Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6

kvs wrote:The whole "debate" is moronic.   As if the people who wrote the book (manual, whatever; it was not Americans or NATzO members)
on the stealth EM applied mathematics cannot conduct simulations using those equations to test any design they produce.
Somehow those equations are good enough when Americans use them, but become worthless when their authors use them.
NATzO fanbois are certifiable retards or frothing at the mouth haters.

TMA1 wrote:The J-20 is hyped by western press which drives me nuts. It is a flagrant collection of copied systems. The fighter itself looks like a mig 1.42 modified with almost identical western stealth features. I remember in 2015 the Chinese were asking to work with russian firms to develop an AESA radar for the fighter. And just a couple years later when it came out they were saying it had a superior AESA radar and Russian kit is totally outdated. Ridiculous.

And dont get me started on their new air to air missiles. One thing I notice that China has been doing lately is trying to one-up Russia. Remember when images from videos showed an su-35 firing an r-37m and su-57s carrying new r-77ms? China was showing some new missiles a couple days before. Russia comes out with new information about the product 30? Just a couple days before that China says development on ws-15 is ahead of schedule. Seen it multiple times when any news comes out about Russian development.

Russia should not be selling anything to China, especially not the su-57. They are not even really true allies. Communist China would gladly backstab anyone for what they would see as sensible reasons.

miketheterrible wrote:Well, the J-20 is a clear rip off of Russian MiG 1.42

And yeah, their so called AESA is heavily questionable.

Add to that, if Indian mod is to be trusted, they spotted a j-20 near Tibet India border from a Su-30MKI (Bars M) from 180km bringing the j-20's stealth to heavy speculation.

J-20 is a piece of shit like nearly everything China produces.  That's no secret.  Hence why poor ass African nations are more interested in the Chinese equipment. Asian nations who buy Chinese equipment are buying equipment that is roughly half Chinese and the rest major components are from either Russia or Europe

Tai Hai Chen wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:Well, the J-20 is a clear rip off of Russian MiG 1.42

And yeah, their so called AESA is heavily questionable.

Add to that, if Indian mod is to be trusted, they spotted a j-20 near Tibet India border from a Su-30MKI (Bars M) from 180km bringing the j-20's stealth to heavy speculation.

J-20 is a piece of shit like nearly everything China produces.  That's no secret.  Hence why poor ass African nations are more interested in the Chinese equipment. Asian nations who buy Chinese equipment are buying equipment that is roughly half Chinese and the rest major components are from either Russia or Europe

J-20 is no joke. It's said to be the most capable fighter jet in the world right now. DSI is something not even Russians and Europeans can do. It's basically a twin engined F-35 with better aerodynamics.

TMA1 wrote:The J-20 is hyped by western press which drives me nuts. It is a flagrant collection of copied systems. The fighter itself looks like a mig 1.42 modified with almost identical western stealth features. I remember in 2015 the Chinese were asking to work with russian firms to develop an AESA radar for the fighter. And just a couple years later when it came out they were saying it had a superior AESA radar and Russian kit is totally outdated. Ridiculous.

And dont get me started on their new air to air missiles. One thing I notice that China has been doing lately is trying to one-up Russia. Remember when images from videos showed an su-35 firing an r-37m and su-57s carrying new r-77ms? China was showing some new missiles a couple days before. Russia comes out with new information about the product 30? Just a couple days before that China says development on ws-15 is ahead of schedule. Seen it multiple times when any news comes out about Russian development.

Russia should not be selling anything to China, especially not the su-57. They are not even really true allies. Communist China would gladly backstab anyone for what they would see as sensible reasons.

lancelot wrote:

TMA1 wrote:The J-20 is hyped by western press which drives me nuts. It is a flagrant collection of copied systems. The fighter itself looks like a mig 1.42 modified with almost identical western stealth features. I remember in 2015 the Chinese were asking to work with russian firms to develop an AESA radar for the fighter. And just a couple years later when it came out they were saying it had a superior AESA radar and Russian kit is totally outdated. Ridiculous.

And dont get me started on their new air to air missiles. One thing I notice that China has been doing lately is trying to one-up Russia. Remember when images from videos showed an su-35 firing an r-37m and su-57s carrying new r-77ms? China was showing some new missiles a couple days before. Russia comes out with new information about the product 30? Just a couple days before that China says development on ws-15 is ahead of schedule. Seen it multiple times when any news comes out about Russian development.

Russia should not be selling anything to China, especially not the su-57. They are not even really true allies. Communist China would gladly backstab anyone for what they would see as sensible reasons.

I would not downrate the Chinese AESA radar capabilities. The Chinese are one of the leaders in telecommunications today and a modern radar isn't all that different from a cellphone tower.
The Chinese also have a more advanced semiconductor manufacturing industry than Russia. A decade or two ago things might have been different but not today.
Actually I expect the Chinese semiconductor industry to even beat the US semiconductor industry in 5 years time.

It is true that the J-20 looks like a MiG 1.42 though. With regards to their air to air missiles, since they haven't been proven in combat your guess is as good as mine.
They did have access to Israeli missiles at one point though so not all of it must be shit. The Israelis are one of the few countries which does a lot of air combat.

With regards to China or backstabbing, or whatever, you have to remember that after the USSR crumbled the Chinese actually made a deal with Russia to solve the longstanding border issues. There was minimal exchange of land to China (perhaps a couple of small river islands). Compare that with what HATO made with both former Warsaw Pact nations and even former USSR republics after promising Gorbachev they wouldn't expand East.

Can someone enlighten me on what is so great about non variable intakes in a jet that's supposed to fly fast and at high altitude ?

It's basically a twin engined F-35 with better aerodynamics.

Doubt there's going to be any Su-57 production jet delivered this year.

I would not downrate the Chinese AESA radar capabilities. The Chinese are one of the leaders in telecommunications today and a modern radar isn't all that different from a cellphone tower.
The Chinese also have a more advanced semiconductor manufacturing industry than Russia. A decade or two ago things might have been different but not today.
Actually I expect the Chinese semiconductor industry to even beat the US semiconductor industry in 5 years time.

By that logic F-15 is a complete monkey see monkey do level copy of the MiG-25. 2 rudders, 2 intakes, 2 engines. hurrrrr. What about EF and rafale? What about Su-57 and YF-23?

lancelot wrote:

TMA1 wrote:The J-20 is hyped by or AESA radar and Russian kit is totally outdated. Ridiculous.
republics after promising Gorbachev they wouldn't expand East.

Not to defend the chinese, but its downright moronic on american levels to claim that the j-20 is a copy of the MiG 1.44. In what way? having canards? Their fuselages
look nothing alike. By that logic F-15 is a complete monkey see monkey do level copy of the MiG-25. 2 rudders, 2 intakes, 2 engines. hurrrrr. What about EF and rafale? What about Su-57 and YF-23?

limb wrote:

lancelot wrote:

TMA1 wrote:The J-20 is hyped by western press which drives me nuts. It is a flagrant collection of copied systems. The fighter itself looks like a mig 1.42 modified with almost identical western stealth features. I remember in 2015 the Chinese were asking to work with russian firms to develop an AESA radar for the fighter. And just a couple years later when it came out they were saying it had a superior AESA radar and Russian kit is totally outdated. Ridiculous.

And dont get me started on their new air to air missiles. One thing I notice that China has been doing lately is trying to one-up Russia. Remember when images from videos showed an su-35 firing an r-37m and su-57s carrying new r-77ms? China was showing some new missiles a couple days before. Russia comes out with new information about the product 30? Just a couple days before that China says development on ws-15 is ahead of schedule. Seen it multiple times when any news comes out about Russian development.

Russia should not be selling anything to China, especially not the su-57. They are not even really true allies. Communist China would gladly backstab anyone for what they would see as sensible reasons.

I would not downrate the Chinese AESA radar capabilities. The Chinese are one of the leaders in telecommunications today and a modern radar isn't all that different from a cellphone tower.
The Chinese also have a more advanced semiconductor manufacturing industry than Russia. A decade or two ago things might have been different but not today.
Actually I expect the Chinese semiconductor industry to even beat the US semiconductor industry in 5 years time.

It is true that the J-20 looks like a MiG 1.42 though. With regards to their air to air missiles, since they haven't been proven in combat your guess is as good as mine.
They did have access to Israeli missiles at one point though so not all of it must be shit. The Israelis are one of the few countries which does a lot of air combat.

With regards to China or backstabbing, or whatever, you have to remember that after the USSR crumbled the Chinese actually made a deal with Russia to solve the longstanding border issues. There was minimal exchange of land to China (perhaps a couple of small river islands). Compare that with what HATO made with both former Warsaw Pact nations and even former USSR republics after promising Gorbachev they wouldn't expand East.

Not to defend the chinese, but its downright moronic on american levels to claim that the j-20 is a copy of the MiG 1.44. In what way? having canards? Their fuselages
look nothing alike. By that logic F-15 is a complete monkey see monkey do level copy of the MiG-25. 2 rudders, 2 intakes, 2 engines. hurrrrr. What about EF and rafale? What about Su-57 and YF-23?

limb wrote:

lancelot wrote:

TMA1 wrote:.

I would not downrate the Chinese AESA radar capabilities. The Chinese are one of the leaders in telecommunications today and a modern radar isn't all that different from a cellphone tower.
The Chi

Holy shit, we know that the Chinese comissioned Russian KB's to design blueprints. Kamov did the research for the Z-10. The 1.44 was used as template by the Chinese. They do not deny it.

EF and Rafale are ironically different in every aspect and it shows on the efficiency. YF vs PakFa...ok never go full retard.

miketheterrible wrote:I think the reason was that they never used the YF was because
1) more expensive
2) Lockheed Martin has a stronger influence in US politics.

YF-23 was a rather good design and it wouldnt be a bad idea to grab some influence designs from it.

Backman wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

limb wrote:

lancelot wrote:

TMA1 wrote:.

I would not downrate the Chinese AESA radar capabilities. The Chinese are one of the leaders in telecommunications today and a modern radar isn't all that different from a cellphone tower.
The Chi

Holy shit, we know that the Chinese comissioned Russian KB's to design blueprints. Kamov did the research for the Z-10. The 1.44 was used as template by the Chinese. They do not deny it.

EF and Rafale are ironically different in every aspect and it shows on the efficiency. YF vs PakFa...ok never go full retard.

I dunno if its full retard. Copy accusations are just fun.  If you had to pick an aircraft that shared the most similarities with the su 57, it would have to be the YF-23. They are both true blend wings.

https://worldwarwings.com/russias-latest-fighter-stolen-american-design-evidence-say/