Project 22160 Bykov-class patrol ship

Welcome to the word little one  

Definitely a handsome modern looking ship
Mast on the stern for transport downstream to Black Sea?

hoom wrote:Definitely a handsome modern looking ship
Mast on the stern for transport downstream to Black Sea?

Problem is that I don't see any slots or covers for AA systems behind the gun. Are they even installed or planned?

Could be just photograph though...

Well thats the million dollar question.

I actually don't think its got them.
Its only very recently we've seen those pics showing VLS, none of the models (CGI or physical) actually have them & I don't believe any official statements said there would actually be VLS.

PapaDragon wrote:

hoom wrote:Definitely a handsome modern looking ship
Mast on the stern for transport downstream to Black Sea?

Problem is that I don't see any slots or covers for AA systems behind the gun. Are they even installed or planned?

Could be just photograph though...

It's not going to have any SAM systems, the point of this ship is the same as the, for instance, the Italian Comandanti class, a large patrol/corvette ship for long range patrolling and territorial water control, for that a god universal gun, machineguns (or 20/25 mm guns) and a helicopter is all it needs, this is never meant to be a proper fighting ship, the only thing that sets it apart from the rest are Kalibr launchers and when that is counted in, it has much more firepower than anything else in the same class.  

Other than it's primary purpose the second thing it will achieve that is important is that the larger frigates, heavy missiles corvette or anything bigger will no longer have to waste it's resources on "simple" paroling missions but they will be used for what they are build for, actual combat missions and patrols.  

The reason I say this is not a real combat ship is it cant perform escort missions, and by escort and don't mean pirate and terrorist speed boat defense, I mean, air defense. Any ship in order to perform a real escort mission needs to handle two out of the tree main threats (surface, subsurface and air), currently the 22160 can launch Onix or Kalibr anti ship missiles and that is awesome, but a 76 mm gun is not and adequate AA defense.

If it only had a Pantsir (or similar) module that would make all the difference in the world, that would make it a long range Karakut with a helicopter.

They could have put in a AK-630M2 Duet on a raised platform behind the main gun, at least, still don't get why not put a pair of AK-630 (they will scare away any sped boat).

Personally, given the state of the RF I think it's foolish to make a 94m ship and not make it a "real" combat ship.

hoom wrote:Definitely a handsome modern looking ship
Mast on the stern for transport downstream to Black Sea?

Is it possible that both the 22160 and the Buyan will be fitted out in Zaliv, Kerch shipyard, one more 22160 is already there (or maybe 2).

The Buyan already started the transition, as far as I can tell it already has all the parts ready.

PapaDragon wrote:
Welcome to the word little one   

Little one

... even though that Buyan-M is dwarfed by it.

Looking cool BTW, will look even better at sea.

Armament:

1 Ka-27PS helicopter
9K338 «Igla-S» SAM system (8 9M342 missiles)
1x1 76 mm AK-176MA
2x1 14,5 mm MTPU
2x10 55 mm DP-65 grenade launchers (RG-55M, GRS-55 grenades)
?x2 45 mm DP-64 grenade launchers (SG-45, FG-45 grenades)

Can carry container mounted SSM or SAM in a rear compartment.

franco wrote:Armament:

1 Ka-27PS helicopter
9K338 «Igla-S» SAM system (8 9M342 missiles)
1x1 76 mm AK-176MA
2x1 14,5 mm MTPU
2x10 55 mm DP-65 grenade launchers (RG-55M, GRS-55 grenades)
?x2 45 mm DP-64 grenade launchers (SG-45, FG-45 grenades)

Can carry container mounted SSM or SAM in a rear compartment.

No Shtil or Redut? That's a massive downgrade from what as advertised.

So basically it's a Buyan-M with two months endurance.

kvs wrote:

franco wrote:Armament:

1 Ka-27PS helicopter
9K338 «Igla-S» SAM system (8 9M342 missiles)
1x1 76 mm AK-176MA
2x1 14,5 mm MTPU
2x10 55 mm DP-65 grenade launchers (RG-55M, GRS-55 grenades)
?x2 45 mm DP-64 grenade launchers (SG-45, FG-45 grenades)

Can carry container mounted SSM or SAM in a rear compartment.

Source for this speculation?

http://russianships.info/eng/today/

No Shtil or Redut? That's a massive downgrade from what as advertised.

They only advertised Shtil-1 as an option on the Export version.
Francos' list is pretty much the standard list of armament I've seen.

Its been speculation on our part that they'd up-arm it with permanent SAM/UKSK due to the current political situation.

hoom wrote:

No Shtil or Redut? That's a massive downgrade from what as advertised.

They only advertised Shtil-1 as an option on the Export version.
Francos' list is pretty much the standard list of armament I've seen.

Its been speculation on our part that they'd up-arm it with permanent SAM/UKSK due to the current political situation.

If that is the case then this ship better be cheap because time invested alone is not worth it.

kvs wrote:Source for this speculation?

It could be for only first of the class?

No ak-630?

marat wrote:No ak-630?

They were never planned

Absence of AA missiles is much bigger issue

This is what a jobs program looks like. Congrats Russia, you've made it to the club along with western navies (think German, RN, USN and so on) receiving vessels for glorified Coast Guard duty.

It's basically not armed, but sure as hell looks mean
RN's River class is now officially jealous and the Germans feel less stupid with their F125s.

KiloGolf wrote:This is what a jobs program looks like. Congrats Russia, you've made it to the club along with western navies (think German, RN, USN and so on) receiving vessels for glorified Coast Guard duty.

It's basically not armed, but sure as hell looks mean
RN's River class is now officially jealous and the Germans feel less stupid with their F125s.

Uh? It's in the name: it´s an OPV, not a self-styled "frigate" like the F125 (and much smaller).

Also, it is remarkable that in your list of under armed piece of crap ships you forgot the god old LCS... that's what I call good value for money

KiloGolf wrote:This is what a jobs program looks like. Congrats Russia, you've made it to the club along with western navies (think German, RN, USN and so on) receiving vessels for glorified Coast Guard duty.

It's basically not armed, but sure as hell looks mean
RN's River class is now officially jealous and the Germans feel less stupid with their F125s.

Well not that bad. It will spend most, if not all service life patroaling to search for fishing boats. Russia, if I'm not wrong, has a big problem with illegal fishing in its waters.

Biggest assholes of that are Japanese, north Korean and Chinese fishermen.

Although, the ships used by FSB seemed fine enough. I guess the FSB will be using these then too.

Although, these ships can be fitted with containers of Kalibr missiles, which gives them the ability to strike targets far away. Pretty impressive for an anti fisherman ship.

I think that the options available for this ship weren't installed or purchased. They may find it difficult to understand their purpose. But then buyan-M would have been overkill.

SLB wrote:

KiloGolf wrote:This is what a jobs program looks like. Congrats Russia, you've made it to the club along with western navies (think German, RN, USN and so on) receiving vessels for glorified Coast Guard duty.

It's basically not armed, but sure as hell looks mean
RN's River class is now officially jealous and the Germans feel less stupid with their F125s.

Uh? It's in the name: it´s an OPV, not a self-styled "frigate" like the F125 (and much smaller).

Also, it is remarkable that in your list of under armed piece of crap ships you forgot the god old LCS... that's what I call good value for money

Go ahead and add LCS, sure.

Isos wrote:

KiloGolf wrote:This is what a jobs program looks like. Congrats Russia, you've made it to the club along with western navies (think German, RN, USN and so on) receiving vessels for glorified Coast Guard duty.

It's basically not armed, but sure as hell looks mean
RN's River class is now officially jealous and the Germans feel less stupid with their F125s.

Well not that bad. It will spend most, if not all service life patroaling to search for fishing boats. Russia, if I'm not wrong, has a big problem with illegal fishing in its waters.

I thought that was FSB's job, why waste RuN's budget on stuff like that?

Shtil is probably too much for a 1500T ship.
The naval TOR or the new 9M100 missiles shown at MAKS-2017 are more likely.

These ships were never supposed to be actual warships, more as LACM platforms like Buyans in case of war but still, such anemic AA is a missed opportunity.

They will definitely get the mileage out of them. With 60 days endurance they will be able to cover East Africa and Central Pacific/Atlantic with two of them, use other two to cover Russia's coastal region and keep two other in maintenance or on diplomatic tours and visits.  

This will free up proper warships for proper naval duties instead of pirate/poacher/PR and other nonsense. But they need to slap together rest of them fast and then free up Zelenodolsk for construction of proper naval corvettes.

Let's just hope that end price is not idiotic.

PapaDragon wrote:
These ships were never supposed to be actual warships, more as LACM platforms like Buyans in case of war but still, such anemic AA is a missed opportunity.

They will definitely get the mileage out of them. With 60 days endurance they will be able to cover East Africa and Central Pacific/Atlantic with two of them, use other two to cover Russia's coastal region and keep two other in maintenance or on diplomatic tours and visits.  

This will free up proper warships for proper naval duties instead of pirate/poacher/PR and other nonsense. But they need to slap together rest of them fast and then free up Zelenodolsk for construction of proper naval corvettes.

Let's just hope that end price is not idiotic.

I agree that those Gibkas are laughable for a ship of this size, but let's hope that they will have at least a naval Tor or Pantsir-ME. Pictures in various previous posts in this thread indicate that these ships will be modular, multi-mission vessels, and they can carry a wide range of weapons, so such SHORAD systems should not be ruled out.

Indeed, they would be useful to free up some corvettes patrolling Russia's littoral waters, or frigates/destroyers in anti-piracy operations for example in the Gulf of Aden or basically anywhere.

TheArmenian wrote:Shtil is probably too much for a 1500T ship.
The naval TOR or the new 9M100 missiles shown at MAKS-2017 are more likely.

I have read it from some sources that those containers placed behind the heliport could be used to launch Shtil SAMs.

That container space can also carry the new BK-16's and BK-10's for interdiction and special operations.

http://nevskii-bastion.ru/bk-16/