Russian Space Program: News & Discussion #2

S7 Space plans to create a reusable rocket based on the Soyuz-5

MOSCOW, Nov. 7 - RIA News. The private company S7 Space (part of the S7 group), which had previously purchased the Sea Launch project, intends to create a reusable modification based on the Roskosmos developed disposable Soyuz-5 rocket with the conventional name Soyuz-7 in a one-off version in 2022, told Sergei Ropov, CEO of the company, to RIA Novosti.

"We are cooperating with Roskosmos in the work on the Soyuz-5 rocket. However, based on the draft design of this carrier, we will make our own version of the rocket with a reusable first stage. The modification of the rocket received the conditional name Soyuz-7, in versions for Sea Launch - Soyuz-7SL (Sea Launch), ”he said.

According to Sopov, the first test launch of a new carrier, while in the one-time version, is possible already after three years - in 2022. As planned, the rocket will launch a cargo ship into orbit, which also plans to create S7 Space.

Roskosmos ordered the development of the Soyuz-5 medium-class rocket of the Energia Rocket and Space Corporation, allocating about 60 billion rubles. The first launch of the carrier is registered for 2022. At the same time, the general designer of the rocket Igor Radugin recently moved from RSC Energia to S7 Space.

Later it became known that the general designer of the Federation spacecraft also went to work at S7 Space, where he would create the transport ship.

Also, after the new Russian rocket, which is creating as part of the Phoenix project, got its current name, Soyuz-5, it was reported that the name Soyuz-7 could receive a carrier using methane as a fuel.

https://ria.ru/space/20181107/1532257466.html

It's great that they plan to get off their butts (plan to, they haven't gotten off of them yet) but today is late 2018.

90's era ended nearly 2 decades ago. What were they waiting for all this time?

Let's be realistic here: for all intents and purposes Russian civilian space program is dead. Better yet, it never lived to begin with.

Military component​ is doing OK but their mission is entirely different.

What Roskosmos does now is launch crew to ISS and occasionally deliver satellite to orbit. Both are done with Soviet platforms and are nothing more than extension of Soviet space program.

Roskosmos accomplished nothing of note. Closest they got to performing their duty was when they launched Exo-Mars probe (with help from ESA). Everything else failed spectacularly.

Russian space program is dead. If they want to bring it to life they have to:

1) Complete Federation development

2) Complete Soyuz-5 development

3) Finish construction of Vostochniy

4) Get Angara into service

5) Use some or all of those above to carry out successful scientific or manned mission

Should they ever succeed at it only then they can say that they have space program. Otherwise it's just someone else's stale leftovers.

GunshipDemocracy wrote:

S7 Space plans to create a reusable rocket based on the Soyuz-5

.....
https://ria.ru/space/20181107/1532257466.html

Nice to hear that somebody is making serious effort. At least they seem to be taking this whole space thing much more seriously than Roskosmos is

So they are working​ on:

- Reusable rocket (nothing more than fashion statement IMO but whatever...)

- It's based on Soyuz-5 which means that someone finally put some boots up posteriors in Roskosmos since they were hogging the tech as recently as month ago

- New cargo ship which is huge news actually, I wonder how they'll go about it?

- Name is Soyuz-7 as in S7 Airlines obviously, looks like Roskosmos will have to come up with something more creative because first come first served

Russian space firm to build 2nd Angara-5 heavy carrier rocket by April 2019

MOSCOW, November 14. /TASS/. An Angara-A5 heavy carrier rocket is expected to be built by April 2019 for a second test launch from the Plesetsk Cosmodrome in north Russia and the Khrunichev Center (the rocket’s manufacturer) is currently testing its integral parts, the Khrunichev press office said on Wednesday.

"The Khrunichev Center plans to ensure the readiness of the second flight copy of the Angara-A5 heavy carrier rocket by April 2019 for its dispatch from the enterprise to the cosmodrome," the press office said.

Khrunichev Center Deputy CEO for Production Roman Khokhlov was quoted by the press office as saying that a decision on the rocket’s dispatch to the cosmodrome and the launch timeframe "will be made by Russia’s Defense Ministry following the results of the tests and the readiness of the Angara-A5 carrier rocket."

The first launch of the Angara rocket took place in 2014 from the Plesetsk Cosmodrome. Roscosmos Head Dmitry Rogozin earlier said that the space agency was planning to start the flight tests of the Angara-A5V heavy carrier rocket with the increased lifting capacity and the hydrogen-powered stage at the Vostochny Cosmodrome in the Russian Far East in 2026.

According to him, the operation of the second launch compound for light and heavy Angara rockets will begin at the Vostochny spaceport in 2023.

As was reported earlier, the Khrunichev Center may start developing the conceptual design of the Angara-A5V heavy carrier rocket with the increased lifting capacity already in 2019 immediately after signing a contract with Roscosmos.

The Angara rocket system is intended for launches of environmentally-friendly carrier rockets of various classes. The Angara family includes Angara-1.2 light rockets, Angara-A3 medium launchers and Angara-A5 heavy carriers (the Angara-A5M as their modification) and Angara-A5V rockets with the increased lifting capacity.


http://tass.com/science/1030815

Will someone here like to tell me more about how Russia will be first to put man on Mars?

Easy... official NASA policy is not to put people into rigid gender/sexuality roles, so they don't know if they have put men on the moon or women or transgender people... so Russia can still be first.

Of course also... who actually believes the US has even been to the moon...

Can Russia reach Mars?.... Yes, but only if they get their sh%t together, and find a convincing reason for the politicians to actually back the project.

My idea, would be to tell them that it's to expand Russia itself.

AlfaT8 wrote:Can Russia reach Mars?.... Yes, but only if they get their sh%t together, and find a convincing reason for the politicians to actually back the project.

My idea, would be to tell them that it's to expand Russia itself.

Fenix superheavy, Federation capsule, space nuclear reactor, ion engine, all necessary parts are under development

It's not about if they can, it's about if they will finally finish what they started for once

TsAGI scientists tested the engine of a promising spacecraft

http://www.tsagi.ru/pressroom/news/4044/

Specialists of the Central Aerohydrodynamic Institute named after Professor N.Ye. Zhukovsky (part of the Research and Development Center “Institute named after N. Zhukovsky”) conducted a series of ground tests under the project of creating direct-flow aerial electric propulsion engines (PFER) for long-term maintenance of spacecraft (SC) in ultra-low orbits (up to 250 km). The studies are carried out within the framework of the TsAGI-RAS program, MAI is a partner in TsAGI.

The advantage of a promising device with a photovoltage fire engine will be its economy and duration of its stay in orbit, limited only by the physical resource of the engine, and not the fuel supply. It is assumed that the role of fuel will be played by rarefied air from the atmosphere, which is ionized and accelerated in an electromagnetic field. The resulting plasma rushes out of the engine, giving the spacecraft acceleration in the opposite direction. Flying in ultra-low orbits will allow the spacecraft to accomplish the same target tasks as in today's popular low orbits at an altitude of about 1000 km, but significantly reduce the mass of the spacecraft and, accordingly, the cost of launching it (approximately 300 times). Also, the required powers of transmitters and satellite communication receivers can be reduced by orders of magnitude.

At this stage, TsAGI scientists imitated the engine at various air densities in a special ionospheric wind tunnel. It is possible to ignite the plasma only starting from a certain density of the atmospheric gas - this means that there is a height above which the use of an air-filled diesel engine is impossible because of too rarefied air. Specialists obtained this threshold density value and from it calculated the altitude range, where the atmosphere is already sparse enough to reduce aerodynamic resistance, but still allows you to start the engine, the thrust of which compensates the resistance of the external environment.

According to experts, the tests were successful, the results confirmed the feasibility of the ionization process in the previously predicted altitude range of 150-190 km.
Looks like news form 2017 is continued.

Roscosmos shows image of future nuclear-powered spacecraft

MOSCOW, November 13. /TASS/. Roscosmos has uploaded to its Facebook page a video showing the image of a nuclear-powered spacecraft of the future.

"The Keldysh Center is currently conducting research into spacecraft boasting more powerful engines - nuclear power plants of a new class. They do not need solar light or solar cell panels," the video says.

Earlier, Roscosmos unveiled plans for making a test sample of a megawatt class nuclear engine meant for flights into deep space.

In 1970-1988 the Soviet Union carried out the launch of 32 spacecraft with thermoelectric nuclear power plants. In 1960-1980 a nuclear rocket engine was developed and tested at the Semipalatinsk test site.

More:
http://tass.com/science/1030596



https://www.facebook.com/pg/tvroscosmos/videos/

TsAGI scientists tested the engine of a promising spacecraft

So it is like an electric ramjet that operates in a very low earth orbit where pockets of thin atmosphere are escaping slowly into space... this thing scoops up this thin loose material and accelerates it backwards to generate thrust while in orbit... neat...

And that nuclear rocket that would make a trip to mars a 7 month journey is the first really practical mode of transport for any mission there... especially if it can generate a microgravity of continuous thrust all the way there... which would help the astronauts immensely.

I know it is not PC but they should train some people with no legs because such a physical state would be excellent for operating in space.

Very simply in low gravity you don't use your legs... you hold on to stuff with your hands and push yourself from place to place so your legs are just dead weight.

When you get to Mars some sort of ground vehicle like a wheelchair could let you move around easily enough...

GarryB wrote:...........
I know it is not PC but they should train some people with no legs because such a physical state would be excellent for operating in space.

Very simply in low gravity you don't use your legs... you hold on to stuff with your hands and push yourself from place to place so your legs are just dead weight......

Circulatory system and blood pressure of amputees is different that those of healthy people as a result of their injuries

It would be too risky health-wise

I think the advantages should be explored...

There are young healthy people all over the world who have lost legs... often because of war... I think creating a role where their disadvantage actually becomes a serious advantage is a positive thing, for them and the mission.

Each kg you have to take to Mars counts.

Of course imagine the situation where prospective cosmonauts get their legs removed to increase their chances of flying the mission... YUK...

I do know information from people with eye injuries from WWII led to the discovery that some types of plexiglass used in canopies resulted in fragments remaining in the eyes of crews during combat damage without problems leading to the use of that material for replacements for human eye lenses.

One of the things they found was that the new synthetic lenses did not block IR wavelengths like human lenses did so their night vision was improved and such people would have been useful for lookouts at night.

(I am not suggesting they could see in the dark, but their ability to see in low or no light conditions was improved...)

BTW are you suggesting that just because both legs have been removed that a person can not be healthy?  

The respiratory changes might actually be benefical for a period of microgravity travel and then normal operations on a low gravity planet like Mars...

I am just saying it should be researched and tested before being dismissed...

Having three or four crew without legs could add up to being able to take more food and fuel...

GarryB wrote:

TsAGI scientists tested the engine of a promising spacecraft

So it is like an electric ramjet that operates in a very low earth orbit where pockets of thin atmosphere are escaping slowly into space... this thing scoops up this thin loose material and accelerates it backwards to generate thrust while in orbit... neat...

or long living sat killers, "air-breathing" orbital engines...

"Kommersant": RSC Energia will try to prepare the ship "Federation" for launch in 2022

However, as the General Director of the Corporation Sergey Romanov noted, the current state of the ship allows it to be launched only in 2024.
MOSCOW, November 16. / Tass /. Rocket and Space Corporation (RSC) "Energia" is preparing proposals to Roskosmos for the work necessary for the unmanned launch of the Russian advanced spacecraft "Federation" in 2022. This was announced by Sergey Romanov, CEO of the corporation, in an interview with Kommersant published on Friday .

"Now we are preparing our proposals to Roskosmos for the work that needs to be done to launch
the ship in unmanned mode in 2022. Because for the time being, as of the ship today, really send the ship
to the cosmodrome in 2024. But we still have to try very hard to make it happen in 2022 ", - said Romanov.

He stressed that before the manned launch of the ship, it is necessary to test eight experimental installations, as well as to complete all production processes.
“Without an experimental test, there can be no talk of any manned launch. We cannot risk people,” added Romanov.

The Federation is being developed at Energia Rocket and Space Corporation. The ship is designed to deliver people and cargo both to near-Earth orbit and deep space. The number of crew "Federation" up to four people. In the autonomous flight mode, the ship will be able to stay up to 30 days, and as a part of the orbital station - up to a year.

https://tass.ru/kosmos/5799674

Progress MS-10 launched and successfully placed in orbit, carrying 2T of cargo.  The docking with the ISS is scheduled for November 18 at 22:30 Moscow time.  This is 1st launch of the man-rated Soyuz-FG since teh Soyuz MS-1 abort, so should be all clear for the Dec 03 Soyuz MS-11.

https://www.interfax.ru/world/638258

Interesting photo of the liftoff, taken from ISS, apparently by Sergey Prokopyev

GarryB wrote:

Will someone here like to tell me more about how Russia will be first to put man on Mars?

Easy... official NASA policy is not to put people into rigid gender/sexuality roles, so they don't know if they have put men on the moon or women or transgender people... so Russia can still be first.

Of course also... who actually believes the US has even been to the moon...

Oh no.. Garryb.. Last time i told NASA never visited the moon ,was accused by popular posters ,of being
a conspirational theorist idiot.   Im wondering why they remain silent now.. will i get credit for
being the first to educate people in this forum ,about Saturn/apollo Rocket real lifting capability? and never
leaving the earth orbit..

On another note..

Russia released a report in RT of a new Nuclear/plasma engine for space travels..
something never done before.. which is the thing Russia government should really focus leading in space
,and not waste their budget in Putin's outdated vision of Russia Development.  Still Russia is late , should
have taken advantage of NASA lag after depending on Russia for space traveling.


After RT released days ago the report of Russia having a space nuclear/plasma engine..
US is making noise about accelerating their space plans for reaching the moons and mars..

2028 Moon Mission Pitched at US National Space Council Meeting

https://sputniknews.com/science/201811171069886380-usa-national-space-council-moon-mission-2028/


So i have a magic ball and will tell people exactly what will happen and why they will do things
that way..

Did anyone knows why Americans obsession to going so quick to the moon and mars..?????
Why they so desperate ???  

The answer is because --->   they need to project.....   LEADERSHIP.
This is project Influence in the world ,so that they Follow American system Instead of the competition..

It will be very very humiliating for US gov .. EXTREMELY humiliating if Russia goes to the moon FOR REAL
(not hollywood) first than they plan to do it.. More humiliating than Losing a warship or an aircraft carrier to
Russia. more damaging for US authority than losing a small war against Russia in the middle east..  This is because History books will be changed forever , the entire world new generations will be teach at schools.. who reach the moon first..  Russia the next thing they will do after landing in the Moon FIRST for real , will be Expose NASA fraud program.. that they never did it..

So DESPERATE are American elite ,to reach moon and mars first.. that ELON mosk was proposing
a one way mission , a suicide mission.. with the goal of getting a human to plant a flag in mars.. even if he die
seconds later.. he told that big achievements requires big sacrifices.. can they do this? Of course they can..
they can send a Criminal from jail as space goat , and another one will take the credit.. and is faked his death..
simply sent to retirement for life to a secret place with a new identity.

So there is a One Nation Race for Writing History in Space for arriving to Moon and Mars First.. for real ..
before Russia do it... Putin is not in this race ,and he is relaxed and happy with breaking agriculture records and winning more olympic medals.. to "promote friendship" with the west.. at least this is how the Moron think.

So this is what the west very very likely will do...

Predictions for the future of US and Russia space programs....  

1)they will "offload the work" to the private industry ,the job to landing in the moon First..  
  this is exactly what they have been proposing.. either private or either with cooperation with Russia
   with Russia doing the rocket and everything and Americans being the ones that do the land part.  

Why will they want private business to do the moon landing? because if something goes wrong NASA
can blame the private company "inexperience" .  and people will not be questioning NASA , about how
could they do it in the past and not now..      So mark my words.. NASA will NOT go to the moon
at least not Officially in front of cameras.. they will hire private companies ,international engineers to do
the job for them with NASA full assistance.. and American companies will take the credit.

2)For Mars travel this is easier.. Because it will be impossible there to PROOF anything..
that anyone landed or not.. NASA can do a one way mission ,send a criminal to mars , faking to be
an astronauts.. and in hopes he will at least get alive on the surface on moon for a few minutes.. enough
for filming the surface for real and for planting the American flag..  But if he fails to even reach mars..
they can very easily do a movie.. of an astronaut landing in mars.. with the american flag..and it will
be IMPOSSIBLE on earth to proof they went there or NOT.. unless you send a mission to check the landing
site.

3)The 5th column website..

http://www.russianspaceweb.com

is financed by external money.. will not be surprised by US congress.. Shows all the signature
of , an Operation of disinformation about Space.. and why will Americans wants to finance disinformation
about space???

To Discredit the Russian space program.. at any REAL achievement they do..    
So if Russia land in the moon for real. he will start conspiracies of Russia filmed the whole thing in
an studio..    

People will be easily confused and mislead because the website provides now high quality information
even publish very high quality hard cover ,color books.. all that cost a lot of money.. for a lonely man
in a small website to do. He lived in Russia and migrated to US.. so he have all the signature of being
a sleep disinformation project.. that will be activated ,the same day Russia attempt to land in the moon
or mars or any other outer space mission. He already have been promoting fake news when Russia participated
with the European union , in the mars project.. and claimed Russian rockets exploded.. and he also was the
only source in internet speaking about Russia spy satellites aiming at americans ones.. So he have to be
financed by the CIA.. because his own information ,was used by US mainstream media later about Russia
interference with US satellites. and satellite killers in space...

The American Empire depends on projecting LEADERSHIP.. the worse thing that can happen .
to any Empire is to Lose Leadership ,that is to lose INFLUENCE.. to not longer be seen as the nation
that can lead the world development.. It will be TERRIBLE , CATASTROPHIC.. and not mentioning the
major Humiliation for Americans. If Russia land in the moon FIRST and expose the FRAUD of
NASA apollo landing..  

Russia can even provoke a civil war in america ..by landing First in the moon..and exposing NASA fraud.
that will be visible when the images released by Russia ,and the motion and behavior of humans in Moon gravity
is very different to how it was shown in NASA videos of the Apollo landing. The scandal that could happen
if Proven it was a fraud , the lawsuits world wide , demanding for paying for damages of billions of books
written that teach incorrectly Americans landed in the moon.  the millions of lawsuit of American citizens
against NASA and against congress ,demanding to know what they did with the Money    for their moon space program ,that Kennedy supported if proven it was a fraud..

SO it will be like the biggest scandal in American history and many people will end in Jail ,because once you arrest
one and he speak.. another one arrested and so and so and so.. and another HUGE problem.. exposing NASA fraud
in the moon will cause.. is the MARS program.. americans will question.. if they lied to us with the moon.. how do we know they are not also faking their Mars ,rovers programs too and the videos not fake ???    

So Russia will benefit ENORMOUSLY multiplied by x 1,000 in landing at very least in the moon FIRST and for real.
Not only will project world leadership ,and damage American image in the world.. No longer will be seen
as the leader of the world development.. and this will hurt their future influence with Europe BIG TIME.
Americans will NEVER be able to sanctions Europe cooperation with Russia in space.  Not even AMericans can stop
cooperating with Russia in space.  

The major obstacle however Russia space program will face. the major challenge ,will be Putin and his minions.
and his backward thinking . he is capable to stay in power all they way to 2030. and not care much about
Russia domination in space. He is even capable to negotiate Russia not exposing
NASA moon landing fraud and helping Americans with technology to reach the moon first for real..
in change of American friendship..

Any sane leader in Russia will understand how critical and important is for Russia to totally dominate in
space not only in Planets exploration but in Military domination too. In space denial to NATO.. since they don't
hide the fact.. they want to do the same.. this is what Trump space forces is about.. To deny Russia and China
the use of space.. as simply as this.. so The future of Russia will depend on this.. on leading in Space.. more than
in any other thing.

Russia space budget should be increased X 10.. at least  usd$ 15 billions dollars a year ,and completely cut the funding to all sports activities and victory parades , and the funding of activities promoting the past culture , and significantly reduce the size of the Government. and with civilians support and direct funding to Space exploration  or smaller projects can be done to encourage more companies to surface in Russia for space exploration.

Remember folks, Vann the Internet Guy is smarter than people like Alexsey Leonov

Stupid Leonov for thinking that moon landing was not faked, what would he know anyway...

Russian cosmonauts to fly on two-week mission to Moon after 2030

MOSCOW, November 19. /TASS/. Russian cosmonauts will for the first time touch the Moon’s surface after 2030. Their mission will last 14 days, according to a presentation made by Chief Designer, First Deputy CEO of Energia Space Rocket Corporation Yevgeny Mikrin on Monday.

The Energia chief designer made the presentation at a conference devoted to the 20th anniversary of the International Space Station (ISS).

The roadmap of the lunar program presented at the conference suggests that the first crews will be landing on the Moon’s surface from a lunar habitable orbiter. The orbiter is planned to be created using the technology developed for the Russian segment of the space station. The presentation indicates the period of 2030-2035 as the timeframe for creating the lunar orbiter. A transparency of the presentation shows that the cosmonauts are set to make the first landing on the Moon for a 14-day stay.

Overall, the roadmap envisages three stages. At the first stage to last through 2025, there are plans to test all the technologies on the ISS, create a basic module of a near-Moon station, test the promising Federatsiya (Federation) manned spacecraft, make unmanned flights around the Moon aboard the Federatsiya and explore the Moon with the help of automated probes.

The lunar orbital outpost may be created using elements of the Russian segment of the ISS, in particular, the nodal module, the manned spacecraft and the research-energy module, which are expected to be docked to the space station by 2022. Lunar take-off and landing and cargo modules will be attached to the orbiter for landing on the Moon’s surface.

The second stage to last from 2025 to 2035 envisages testing the means of access to the Moon’s surface, performing first manned flights to the Moon’s surface, creating and placing the first elements of the habitable base on the Moon.

At the third stage after 2035, the construction of a full-fledged habitable lunar base will be completed. Also after 2035, the single system of manned and automated probes of exploring the Moon is expected to be created.

Conference devoted to the ISS’s 20th anniversary

The scientific and practical conference, "Cosmonautics: the Open Space of International Cooperation and Development," devoted to the 20th anniversary of the International Space Station runs on Monday at the Cosmonautics and Aviation Center of the All-Russian Exhibition of Economic Achievements (VDNKh) in Moscow.

The conference was opened by Chief of Russia’s State Space Corporation Roscosmos Dmitry Rogozin. The conference has brought together representatives of Roscosmos, foreign space agencies, cosmonauts and astronauts, designers and rocket builders.

http://tass.com/science/1031552

PapaDragon wrote:
Remember folks, Vann the Internet Guy is smarter than people like Alexsey Leonov

Stupid Leonov for thinking that moon landing was not faked, what would he know anyway...

Soviets cosmonauts have NO fucking way to know what happened in the moon.. unless Russia government
tells them.. is not that you could see with simple eyes NASA astronauts  playing gulf in the moon right?
So his opinion about the whole thing of NASA and the moon ,is his opinion.. Only Russia intelligence agencies and very top of the Government leadership can know..  in my opinion NASA helped the soviets finance their space
program , Soviets were launching rockets to space ,like there was no tomorrow , (the way it should be..)
in change for staying in silence about the whole moon hoax..  but thats a big possibility ,still can't proof that.

What i can proof is that the entire story does not make any sense . at all.. defy logic and science and common
sense.. if NATO today is seeking to build technology , to bypass radiation.. something they mastered 40 years ago..
but suddenly "forgot" where they left the blue prints . and destroyed the technology too..
neither makes any sense why would NASA lose the Telemetry data ,what is supposed to be the most Important information ever collected in the history of human mankind.. that is the travel to another planet..  major evidence they will need to Proof they did landed in the moon.. so you just don't miss those things by "Accident"  .
The French Astronaut is even on record saying NASA destroyed the technology to bypass radiation.. )-Oops-
this things only happen in fantasy land .. in Disney.. movies.. not in the real world..  Your lack of knowledge
how Engineering works , and how it doesn't .it what makes you believe in fantasy tales of NASA and the moon.

When engineers design a new Bridge..and build it.. they need to test it a hundred of times... very rigorous test..
, to make very sure that it will not break.. But when it comes to the most important engineering project in the world..a space moon rocket ..it had to be tested a thousand if not a million of times.. Armstrong nearly die.
when testing the lander in earth.. and the lander was destroyed.. it was near impossible to control it..
but somehow the second time he did it in the moon ,he fly the lander ,he did it perfectly.

and we are expected to believe that NASA did it right on the first try.. on the moon.. and did it 6-8 times more without a single issue.. they even play gulf in the moon.. and then move to mars.. and then stop going to the moon for 35 years and suddenly we are expected to believe they forgot how to build rockets that can travel safely to space and now depends on Russia for manned landings..????    

Such things don't happen dude in the real world. The last thing a nation like United States will want..
is to be humiliated in Space by Russia.. from all embarrassing things could happen to Americans..
being defeated in Space is the worse one.. because Space helps create LEADERSHIP in the world.
Who leads in Space ,will attract the best international scientist and engineers and the nation will get
the biggest credit and most praised.. So to win in space is like to win the olympics a hundred of times..
win most the gold medals.. So is impossible that Americans will abandon the Saturn and apollo program..
that supposedly landed in the moon .. had it really landed there ..  The most logical thing to happen , after a nation lands on the moon ,with humans or with Robots. is to CONTINUE improving the technology.. you never reinvent the wheel.. once something works.. it works.. but this is exactly what NASA did.. after their supposed success
with the Saturn Rocket and Apollo.. they reinvent the wheel..and go for a far more expensive Space shuttle..which ended killing dozens of astronauts.. and after they lost 2 space shuttles.. they give up for 20 years the fabrication of rockets for space..and pass their national security ,their space program to Russia to save money ????

Such things are IMPOSSIBLE dude.. to happen.. The US government will NEVER allow their nation to depend
on Russia for such critical important technology.. like a space rocket.. but they do it. why ? because it was a hoax.
their space program never left the earth Orbit..  this is why they now in a race to build a shield against radiation..
before it was told by fanboys that radiation protection is not needed in the moon ,because is low.. Now NASA needs radiation protection..   BY the way dude.. the Gear you need to survive radiation..in the moon is very thick. the Rovers China used and Russia full covered in Gold and other strong metals..

Now take the photos that NASA took from the supposed moon landing.. in a CIVILIAN CAMERA  
with ZERO... ZERO protection for radiation..and still the photos were cristal clear.. and another amazing thing
is how centered were all the photos..  People Proffessionals ,that knows more of Photography that the astronauts..since all their lives lived taking photos.. they themselves say is IMPOSSIBLE ,the NASA photos on the moon.. NASA committed to show the numbers in the photos and upload them in series.. so photographers who
are experts in taking photos ,told that it takes dozens of shots to get 1 right.. and that it was impossible that
the astronauts could get it right on first shot ,self centered all the shots, without any imperfection.. in an extremely hostile environment..  (a civilian cameras freeze or melt in the moon) so it was Impossible that NASA could take
clear perfect centered pictures with a civilian camera.. in series.. without failing a single time.. this is more
crazy ,when you take the fact.. that the Astronauts.. could not look through the lens of the camera.. since
was attached to their chest..    So it was a hoax dude.. aside of NIXON speaking live with the astronauts
they responding without a single delay.. in real time.. but when you see today discussions of NASA with the ISS
that is much closer than the moon.. there is an annoying delay of seconds between conversations.. So there should be between 30 seconds to 1 minute delay.. there is no way to go around this with radio communications limitations.. since the moon is far away.. and radio signals are slow.. you will need Laser like communications ,to have a conversation without delay.. as Nixon had it with Astronauts on the fake moon. a powerful laser cannon aiming at a laser receiver in the moon..thats how could you do a real time communication without delay. but nixon apparently did not know it.. that it was impossible to communicate so clearly and fast ,instantly with the astronauts.. he could do it.. because the astronauts were  in an studio in Florida..   not in the moon..

There is No WAY in hell the moon landing happened.. not a chance in a million. The official story have Mountains
of problems to match reality.  In a highly radiating environment as the Moon is.. Even Electronics and plastic melts.. heavy radiation is similar to a nuclear accident..  In the accident of the nuclear reactor in Ukraine..i saw how Robots designed to work in radiation zones ,all failed.. their electrical circuits melts..because of the ionization of its structure.. Humans exposed to radiation ,can die in minutes.. So this is how bad it is.. this is why
you need a lot of Gold and thick metals protecting Rovers .. and Astronauts gear.. is full of electronics.. so needs protection from radiation.. Did i mention the Camera Neale armstrong had a CIVILIAN camera that had ZERO protection against radiation.. but it had no problems operating in the moon and in travel for 3 days..

Have you seen what happens to those old cameras when you expose  the film at the sun in earth ?
the radiation of the sun damage the photos..this is why you need dark rooms with special red lowlight
to process the photos.. but in the moon ,its lethal radiation could break robots.. but not a Kodak camera..  

another interesting problem for NASA was cooling.. and batteries.. the surface of the moon.. how bad it is?
Temperatures on the moon are very hot in the daytime, about 100 degrees C. At night, the lunar surface gets very cold, as cold as minus 173 degrees C.

So that Boiling water HOT , the temperature of moon surface.. good luck trying to find a cooling system
that could keep astronauts fresh in such extreme zones .and at night -173 celcius. ..will freeze you in seconds
without a massive prowerfull heater.. Simply NASA did not had such technology in the past.. and neither you have it today either to keep humans for days in the moon.  You will need a nuclear reactor like energy battery ,and very powerful big air conditioner for the lander and heaters in the moon working..  BEFORE you send any human there.

So a real moon landing ,will need to much machines and equipment to keep you alive.. protection against radiation ,protection against extreme heat ,protection against extreme Cold, and a portable nuclear reactor.. expecting solar energy dependent technology to keep you cooled or warm in the moon is insane.  Such technology does not exist today... Russia will need to send first heavy equipment ,and build a living place ,to be for days in the moon,without a real living place is non sense . and NASA and all the people like you who believed their story ,will be the laughing stock of the world.

Landing in the moon.. with humans , and they stay alive.. is much harder than going to the artic in the worse
time of year ,where is more cold.. and expect a civilian camera to not get frozen there.. with zero protection..
Is ridiculous dude.. what NASA did.. it was a hoax.. you will need a much larger expedition ,to land in the moon
with humans.. like 3-5 big landers with heavy equipment and portable nuclear reactors.. Because Solar panels is useless to generate enough electricity required to keep humans alive.. not boiling with the heat or not freezing in the moon nights. special rovers and Robots in the other hand can operate in such extreme conditions...

Vann7 wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:Remember folks, Vann the Internet Guy is smarter than people like Alexsey Leonov

Stupid Leonov for thinking that moon landing was not faked, what would he know anyway...

Soviets cosmonauts have NO fucking way to know what happened in the moon......

Vann, I will try to phrase this in away that even you should be able to understand:


Alexsey Leonov is titan of human scientific accomplishment, pioneer of space exploration and one of most experienced and knowledgeable space travel experts alive.

His word matters and that's final.




You, on the other hand, are some random irrelevant nobody of questionable IQ level and inbreeding status.

You don't get to talk about what Soviet cosmonauts know or not know!

Only way that your opinion on anything could ever matter is if it suddenly turned out that Earth is flat.

PapaDragon wrote:

Vann7 wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:Remember folks, Vann the Internet Guy is smarter than people like Alexsey Leonov

Stupid Leonov for thinking that moon landing was not faked, what would he know anyway...

Soviets cosmonauts have NO fucking way to know what happened in the moon......

Vann, I will try to phrase this in away that even you should be able to understand:


Alexsey Leonov is titan of human scientific accomplishment, pioneer of space exploration and one of most experienced and knowledgeable space travel experts alive.

His word matters and that's final.




You, on the other hand, are some random irrelevant nobody of questionable IQ level and inbreeding status.  

You don't get to talk about what Soviet cosmonauts know or not know!

Only way that your opinion on anything could ever matter is if it suddenly turned out that Earth is flat.

Not VANN, but i think he made good arguments(just read in diagonal dont like walls), we can agree or disagree dont see the need to offend...

Can Alexey Leonov prove That the man went to the Moon?

dino00 wrote:.........
Can Alexey Leonov prove That the man went to the Moon?

Any astronomer with access to decent telescope can.

And remember this tiny event Cold War? There was this little country called USSR that might have had some interest in proving it didn't happen and could have easily done so. They would have mentioned something before they kicked the bucket.

Anyone who buys into the whole fake moon landing conspiracy is moron degenerate of highest order on par with flat-earthers.

PapaDragon wrote:

dino00 wrote:.........
Can Alexey Leonov prove That the man went to the Moon?

Any astronomer with access to decent telescope can.

And remember this tiny event Cold War? There was this little country called USSR that might have had some interest in proving it didn't happen and could have easily done so. They would have mentioned something before they kicked the bucket.

Anyone who buys into the whole fake moon landing conspiracy is moron degenerate of highest order on par with flat-earthers.

Well so i Guess i am a moron degenerate of highest order until i see evidences of the man going to the Moon.
i dont believe That the earth is flat (strange thing to say in XXI Century)
Dont know why you compare both.

dino00 wrote:......
Well so i Guess i am a moron degenerate of highest order until i see evidences of the man going to the Moon.
i dont believe That the earth is flat (strange thing to say in XXI Century)
Dont know why you compare both.

I compare them because both require similar level of sheer stupidity. And you haven't explained why would Soviets keep their mouths shut.

But for entertainment sakes I'll ask: what "evidences" that moon landing took place would satisfy keen scientific mind such as your own?

[/quote]

I compare them because both require similar level of sheer stupidity. And you haven't explained why would Soviets keep their mouths shut.

But for entertainment sakes I'll ask: what "evidences" that moon landing took place would satisfy keen scientific mind such as your own?[/quote]

Nothing fancy Go there again with astronauts of other nationalities, Russian Cosmonauts, live stream...etc

I dont trust the same people who lied on every single big event on the last Century for free. Doing that would require an astonomic level of sheer stupidity.

dino00 wrote:....
Nothing fancy Go there again with astronauts of other nationalities, Russian Cosmonauts, live stream...etc

I dont trust the same people who lied on every single big event on the last Century for free. Doing that would require an astonomic level of sheer stupidity.

And how are we to know that Russia will not fake that livestream? Unless you are there personally?

Not many people would trust a country that lied about quite a few big events over last century (yes, Russia)

Also, when you said "go there again" that implies that someone has been there already

PapaDragon wrote:

dino00 wrote:.........
Can Alexey Leonov prove That the man went to the Moon?

Any astronomer with access to decent telescope can.

And remember this tiny event Cold War? There was this little country called USSR that might have had some interest in proving it didn't happen and could have easily done so. They would have mentioned something before they kicked the bucket.

Anyone who buys into the whole fake moon landing conspiracy is moron degenerate of highest order on par with flat-earthers.

lol telescope from earth cant proof a shit ... lol

How can you know astronauts landed in the moon that is 327km away ?> are you serious.. ?
you will not see the astronauts playing golf in the moon ,, as NASA claimed , with a telescope

your hero is full of shit.. RT ,that is Russian government media.. even is hinting from time to time
that the NASA program was fake.. this is why revive the topic all the time..

Because you are an ignorant one of the biggest one in the forum.. and can't read between the lines .. when a Russian media draw the attention to the Moon controversial moon landing.. lets show you what western media
managed to see ,when reading RT reports about NASA and the moon.  Pay attention to the headlines.

Russia calls investigation into whether US moon landings happened
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-calls-investigation-into-whether-us-moon-landings-happened-10327714.html

A close government official of Putin ,was calling for an international lawsuit against NASA ,for fraud..
to find the place of the moon rocks ,nasa claimed they had..

So why would Russian government media constantly create reports ,that tells people ,hey there is a controversy
in the moon.. are you listening? are you paying attention?

America NEVER landed on the moon, Russia's Vladimir Markin ... [b]
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3130017/Russian-official-demands-investigation-really-happened-moon-landing-original-footage-disappeared.html

[b]Did NASA really land on the Moon? - Russia wants ... - Daily Express  
https://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/587569/NASA-really-land-Moon-Russia-probes-missing-video-lunar-rock-faked-hoax-astronaut

Russian Official Calls for an Investigation into Apollo Moon Landings ...
https://www.iflscience.com/space/russian-official-calls-investigation-apollo-moon-landings/

and the most interesting thing of all.. is not that a Putin right hand officer.. close aided..
mentions the words NASA ,Moon ,FRAUD and international LAWSUIT  in the same sentence.. for the idiots
that don't pay attention.. but that Putin did not commented about this.. he remained totally
silent and did not reprimmended his officer.    Putin could have ended
all the controversy by saying.. Stop with the non sense.. NASA did landed in the moon.. we know it..
but silence of Putin after his officer petition for an international investigation about Fraud done by NASA
with the moon rocks.. this is VERY TELLING..  is also funny how he say.. "this is not that we doubt
that NASA did not landed in the moon.." noo noo.. don't think that way..    is because we want
to make sure that those important rocks ,NASA captured from the moon.. are not lost.. and properly
traced the place they are..     This is told because NASA don't know themseves where are all the moon
rocks they bring from the moon.     they lost the telemetry data that they could use to Proof they landed
and they also lost the technology to bypass radiation..  astronauts did not lose their heads and legs because was attached to their bodies..


How idiotic they thing people is?
obviously such NASA claims works with fools but more smarter people don't fall for that.


So what we have ? Journalist with brains... GOT THE MESSAGE... that RT was hinting the moon landing
was FAKE...

This is like the 5th Report of RT.. that Hints.. NASA  did NOT landed in the moon...
i will post again when they revive one more time the controversy.  

The previous time.. it was another news..in RT  of  Moscow University seeking to "end for once"
the controversy of NASA and the moon.  

are you paying attention Mr Blind what Russia government media is doing ?
Micro-satellite to inspect if Americans did land on Moon


Mr ignorance . just put me in ignore list
and you will me save me a lot of time..   and i don't need RT or any lying Cosmonaut to know
NASA Faked the moon,, i did my own investigation long time ago..and Russia is going to expose it..
in less than 10 years you will see this happening. this is Russia sending signals to Americans.. that Russia will expose them.. is very clear the message of the kremlin by frequent reports in RT ,creating doubts about NASA moon landing  by reviving the controversy.

This is why is very important that Russia land in the moon first..with humans.. the space race is not over.
Because if Americans lands first..in 2030 or 2025.. in the  future.. then it will be another missing opportunity
to provoke a major backslash on US and damage the nation image world wide . This also will also put into
question other space programs of NASA , like MARS.. if they lied in the moon. then more easily they will lie
about mars.. This means that the hundred of billions dollars $$ NASA spend in space will go down the toilet,
if NASA exposed for cheating in the moon and nobody trust again on any video or picture of NASA.. so the intention to promote America as a leader in space will fail.. if people totally distrust of NASA ,after the moon
fiasco.  Im sure NASA will try to do a moon landing for real without hollywood next time..  but it will not matter ,if Russia lands first and expose NASA fake moon landing.    it will be a massive PR disaster for US and NASA
and the laughing stock in the world if Russia shows the fraud by landing in the place where NASA supposedly landed..and nothing is there. the investigations of where the money was used for NASA to go to the moon,
will shut down the agency..and send many politicians to jail Russia can take a huge monumental advantage of
this NASA scandal with their fake landing.. but only if Russia reach the moon first.. with a manned mission.