Russian Navy: Status & News #3

The adoption of the new weapons by the current ships is a very important upgrade. More important than to replace ships of 30 years old with a potential long life still.

PapaDragon wrote:.
Okay, which one of you jokers dumped a canister of nerve gas into National Interest HQ? Because they just published sensible and balanced article on Russian Navy...


Why the Russian Navy Is a More Capable Adversary Than It Appears

http://nationalinterest.org/feature/why-the-russian-navy-more-capable-adversary-it-appears-22009?page=show


And they just introduced the term "kalibrzation". Also, here is last paragraph:

...There are still plenty of deficits to point to, but the Russian Navy isn’t going anywhere; when you look at the trend lines over the near to midterm, they are actually positive. Russia is building a navy that makes sense for its strategy. It is transitioning to a green-water force by design, while retaining and investing in capabilities that will allow it to deter or threaten stronger maritime powers for decades to come. So the next time you hear that the Russian Navy is disappearing, Russia is running out of people, out of money, or out of business, and want to test this theory, just remember to pack a life raft.

yea I too thought it was an excellent analysis. This was good too:
        http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2798498.html#%2Fcutid1
Not sure if it was posted already.

oh for people who thought no more Buyan M's would be built after the Grad. Keep in mind they are talking about Buyan M's only since the regular Buyan's weren't built at Zelenolsk, I happened to find this and thought to share it

https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160907/1476295916.html

Kubinka (Moscow region), 7 Sep - RIA Novosti. The contract signed between the Defense Ministry and Zelenodolsk Shipbuilding Plant on the forum is 27 billion rubles and provides for the construction of three Buyan-M class ships, Rena Novosti's general director Renat Mistakhov said.

Zelenodolsk plant has already built five ships of this type and transferred them to the Russian Navy. Four ships are in varying degrees of construction.
"The contract signed today with the Ministry of Defense provides for the construction of three more ships of this type, and in 2019 one ship and two ships will be built in 2020," Mystakhov said after signing the documents.

GarryB wrote:

Ha... so much reminded me of old Yugoslavian subs.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:oh for people who thought no more Buyan M's would be built after the Grad. Keep in mind they are talking about Buyan M's only since the regular Buyan's weren't built at Zelenolsk, I happened to find this and thought to share it

https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160907/1476295916.html

...........

Excellent news.

Buyan-M is gift that keeps on giving.

So this means that there will be 12 in total (at least)

Plus orders for 18 Karakut's.

PapaDragon wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:oh for people who thought no more Buyan M's would be built after the Grad. Keep in mind they are talking about Buyan M's only since the regular Buyan's weren't built at Zelenolsk, I happened to find this and thought to share it

https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160907/1476295916.html

...........

Excellent news.

Buyan-M is gift that keeps on giving.

So this means that there will be 12 in total (at least)

Well I said this how long ago nothing new.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:oh for people who thought no more Buyan M's would be built after the Grad. Keep in mind they are talking about Buyan M's only since the regular Buyan's weren't built at Zelenolsk, I happened to find this and thought to share it

https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160907/1476295916.html

...........

Excellent news.

Buyan-M is gift that keeps on giving.

So this means that there will be 12 in total (at least)

Well I said this how long ago nothing new.

Also reported the three last ordered are to be upgraded.

Small missile ships of project 21631 "Buyan-M" will equip a new radar with active phased array and anti-aircraft missile and gun system "Pantsir-SM"

slasher wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:oh for people who thought no more Buyan M's would be built after the Grad. Keep in mind they are talking about Buyan M's only since the regular Buyan's weren't built at Zelenolsk, I happened to find this and thought to share it

https://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160907/1476295916.html

...........

Excellent news.

Buyan-M is gift that keeps on giving.

So this means that there will be 12 in total (at least)

Well I said this how long ago nothing new.

Also reported the three last ordered are to be upgraded.

Small missile ships of project 21631 "Buyan-M" will equip a new radar with active phased array and anti-aircraft missile and gun system "Pantsir-SM"

Well we will need to see the Grad when she is done, since the Grad is the first of the last three after those two no more Buyan's will be made.

Always surprised to see the 1204's still out there. Those boys are long in the tooth and I thought the Buyan was to replace.

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139735@egNews

franco wrote:Always surprised to see the 1204's still out there. Those boys are long in the tooth and I thought the Buyan was to replace.

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139735@egNews

Smetlivy says "hi"

Two more Grigorovich and Lada order most likely coming soon

RT reported:

The ministry is also considering new orders for two Admiral Grigorovich-class frigates in addition to the three currently under construction for the Black Sea fleet and the three already complete, the official said. Another possible purchase is two more advanced Lada-class stealth attack submarines. Funding for both has been requested for the new military procurement program launching next year.

Those two frigates if they did order them would likely go tot he Baltic Sea

SeigSoloyvov wrote:Those two frigates if they did order them would likely go tot he Baltic Sea

I also think that. But my opinion is they should order at least the frigates not the subs and put them into Pacific fleet. Even if its as an interim deployment. Pacific area is getting hotter. Varyag could use some new escorts with her. South China Sea also needs some Kalibr craze.

T-47 wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:Those two frigates if they did order them would likely go tot he Baltic Sea

I also think that. But my opinion is they should order at least the frigates not the subs and put them into Pacific fleet. Even if its as an interim deployment. Pacific area is getting hotter. Varyag could use some new escorts with her. South China Sea also needs some Kalibr craze.

Pacific fleet is getting the bigger corvettes and modernized Udaloy's.

there isn't much need to send those ships there.

2 more 11356 over existing 6 ordered or as part of some deal where India gets some of the 2nd lot of 3 ordered for the BSF?
If we're talking 8 they might split 4 & 4 rather than all 6 going to BSF.

Occurs to me if the 22350s are being bumped up to ~8k tons then building more 11356 is less problematic in terms of overlapping abilities -> at least 6 for each fleet could be a good way to bump up numbers of modern ships.

hoom wrote:2 more 11356 over existing 6 ordered or as part of some deal where India gets some of the 2nd lot of 3 ordered for the BSF?
If we're talking 8 they might split 4 & 4 rather than all 6 going to BSF.

Occurs to me if the 22350s are being bumped up to ~8k tons then building more 11356 is less problematic in terms of overlapping abilities -> at least 6 for each fleet could be a good way to bump up numbers of modern ships.

2 are enough for Baltic. It's a tight space with shorter distances so corvettes are preferable. These 2 frigates will be there just in case.

Black Sea Fleet needs to cover Med now as well so 6 for them it is.

They just need to add anti-ship function on them now, they really screwed the pooch with that one.

PapaDragon wrote:
Black Sea Fleet needs to cover Med now as well so 6 for them it is.

They just need to add anti-ship function on them now, they really screwed the pooch with that one.

I agrree that they need 6 of them as a minimum regardles of the configuration (modernized or not), but what do you mean by:

"They just need to add anti-ship function on them now"

do they not have the ability to fire Onix and wont the Kaliber fammily soon have a anti-ship version ready, its still in the design and testing phase as far as I understand.

More importantly while we are on the subject, I wanted to ask this question a long time ago, but, is there any picture or a video of a Russian ship launching an Onix missile from a UKSKs. I haven't actually seen any and that's pretty weird certainly not a good sign.

I know we had an discussion on, are the UKSKs really universal but wasn't the conclusion that it all depends on the ships equipment, which is quite logical or there is some other problem.

T-47 wrote:

franco wrote:Always surprised to see the 1204's still out there. Those boys are long in the tooth and I thought the Buyan was to replace.

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139735@egNews

Smetlivy says "hi"

The four 1204 ships remaining active were commissioned in 1969, 1971, 1972 and 1972. The Smetlivy was commissioned also in 1969.

miroslav wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:
Black Sea Fleet needs to cover Med now as well so 6 for them it is.

They just need to add anti-ship function on them now, they really screwed the pooch with that one.

I agrree that they need 6 of them as a minimum regardles of the configuration (modernized or not), but what do you mean by:

"They just need to add anti-ship function on them now"

do they not have the ability to fire Onix and wont the Kaliber fammily soon have a anti-ship version ready, its still in the design and testing phase as far as I understand.

More importantly while we are on the subject, I wanted to ask this question a long time ago, but, is there any picture or a video of a Russian ship launching an Onix missile from a UKSKs. I haven't actually seen any and that's pretty weird certainly not a good sign.

I know we had an discussion on, are the UKSKs really universal but wasn't the conclusion that it all depends on the ships equipment, which is quite logical or there is some other problem.

This is the problem with anti-ship setup:

https://www.russiadefence.net/t6680p25-uksk-vls-system#202652

Grigorevich frigates don't seem to have required equipment to launch Onyx missiles if this is accurate

And I haven't seen Onyx launch also

PapaDragon wrote:

miroslav wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:
Black Sea Fleet needs to cover Med now as well so 6 for them it is.

They just need to add anti-ship function on them now, they really screwed the pooch with that one.

I agrree that they need 6 of them as a minimum regardles of the configuration (modernized or not), but what do you mean by:

"They just need to add anti-ship function on them now"

do they not have the ability to fire Onix and wont the Kaliber fammily soon have a anti-ship version ready, its still in the design and testing phase as far as I understand.

More importantly while we are on the subject, I wanted to ask this question a long time ago, but, is there any picture or a video of a Russian ship launching an Onix missile from a UKSKs. I haven't actually seen any and that's pretty weird certainly not a good sign.

I know we had an discussion on, are the UKSKs really universal but wasn't the conclusion that it all depends on the ships equipment, which is quite logical or there is some other problem.

This is the problem with anti-ship setup:

https://www.russiadefence.net/t6680p25-uksk-vls-system#202652

Grigorevich frigates don't seem to have required equipment to launch Onyx missiles if this is accurate

And I haven't seen Onyx launch also

3M-54 isnt supersonic in terminal phase? somaybe Onix is not priority there.

T-47 wrote:

franco wrote:Always surprised to see the 1204's still out there. Those boys are long in the tooth and I thought the Buyan was to replace.

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139735@egNews

Smetlivy says "hi"

God God, when are they ever going to get rid of that heap of trash?

KiloGolf wrote:

T-47 wrote:

franco wrote:Always surprised to see the 1204's still out there. Those boys are long in the tooth and I thought the Buyan was to replace.

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139735@egNews

Smetlivy says "hi"

.........

God God, when are they ever going to get rid of that heap of trash?  

2 decades from now.

Fun fact: after Crimea reunification other similar ship caught fire and got scraped. However it's turbines were fresh out of overhaul so they moved them to Smetlivi thus extended her service life without planning to.

She will be around for a while. Still perfectly good as offshore patrol vessel. Has range, has helicopter, has guns. Even has 8 Uran missiles as a bonus.

Would be dumb to throw it away now when it's unexpectedly overhauled. Pirates won't find any comfort in ship's old age once it's starts shooting up their asses.

PapaDragon wrote:

KiloGolf wrote:

T-47 wrote:

franco wrote:Always surprised to see the 1204's still out there. Those boys are long in the tooth and I thought the Buyan was to replace.

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139735@egNews

Smetlivy says "hi"

.........

God God, when are they ever going to get rid of that heap of trash?  

2 decades from now.

Fun fact: after Crimea reunification other similar ship caught fire and got scraped. However it's turbines were fresh out of overhaul so they moved them to Smetlivi thus extended her service life without planning to.

She will be around for a while. Still perfectly good as offshore patrol vessel. Has range, has helicopter, has guns. Even has 8 Uran missiles as a bonus.

Would be dumb to throw it away now when it's unexpectedly overhauled. Pirates won't find any comfort in ship's old age once it's starts shooting up their asses.

The issue is the huge waste of human resources for such a low-capability ship (> 250 sailors). A small FAC can have 8 Urans and an OPV can perform the rest of its duties. And that keeping busy less people and having two vessels in its place, for much longer time.

I highly doubt this vessel will be of any use to anyone past 2025. It's a waste of money to keep it afloat like that imo.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Pacific fleet is getting the bigger corvettes and modernized Udaloy's.

there isn't much need to send those ships there.

I said "Even if its as an interim deployment." But Vladivostok is very long way. BTW frigates are always better than bigger corvettes. But anyway if it works it works, nobody cares how.

eehnie wrote:
The four 1204 ships remaining active were commissioned in 1969, 1971, 1972 and 1972. The Smetlivy was commissioned also in 1969.

Thats why Smetlivy said hi 1204s are small boats. Smetlivy is a destroyer. Lots of new kids came, get old and get scrapped but this granny is still trolling around like a boss