Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9

magnumcromagnon wrote:..but can we at least agree that Putin's policy of 'put-all-my-eggs-in-a-ceasefire-basket' over the past 2 years were absolute failures?

Absolute failure - No.
But yes there has been failures... we need to understand that path we travel are not always straight and smooth and sometimes we make bad decisions....

Also, we should not be naive to think that Putin as a person makes the decisions based on his mood. Rather decisions are made based on the inputs and analysis of the various departments and advisors.

If it weren't for MINSK 1/2, NAF would likely of liberated Odessa and connecting Transnistria, denying Ukrappy's any naval access.

I agree..... but my way of thinking was different and would predate the Crimean spring. If I had my way, I would have wanted the Russian forces take over the Eastern Ukraine in the hours/days following the overthrow of the elected govt by the euronazis. This is to bring the entire eastern part under the protection of Russian peacekeeping force for protecting the Eastern part from the euronazis. The Ukranian units who were not much prepared then would have been disbanded much more effectively without much bloodbath. In the weeks and months following such a peacekeeping force, local protection units will be created and fine tuned as a good fighting force so that they can hold the frontline after Russian peacekeepers withdraw after stabilizing the situation.

Similarly Putin waited 4 years to give any serious help via PGM strikes, and had he started in 2011 the bearded goatf*ckers would of never taken over so much territory, ultimately making the job for VKS much easier.

I have said it earlier too... and that's been my opinion too... The Russian Govt wasted a lot of years and that was mainly because Russia was clearly on the back foot and had no clear strategy on what to do. I would say Russia was almost clueless on the situation orchestrated by the usual suspects. But then again we need to understand that its the advisors to the Govt which help shape the decisions.

The pullout ordered by the Russian Govt from the Tartous naval station in the years after the start of Syrian crisis clearly tells us that Russia was not prepared for the situation and there wasn't even any short or long term plan. From the looks of its, its long after the crisis started that the Russian Govt started actively looking into the state of affairs and started formulating a strategy with the result being Russia sending its forces to stabilize the situation.    

Its simple for us to talk on the matter, but there are lots of geostrat stuff that need to be looked into and among the reasons why Russia acted like that during those period...which I personally feel was lacking from the Russian side.

Do you guys remember in the early days/years of the conflict...?
We had the real good men from Ukraine expressing the desire to go to Syria and help the SAA and govt to fight the terrorists. We had even seen some videos online related to it.... it was nearly 80,000 former servicemen and fighters from Ukraine, as reported during that time. There should not be any doubt that this would have given a significant boost in quality and quantity in the fight against the terrorists...... but..... then...... we saw the NATO empowered crisis in Ukraine....

The current ceasefire in Syria is a proven failure, and now their shouldn't be anymore ceasefires enabled until after Raqqa has been flattened with at least 6 FOAB's.

There is no doubt the ceasefire is playing to the terrorists advantage NOW. But what we should not fail to note is the change in strategy employed by the terrorists masters.

Was Russia/Syria/Iran/Hezbollah right when they collectively agreed for a ceasefire? YES!
(Even though its Russia that talks on the table, the good part of the Russians is that they do not have a dictatorial mentality and they discuss the matter with their partners, in this case the parties involved in the counter-terrorists operation. Thats why I put all the parties together.)

It was going as per plan and the counter-terrorist forces concentrated their effort on liberating the eastern front. The first major victory came with liberation of Palmyra giving a tremendous shock to the terror masters and minions on the "negative" impact of the ceasefire. We all saw how the scums reacted to the liberation of Palmyra and in parallel saw the FSA terrorists and their allies heating up the ceasefire areas. The intend was simple, to stall the eastern offensive and tie down the manpower constrained SAA and allies on multiple fronts. And thats it.

Was the ceasefire agreement good when it was initiated - Yes.
Has it outlived its utility due to a change in strategy by the terrorists - Yes.
Does the current 'ceasefire' need to hold - No

The way Obama plays Putin like a rag doll on the chessboard is just like how Reagan played Gorbachev like a rag doll on the chessboard. Disgusting dirty style. Sending TOWs by the thousands and offering diplomatic shield at the UNSC on the one hand while advocating for a fake ceasefire on the other hand. It's like someone plunging a knife into you while at the same time saying I didn't do it. This is Sun Tzu's teaching. Sun Tzu's teaching is studied in the US but not in Russia. Sun Tzu was a despicable man who beat his opponents by playing dirty.

Does Russia have even clear strategy in Syria ?

Western backed terrorists will not disband on it's own, and it is obvious that SAA can't destroy them without massive help, which is forbidden due to this another insane "ceasefire".
Classical Catch-22 unfortunately.

Kadmos45 wrote:Does Russia have even clear strategy in Syria ?

Western backed terrorists will not disband on it's own, and it is obvious that SAA can't destroy them without massive help, which is forbidden due to this another insane "ceasefire".
Classical Catch-22 unfortunately.

Nop. Putin is going to spend the remaining days of his life on Syria not knowing what to do. Syria war will be decided by Iran, not by Russia.

Kadmos45 wrote:Does Russia have even clear strategy in Syria ?

Western backed terrorists will not disband on it's own, and it is obvious that SAA can't destroy them without massive help, which is forbidden due to this another insane "ceasefire".
Classical Catch-22 unfortunately.

Russia definitely has very clear strategy in Syria, they just aren't dumb enough to advertise it.

SAA already receives massive help and are still unable to accomplish anything remotely significant. Even after 5 years they still drive tanks straight into ATGMs without any infantry cover or recon. And when fired upon they scatter immediately without even shooting back.

Russia already secured everything it needed. All that is left for them to do now is some geopolitical PR and jihadi headhunt. Why should Russians bleed for Syrian nation? Syrians definitely do not plan to bleed for Syria that much is clear as day.

How it goes from here depends solely on Syria and Iran. They either stop screwing around and start doing their job or some other solution emerges.

Watching fortifications of Istanbul

PapaDragon wrote:

Russia definitely has very clear strategy in Syria, they just aren't dumb enough to advertise it.

Definitely "very clear" is pretty strong word , and we can only hope that this strategy is slightly less dumb than Donbass "gambit".

PapaDragon wrote:
SAA already receives massive help and are still unable to accomplish anything remotely significant. Even after 5 years they still drive tanks straight into ATGMs without any infantry cover or recon. And when fired upon they scatter immediately without even shooting back.

So SAA is useless crap now ? Guess westerners were right about something years ago.

PapaDragon wrote:
Russia already secured everything it needed. All that is left for them to do now is some geopolitical PR and jihadi headhunt. Why should Russians bleed for Syrian nation? Syrians definitely do not plan to bleed for Syria that much is clear as day.

Syria is only a playground and Russia opportunity to destroy filth and be real defender of civilisation.
But it's not about Syria it never was. This is just part of war against Russia like Kosovo was.
Yeltsin Russia sold Kosovo to Nato. And months later west attacked Russia in Chechnya.

Russia secured nothing. Western terrorists weren't decimated and eliminated. Guess where will they go next ?

It will be caucasus and post-soviet central Asia. Better kill them all in Syria or it will be too late. Radical islam virus is only contagious in muslim population .  And Russia have big one. Not to mention bordering -stans.

PapaDragon wrote:
How it goes from here depends solely on Syria and Iran. They either stop screwing around and start doing their job or some other solution emerges.

Losing Syria is not an option. And would be suicide for Russia.

SAA need to take back the borders for this war to end. What Russia should do is paratroop near Syria's borders. Who shoots at Russian soldiers die a horrible death. Ukrainians didn't dare shoot at Russian soldiers. I doubt US backed fags do.

Kadmos45 wrote:

Losing Syria is not an option. And would be suicide for Russia.

Don't waste your time explaining clueless ignorants , about the real situation of the problem.
Your 100% correct. The war in Syria is a war against Russia. just like the war in Ukraine.
The danger that will be ISIS or any other terrorist to capture Syria ,will be that later Obama
can black mail any European nations with another Syria style proxy war by arming muslins
,if they do not cooperate with Americans policies and interest of total domination of the world.

Listen I'm not on the Ultron/Flagshipvictory's sort of narcotics...but can we at least agree that Putin's policy of 'put-all-my-eggs-in-a-ceasefire-basket' over the past 2 years were absolute failures? If it weren't for MINSK 1/2, NAF would likely of liberated Odessa and connecting Transnistria, denying Ukrappy's any naval access. Similarly Putin waited 4 years to give any serious help via PGM strikes, and had he started in 2011 the bearded goatf*ckers would of never taken over so much territory, ultimately making the job for VKS much easier. The current ceasefire in Syria is a proven failure, and now their shouldn't be anymore ceasefires enabled until after Raqqa has been flattened with at least 6 FOAB's.

Forget about Ukraine. Russia should stay the hell away of it. Ukraine is the only place
that Russia policy is correct ,after the monumental failure of allowing Yakunovych to be overthrow which was terrible mistake.  If your goal is to saves lives , will you consider acceptable Russia economy to collapse and later allowing Americans to easily create unrest
in Russia and euromaidans there? Money and family weight more than any patriotism and any flag. If Russia invades Ukraine ,it cannot do the same they are doing in Syria. it needs to overthrow kiev in a full scale invasion and later manage the country ,create elections
and this is what Americans wants Russia to try to do. is a trap. Russia does NOT have
the influence that Americans or Europe have there.Even Yakunovych wanted to integrate with the Euroean union. Russia terrible Influence with former soviets republics is a major problem.
So once Russia take control of Kiev ,it will have the former Euromaidans again protesting Russia to leave their nation. Then the Russian budget will be spend in feeding 40 millions of Ukrainians. that all of them will be hating Russia later for their economy ,their misery and unrest.
No Thanks.  

This is not mentioning the time bombs there , Ukraine nuclear reactors that can be exploded
by the nazis , a major crisis that will later be blamed on Russia .and the ethnic cleansin
of Russians in every city by the nazis in retaliation for Russia invasion. aside Russia will be isolalted from Europe if does that. So if Putin invades Ukraine it will need to be ready to face
Hundreds of Thousands protest not only in Ukraine but also in Russia.  Ukrainian themselves needs to liberate their nation and not Russia. So that later Russia is not blamed for their misery. Russia the best it can do ,is create conditions to pressure kiev to sit down to the negotiation table with eastern Ukraine. welcome to Minsk-2. a peace trap. is not perfect. but as long Europe backup it , Ukraine will be forced to implement it when they see their chances to survive are zero as a country ,without Russia help.

Dima wrote:

d_taddei2 wrote:i personally think this was a total waste Tu-160 drops 10 bombs and only kills 20 terrorists and injures an Emir, hardly worth it, if they were intent on sending a Tu-160 they might as well have dropped a FOAB at least that way they would have killed at least 200 rather than 20. lol, Tochka and Frog-7 have killed more in one missile strike than these 10 bombs, would be cheaper to use tocka than Tu-160 with 10 bombs

We don't know the requirements so its hard to say what they carried and why they choose Tu-160s. But from the reports, considering the killed were over a dozen commanders, it was probably a strike on area where commanders were carrying out a secret meeting?

If the UK govt mouthpiece SOHR is claiming 20 killed on their side, we can safely assume the figure is more and if they are claiming 50 civilians dead we can safely assume a small fraction of it to be true or those killed are mainly terrorists.

I completely agree about the FOAB and would love to see it being employed. With a shit clearing radius of 300meters, it would be a good asset to make the way ahead.
Btw, how many FOABs can be carried by the Tu-160 in its bay?

all i read was 20 dead and one Emir, havent seen anything about 16 commanders but good news if its true.(not that i am doubting you just the source)

as for number of FOAB i can really be sure as i cant find anything sizes for the FOAB but if you go just by weight alone your looking at 5, but i am guessing they would only ever carry one or two at a time, the FOAB is pretty bulky, i think its more down to size than weight when it comes to carrying a FOAB as i haven't heard it being mentioned in relation to Tu-22m or Tu-95 which could ging by weight carry three and Tu-95 two but like i said i think its down to size, i dont think the Tu-22m loading bay could fit it but i am just guessing.

magnumcromagnon wrote:Listen I'm not on the Ultron/Flagshipvictory's sort of narcotics...but can we at least agree that Putin's policy of 'put-all-my-eggs-in-a-ceasefire-basket' over the past 2 years were absolute failures? If it weren't for MINSK 1/2, NAF would likely of liberated Odessa and connecting Transnistria, denying Ukrappy's any naval access. Similarly Putin waited 4 years to give any serious help via PGM strikes, and had he started in 2011 the bearded goatf*ckers would of never taken over so much territory, ultimately making the job for VKS much easier. The current ceasefire in Syria is a proven failure, and now their shouldn't be anymore ceasefires enabled until after Raqqa has been flattened with at least 6 FOAB's.

You guys are funny. Maybe you want to check what ceasefires have been about the last 15 years ALL AROUND the WORLD? This is what they look like for the most. Liberating Odessa and then what? While we can agree that the February ceasefire was premature. The idea that no ceasefire would be better is stupid. The goal was to show Russia could be a reliable partner. And they are when it comes to this; however, the biggest issue comes from the fact that the US, just like Russia doesn't like humiliation. And it will not accept getting kicked out of a situation they promoted, created and are fuelling.

Even in the best case scenario and Azaz being cleared, cross border raids and Turkish artillery strikes would be a problem, that would have no real solution. And then you have the rest of this shitjob.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:Listen I'm not on the Ultron/Flagshipvictory's sort of narcotics...but can we at least agree that Putin's policy of 'put-all-my-eggs-in-a-ceasefire-basket' over the past 2 years were absolute failures? If it weren't for MINSK 1/2, NAF would likely of liberated Odessa and connecting Transnistria, denying Ukrappy's any naval access. Similarly Putin waited 4 years to give any serious help via PGM strikes, and had he started in 2011 the bearded goatf*ckers would of never taken over so much territory, ultimately making the job for VKS much easier. The current ceasefire in Syria is a proven failure, and now their shouldn't be anymore ceasefires enabled until after Raqqa has been flattened with at least 6 FOAB's.

You guys are funny. Maybe you want to check what ceasefires have been about the last 15 years ALL AROUND the WORLD? This is what they look like for the most. Liberating Odessa and then what? While we can agree that the February ceasefire was premature. The idea that no ceasefire would be better is stupid. The goal was to show Russia could be a reliable partner. And they are when it comes to this; however, the biggest issue comes from the fact that the US, just like Russia doesn't like humiliation. And it will not accept getting kicked out of a situation they promoted, created and are fuelling.

Even in the best case scenario and Azaz being cleared, cross border raids and Turkish artillery strikes would be a problem, that would have no real solution. And then you have the rest of this shitjob.

So it looks that in eyes of our tan world grade strategists Putin is "clueless" and cannot assess the risk. Also Federation Security Council seems to be lame. Damn they need urgently to read this forum and twitter to know real numbers and war news instead to check every possible move´s follow up in military, political, social and economical dimensions like 10 steps ahead and basing on intel data and heavy simulations of possibile outcomes?

Wtf magnumcromagnon's posts just disappeared? Oy vey...

Also magnum, man, I told you we can agree that the February cease-fire was premature. They should have been red flags. One off such was the fact Turkey could still ferry fighters FROM AL NUSRA on both sides of the Mare line and even re-infiltrate them in Latakia.

But that would require a war against Turkey. That's how it is. And that's why Nusaybin is on fire...

Vann7 wrote:

Influence with former soviets republics is a major problem.
So once Russia take control of Kiev ,it will have the former Euromaidans again protesting Russia to leave their nation. Then the Russian budget will be spend in feeding 40 millions of Ukrainians. that all of them will be hating Russia later for their economy ,their misery and unrest.
No Thanks.  

Hundreds of Thousands protest not only in Ukraine but also in Russia.  Ukrainian themselves needs to liberate their nation and not Russia. So that later Russia is not blamed for their misery. Russia the best it can do ,is create conditions to pressure kiev to sit down to the negotiation table with eastern Ukraine. welcome to Minsk-2.  a peace trap. is not perfect. but as long Europe backup it , Ukraine will be forced to implement it when they see their chances to survive are zero as a country ,without Russia help.

very true Vann7. 40 mlns zombiefied people, many with maidown syndrome hating Russia? Blaming Putin for every economical problem and current democratic hlodomor? no way

Look Up left. In prone position..

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Look Up left. In prone position..

Are you talking about this photo? pbs images don't show up on my browser

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CiaNfSKXIAAtbeo.jpg

I don't know. 6B45, multicam and painted helmets? Could be. But I am not 100% sure. Need bigger photo.



It has reminded me of this.

Turkey hellicopter shotdown by Kurdish PKK..
wondering from where they got their manpads.








Perhaps Russia giving Erdogan a taste of his own medicine?

Where is Mustafa the troll? The Turkey airforce is not as strong as he claimed.
their planes and helicopters can be beaten just using soviet weapons..



In more news.. Syria 24 facebook..

https://www.facebook.com/syria24english

Some moderate progress in Homs reported by Syrian army , advances in damascus too and
recapturing some positions. and in Deir Ezzur , ISIL offensive was halted a bit ,and they pulling back but the fight continues.

I don't know what kind of koolaid people have been consuming over the years but this retardation of "just old soviet weapons" nonsense is giving me cancer.

Soviet weapons to till this date one among the best that have been created, often with no equivalents in the west.

Turkey trained and armed Chechen/Caucasus militants in early-middle 90ies, Russians responded by giving some weapons to PKK (RPGs, Strelas, ammo etc.) and Turkey backed off.

Thing is PKK/Kurdish issue is far more threat to Turkey as a nation than Chechnya is to Russia.

New pictures of russian soldiers at shaer gas fields...

From page before, from different angel.
18+
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CibsTIsXAAAddKD.jpg:large

Werewolf wrote:I don't know what kind of koolaid people have been consuming over the years but this retardation of "just old soviet weapons" nonsense is giving me cancer.

Soviet weapons to till this date one among the best that have been created, often with no equivalents in the west.

I think because the US had so much time to catch up after fall of Soviet Onion and so much more money to spend, its almost comical when their stuff gets shredded by "old, rusted, weak-Russia techknowledgy". It seems propaganda does not make your military gear any stronker than normal.

OminousSpudd wrote:

Werewolf wrote:I don't know what kind of koolaid people have been consuming over the years but this retardation of "just old soviet weapons" nonsense is giving me cancer.

Soviet weapons to till this date one among the best that have been created, often with no equivalents in the west.

I think because the US had so much time to catch up after fall of Soviet Onion and so much more money to spend, its almost comical when their stuff gets shredded by "old, rusted, weak-Russia techknowledgy". It seems propaganda does not make your military gear any stronker than normal.

Specially if we also take into account, that UAE Mirage-2000 was shot down by old Strela-2 (SAM-7) in Yemen.

medo wrote:

OminousSpudd wrote:

Werewolf wrote:I don't know what kind of koolaid people have been consuming over the years but this retardation of "just old soviet weapons" nonsense is giving me cancer.

Soviet weapons to till this date one among the best that have been created, often with no equivalents in the west.

I think because the US had so much time to catch up after fall of Soviet Onion and so much more money to spend, its almost comical when their stuff gets shredded by "old, rusted, weak-Russia techknowledgy". It seems propaganda does not make your military gear any stronker than normal.

Specially if we also take into account, that UAE Mirage-2000 was shot down by old Strela-2 (SAM-7) in Yemen.

Actually that's not the worst. Worst is w still don't know how did that F15E of the RSAF lose its CFM during combat mission...

It appears that Russian troops had to directly intervene to prevent the fall of the T-4 military airfield to the ISIS, who are claiming today that they destroyed 4 helicopters and 20 trucks on the ground in their attack.

https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/russian-marines-syrian-army-gain-ground-isis-eastern-homs/