Russian special military operation in Ukraine #44

Arrow wrote:       So for a clown

Arkanghelsk wrote:It's not over yet, there will have to be a sanitation zone, and thousands of more guys will die in the coming offensives

Hopefully Ukraine has been hurt enough by bakhmut  and this offensive that there won't be that much in the way of attacking forces

But judging by South Africa, Egypt, and other smaller states reactions, pressure increases on Putin

Algeria was friendly enough,  but overall they have embarrassed him by demanding an end to the war

What was good is that Russia did not capitulate, but the war party has been strengthened enough to overpower Peskov , Putin, and the other doves

Peskov will be ridiculed by the hawks , and Putin will be confronted behind closed doors to speed things up

Even Shoigu and Gerasimov cannot continue to be blamed for the lack of political will

The grain deal will end, and like a domino effect, pressure will increase on Putin to speed things up, because of the inflationary pressures that will fall on those states most affected by the grain deal

Specifically African and Asian states

Either way Ukraine est delenda and that is a good thing

tass wrote:ST. PETERSBURG, June 17. /TASS/. African countries stand for the indivisibility of global security, and Russia backs this principled position, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said on Saturday after Russian President Vladimir Putin’s meeting with an African peace mission.

"First of all, they (African countries - TASS) highlighted China’s well-known twelve points, which were presented a couple of months ago, and they highlighted those parts of that Chinese initiative that are close to them and that stipulate that there no double standards in the world, that all the principles of the UN Charter in their integrity and correlation are respected and implemented, that there are no unilateral sanctions, that there are no attempts to ensure someone’s security at the expense of others, that security is indivisible on a global scale. They are the principled attitudes that we share," he said.

Lavrov also pointed out that African countries have shown an understanding of the root causes of the Ukraine crisis, "which was created by the West’s efforts".

"They have shown an understanding that this situation has to be resolved by grappling with those root causes, by working out specific real actions to eliminate the causes that are undermining and have been undermining fair security in Europe throughout many years," the Russian foreign minister said.

The African peace mission has brought together South African President Cyril Ramaphosa, President of the Comoros Azali Assoumani, Senegal’s President Macky Sall, Zambia’s President Hakainde Hichilema, as well as Egypt’s Prime Minister Mostafa Madbouly and Florent Ntsiba and Ruhakana Rugunda, special envoys of the presidents of the Republic of the Congo and Uganda respectively. On June 16, the mission visited Kiev, where they held talks with Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky. On June 17, the African delegation held a meeting with Putin in St. Petersburg, where they outlined their initiative.

tass wrote:ST. PETERSBURG, June 17. /TASS/. Russian President Vladimir Putin showed the initialed draft agreement with Ukraine, which was drawn up in March 2022 in Istanbul, to leaders and representatives of several African countries at their meeting on Saturday.

"I would like to draw your attention to the fact that with [Turkish] President [Tayyip] Erdogan’s assistance, as you know, a string of talks between Russia and Ukraine took place in Turkey so as to work out both the confidence-building measures you mentioned, and to draw up the text of the agreement. We did not discuss with the Ukrainian side that this treaty would be classified, but we have never presented it, nor commented on it. This draft agreement was initialed by the head of the Kiev negotiation team. He put his signature there. Here it is," the Russian president said showing the paper to the African delegation.

Arkanghelsk wrote:Russia does not see any chance of extending the Black Sea Grain Initiative, which has facilitated the safe export of Ukrainian grain, Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov said Saturday.

"It's hardly possible to predict any final decision here, but I can say that judging de facto by the status quo that we have, this deal has no chance," Peskov told the Russian news outlet Izvestia in footage posted on its Telegram channel.

Meanwhile, Russian President Vladimir Putin told African leaders that exports of Ukrainian grain under a deal ensuring its safe passage through the Black Sea is not helping to resolve Africa's problems with high global food prices as only 3% have gone to the poorest countries.


Given this, is it safe to say, the VMF will blockade Odessa again?

How will the VMF assert itself to block Odessa and Nikolayev? Prevent the drones from attacking naval ships?

The VMF could use a rehabilitation of its reputation

Podlodka77 wrote:As much as I criticize the inefficiency of Russian shipbuilding, what is happening in the West is a disaster.
Military Spending by Country; Britain 68 billion dollars, Germany 55.8 billion and France 53.6 billion.
I wonder what for ?

Most importantly, I wonder how big a military budget those countries need to produce attack helicopters, tanks, howitzers, air defense systems, MLRS systems, etc.
They have a decent navy and a decent air force and that is all, but there are flaws like the UK with Type-45 destroyers.
The military-industrial complexes of those countries charge a fortune for their products but the armies of those countries do not have what they really need.
Somehow it all seems inflated to me...

The Kriegsmarine or German Navy has 6 submarines, 11 frigates and 4 corvettes.
The German Luftwaffe has a total of about 400 aircraft - in total.. Slightly more than half of the total number are Eurofighter and Tornado.
The ground forces have a total of 290 tanks, 100+ howitzers and just over 700 IFVs.
There are also a few air defense systems, as well as other vehicles, but it's all miserable..
And for this, the Germans allocate over 50 billion dollars ?

Arkanghelsk wrote:There is video of Ramaphosa and what he said, so I stand by it

Will the end of the grain deal force them to stand with Russia? Or will they, as Egypt already does, take a harder position with the west?

Noone needs South Africa, and in principle you are right, noone cares if Sisi and Ramaphosa issues some demands

But if today it was them, and tomorrow it is Xi?

This is why now both Peskov and Putin are talking about sanitation zones btw

I thought there was no need for it? It seems things reached the top, first slowly, then suddenly

But the tone has changed and noone can deny it

ALAMO wrote:Wartburg wouldn't either bro

Hole wrote:"...And experienced officers (ours) are shocked by what they saw today. They have never seen such a massacre (according to them), and such a disregard for the life of their soldiers (on the part of the Armed Forces of Ukraine)..."

Kiko wrote:Former deputy of Rada Kiva claims that the head of intelligence of Ukraine Budanov has died, 06.17.2023.

Former deputy of the Verkhovna Rada Ilya Kiva, citing his own sources, said that the head of the Ukrainian military intelligence, Kirill Budanov, had died.

“Budanov died without regaining consciousness,” the information came from the Ukrainian Embassy in Germany. A source in the OP said, ” Kiva said.

At the same time, the ex-deputy believes that this information in Kyiv will be hidden for as long as possible.

On June 15, RIA Novosti reported, citing a source, that Budanov  was wounded  on May 29 during an attack by Russian troops on a Ukrainian intelligence building. 

According to the agency, after that Budanov was taken in a serious condition to the Bundeswehr hospital in Berlin, where he stayed until mid-June.

On June 16, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said that Budanov allegedly attended a meeting of the military cabinet on June 16.

https://russian.rt.com/ussr/news/1163289-kiva-razvedka-budanov

Arkanghelsk wrote:Specifically African and Asian states