD per day . Still not cheap . Perhaps the reserves number of 650 billion USD is reliable ? Still with lowest estimate , the war can be funded for a couple of years only . Remember foreign currency reserves were confiscated , amount of 350 billion ? And revenue from oil and gas and Gold export also less or at best the same . So still economic reason favours a short war . Only a careless person would aim for a long war . You plan for a shortest war . But misfortune may extend the war .

I agree. I hope that war won't take longer than a year or, at most, 18 months. They can put that money to better use.

Arkanghelsk wrote:
There are tons of drones, everyday we see lancet and Kub used

What is the point of such a comment

Another point is that there were plenty signals lately that drone industry isn't close to where it should be. First thing Manturov commented on, when he was appointed on new function, Putin's comments on Rostec, etc.
You're Russian. Try to find and read all the **** up around Altius drone that happened over the last decade and money wasted.

Some people here act same way as Ukrainians. This war showed that Russian army has shortcomings and then you acknowledge them and rectify. Not pretend they don't exist and thump your chests. Leave that to Ukrainians.

Russia is testing some new toys
it seems that they are 9М544 & 9М549 300mm guided rocket with 120km range.

https://t.me/milinfolive/87457

I don't know where ISOS got his info about "10 orion"

Johninmk showed 50 Orion were already in service

Thats enough for more than several wars

So where is the drone shortage?

Again it's not a lack of equipment , people said this, then Kremlin launched thousands of missiles in 1 week

Simply the military already has intel from other sources and has not considered necessary to increase the kind of drone missions that some are saying Russia needs to do

I trust the MOD and General Staff in their assessments

After all, they make decisions, not us

sepheronx wrote:

The Russians are rectifying, hence why they now have 3 shift production for Orion drones at the new plant. Then of course Orlan and others.

I suppose the Orion could act double as a heavier observation drone too while Russia waits.

Although, maybe localize production of some heavier Iranian drones would have been better than forpost localized production.

I was thinking about purchasing most suited platforms and testing them in real war conditions. Iranians have been using drones extensively for 2 decades already. If they perform better than analog Russian platforms maybe choose to purchase manufacturing license. Also, that would solve short term needs at the front.

This was one post Johninmk has the Kronstadt post where it shows over 50 Orions in service

So idk where there is a drone shortage

Some Americans know that HIMARS is not any sort of wonder weapon.

Whydid the Russian MOD habe no problems with license producing an Israeli drone, but theyre so apprehensive qbout using iranian drones? Is there a jew lobby trying to firce russian soldiers not to use Iranian weapons?

Why was the Russian MoD also ok with buying canon cameras for the orlan?