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98 posters
MiG-31BM/Κ Interceptor/Attack aircraft: News
George1- Posts : 18523
Points : 19028
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
Big_Gazza- Posts : 4901
Points : 4891
Join date : 2014-08-25
Location : Melbourne, Australia
Interesting pic! 
New propulsion system based on nuclear air-bursts?
Anti-AAM defensive aid?
Emerging from a newly opened warp-gate?
New propulsion system based on nuclear air-bursts?
Anti-AAM defensive aid?
Emerging from a newly opened warp-gate?
mnztr
mnztr- Posts : 2900
Points : 2938
Join date : 2018-01-21
Any good videos of night or dusk takeoff with full afterburner? 31's are awesome. Such a brutally practical design with such a unique capability.
archangelski- Posts : 624
Points : 641
Join date : 2015-04-25
Launching "Kinzhal" ASM missile : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mn32aOTECE0&feature=youtu.be
d_taddei2- Posts : 3028
Points : 3202
Join date : 2013-05-11
Location : Scotland Alba
Syria could be a good test of this missile.
GarryB- Posts : 40553
Points : 41055
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
... no... landing even fragments of the weapon will lead to them ending up in US hands within days...
Keep this weapon away from western intel and just make them sweat...
In fact make fake flawed parts and give them to locals in Russia to sell to the CIA for a few dollars... the CIA gets hold of them, some Russians make some money and the west becomes convinced that these weapons are fake and not real... so that when it comes time to use them they totally underestimate them and get their asses handed to them on a plate.
Keep this weapon away from western intel and just make them sweat...
In fact make fake flawed parts and give them to locals in Russia to sell to the CIA for a few dollars... the CIA gets hold of them, some Russians make some money and the west becomes convinced that these weapons are fake and not real... so that when it comes time to use them they totally underestimate them and get their asses handed to them on a plate.
mnztr- Posts : 2900
Points : 2938
Join date : 2018-01-21
GarryB wrote:... no... landing even fragments of the weapon will lead to them ending up in US hands within days...
Keep this weapon away from western intel and just make them sweat...
In fact make fake flawed parts and give them to locals in Russia to sell to the CIA for a few dollars... the CIA gets hold of them, some Russians make some money and the west becomes convinced that these weapons are fake and not real... so that when it comes time to use them they totally underestimate them and get their asses handed to them on a plate.
As an anti ship missile with 2000 km range and mach 10 capability this missile would render carriers obsolete. It pretty much has the same capability as the Chinese DF-21 but is much cheaper and can be launched in much greater numbers.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
Points : 13512
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
mnztr wrote:........
As an anti ship missile with 2000 km range and mach 10 capability this missile would render carriers obsolete. It pretty much has the same capability as the Chinese DF-21 but is much cheaper and can be launched in much greater numbers.
This missile renders the very concept of surface navy in major war obsolete, not just carriers.
Everyone is gawking and ranting about that nuclear powered missile and they all ignore the fact that Kinzhal just redefined entire modern warfare.
This article says as much:
The Implications of Russia's New Weapon Systems
http://www.unz.com/article/the-implications-of-russias-new-weapons/
Long story short, USA (based on conventional superiority) might be tempted to go into direct conflict with Russia not just under assumption that ABM would work (it won't) but also because they could expect that Russia will refrain from using nukes even if losing a conventional war because using nukes is still horrifying proposition.
But with Kinzhal in play even non-nuclear war becomes unacceptably dangerous idea because they would be risking their entire surface fleet against cheap and hard to track airplanes. Battleship vs carrier situation of WW2 only this time it's both carriers and, more importantly, large surface ships that have become obsolete (they were there already with Zircon but Kinzhal just accelerated process massively)
mnztr- Posts : 2900
Points : 2938
Join date : 2018-01-21
Its quite funny how the western press and Russian dissidents are claiming Putin is trying to terrify western people. As a western citizen I am not terrified by him but more by Trump and the lunatics that think a war with Russia can somehow be won. The reality is that the entire US concept of carrier groups and layered defense is now obsolete and the hundreds of billions in investment have been rendered obsolete. The combat radius of the F-18 E is just not sufficient to defend the against a TU-22 or Mig 31 with this missile. If TU-22 can launch 3 of these 7 TU-22s will wipe out a carrier group. If they coordinate with a sub launching Tsirkon it will be pretty impossible to defend. Personally I don't mind the US navy, they can and often have been a force for good and open navigation. But the real threat from Russia is if the US intimidates their allys like Iran, they may just provide a few of these to their friends.
Isos- Posts : 11603
Points : 11571
Join date : 2015-11-06
mnztr wrote:Its quite funny how the western press and Russian dissidents are claiming Putin is trying to terrify western people. As a western citizen I am not terrified by him but more by Trump and the lunatics that think a war with Russia can somehow be won. The reality is that the entire US concept of carrier groups and layered defense is now obsolete and the hundreds of billions in investment have been rendered obsolete. The combat radius of the F-18 E is just not sufficient to defend the against a TU-22 or Mig 31 with this missile. If TU-22 can launch 3 of these 7 TU-22s will wipe out a carrier group. If they coordinate with a sub launching Tsirkon it will be pretty impossible to defend. Personally I don't mind the US navy, they can and often have been a force for good and open navigation. But the real threat from Russia is if the US intimidates their allys like Iran, they may just provide a few of these to their friends.
The most stupid thing they did is replace f-14/Phoenix by f-18/amraam. Against bombers and cruise missile they have no more tools to defend carriers.
If russia get a carrier they will have to put a fighter able to lunch r-37 missile.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
Points : 13512
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
mnztr wrote:.........The reality is that the entire US concept of carrier groups and layered defense is now obsolete and the hundreds of billions in investment have been rendered obsolete. The combat radius of the F-18 E is just not sufficient to defend the against a TU-22 or Mig 31 with this missile..........
Agreed
Combat radius of F-18E is 720km.
Kinzhal has 2000km range. Also with Mach 10 speed you have nightmare scenario. And this is just first version of that thing, they will be improving it over years to come.
And with MiG-31 having combat radius of 1400km you end up with situation where ship can be sunk by off-the-shelf fighter jet stationed 3400km away.
There is no way to keep any ship in one piece in that scenario. MiG-31 from Kamchatka can sink a vessel parked off port Anchorage. It's insanity.
Surface navies are done.
miketheterrible- Posts : 7383
Points : 7341
Join date : 2016-11-06
- Post n°537
Re: MiG-31BM/Κ Interceptor/Attack aircraft: News
miketheterrible Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:23 pm
PapaDragon wrote:mnztr wrote:.........The reality is that the entire US concept of carrier groups and layered defense is now obsolete and the hundreds of billions in investment have been rendered obsolete. The combat radius of the F-18 E is just not sufficient to defend the against a TU-22 or Mig 31 with this missile..........
Agreed
Combat radius of F-18E is 720km.
Kinzhal has 2000km range. Also with Mach 10 speed you have nightmare scenario. And this is just first version of that thing, they will be improving it over years to come.
And with MiG-31 having combat radius of 1400km you end up with situation where ship can be sunk by off-the-shelf fighter jet stationed 3400km away.
There is no way to keep any ship in one piece in that scenario. MiG-31 from Kamchatka can sink a vessel parked off port Anchorage. It's insanity.
Surface navies are done.
Go to keypub. They say that Aster,SM-2 and everything the US had since 1980's can shoot this thing down. Lol
mnztr- Posts : 2900
Points : 2938
Join date : 2018-01-21
Isos wrote:mnztr wrote:Its quite funny how the western press and Russian dissidents are claiming Putin is trying to terrify western people. As a western citizen I am not terrified by him but more by Trump and the lunatics that think a war with Russia can somehow be won. The reality is that the entire US concept of carrier groups and layered defense is now obsolete and the hundreds of billions in investment have been rendered obsolete. The combat radius of the F-18 E is just not sufficient to defend the against a TU-22 or Mig 31 with this missile. If TU-22 can launch 3 of these 7 TU-22s will wipe out a carrier group. If they coordinate with a sub launching Tsirkon it will be pretty impossible to defend. Personally I don't mind the US navy, they can and often have been a force for good and open navigation. But the real threat from Russia is if the US intimidates their allys like Iran, they may just provide a few of these to their friends.
The most stupid thing they did is replace f-14/Phoenix by f-18/amraam. Against bombers and cruise missile they have no more tools to defend carriers.
If russia get a carrier they will have to put a fighter able to lunch r-37 missile.
I think Russia made carriers obsolete. I think they will project power is heavily armed subs in the future. If they build carriers I doubt they will be very large.
mnztr- Posts : 2900
Points : 2938
Join date : 2018-01-21
miketheterrible wrote:PapaDragon wrote:mnztr wrote:.........The reality is that the entire US concept of carrier groups and layered defense is now obsolete and the hundreds of billions in investment have been rendered obsolete. The combat radius of the F-18 E is just not sufficient to defend the against a TU-22 or Mig 31 with this missile..........
Agreed
Combat radius of F-18E is 720km.
Kinzhal has 2000km range. Also with Mach 10 speed you have nightmare scenario. And this is just first version of that thing, they will be improving it over years to come.
And with MiG-31 having combat radius of 1400km you end up with situation where ship can be sunk by off-the-shelf fighter jet stationed 3400km away.
There is no way to keep any ship in one piece in that scenario. MiG-31 from Kamchatka can sink a vessel parked off port Anchorage. It's insanity.
Surface navies are done.
Go to keypub. They say that Aster,SM-2 and everything the US had since 1980's can shoot this thing down. Lol
They may be able to shot one down, but this is why it has a very steep trajectory. When it is hit by a sam, you pretty much get a mach 10 shotgun blast. In either case the interception problem is much harder then the ABM tests they have done as this one can maneuver and probably release decoys and be ripple fired. Its a very difficult problem to counter.
GarryB- Posts : 40553
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Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
Of course the US navy is not really about WWIII... it has very little to actually do for WWIII because lets face it the idea that Russian invasion by a massive tank army reaching the English Channel only to be forced back by the good old yanks arriving in huge numbers to push them back is not going to happen... WWIII is going to be a small flash point that sets off strategic nuclear war and then armies and navies and airforces will be destroyed where ever they are... without having much effect either way.
The US Navys greatest value is in peace time and limited conflict, giving the US and her allies unmolested access to the world via the worlds oceans and seas... and also the US military very rapid air power to any place while the land forces are built up and land bases nearby are negotiated.
Some people over estimate navies like they over estimate air forces...
Like the Seawolf can shoot down Exocets right?
The US Navys greatest value is in peace time and limited conflict, giving the US and her allies unmolested access to the world via the worlds oceans and seas... and also the US military very rapid air power to any place while the land forces are built up and land bases nearby are negotiated.
Some people over estimate navies like they over estimate air forces...
They say that Aster,SM-2 and everything the US had since 1980's can shoot this thing down. Lol
Like the Seawolf can shoot down Exocets right?
medo- Posts : 4343
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Join date : 2010-10-24
Location : Slovenia
RuAF MiG-31BM armed with Kinzhal missiles.
George1- Posts : 18523
Points : 19028
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
George1- Posts : 18523
Points : 19028
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
MiG-31BM 90 Red with Kinzhal air-to-surface missile. Probably snapped during the Victory Day flyover rehearsal over Moscow.
George1- Posts : 18523
Points : 19028
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
MiG-31BMs launch R-73s. A couple of day ago 2 squadrons of MiG-31BMs & Su-27SMs w/790th Fighter Aviation Regiment(IAP) were transferred fr. Khotilovo-2,ZVO,to Privolzhskiy,YuVO,to partake in exercise above Ashuluk-Su-27SMs vs simulated fighter targets & MiG-31BMs vs simulated SAMs
https://twitter.com/Russian_Defence/status/986337819386961920
https://twitter.com/Russian_Defence/status/986337819386961920
George1- Posts : 18523
Points : 19028
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
MiG-31BM 92 Red with Kinzhal air-to-surface missile on the center-line hard-points. Re; our previous assertion-it appears not to utilize R-33's (Izdeliye 410 /NATO AA-9 Amos) AKU-410 panto-graphic ejector racks,at least in their original state.
Note the white missile & fairing coating
https://twitter.com/Russian_Defence/status/987733477972996097
Note the white missile & fairing coating
https://twitter.com/Russian_Defence/status/987733477972996097
AMCXXL- Posts : 1018
Points : 1018
Join date : 2017-08-08
George1 wrote:MiG-31BM 92 Red with Kinzhal air-to-surface missile on the center-line hard-points. Re; our previous assertion-it appears not to utilize R-33's (Izdeliye 410 /NATO AA-9 Amos) AKU-410 panto-graphic ejector racks,at least in their original state.
Note the white missile & fairing coating
https://twitter.com/Russian_Defence/status/987733477972996097
Hello again !!!!
Nº90 , 91 , 92 , 93 , 94 , 95 ARE NOT MIG-31BM
Only can be BM the modernized B/BS versions
DZ cannot be upgraded to a BM versión , even if had "B" versión radars enough, because the inner structure of the MiG-31DZ
Nº90 RF-95215
Nº92 RF-95217
Both MIG-31DZ ex-22IAP, the other are also DZ.
All the MiG-31B upgraded to MiG-31BM was modernized between 2008 and 2013 (about 45).and also all of these had two pilons under each wig¡ng before the modernization
This versión with "Kinzhal" missiles only a repaired MiG-31DZ with improvement for use the Kinzhal missile
This versión MiG-31DZ-Kinzhal have not the two pilons under the wings, and also have not an antenna just before the forward landing gear
This airplanes are not part of VVS today, in the tail have "VKS Russia"
Probably this will be part of strategic forces or space forces
For the year end is planned to complete one squadron
Last edited by AMCXXL on Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:38 am; edited 1 time in total
Hole- Posts : 11122
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Join date : 2018-03-24
Age : 48
Location : Scholzistan
Maybe we should call it MiG-31K. Like the missilce carrier versions of the Tu16, Tu-22 and so on.
Long-range Bombers and space Forces are part of the VKS.
Long-range Bombers and space Forces are part of the VKS.
GarryB- Posts : 40553
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White missiles would be dummies for drag and weight approximations.
Hole- Posts : 11122
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Join date : 2018-03-24
Age : 48
Location : Scholzistan
It seems my speculation was right. According to Zvezda and Sputnik defence Minister Shoigu called the Kinzhal carrier MiG-31K.
George1- Posts : 18523
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Location : Greece
Hole wrote:It seems my speculation was right. According to Zvezda and Sputnik defence Minister Shoigu called the Kinzhal carrier MiG-31K.
Yes. http://tass.com/defense/1002757