The Situation in the Ukraine. #28

Russia is a more unique case of a countries economy and structure.

It's actually a real economy and structure. Even China is fraught with fraud and heavy amounts of paint to hide an issue.

Sure China has the population and the industrial base
.but it's actually a small portion of China, concentrated in the south east. While rest of rural China isn't as developed really. And I'm the city, you got of course mass corruption in the construction industry. Which might I add is a massive provider to China's GDP growth. Ghost cities were part of that. China is though slowly fixing this issue.

Russia on the other hand doesn't rely on massive construction programs that are over inflated costs to drive up economic numbers. Instead, it does so at a budget so they can get it done, working and on the cheap without needing to borrow. In turn, this doesn't inflate the economy as much.

If Russia really wanted to see massive number GSP growth, then it has to Invest in the Urals and central Russia. Build grand infrastructure and mass buildings for population. Issue is, then what? What about jobs? Russia doesn't have the population to just go in and create all this infrastructure and expect people to occupy it

So instead, they do the honest yet smart method - cheap, effective and useful. Sure, doesn't look good on paper. But reality is different.

But there are indeed areas that need modernization and cheaper resources.

A batch of 60 French ATGM have arrived. Can't find the photo.

Backman wrote:

PhSt wrote:It seems China is doing a better job in pacifying and promoting its influence among its neighbors,.

Nah. Its not that simple. Hong Kong was a total embarrassment that they lost control over. When Ted Cruz shows up inside your territory and has his name spray painted on the wall, you really F'd up. I support China against the US but Xi has to man the F up and not allow such embarrassments as Hong Kong

China lost control? Embarrassment? Did I miss something?

Sure China has the population and the industrial base
.but it's actually a small portion of China, concentrated in the south east. While rest of rural China isn't as developed really

This is nonsense. China has made huge leaps in increasing prosperity and spurring development in its rural provinces, with cities like Chengdu, Chongqing, Wuhan, Hefei, Changsha and Zhengzhou now being the motor of China's economic growth

And I'm the city, you got of course mass corruption in the construction industry. Which might I add is a massive provider to China's GDP growth. Ghost cities were part of that.

The housing market is still overheated (and overpriced) and ghost cities are nothing but a BS story. In fact I lived for 3 years plus in one of the cities (Changzhou) where 'ghost towns' were, according to the interwebz, were apparantly a thing and its all BS

Which might I add is a massive provider to China's GDP growth.

Yeah, not really. In fact it's the opposite. China's GDP is massively understated because they keep the yuan artificially low. It's still an export based economy and not doing so would hurt their manufacturing base.

The moment you'll see the yuan thriving towards its actual value is the moment China will transform from a export based economy to a savings based economy.


In the next 10/15 years we will see the launch of the digital Yuan, which will coincide with establishing the Rmb as a strong currency that will overtake the US$ first in East and SE Asia, then in most of the third world. The Yuan will be worth around $3-$4 by the end of the decade, double what it is worth today, and China's GDP will be around $40-$50 trillion, about 50% larger than what the US GDP will be in 2030. If you measure the weight of their public sector as % of their GDP their are below all Western countries. In 2020 alone they signed several vital trade agreements, most notably the CAD with the EU and of course the RCEP in Asia. Their ethno-nationalist ideology and anti-degenerative stance make their society much healthier than any other

One key aspect of this pivot to the digital Yuan is that China is effectively bypassing and ending the fractional reserve debt-based Fed private banking system. This is the main reason you're going to see growing hostility from the US and the West towards China this decade

Backman wrote:

elconquistador wrote:

Backman wrote:

PhSt wrote:]

China lost control? Embarrassment? Did I miss something?

Maybe you did

Even the Ukraine Nazis came to get their picture taken in Hong Kong to shill for American imperialism aka freedom. Thats loosing control of the situation in my books.

So if I travel to Russia and I take a picture wearing a shirt of Navalny it means Putin has lost control?

Or if, let's say, a bunch of foreign diplomats decide to crash a pro-Navalny demonstration, or if high ranking foreign emissaries conspire against the rightful government of Russia it means Putin/Russia has embarrassed himself/itself?

HK was a big fat win for Xi and the world knows it. HK is back in the fold, much earlier than expected dare I say. The globalist controlled banks and financial institutions (situated in HK mostly) are purged. The foreign agents and networks have exposed themselves in the protest, fifth column types have been rooted out and the 'one country, two systems' nonsense is now in the garbage bin

Before Taiwan will become an issue Thailand and Myanmar have become battlefields. You probably already know what I think is going to happen

Paging Mr Garry

Paging Mr Garry

Don't know what those posts are doing in this thread.

Please move to TB.

Thanks in anticipation.

There are insistent rumours that the conflict in the Donbass will be unfrozen this spring, shelling restarted, deployment of heavy weapons, cocky talk from the nazis, even the blocking of the Crimean channel prepared and pre-emptively given as a reason for what Russia will do... forcing their authority is the only thing the gentlemen in DC know, and it is time to stop pouring money on the ukie bottomless pit and start getting some concrete action against Russia from them instead (i.e. for them to start putting the corpses of their people on the table). One wonders if they can actually be so stupid to legitimize what comes next from Russia and the Russians in current Ukrainian lands, but never stop your enemy while they are royally fucking up...

kvs wrote:

Firebird wrote:I'm a huge Putin fan historically. But I'm starting to wonder, what the hell is he playing at?

1)The Russian majority of the Ukrainain area are clearly being persecuted and attemptedly brainwashed.
2)The most recent incarnation of this garbage started in 2014 with the American coup.
We were all told "Russian soft power will win". Has it happened since Georgia in 2008? What about Armenia which was one of the 5 Eurasian Union states?Even Belarus which was a "foregone conclusion" for reintegrationw ith Russia, is dicking around, despite no real pro-West inclination. Soft power hasn't happened, atleast not so far. It just encourages America to sow more and more evil.
3)What has Russia done back to America or the other Nazis in the EU?
Its like someone blocking the punches of an asssaillant, and copping a few direct hits. Does the attacker stop? Nope the attacker just thinks he's dealing with an idiot or a coward.
Why hasn't Russia supported the blacks, the Hispanics, the Red Indians, Hawaians and armed them in their "struggle for freedom"? Why hasn't Russia supported the Scottish, Welsh, Basques, Catalans etc against the EU's main powers?
Russia hasn't done a SINGLE THING back.

Can someone in the know, or with a good idea, tell me what Russia plans to do here?
Otherwise maybe its time to hand the Kremlin to Zhiranovsky who would happily bomb the Banderites to smithereens.
Its a very sad state of affairs. And I say that as someone who's paternal side are all from Kiev and the Ukrainian area (Russian not hohol BTW).

So what do you propose?   That Russia invade this toilet and "save" it?   That sounds nice, but in reality it is a nightmare
for Russia.   It would have to sink on the order of $50 billion per year to prop up Ukraine's collapsed economy.   If it did not
spend any money on Ukraine's economy, it would just enable the anti-Russian 40% to argue that Russia is a big bad occupant.

The current policy on Ukraine is ideal.   It is succeeding in fully discrediting the anti-Russian elements in the country who
are utterly failing to deliver on their promised "prosperity without the Russian yoke".    And here is where the critical detail
resides, it is up to the Ukrainian majority who are alleged to be pro-Russian, to clean their own asses.   I see little evidence
of true pro-Russian sentiments in Banderastan.  There are just people who think that they can restore the old times.   These
people are not Russia's real friends.   They are leeches who never tried to stop the anti-Russian elements even before the
collapse of the USSR.  

Keeping out of Ukraine is also putting that failed state in NATzO's lap.   You can hear NATzO officials whine about how Russia
should support Ukraine for its own good.   That was stated by at least one German official.   Then you have the farce over
Nord Stream 2, which is clearly a pathetic attempt to provide Ukraine welfare at the expense of Russia by forcing Russian
gas transit through Ukraine.  NATzO has shown Ukrainians that it can't put its money where its mouth is.   Seriously, Russia
is supposed to feed enemy Ukraine billions of dollars per year, but Ukraine's bestest new pals in NATzO can't even give it
some IMF loans?   For real?  

I'm not clear what you are saying?
Are you saying Russia should give up on its own lands and its own people for ever, and let Yankistan take over, and turn them all into rabid Russia haters, with US missiles parked?

Why the hell should supposedly a proud and powerful nation let some cesspool of Neoliberal degeneracy on the other side of the World dictate that the Russian language should be banned, and that Russian speakers should be classed as 4th class citizens or even foreigners in the birthplace and traditional epicentre of Russia?
Should Russia give up on Belarus too? How about the Caucuses? Maybe Siberia and Tatarstan, if America decides it wants to poke its nose in? Call Moscow Navalny-land?

Putin was fighting with Liberast pricks who would happily take American dicks up their arses, and have the Ukraine slaughtering even more Russians. So we give him time with "soft power". What has soft power done.. anywhere? Even Belarus and Armenia (Eurasian Union members) aren't looking like solid partners right now.

You talking about Russians in the East and South learning to "wipe their own asses". Well who fucked their asses up in the first place. Clowns like Yeltsin, Krushchev, Stalin with his "Ukrainification" and "Chauvinism of nations" nonsense speeches. The Commonwealth agreement was never to have the key regions completely split up, it was more like the United KIngdon/Britain in arrangement.

How the hell can the Russian people "clean their own asses" when Russian is banned and they are black listed from improtant jobs. Its delegating control of the Ukraine to Washington DC/Brussels. Russian people in Kharkiv/Odessa etc aren't leeches, neither are people in the centre/Kiev. Yes the Lvov-its are scum. But Russia doesn't need to convince those filth. It needs to convince the "middle ground". And it looks like its given up. The Russian-most 1/3rd is being terrorised by the Lvov-ites. And America/the Bander-shite are brainwashing the middle 1/3rd. Russia doesn't need to convince everyone, just a sizeable chunk and key positions.

America doesn't need to put money into the Ukraine. Its not Taiwan. It just wants to taunt Russia and create misery amongst her people. And make the World think Russia is weak and fading into oblivion. Its not all about money anyway. Its about playing hard rather than like a jelly.

Here's what I'd do.
1)Take the fight to America and the EU members. Set up paramilitaries/separatists, all manner of filth and maniacs. The only reason America doesn't nuke Russia, is that Russia will nuke it back. Apply the same rules in nation-destroying.
2)Carrot and stick. Offer money for businesses dependent on Russia.
3)Appeal to opinion formers and groups of significance. Target the army with its proud ties with Russia. Target film and media and celebrities which need Russian langauge to be economically viable.
4)Take the economic war to Russia's enemies. Counterfeit US and European brands on a massive scale if they continue persecuting Russians. This is Cold War 2.
5)Prepare for a war with the Banderites. Seriously, who gives a piece of shit about them?
6)Blackmail,hacking and intimidation are fair game against evil. I'm thinking Banderites and their supporters.
Even America admits its no match for the FSB in the Ukraine. Too many cultural and linguistic differences for a start. You can't do Marquess of Queensbury rules in a gunfight. So why does Russia attempt to do so vs the US?
7)Create misery, violence and the like in Galicia. And get Kiev, the South and East eager to reintegrate. Not by handouts, but by intelligent collaborations based around compatibility of business and culture.
8)Look at federalisation as the solution. Once the critical power of Kiev is reduced, regions will look to their natural allies. Just plonk some Russian bases in the Banderite area, and ignore them economically. Tell them they cant have Yankee bases there because the constitution forbids it. If they complain, let a nearby region crush them. You need to crack a few eggs to make an omelette.
Divide the regions up psychologically if you can't convince the whole mass. Thats forcing federalisation. And that will force reintegration for what is worth reintegrating.

Russia should keep it's own money for itself and wait until that rathole is gradually depopulated

Once that happens they need to take control of it with minimum investment of effort and resources

The Ukrainians first need to learn to stop expecting access to luxuries like above subsistence income, education of all kinds, healthcare (free or otherwise), electricity, running water, drinking water, offspring and other stuff that Russia would be stuck paying for in any amount

Once that happens they will become suitable for minimum investment in exchange for literally everything with all legal risks and responsibilities going to the Ukrainians of course, it's free market after all

PapaDragon wrote:
Russia should keep it's own money for itself and wait until that rathole is gradually depopulated

Once that happens they need to take control of it with minimum investment of effort and resources

The Ukrainians first need to learn to stop expecting access to luxuries like above subsistence income, education of all kinds, healthcare (free or otherwise), electricity, running water, drinking water, offspring and other stuff that Russia would be stuck paying for in any amount

Once that happens they will become suitable for minimum investment in exchange for literally everything with all legal risks and responsibilities going to the Ukrainians of course, it's free market after all

Much of the breeding population has now left. The older population, usually left behind when the breeders and workers left, are dying off due to bad weather, bad conditions, bad food and probably finally Covid accelerating deaths.

I'd give it probably until the gas revenues drop hard, so maybe 4 years or so, before the country splits into its natural parts. Probably before that if the UKies get desperate and force some action. Even then the Russians, apart from protecting their own, will be in no hurry to move say any further than the oblast borders. The rest can wait.

If the Ukies stop the water then expect Russia to stop the coal.

https://twitter.com/shinobi22427722/status/1368246771370127370

More and more armor entering #donbass direction #donetsk , seems that #ukraine is begging for another beating

DPR Foreign Ministry views missile strike at Donetsk as Kiev’s wish to start fighting in region

Head of the DPR: Kiev is preparing for a new war in the Donbass

The head of the DPR Denis Pushilin said that Kiev is actively preparing for the resumption of hostilities in the Donbass.

According to the leader of the self-proclaimed republic, "foreign advisers" and sabotage groups are gathering to the border with the DPR. "This is now the main threat," Pushilin said.

He added that the Ukrainian negotiators were instructed by Kiev to " block any agreements in all subgroups." "This is another sign that they are preparing for war," the head of the DPR stressed.

In addition, Pushilin accused the Ukrainian authorities of not allowing humanitarian convoys, including the Red Cross, to pass through.

Over the past day, three people were killed in the Donbas, and another was wounded as a result of shelling by Ukrainian security forces. At the same time, Kiev uses weapons prohibited by the Minsk agreements. The day before, the south of the unrecognized DPR was fired from mortars, and the north of Donetsk - from "Grads". According to the Minsk agreements, such weapons simply should not be on the front line. The last time rocket launchers were fired in the Donbas was almost three years ago.

https://www.ntv.ru/novosti/2520840/

Are they shooting back at least?

miketheterrible wrote:Are they shooting back at least?

They were given permission to fire back whenever attacked last week.

The whole Ukrainan story is quite interesting.

They made lot of money from the Russian gas and oil.

From the transit and the cheap purchase /resell to europe.

Now, from the middle of 2000 the Russians started to take the gas selling as a business, not as a charity, that made the Ukrainan oligarch poorer , lacking the billions of revenue.

they had the option for loands, but they wanted proper free money.


They fall to the trap of the USA with the rubbsih talk about money, trade and stuff like that, but there was nothing beyond that from there .

USA doens't want give money, there is no trade , so they just managed to get sold for empty promises.

Now the transit money fall to 1.2 billion/year, that most likely just enought to keep running the network, from the 3 billion/year in prior time , from the 5-7 billion/year prime times.

DPR head: Kiev prepares for a new war in Donbass

Auto translated into English

https://vk.com/novnews?z=video-50332460_456317325%2F88632db9c4a668254c%2Fpl_wall_-50332460

Head of DNR Denis Pushilin on Solovev live.

Novorussian artilery made heavy strikes on Ukrainian army positions in response on Ukrainian attacks.

Adviser to the head of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Ukraine: Russia will not use military aircraft in Donbass

In Ukraine, there was an interview with the adviser to the head of the Ministry of Internal Affairs Valeriy Potseluyko, in which issues of Ukrainian "integrity" and security were raised. According to Potseluyko, Kiev has a strategy to "de-occupy" the territories of Donbass, which the Ministry of Internal Affairs is "ready to implement."

According to the adviser Arsen Avakov, the Interior Ministry is ready to "liberate Donbass".

Valery Potseuiko:

For this, only one thing is needed - an appropriate decision of the country's top leadership.

According to the adviser to the head of the Ukrainian Ministry of Internal Affairs, "important steps have already been taken." Mr. Potseluiko called such steps the closure of the channels, which, according to Kiev, were controlled by Viktor Medvedchuk, the leader of the political movement Opposition Platform - For Life. This political movement some time ago came out on top in the country in terms of the level of approval from the citizens of Ukraine.

Kiss said that "the response to the closure of TV channels may be an aggravation in the war." At the same time, Avakov's advisor claims that this aggravation "can be carried out by Russia." According to him, "while there (in the Donbass) it is quite difficult to conduct hostilities":

The fields need to be dry. We are ready not only for an aggravation, but even for a full-fledged invasion, and it will be crushing for Russia.

During the interview, Kissuiko was asked whether Kiev is ready for the fact that “Russia will use its military Aviation».

Advisor to the head of the Ministry of Internal Affairs:

Russia will not use combat aircraft.
.
Then Kiss explained why this will not happen:

Because they always say, "They are not there." And we have our own aviation, plus support from the West. Believe me, if something happens, the answer will be equal.

As a result, Kissuiko added that a decision by President Zelensky and the Verkhovna Rada is needed to "return Donbass".

https://en.topwar.ru/180630-sovetnik-glavy-mvd-ukrainy-rossija-ne-stanet-primenjat-boevuju-aviaciju-na-donbasse.html

From the many statements the Nazis are doing lately, it seems clear to me that the Biden administration has promised them "to stand with the people of Ukraine", and these retards are inferring that the US is going to war with Russia over their Ukrainian serfs... and at the Russian border, where they would lose even if they tried with all they have. Yeah sure. The only thing US wants from this escalation is more headlines to continue ramping up pressure on Europe and try to further isolate Russia. The amount of ukies killed is not even a parameter in their calculations...