Home
Latest images
Register
Log in
Thanks
+55
Singular_Transform
Big_Gazza
The-thing-next-door
flamming_python
ZoA
slasher
SLB
T-47
Benya
Rowdyhorse4
Mindstorm
Rodion_Romanovic
Vann7
hoom
KiloGolf
PapaDragon
miketheterrible
TheArmenian
GarryB
Tsavo Lion
Kimppis
Rmf
Isos
eehnie
marat
SeigSoloyvov
JohninMK
Airman
ATLASCUB
AlfaT8
miroslav
humphuy
Viktor
Dennis_3003
DB1234
Skandalwitwe
par far
Luq man
magnumcromagnon
Ned86
zg18
zardof
Shadåw
A1RMAN
Honesroc
George1
franco
Project Canada
OminousSpudd
VladimirSahin
kvs
Austin
eridan
GunshipDemocracy
Singular_trafo
59 posters
Russian Navy: Status & News #3
PapaDragon- Posts : 13467
Points : 13507
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
Isos- Posts : 11598
Points : 11566
Join date : 2015-11-07
PapaDragon wrote:Thanks
Every navy has one of these boat. Training torpedos are exactly the same as real ones so if they don't recover them someone, like US navy will get them and learn everything about them because they don't explode and can sustain intact at least at 1000m under the sea.
Benya- Posts : 526
Points : 528
Join date : 2016-06-05
Location : Budapest, Hungary
Northern Fleet announces big-scale exercise
It will include about 50 vessels and is held as a preparatory phase to the upcoming «Zapad-2017» drills.
Ships set out from Northern Fleet headquarters in Severomorsk. Photo: mil.ru
The Northern Fleet, the most powerful of Russia’s five fleets, is unfolding a special exercise which includes key parts of fleet capacities.
The drills will be headed directly by Russian Navy Head Commander Vladimir Korolyev and will last «for several days», the Northern Fleet informs.
Included are about 50 ships, submarines and support vessels. Also aircrafts, helicopters from the Air Force and Air Defense will be deployed, a Navy representative says to Interfax.
The drills are held as several of the most powerful Northern Fleet vessels are on their way home after participation in a Navy parade outside St.Petersburg. Among them are battle cruiser «Pyotr Veliky» and typhoon-class submarine «Dmitry Donskoy».
It is likely that the returning vessels will take part in the exercise.
In the course of the training, antisubmarine and anti-sabotage activities will be conducted along with navigational, hydrographical, anti-mine and search and rescue operations.
According to the Navy representatives, the exercise is held as a preparatory phase to the large-scale joint Russian-Belarus drills «Zapad-2017» scheduled for the period 14-20 September.
https://thebarentsobserver.com/en/security/2017/08/northern-fleet-announces-big-scale-exercise
It will include about 50 vessels and is held as a preparatory phase to the upcoming «Zapad-2017» drills.
Ships set out from Northern Fleet headquarters in Severomorsk. Photo: mil.ru
The Northern Fleet, the most powerful of Russia’s five fleets, is unfolding a special exercise which includes key parts of fleet capacities.
The drills will be headed directly by Russian Navy Head Commander Vladimir Korolyev and will last «for several days», the Northern Fleet informs.
Included are about 50 ships, submarines and support vessels. Also aircrafts, helicopters from the Air Force and Air Defense will be deployed, a Navy representative says to Interfax.
The drills are held as several of the most powerful Northern Fleet vessels are on their way home after participation in a Navy parade outside St.Petersburg. Among them are battle cruiser «Pyotr Veliky» and typhoon-class submarine «Dmitry Donskoy».
It is likely that the returning vessels will take part in the exercise.
In the course of the training, antisubmarine and anti-sabotage activities will be conducted along with navigational, hydrographical, anti-mine and search and rescue operations.
According to the Navy representatives, the exercise is held as a preparatory phase to the large-scale joint Russian-Belarus drills «Zapad-2017» scheduled for the period 14-20 September.
https://thebarentsobserver.com/en/security/2017/08/northern-fleet-announces-big-scale-exercise
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
Could those first 4 boats later feasibly be back fitted with AIP?The Russian Navy is expected to receive four ships in the original diesel-electric version, and then another five boats of an improved project fitted with an air-independent propulsion (AIP) system. https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5473-project-677-lead-submarine-st-petersburg-passed-all-russian-navy-tests.html
PapaDragon- Posts : 13467
Points : 13507
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
Tsavo Lion wrote:Could those first 4 boats later feasibly be back fitted with AIP?The Russian Navy is expected to receive four ships in the original diesel-electric version, and then another five boats of an improved project fitted with an air-independent propulsion (AIP) system. https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5473-project-677-lead-submarine-st-petersburg-passed-all-russian-navy-tests.html
Most likely, I don't think that there will be any changes to hull design in AIP versions.
JohninMK- Posts : 15617
Points : 15758
Join date : 2015-06-16
Location : England
Mainly a question of having a hole in the hull large enough to get the old out and the new in. Do these diesel-electrics already have the ability to change out their diesel engines? If so that is probably the question answered.PapaDragon wrote:Tsavo Lion wrote:Could those first 4 boats later feasibly be back fitted with AIP?The Russian Navy is expected to receive four ships in the original diesel-electric version, and then another five boats of an improved project fitted with an air-independent propulsion (AIP) system. https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5473-project-677-lead-submarine-st-petersburg-passed-all-russian-navy-tests.html
Most likely, I don't think that there will be any changes to hull design in AIP versions.
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
Can the Kilos be feasibly given AIP? Except those in the BSF, they also operate under ice & could benefit by having it.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13467
Points : 13507
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
Tsavo Lion wrote:Can the Kilos be feasibly given AIP? Except those in the BSF, they also operate under ice & could benefit by having it.
Don't know but for them set of fancy new batteries alone several years from now would do wonders
I am more interested to see if Lada class will be getting VLS systems
JohninMK- Posts : 15617
Points : 15758
Join date : 2015-06-16
Location : England
From Benya post above: "We say that the Project 677 diesel-electric submarine is a prototype for the Amur 1650"PapaDragon wrote:Tsavo Lion wrote:Can the Kilos be feasibly given AIP? Except those in the BSF, they also operate under ice & could benefit by having it.
Don't know but for them set of fancy new batteries alone several years from now would do wonders
I am more interested to see if Lada class will be getting VLS systems
So, as the Lada is going to turn into the Amur 1650 for the Indian 75i project perhaps the spec of that gives us a clue?
From Wiki
The Project 75I-class submarines will have a vertical launch system(VLS) to enable them to carry multiple Brahmos supersonic cruise missiles, making the submarines fully capable of anti-surface and anti-ship warfare missions. Project 75I submarines will also be armed with torpedoes and will feature advanced stealth capabilities such as a greater ability to suppress noise and acoustic signatures.[3] Submarines will also be outfitted with Air-independent propulsion (AIP) fuel cells which can significantly increase submerged endurance and operational range.[8]
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
Besides the RF, China, Vietnam, Algeria, Poland, Romania, Iran & India now have 66 Kilos between them & yet none of them were given AIP.PapaDragon wrote:Don't know but for them set of fancy new batteries alone several years from now would do wondersTsavo Lion wrote:Can the Kilos be feasibly given AIP? Except those in the BSF, they also operate under ice & could benefit by having it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilo-class_submarine#Operators
Perhaps it's too expensive &/ there is no suitable AIP that would fit on them?
GarryB- Posts : 40516
Points : 41016
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
The AIP system they are talking about is brand new and uses diesel fuel to power the AIP instead of a separate oxygen and hydrogen tank system.
Hydrogen requires all new storage and transfer facilities to be built at every port... most modern ports already have diesel transfer and storage facilities already... so the infrastructure for the new Russian AIP system is already built in to every port.
Not so for modern French or German AIP technology.
Hydrogen requires all new storage and transfer facilities to be built at every port... most modern ports already have diesel transfer and storage facilities already... so the infrastructure for the new Russian AIP system is already built in to every port.
Not so for modern French or German AIP technology.
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
Is it using the same principle as http://www.deagel.com/Propulsion-Systems/Stirling-AIP_a001357001.aspx ? I guess it's too time consuming & costly to insert a plug with AIP in all those Kilos! https://trid.trb.org/view/431953 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tze6zgrRJKM
GarryB- Posts : 40516
Points : 41016
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
Not at all... a sterling engine is just an internal combustion engine that runs on liquid oxygen... they are noisy and generate lots of carbon monoxide that must be released into the sea water... both of which make noise.
The new AIP the Russians are working on are like hydrogen fuel cells... like chemical batteries that don't generate noise.
The Russian cells reportedly generate a lot more power too.
This is a bit like making a diesel electric into an all electric sub...
A diesel sub has the dilemma that it is short ranged and slow, but when it runs on batteries it is much quieter than any other sub at sea. The problem is that its low speed and limited battery life means it soon has to come to snorkel depth and make noise running its diesel engines to recharge the batteries.
With this AIP they wont need to run the diesels at all... and can spend a couple of weeks in silent mode underwater at a time.
Much harder to find and deal with.
The Lada combines a powerful armament and very capable sensors with near nuke performance in terms of time underwater... all it is missing is high speed to be an SSN...
The new AIP the Russians are working on are like hydrogen fuel cells... like chemical batteries that don't generate noise.
The Russian cells reportedly generate a lot more power too.
This is a bit like making a diesel electric into an all electric sub...
A diesel sub has the dilemma that it is short ranged and slow, but when it runs on batteries it is much quieter than any other sub at sea. The problem is that its low speed and limited battery life means it soon has to come to snorkel depth and make noise running its diesel engines to recharge the batteries.
With this AIP they wont need to run the diesels at all... and can spend a couple of weeks in silent mode underwater at a time.
Much harder to find and deal with.
The Lada combines a powerful armament and very capable sensors with near nuke performance in terms of time underwater... all it is missing is high speed to be an SSN...
T-47- Posts : 269
Points : 267
Join date : 2017-07-17
Location : Planet Earth
GarryB wrote:
The Lada combines a powerful armament and very capable sensors with near nuke performance in terms of time underwater... all it is missing is high speed to be an SSN...
Whats the problem of Lada at the first place?
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
This reminds me of the fictional Capt. Nemo's submarine:GarryB wrote:The AIP system they are talking about is brand new and uses diesel fuel to power the AIP instead of a separate oxygen and hydrogen tank system. ..The new AIP the Russians are working on are like hydrogen fuel cells... like chemical batteries that don't generate noise. The Russian cells reportedly generate a lot more power too.
This is a bit like making a diesel electric into an all electric sub...
But the Chinese Yuan class "submarines are equipped with Sterling AIP system, which the Chinese claim is more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world." http://cimsec.org/chinas-yuan-class-submarine-visits-karachi-assessment/17627 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_039A_submarine#PropulsionElectricity provided by sodium/mercury batteries (with the sodium provided by extraction from seawater [using coal]) is the craft's primary power source for propulsion and other services.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nautilus_(Verne)#Description
https://americanliterature.com/author/jules-verne/book/20000-leagues-under-the-sea/part-two-chapter-10-the-submarine-coal-mines
PapaDragon- Posts : 13467
Points : 13507
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
Uncle Sam is at it again...
GarryB- Posts : 40516
Points : 41016
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
Whats the problem of Lada at the first place?
Everything was brand new prototype stuff, not evolutionary in design and it took time to work out the bugs to get them working to specs level expected.
Now the bugs are worked out.
But the Chinese Yuan class "submarines are equipped with Sterling AIP system, which the Chinese claim is more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world."
Sterling engine is a combustion engine so it generates a lot of power.... just like a diesel engine really but designed to operate underwater below snorkel depth... if AIP was better than diesel engines then new AIP subs would be all electric... they are not.
Uncle Sam is at it again...
Don't be surprised if a US senator suggests building artificial islands 3,000km off the coast of the US so they can claim half the Pacific and half the Atlantic as being US internal lakes...
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
The quote says "..more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world.", not diesel engines. The new Russian AIP for Ladas aren't "available" yet, at least for export.GarryB wrote:Sterling engine is a combustion engine so it generates a lot of power.... just like a diesel engine really but designed to operate underwater below snorkel depth... if AIP was better than diesel engines then new AIP subs would be all electric... they are not.But the Chinese Yuan class "submarines are equipped with Sterling AIP system, which the Chinese claim is more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world."
Don't be surprised if a US senator suggests building artificial islands 3,000km off the coast of the US so they can claim half the Pacific and half the Atlantic as being US internal lakes...Uncle Sam is at it again...
Artificial islands 3,000km off the coast will only create 200mi territorial waters zone around them, unless a chain of them is built like the volcanic Aleutians & Kurils. Even then, the USN subs still went to the Okhotsk Sea & the Soviet Arctic Zone to gather intell., & a Russian SSN allegedly sneaked into the Mexican Gulf. Also, NATO controls access to the Med. Sea from the West via Gibraltar & yet Soviet & RF SSN/GNs have gone there dozens of times too. The UK has islands in the Mid-Atlantic from Bermuda to S. Georgia & US in the mid-Pacific- Hawaii & Am. Samoa- but even if they illegally claim the whole areas as "internal lakes", it won't stop Russian or Chinese subs from going there. I hope there's no senator shallow enough to propose it!
Tsavo Lion- Posts : 5960
Points : 5912
Join date : 2016-08-15
Location : AZ, USA
Tsavo Lion wrote:The quote says "..more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world.", not diesel engines. The new Russian AIP for Ladas aren't "available" yet, at least for export.GarryB wrote:Sterling engine is a combustion engine so it generates a lot of power.... just like a diesel engine really but designed to operate underwater below snorkel depth... if AIP was better than diesel engines then new AIP subs would be all electric... they are not.But the Chinese Yuan class "submarines are equipped with Sterling AIP system, which the Chinese claim is more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world."
Don't be surprised if a US senator suggests building artificial islands 3,000km off the coast of the US so they can claim half the Pacific and half the Atlantic as being US internal lakes...Uncle Sam is at it again...
Artificial islands 3,000km off the coast will only create 12 mi terr. waters & 200mi EEZ zone around them, unless a chain of them is built like the volcanic Aleutians & Kurils. Even then, the USN subs still went to the Okhotsk Sea & inside the declared Soviet Arctic Sector's E.Siberian, Laptev & Kara Seas, both with big islands- to gather intell., & a Russian SSN allegedly sneaked into the Mexican Gulf. Also, NATO controls access to the Med. Sea from the West via Gibraltar & yet Soviet & RF SSN/GNs have gone there dozens of times too. The UK has islands in the Atlantic from Bermuda to S. Georgia & Diego Garcia in the mid-Indian Ocean; Portugal has The Azores; the US has Hawaii, Am. Samoa, etc. in the mid/S-Pacific- but even if they illegally claim the whole those areas as "internal lakes", it won't stop Russian or Chinese subs from going there. I hope there's no senator shallow enough to propose it!
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f0/Laptev_Sea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bermuda#Military
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_islands_in_the_Atlantic_Ocean#South_Atlantic_Ocean https://markosun.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/diego11.jpg?w=1000&h=741
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azores#Geography
http://vhscratchingpost.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Territories.png
kvs- Posts : 15850
Points : 15985
Join date : 2014-09-11
Location : Turdope's Kanada
Tsavo Lion wrote:The quote says "..more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world.", not diesel engines. The new Russian AIP for Ladas aren't "available" yet, at least for export.GarryB wrote:Sterling engine is a combustion engine so it generates a lot of power.... just like a diesel engine really but designed to operate underwater below snorkel depth... if AIP was better than diesel engines then new AIP subs would be all electric... they are not.But the Chinese Yuan class "submarines are equipped with Sterling AIP system, which the Chinese claim is more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world."
Don't be surprised if a US senator suggests building artificial islands 3,000km off the coast of the US so they can claim half the Pacific and half the Atlantic as being US internal lakes...Uncle Sam is at it again...
The statement is chest thumping nonsense.
From the details of the Russian AIP, it is an actual fuel cell that likely does not require O2 production to operate. Fuel
cells can use alternative chemical pathways for energy extraction from diesel or other fuels. They can also be made much
more efficient than internal combustion engines. So the long term operation in pure electrical mode is a very realistic
outcome of this engineering solution. I am not sure what the limitation is that prevents the diesel engines from being
removed altogether.
GarryB- Posts : 40516
Points : 41016
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
The quote says "..more efficient than the AIP systems currently available in the world.", not diesel engines. The new Russian AIP for Ladas aren't "available" yet, at least for export.
A sterling engine is an AIP, and they are not that efficient... when the O2 runs out they stop working as air independent propulsion systems.
When there is O2 then they are the noisiest AIP you can get... even nuclear power plants are quieter... only their cooling system pumps make noise...
I hope there's no senator shallow enough to propose it!
Of course there is.
And the US navy is well known for being sticklers to international law when it suits them...
Check this out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZmundI7OTQ
Warning don't read the comments below this vid as they are mostly BS from ignorant fools.
The facts are that the US Navy in this case was attempting to claim "right of innocent passage"... can't remember the exact details but it says something like as long as you said in a straight line from point a to point b you can pass through the territorial waters of another country as long as you keep sailing straight.
This led to them entering within the 12 mile territorial waters of the Soviet Union... leading to what you see in the vid.
Benya- Posts : 526
Points : 528
Join date : 2016-06-05
Location : Budapest, Hungary
Russian Navy Special Forces to Receive P-650 Midget Submarines
The Russian Navy’s special operations forces (SOF) will receive the newest P-650 special-purpose midget submarines. These ships display just 720 tons and will be able to covertly deliver special-purpose and SOF groups to the shore and retrieve them. The submarine was designed by the Malakhit Special Marine Engineering Design Bureau. According to experts, it will be a response to the introduction of submarines converted by the U.S. Navy into SOF platforms, the newspaper Izvestia reported.
P-650 special-purpose midget submarine scale model as shown by Malakhit design bureau during IMDS naval show in St. Petersburg.
As Izvestia was informed at the Navy’s Main Staff, the P-650 is seen as a dedicated platform and a SOF support boat. The decision on them will be made after the final boat configuration is defined.
"The P-650 is a multipurpose boat," Malakhit’s leading designer Viktor Karavaev told Izvestia. "It provides for the installation of torpedo tubes to enable the SOF personnel to leave the submarine and a special compartment with a lock-out chamber to retrieve them. The ship has a modular design, which makes it possible to additionally deploy different types of cruise missiles, torpedoes, and bottom mines. Therefore the submarine can not only carry out clandestine missions, but also act as a patrol ship, destroy single ships or shore targets with missiles and torpedoes, conduct covert electronic intelligence, provide target designation to other ships in a group."
P-650 special-purpose midget submarine scale model as shown by Malakhit design bureau during IMDS naval show in St. Petersburg.
The P-650 has a length of 55 m and a width of 6.4 m. The maximum diving depth is 300 m. The boat is powered by two diesel generators generating electric power for a super-quiet propulsion motor. Its range is 2,000 nautical miles (over 3,000 km). The submarine can travel most of this distance submerged without disclosing its location. The submarine has a crew of nine people. There is a special room aboard the submarine to accommodate a group of six combat swimmers. The ship can carry four 533 mm torpedoes, eight 400 mm torpedoes. In addition to them, 12 bottom mines are placed in special bomb bays located between the pressure and outer hulls of the boat.
According to Karavaev, the P-650 traces its roots to the Soviet Navy’s Project 865 Piranha class midget submarines. These ships were specially designed for covert delivery of SOF personnel to the enemy's coast. For this reason they were one of most secret boats in the Navy. A total of two submarines, MS-520 and MS-521, were built. However, the program was closed in 1999 and it was decided to scrap the boats.
P-650 special-purpose midget submarine scale model showing 12x launch tubes for sea mines.
Expert Vladimir Shcherbakov told Izvestia that interest in midget submarines is primarily caused by the introduction of special attack ships in the US Navy. "Unlike the American one, the Russian concept presupposes the construction of ultra-small and low-noise ships operating in the coastal zone or inland seas," the expert said. "They will be in strong demand in the Baltic, Black, South China or Caspian Seas where there are no great depths and where a nuclear-powered boat will never enter stealthy."
The United States is now the main developer of special-purpose midget submarines. To improve the delivery of divers-SOF soldiers, the US United Special Operations Command ordered a "dry" midget submarine from Northrop Grumman Corporation under the Advanced Swimmer Delivery System (ASDS) special program. The ship has a length of 19.81 m, a diameter of 2.43 m, and a displacement of 55 tons. The diving depth of the boat exceeds 300 m. The boat is delivered to the objective area by specially equipped nuclear submarines and surface ships. ASDS boats do not have armament, recalls the newspaper Izvestia.
https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5492-russian-navy-special-forces-to-receive-p-650-midget-submarines.html
The Russian Navy’s special operations forces (SOF) will receive the newest P-650 special-purpose midget submarines. These ships display just 720 tons and will be able to covertly deliver special-purpose and SOF groups to the shore and retrieve them. The submarine was designed by the Malakhit Special Marine Engineering Design Bureau. According to experts, it will be a response to the introduction of submarines converted by the U.S. Navy into SOF platforms, the newspaper Izvestia reported.
P-650 special-purpose midget submarine scale model as shown by Malakhit design bureau during IMDS naval show in St. Petersburg.
As Izvestia was informed at the Navy’s Main Staff, the P-650 is seen as a dedicated platform and a SOF support boat. The decision on them will be made after the final boat configuration is defined.
"The P-650 is a multipurpose boat," Malakhit’s leading designer Viktor Karavaev told Izvestia. "It provides for the installation of torpedo tubes to enable the SOF personnel to leave the submarine and a special compartment with a lock-out chamber to retrieve them. The ship has a modular design, which makes it possible to additionally deploy different types of cruise missiles, torpedoes, and bottom mines. Therefore the submarine can not only carry out clandestine missions, but also act as a patrol ship, destroy single ships or shore targets with missiles and torpedoes, conduct covert electronic intelligence, provide target designation to other ships in a group."
P-650 special-purpose midget submarine scale model as shown by Malakhit design bureau during IMDS naval show in St. Petersburg.
The P-650 has a length of 55 m and a width of 6.4 m. The maximum diving depth is 300 m. The boat is powered by two diesel generators generating electric power for a super-quiet propulsion motor. Its range is 2,000 nautical miles (over 3,000 km). The submarine can travel most of this distance submerged without disclosing its location. The submarine has a crew of nine people. There is a special room aboard the submarine to accommodate a group of six combat swimmers. The ship can carry four 533 mm torpedoes, eight 400 mm torpedoes. In addition to them, 12 bottom mines are placed in special bomb bays located between the pressure and outer hulls of the boat.
According to Karavaev, the P-650 traces its roots to the Soviet Navy’s Project 865 Piranha class midget submarines. These ships were specially designed for covert delivery of SOF personnel to the enemy's coast. For this reason they were one of most secret boats in the Navy. A total of two submarines, MS-520 and MS-521, were built. However, the program was closed in 1999 and it was decided to scrap the boats.
P-650 special-purpose midget submarine scale model showing 12x launch tubes for sea mines.
Expert Vladimir Shcherbakov told Izvestia that interest in midget submarines is primarily caused by the introduction of special attack ships in the US Navy. "Unlike the American one, the Russian concept presupposes the construction of ultra-small and low-noise ships operating in the coastal zone or inland seas," the expert said. "They will be in strong demand in the Baltic, Black, South China or Caspian Seas where there are no great depths and where a nuclear-powered boat will never enter stealthy."
The United States is now the main developer of special-purpose midget submarines. To improve the delivery of divers-SOF soldiers, the US United Special Operations Command ordered a "dry" midget submarine from Northrop Grumman Corporation under the Advanced Swimmer Delivery System (ASDS) special program. The ship has a length of 19.81 m, a diameter of 2.43 m, and a displacement of 55 tons. The diving depth of the boat exceeds 300 m. The boat is delivered to the objective area by specially equipped nuclear submarines and surface ships. ASDS boats do not have armament, recalls the newspaper Izvestia.
https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5492-russian-navy-special-forces-to-receive-p-650-midget-submarines.html
AlfaT8- Posts : 2488
Points : 2479
Join date : 2013-02-02
Good to hear the Piranha-class finally getting some attention, it's not the one with cruise missiles, but still good.\
I wonder if thIs is the one with AIP
Spent an entire day looking for a complete list of the Piranha-class subs, can't seem to find it, and no, United Shipbuilding Corporation doesn't list all the variants.
I wonder if thIs is the one with AIP
Spent an entire day looking for a complete list of the Piranha-class subs, can't seem to find it, and no, United Shipbuilding Corporation doesn't list all the variants.
GarryB- Posts : 40516
Points : 41016
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
PapaDragon- Posts : 13467
Points : 13507
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
.
Okay, which one of you jokers dumped a canister of nerve gas into National Interest HQ? Because they just published sensible and balanced article on Russian Navy...
Why the Russian Navy Is a More Capable Adversary Than It Appears
http://nationalinterest.org/feature/why-the-russian-navy-more-capable-adversary-it-appears-22009?page=show
And they just introduced the term "kalibrzation". Also, here is last paragraph:
Okay, which one of you jokers dumped a canister of nerve gas into National Interest HQ? Because they just published sensible and balanced article on Russian Navy...
Why the Russian Navy Is a More Capable Adversary Than It Appears
http://nationalinterest.org/feature/why-the-russian-navy-more-capable-adversary-it-appears-22009?page=show
And they just introduced the term "kalibrzation". Also, here is last paragraph:
...There are still plenty of deficits to point to, but the Russian Navy isn’t going anywhere; when you look at the trend lines over the near to midterm, they are actually positive. Russia is building a navy that makes sense for its strategy. It is transitioning to a green-water force by design, while retaining and investing in capabilities that will allow it to deter or threaten stronger maritime powers for decades to come. So the next time you hear that the Russian Navy is disappearing, Russia is running out of people, out of money, or out of business, and want to test this theory, just remember to pack a life raft.