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Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko

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Post n°126

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko Tue Aug 20, 2024 1:13 pm

Russia takes everyone, by Elena Karaeva for RiaNovosti. 08.20.2024.

Our country has once again taken a step that few expected from it: the head of state signed a decree that speaks of the possibility of coming and settling in Russia without any conditions, without knowledge of the language, a work permit and other bureaucracy for all those who do not agree to live in handcuffs, shackles and the muzzles of political correctness.

When the norm has to be not so much hidden, but its demonstration can end in a lawsuit, when children have to be protected from the “rainbow agenda” almost from kindergarten, and when feelings and emotions, in accordance with the neoliberal newspeak, were called “relationships.”

"Tell me, do you love him?" - "No, we just have a relationship."

The stunning irresponsibility, when normal human communities, large and small, cells of society and the foundations of society, from which the globalists drove all this, and quite, it must be said, briskly and successfully, “beyond Mozha”, somehow suddenly ended.

Now anyone, absolutely anyone, married, single or single, with or without children, can pack a suitcase, board a plane or a train and come to us.

This is how the document itself says about it: "In order to protect fundamental human rights and freedoms, to support individuals who have made a free choice in favor of spiritual, cultural and legal ties with the Russian Federation <…> I decree <…> to grant the right to apply for a temporary residence permit without taking into account the quota approved by the Government of the Russian Federation and without submitting a document confirming proficiency in the Russian language, knowledge of the history of Russia and the fundamentals of the legislation of the Russian Federation to foreign citizens and stateless persons who have expressed a desire to move to the Russian Federation for residence from foreign countries of their citizenship <…> on the grounds of non-acceptance of the implemented <…> policy, which imposes destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes."

No standing in lines, no signing up for a consular appointment, just come to the Russian diplomatic mission, say "Please help us!", and Russia will do everything to help.

I don't even want to imagine how the eyes of professional, high-paid and generously-bonused human rights defenders of no less colorful NGOs, whose names for some reason always begin with the word "open", fell out. Society, country, thought.

The state, which for the last couple of centuries, and what couple, all the time of its existence was, according to their terminology, either a "prison of nations" or "Ze (or Le) GULAG", as a result, judging by its deeds, turns out to be the freest, that is, the most open country on the planet.

While the US is building a wall with Mexico , while fences and hedges are being erected in Eastern Europe , while control over what people say, think, and write is being tightened wherever possible, while specially trained experts are combing social networks in search of non-mainstream statements and other dissent, Russia is saying: "Come and come to us without any conditions, simply because you want to hide from all this hell of surveillance and denunciation. Here you will find refuge, shelter, food, and a home. And, what is also very important, you will not be perceived as strangers or enemies. You are the same as us, well, you just don’t speak Russian yet. But never mind, you will start speaking. And you will speak quickly."

It is in Europe , especially in France , for example, that visitors - any, regardless of their property value - are looked at the way soldiers used to look at lice. The wrong accent, the wrong manners, the smile not too wide.

And in Russia, a simple "hello", pronounced with a cute lisp, will open all doors. By the way, it is characteristic that despite the Western press's scare tactics against expats - whether from New Zealand , Germany , or Britain - almost none of them have left. They haven't closed their businesses. Everyone is happy, not in "relationships", but in love. They are raising children. Of any skin color, with joy and pleasure, as they say in our film "Circus".

While neoliberal NGOs and other globalist-funded communities are running around looking for signs of "racism" and "xenophobia" wherever they can, the presidential decree, and it is important to emphasize, does not contain any references or preferences of a religious or ethnic nature. We are glad to see everyone. If people want to live peacefully, work honestly, pay taxes accurately, we will be only glad of this. Because we love everyone, and most importantly, we are free and open in soul. And mind.

If necessary, we will support you, where needed, we will help you, and we will even help you learn the language.

The Russian world, beautiful in its diversity, will grow, including other European cultures and traditions. In fact, its foundation has always been like that, from the moment when Russian statehood began to take shape.

The presidential decree is not only evidence of our generosity, kindness, openness and humanistic values, which have been severely corroded in the West by neoliberal ideologists; it is, first and foremost, a continuation of the traditions of that same great historical Russia, which we are now continuing to build.

https://ria.ru/20240820/rossiya-1967225190.html

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Kiko

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Post n°127

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko Thu Aug 22, 2024 11:23 am

Russia becomes an ark of tradition, by Igor Karaulov, poet, publicist, for VZGLYAD. 08.22.2024.

If Russia is already becoming a haven for outcasts of Western civilization, including those who have little understanding of our country, is it not time to secure the unconditional right to citizenship for those who by birth belong to the Russian people and other indigenous peoples of Russia?

The recent decree of the Russian president "On providing humanitarian support to persons sharing traditional Russian spiritual and moral values" is not one of those documents that immediately changes our lives or makes world stock exchanges worry. But in a conceptual sense, in the world of ideas, it is a real sensation, and the influence of this decree is calculated to last a long time.

From now on, Russia tells the world: we have not only interests, but also values, and if our interests concern only ourselves, then we offer to share our values with all of humanity and, moreover, we are ready to defend these values not only at home, but also abroad. Including by providing asylum to those people who feel uncomfortable in their own countries. Now such people will be able to settle in Russia even without knowledge of the Russian language, our history and our laws. Just come and live in safety.

In this way, Russia not only demonstrates humanism, but also asserts its global role, becoming a center of attraction for all who share our values.

The type of country of refuge has been encountered more than once in history, and it must be said that the policy of global affirmation of values has invariably given such countries advantages, and sometimes served as the main basis for their existence.

For example, the United States arose as a refuge for people who were persecuted for religious reasons in their homeland, England. And America later willingly gave refuge to French Huguenots, oppressed Irish, Russian and European Jews. And let's not forget the scientists who fled Hitler and helped the United States develop the atomic bomb. All of these people made their new homeland a superpower.

In the same way, Russia in the 18th century gave refuge to both German Mennonites and French aristocrats fleeing the revolution. And this also benefited the country. Novorossiya was developed by German, Greek, and Serbian settlers, and Duke Richelieu faithfully served the empire by founding Odessa.

We also have experience from the Soviet era. The USSR was a spiritual homeland for leftists around the world and provided protection to those who were in danger. Let us recall the thousands of children taken out of Spain during the civil war in that country.

However, external value expansion can also be a subject of abuse. Here, too, the United States is ahead of everyone else. This country has long made concern for democracy and human rights a pretext for interfering in the affairs of other countries. This interference is always hypocritical and selective, depending on the selfish interests of the great power. Some countries can kill children by the thousands, while others cannot ban gay parades. Disobedience is followed not only by reprimands, but sometimes by sanctions and military aggression.

In essence, the US has become a value monopolist in the world, single-handedly determining what is good and what is bad. And you can never prove to a monopolist that you are not a camel. So something had to be put up against it in this field. And decree No. 702 was a strong step in this direction.

This decree introduces a new important concept: “destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes.” Let’s pay attention to the word “neoliberal.” This is a hint that classical liberalism is not our enemy, that we offer people protection from the perversions of liberalism, from what liberalism has degenerated into over time. These perversions ultimately lead to the destruction of the foundations of society, to the rejection of humanity. That is why these attitudes are called “destructive.” In addition, it follows from the text that there are now two ideological poles in the world: those who do not accept destructive neoliberal attitudes are automatically considered to share traditional Russian spiritual and moral values.

The decree contains another important innovation: now we will have an officially approved list of foreign countries that impose the aforementioned destructive attitudes in their policies. This is not the same as the list of unfriendly countries, although there will clearly be overlaps between the two lists. The principle of compiling the list will be different this time. An unfriendly country is simply a country that has done something nasty to us, imposed sanctions or other restrictions. The new list should include countries that infringe on the rights of their citizens to live according to traditional values. This will require objective evidence, facts of infringement of such rights. For example, if juvenile justice is rampant in a country, children are forced to accept propaganda of non-traditional relationships or gender reassignment, and those who disagree with this are silenced, then such a country is a logical candidate for inclusion in the new black (or, perhaps, rainbow) list. I would, for example, assume that Italy or Japan don't have much of a chance of getting on this list at the moment, but France can be included in it based on the fact of hosting the recent Olympics.

However, no matter how great the conceptual significance of the decree as an instrument of Russian policy, the main thing is the people. The people who will come to us. Of course, there won't be many of them at first, but it is even more necessary to treat them correctly. On the one hand, not to make a propaganda dance with a tambourine around them, as was the case with Gerard Depardieu's "move" to Saransk. On the other hand, not to abandon these people to their fate, to show them that they can find work for themselves here and become part of our society.

Finally, if Russia is already becoming an ark for the outcasts of Western civilization, including those who have a weak understanding of our country, isn't it time to secure the unconditional right to citizenship for those who by birth belong to the Russian people and other indigenous peoples of Russia? People are desperately needed in our country, and in principle we can make a Russian out of anyone, as guaranteed not only by the character of our people, but even by our climate. But even more so, we cannot turn our backs on those who are already Russian in their culture and in the makeup of their soul.

https://vz.ru/opinions/2024/8/22/1282954.html

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lyle6

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Post n°128

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

lyle6 Fri Aug 23, 2024 6:57 pm

Open Russian borders, but for white Christians only.

kvs

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Post n°129

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

kvs Fri Aug 23, 2024 9:33 pm

lyle6 wrote:Open Russian borders, but for white Christians only.

Even doing this will not save Russia from demographic decline. Russia needs to get rid of progressive feminist "values". Women should spend their late teens
and early 20s starting families and then getting educations and careers in their late 20s and 30s. This is dictated by biology and procreation necessity of having
a TFR of at least 2.3. Anything less than 2 implies attenuation of the population. Immigration is not a solution, it is just a hack resulting the substitution of
the original population. America is a country of immigrants, but Russia is not (at least on short time-scales).

Society limits people's rights. So it is natural for women to have to put procreation first and careers second. But it is not even a choice of either-or. Just defer
college and the pursuit of career by 10 years. There is plenty of time. But waiting to have children after the age of 35 is just criminally retarded. Surveys
indicate that women make a choice between children and career. So this is the central issue. Society should not let them think this way since it is clearly a
false dichotomy.

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sepheronx

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Post n°130

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

sepheronx Fri Aug 23, 2024 9:50 pm

Russia is one of the few countries that's of the more advanced, that has the most benefits towards families, especially women, who have children.

That has helped but not exactly to what is needed. And thus KVS is correct, the rabid feminism that exists in Russia (still not as bad as the ones here), needs to be removed.

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Broski

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Post n°131

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Broski Sat Aug 24, 2024 12:25 am

sepheronx wrote:Russia is one of the few countries that's of the more advanced, that has the most benefits towards families, especially women, who have children.

That has helped but not exactly to what is needed. And thus KVS is correct, the rabid feminism that exists in Russia (still not as bad as the ones here), needs to be removed.

Russia really needs to crack down on immigration from the Central Stans and break apart the enclaves where they currently dwell. There's no reason for them to even exist in Russia in the numbers they do.

Also, any benefits the state gives towards married couples with children will almost certainly be abused ruthlessly by them, and no, you can't Russify these people. They have an identity completely separate from Russia. Start revoking the ones that obtained citizenship dubiously, like the 500000 Tajiks (or Turkmen's, can't remember) that couldn't even pass the language proficiency tests.

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kvs

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Post n°132

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

kvs Sat Aug 24, 2024 1:36 am

People try to make the word "assimilation" into a bad one. No, it is essential, proper and just. If you want to preserve your identity, then don't migrate. Making ethnic
ghettos is just a long term problem.

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sepheronx

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Post n°133

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

sepheronx Sat Aug 24, 2024 1:48 am

Central Asians get kicked out of Russia all the time. Russia isn't as lenient as the rest of Europe.

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PhSt

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Post n°134

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

PhSt Sun Aug 25, 2024 3:31 pm

I dont think the problem with Central Asians is Ethnicity, but of Religion. Russia has many ethnicities that are Asiatic BUT non-Islamic, there are the Yakuts, Tuvans, Kalmyks, Buryats, etc, and regions with these populations have remained mostly peaceful and the people have more or less assimilated into Russian customs and way of life.

Now look at the Regions where there are Islamic population, Chechnya have been pacified, but was the center of Islamic Terrorism and Separatism in the 90s. And up to at least the middle to late 2000s, there are sporadic Islamic terror activities in the north Caucasus.

Although not All Muslims are Islamic Terrorists/ Supremacists, etc, being a Muslim makes these people susceptible to Islamic Propaganda and Brainwashing, and thus they are easy targets for NATO sponsored terror indoctrination.

I think kicking out Central Asians from Russia is a Good TEMPORARY solution, but in the long term, Russia will have to Take Back its rightful territories in Central Asia, If not, NATO will move in and attempt to Box in Russia from all sides.

So the only long term and Effective solution to the Central Asian question is FULL Russification. As I mentioned before, FULL Russification involves the adoption of Russian language, customs, names, and Religion. This policy needs to be Imposed and not as an optional basis.

Russia needs to take note of the Soviet and Chinese approach to the De-Islamification of their Muslim population, During the Soviet Era, there were no known incidents of radicalization in Central Asia.
And at present, all elements of radicalization have been stomped out of Chinese Xinjiang.

But a FULL PROOF program to get rid of the Islamic Threat in these regions is FULL De-Islamification, which means, converting the entire population to a State religion other than Islam. Why did I say this? Because if the population still identifies as Muslim, although the elements of radical Islam have been suppressed,(A good example is Central Asia under the Soviet Union) there will be a point in time when radicalization will surge again.

When the Soviet Union was still a functioning state, its State Atheism policies have put radical Islam in check, but when the state crumbled and the Central Asian regions broke up and formed their own fake countries, Radical Islam has easily taken over because the local population already identified themselves as Muslim.

So if Central Asians are converted to the Russian Orthodox Church, and are constantly exposed to Pro Russian ideas and narratives, Russia will have a more firm hold in the region and the people will be less susceptible to Islamic extremism and terrorism.

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PhSt

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Post n°135

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

PhSt Fri Sep 06, 2024 1:14 am

I'd like to expand on the recent discussion on the SMO thread about whether Ukrainians (and other minorities in the former Soviet Union and soon-to-be Neo Russian Empire) can be re-educated to become normal citizens of Russia.

In my educated opinion, the main culprit why Ukrainians gravitated back to Nazism is because of NATO brainwashing, when the Soviet Union disintegrated, NATO wasted no time pouring in their agents to the breakaway republics to start the process of De-russification. A big part of this De-Russification project, to make it effective, is to instill extreme hatred towards the Russians. This brainwashing is not only limited to former Soviet territories since anti Russian sentiments are also promoted in countries like Sweden and Finland, which is why NATO had an easy time taking over these countries without any serious resistance from the population, since the people have already been brainwashed into thinking that Russians are evil and that Prostituting themselves to NATO is the right thing to do.

NATO is aware of Russia's cultural affinity to Ukraine, since most of Ukraine are traditional parts of Russia, this is why Ukraine got the top priority in their De-Russification campaign. If Belarus didn't have Lukashenko as its leader, there is a big chance that it would have turned into a Ukraine Lite.

In the 90s, NATO even supported separatist elements Inside Russian borders, in this case, in Chechnya. NATO via its contact with the Saudis has arranged to send Wahabi terrorists to help support separatists in Chechnya.

BUT, because Chechnya is a Russian territory, NATO has been unable to conduct an extensive/ Uninterrupted Brainwashing of its local population, Unlike in Ukraine, for example.

So after the SMO in Chechnya, when hostile elements have been mostly extinguished, after law and order have been established, Russia has been able to Re-educate the Chechen population into becoming normal citizens of Russia.

Look at Armenia, The Relationship between Russia and Armenia was mostly okay until NATO has successfully installed its puppet Pashinyan, then one by one, the entire leadership structure of Armenia has been replaced with Pro NATO prostitutes, and now the country has suddenly become Hostile to Russia.

So my point is, if Russia can Cut off the constant stream of NATO propaganda and brainwashing to a target population, this population can then be subjected to Russia's own re-education programs to humanize them and turn them into normal Russian citizens. To achieve this in Ukraine, Russia will need to push forward until it reaches NATO's border to the west. Once the border with NATO is secured, then Russia will have a free hand to implement its Russification program to the entire population of Ukraine Oblast.

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GarryB

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Post n°136

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

GarryB Fri Sep 06, 2024 12:12 pm

Open Russian borders, but for white Christians only.

So I can't go?

I have my FSB gold pass given to me by Putin...

And when you say Christians you are including a lot of different nutters in that group... asking for trouble...

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higurashihougi

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Post n°137

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

higurashihougi Tue Sep 10, 2024 5:39 pm

https://www.rt.com/russia/603736-russia-birth-rate-decline/

Russia’s birth rate hits historic low – data
The number of babies born in January-June 2024 was down by 16,600 in annual terms, according to Rosstat

Russia recorded a historic minimum birth rate in the first six months of this year, with the number of babies born having declined by 16,600 in annual terms, according to data published on Monday by the state statistics agency Rosstat. Such a low was last recorded in the wake of the 1998 financial crisis in the country.

According to the report, only 599,600 children were born in Russia in the period January to July of this year, down from the 616,200 during the same period in 2023.

The data showed that in June 2024, the birth rate in the country plunged to a record low of just 98,600 births.

Natural population decline in the country has also intensified, according to Rosstat. The figure rose by 49,000 in the first half of this year to 321,500 people.

Overall, only 1.26 million babies were born in Russia in 2023, compared with 1.3 million in 2022, and 1.4 million babies in 2021, according to Rosstat.

Russia is facing a “terrible” demographic crisis which could result in an acute labor shortage of up to 2.4 million workers by 2030, Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Chernyshenko warned in June.

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Kiko

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Post n°138

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko Sat Sep 14, 2024 7:23 pm

Russian women start - and win, by Elena Karaeva for RiaNovosti. 09.14.2024.

Women's fate in Russia, which our great classical literature has taught us to cry over and to sympathize with (it is practically impossible to find a heroine with a happy life and fate), today does not need either tears or empathy for misfortunes. Just a short run through the news agenda completely crushes the thesis about "unhappiness" and throws it in the trash. As not corresponding to reality and misleading.

Today, women living in the big and great Russia can only be envied. Because a Russian woman, regardless of her ethnic origin and place of birth, is first and foremost an infinitely happy woman. Because a Russian woman is first and foremost a free woman. In choosing her life, her destiny, her profession, and everything that is part of the concept of Russian happiness. Which, as we know, is that Russian women (and the femininity that she embodies) are understood. Men. All of them, without exception. Men in power, who know how and with what the state can support women. Men at work, who are devoid of the jealousy and envy in their profession that are so typical of Western characters in pants. Men, whom our women choose to be with them, who help them when the women who chose them are having a hard time.

This note about Russian women's luck and self-realization, without which happiness is impossible, comes out when one major political forum, the focus of which is women in all their forms, is over. The event took place in Grozny , the capital of Chechnya, and was called "Women's Initiatives - Time to Act."

And the next one, already international, in which women from 120 countries participate, begins work in St. Petersburg next week. This is the Eurasian Women's Forum, it is being held for the fourth time and is called "Women: a global mission in a new reality." The opening is scheduled for September 18.

Now let's ask ourselves: why do we practically not pay attention to such events in our everyday life? And we will give an answer right away. Because the global role of women, as well as initiatives in which women in Russia are both active and successful, is routine. Something we have all gotten used to. And for a very long time. Women academics, women politicians, women who have made significant decisions in the life of the state, for us for the last hundred years or so have been a social norm.

Today in the West, women are driven into the reservation of political correctness, even when it comes to the most intimate aspects of their lives. For example, it is impossible, practically impossible, to speak out against the encouragement of abortions. When the right to artificial termination of pregnancy is elevated to the rank of a constitutional norm.

The globalist agenda, in which the theme of the destruction of tradition is almost the main one, cannot come to terms with the stability of women's morals and has been attacking them for several years now.

It's funny to shout that the thesis "my body is my business" is not subject to discussion, and then, in exactly the same place and from the same throats, to hear indignant exclamations that in the "Garden of Eden" and in the "shining cities on a hill" there are - and very serious - demographic problems. Well, of course, after you've been shouting at the top of your lungs that disposable diapers are "harmful to the environment", and disposable baby food packages "pose a huge threat to nature", it becomes quite difficult to understand that, it turns out, women, with politically correct restrictions imposed on the one hand, and with the encouragement of childlessness on the other, do not immediately go and give birth.

The above does not mean that our country does not have problems with demography and low birth rates. But in Russia, difficulties do not cause either hysteria or panic. In our country, the presence of a problem presupposes its open — and at the highest level — discussion, when there are all the opportunities to touch upon a very complex topic. And the search for a solution to such a complex situation relies on traditions, social harmony and, most importantly, on the freedom of women themselves. Being a woman is not only a great step, as Pasternak wrote, today it is also independence. Motherhood is not a heroic act, no one pushes a woman into the embrasure. But she can (key word) be told and is told (second key word) that motherhood is a good thing.

Words from the podium are supported by actions, financial support for what has been said, and also by the planned prospects for the country's development. No one questions financial instruments and their benefits in protecting motherhood and childhood, but let's say that confidence in the future is no less significant. Women and men want their current and future children to live in a world where there are values that will never be a subject for discussion. And that no one will ever discuss "gender fluidity". Not under any slogan of any (always false) "inclusion".

If they say no in Russia, then it's a no - and forever. And if they say yes in Russia, then it's approval of both a moral and financial nature - and it's also forever. We don't have "maybe" and other fifty "shades of gray". And we won't.
This is the tradition of our cultural code, in which the people’s understanding of what and why the state is strong has not changed over the last thousand years.

The instinct of procreation is the main one. For everyone. Women and men. And there is no need to be embarrassed to talk about it. There is no need to be afraid to emphasize it. It is necessary to support women's desire for any self-realization, not forgetting to mention that motherhood does not compress the range of possibilities, but expands them. That "handbags and shoes" and other fashionable consumerist things and toys go out of fashion and wear out or break, but a child or children - for mothers and fathers - will forever remain both pride and happiness. An undisputed and eternal value.

In the end, it must be said that parenthood is a fantastic chance given to us by nature, the best and most visible result of hope.

Allow women to challenge the classics' theses about the "hard lot of Russian women," and they will cope with demographic problems. Our women have always been strong because they were believed in, hoped for, and loved. Because our women are happy when they are understood. And when we, women, are understood, we always win.

https://ria.ru/20240914/zhenschiny-1972605039.html

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Kiko

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Post n°139

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko Wed Sep 18, 2024 5:05 pm

Am willing to move with my whole family to Russia. How should I proceed? Contact with the Russian Embassy?

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higurashihougi

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Post n°140

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

higurashihougi Thu Sep 19, 2024 2:47 pm

kvs wrote:Women should spend their late teens
and early 20s starting families and then getting educations and careers in their late 20s and 30s.
Society limits people's rights. So it is natural for women to have to put procreation first and careers second. But it is not even a choice of either-or. Just defer
college and the pursuit of career by 10 years. There is plenty of time. But waiting to have children after the age of 35 is just criminally retarded. Surveys
indicate that women make a choice between children and career. So this is the central issue. Society should not let them think this way since it is clearly a
false dichotomy.

1) What is the level of welfare, salary, parental care, price of real estates and neccessity expense ?

You need more money if you want to raise more kids. Can you guarantee that people can have a sufficient income and access to cheap goods and services for raising new generations if you demand them to have more kids ?

It is even more critical because due to your proposal, one member of the couple cannot be employed for a significant period of time to generate income for the family.

The biggest reason for people to not getting married or having kids is simply they do not have money to raise it, especially when the kids need high level of education to be competitive in the job market.

2) Delayed or denied education mean less competitive in the job market, i.e. risks of unemployment, or being employed at poor position with low wages. Not to mention that many business do not want to hire aged workers.

Can you guarantee the job and career prospects for women if you want them to delay or deny education for you ?

3) There are many people have the tendency to abuse their spouse if the spouse have less income or less educated than them. Many other people do not appreciate the value of housechords, they claim that housechord are dirty works and tend to treat the housewives (or house-husbands) with contempt and have no gratitude to the ones that carry out the burden of housechords.

Can you guarantee that the wives and women will be fairly treated, will be respected, and their contribution in housechords and child rearing will be appreciated ? Can you guarantee that woman will not be abused and mistreated if they have lower education level due to being delayed education according to your proposal ?

lyle6

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Post n°141

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

lyle6 Thu Sep 19, 2024 7:39 pm

higurashihougi wrote:1) What is the level of welfare, salary, parental care, price of real estates and neccessity expense ?

This is why the norm throughout history was age gap pairings btw. So the man could actually afford raising a family all on his own.

higurashihougi wrote:2) Delayed or denied education mean less competitive in the job market, i.e. risks of unemployment, or being employed at poor position with low wages. Not to mention that many business do not want to hire aged workers.

Many countries practice conscription that takes males from the economy anywhere from 1-2 years. The employers will just adjust their expectations.

higurashihougi wrote:3) There are many people have the tendency to abuse their spouse if the spouse have less income or less educated than them. Many other people do not appreciate the value of housechords, they claim that housechord are dirty works and tend to treat the housewives (or house-husbands) with contempt and have no gratitude to the ones that carry out the burden of housechords.

Ok. By your ridiculous standards carrying a child to term is an abuse - you are shackling a woman with a job she may not want and its illegal in most countries to abandon midway, plus non-insignificant risk of death or injury along the way.

Fucking hell. The alternative is civilizational death. Your mothers, grandmothers, great grandmothers... you get the point, did their duty without complaining about it. You don't see men complaining about the need to go to war, or work jobs that are very taxing, dangerous, or pays really shit.

Its ridiculous. Now you see why women were reduced to second status citizens in almost every civilization that ever existed on this planet... and its sad.

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higurashihougi

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Post n°142

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

higurashihougi Fri Sep 20, 2024 4:56 am

lyle6 wrote:You don't see men complaining about the need to go to war

They do complain, by both words and deeds - for example Ukraine, do you see that Ukrainian people are dodging conscription ?

If it is a war that to protect their own home, their own family, and the warriors are respected by the people, and their sacrifice are highly appreciated, then even women will volunteer to serve in the war.

If it is the opposite, they will point the gun to their own government.

It is the same as housechords.

If you want woman to do housechords and child rearing, do you respect their role ? Do you appreciate their contribution ? Or you say that housechords are dirty works and still want to enforce them to women ?

Why should they work for you if what they receive is contempt and mistreatment ?

"There is no free meal" is the mantra of your so-called revered capitalism. Then what is the payment for the woman that are doing housechords ?

lyle6 wrote:This is why the norm throughout history was age gap pairings btw. So the man could actually afford raising a family all on his own.

Then why should not be a norm to increase salary, reduce working days, increase welfare and parental care payment, and purging of price gouging and real estate speculation instead ?

lyle6 wrote:By your ridiculous standards

It is not my standard. I am stating the fact that many people do not appreciate the contributions of housewives (or househusbands) and have the tendency to abuse their spouse due to such prejuidices.

If you want to enforce child rearing and housechord as the sole duty for women they should you guarantee that they are not mistreated by such prejuidices or their task are appreciated by men ?

Kiko

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Post n°143

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko Sun Sep 22, 2024 9:16 am

Russia will win, but the war will continue, by Kirill Strelnikov for RiaNovosti. 09.22.2024.

The scandalous Paris Olympics continue to justify their reputation even after the closure: it has become known that Serbian athlete Nemanja Majdov was suspended from competition for five months because he crossed himself before entering the tatami at the 2024 Olympics. The International Judo Federation (IJF) saw this gesture as a terrible crime: "By demonstrating an obvious religious gesture when entering the tatami and refusing to bow to your opponent at the end of the competition, you have committed a potential violation of the International Judo Federation's code of ethics."

Yesterday, commenting on this incident, State Duma Chairman Vyacheslav Volodin said that the West continues to go crazy, and recalled the scandalous opening of the Games, which turned into blasphemy and an insult to all Christians in the world, and at the same time no one imposed any sanctions on the organizers of the ceremony - on the contrary, all of enlightened Europe applauded the "eccentric and wonderful" LGBT* gathering. According to Volodin, Europe has made a final choice in favor of degradation, which means that Europe "has no future."

Only "uncivilized" Russians can do this: sincerely pity those who dream of destroying you. Apparently, it's about values, which are becoming a battlefield before our eyes - immeasurably more important than even the outcome of the current conflict in Ukraine.

In his address to the nation dedicated to the beginning of the SVO, Vladimir Putin directly indicated that one of the main reasons for the decision to conduct the operation was not only the military, but also the civilizational expansion of the West, the goal of which is "to destroy our traditional values and impose on us their pseudo-values that would corrode us, our people, from within, those attitudes that they are already aggressively implanting in their countries and which directly lead to degradation and degeneration, since they contradict the very nature of man." In the West, this idea was presented as an "absurd justification for aggression" against an innocent, peaceful and democratic state that had already stuck one foot through the fence of the "magic garden."

But a year passed, and the Deep State American publication The National Interest published an article, "The World is Facing a Global War of Beliefs," which stood in stark contrast to the endless stream of Western materials on the military aspects of the fighting in Ukraine. While others were counting soldiers, guns, and tanks, drawing arrows, and updating tactical maps, the author of the article unexpectedly openly voiced the main reason for the war that the West had essentially declared on Russia, and practically word for word confirmed everything Putin had said.

"The war in Ukraine will end (sooner or later). However, the conflicts that underlie this war will not end. These are global and eternal conflicts... The first conflict is the West's desire to maintain its global dominance - economic, military and cultural. The other is a clash between opposing value systems." According to the publication, the conflict between Russia and Ukraine is not military, but cultural and civilizational, where the West must defeat Russia with the help of a pro-Western Ukraine.

Another article, which had appeared shortly before in the analytical publication The Review of Faith & International Affairs, went virtually unnoticed, although in it experts looked into the problem even more deeply: “Russia’s Doctrine of Spiritual Security Is a Challenge to European Security.” And the stakes here are higher than ever before in history.

What is so deadly, dangerous and terrible for Europeans in the moral and cultural values of Russia that the West is ready to bring the world to the brink of a total war of annihilation?

Let us recall that our values are enshrined in the Fundamentals of State Policy for the Preservation and Strengthening of Traditional Russian Spiritual and Moral Values, adopted in the fall of 2022. Among them are life, dignity, human rights and freedoms, patriotism, citizenship, service to the Fatherland and responsibility for its fate, high moral ideals, a strong family, creative work, the priority of the spiritual over the material, humanism, mercy, justice, collectivism, mutual assistance and mutual respect, historical memory and continuity of generations, the unity of the peoples of Russia, as well as the free practice of traditional religions, which serve as a source of cultural identification and the moral foundation of a person.

The source of Russia's danger to the West in general and Europe in particular was named in a recent publication in the well-known neocon publication Politico . After discussing what Europe is actually fighting for, the conclusion is made that the main struggle is for "values" and "identity". The authors spent a long time listing what is the "heart" of European identity, but agreed on the main thing: "If Europeans can be truly proud of something, it should be secular values, which must defeat the Church."

Russia has never put the religious aspect at the forefront of its value-cultural confrontation with the West. But the West, at yet another session of information striptease, admitted: we are fighting Russia because God is with it.

As even atheists know, God cannot be mocked, and in their satanic struggle, the same Europeans have imperceptibly destroyed themselves. Back in 2009, as many as 82 percent of Europeans identified themselves as Christians. Now, only 18 percent do. In just one year, the number of anti-Christian crimes, vandalism, and church burnings has increased by 44 percent.

It is no wonder that in the same Europe the popularity of parties defending traditional values has sharply increased, as has the number of people who are ready to leave for countries where they can calmly start families, raise children, practice their religion and not be afraid that their children can be forcibly turned into monsters.

This is why President Vladimir Putin recently signed a decree according to which foreigners are given the green light to move to Russia and receive assistance "on the grounds of not accepting the policies implemented by these countries, which impose destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values."

Our enemies fear us because of our strength. But they fear even more because we bring true light into the world, which cannot be extinguished, and therefore we cannot be defeated.

https://ria.ru/20240922/rossiya-1974028473.html

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Rodion_Romanovic

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Post n°144

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Rodion_Romanovic Sun Sep 22, 2024 3:03 pm

higurashihougi wrote:There are many people have the tendency to abuse their spouse if the spouse have less income or less educated than them. Many other people do not appreciate the value of housechords, they claim that housechord are dirty works and tend to treat the housewives (or house-husbands) with contempt and have no gratitude to the ones that carry out the burden of housechords.

Can you guarantee that the wives and women will be fairly treated, will be respected, and their contribution in housechords and child rearing will be appreciated ? Can you guarantee that woman will not be abused and mistreated if they have lower education level due to being delayed education according to your proposal ?

Abusing spouse or their partner is actually a criminal offence (by the way there are also many men abused (mainly psychologically) by their wives)), so it should not be taken as example.

The length of study is actually excessive for everyone, and there are a lot of fake degrees, even from important universities. Most people in uni (and I mean men as well) should not study in University but work or do proper apprenticeships.

In the past as an example many profession like financial advisor (in Italy) could be done by someone that had done a technical high school for accountants (Istituto Tecnico Commerciale Per Ragionieri), followed by a apprenticeship. Now it is mandatory to have an economic degree. The sad thing is that the competence of the people with a bachelor in economics now is (much) less than the one of the high school graduate from the 70s or the 80s.

Anyway for women is easier and healthier to have a child before 35 (ideally in their early 20s).
It is also much less probable that the children will have congenit diseases if the mother is in her 20s.

The thing that people need to understand is that, while working moderately is actually a good thing, striving for a extremely competitive career and aim for the top position is not, and it is often not even compatible with raising a family (unless you have a lot of support from other family members, as it was in the past for most families, where grandparents and aunts were helping the parents)

I remember speaking to a language teacher many years ago that complained that while most teacher in the school were women, the director was a man. I asked her if she would have liked to take that jobs and she said no, because it required much longer hours and additional responsibility. But earlier she was ready to criticise and say that it was a simbol of the man dominated society...

Furthermore most women (including colleagues) that I know want to reduce working hours after having children. You cannot be in top management and work part time. And if you do not want to aim for top management it does not change much if you start your career at 24 instead of having first children and then starting a moderate career after your kids start elementary school (while you are in your late 20s or early 30s).

Anyway women need to understand that not every woman is a Marie Curie worth of a Nobel prize (and even she managed to have 2 kids, albeit relatively late).

higurashihougi wrote:If you want to enforce child rearing and housechord as the sole duty for women they should you guarantee that they are not mistreated by such prejuidices or their task are appreciated by men ?

Going to war (and before that, dangerous animal hunting) has been almost exclusively for men since prehistoric times. Women and children suffer during wars because of invading armies, but far from the warzone they were living peacefully at home, while men were dying in the warzones.

Even nowadays men do all dangerous jobs. There are a lot of women interested in doing well paid jobs, but few of them that want to be miners, depth scuba divers involved in welding or similar, etc etc.

Work related deaths are for the vast majority for men. As an example in Italy in the last years we had more than 1000 work related death each year (about 90% of them men).

Are women grateful that men take most of the dangerous jobs?

higurashihougi

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Post n°145

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

higurashihougi Sun Sep 22, 2024 4:10 pm

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:Anyway for women is easier and healthier to have a child before 35 (ideally in their early 20s).
It is also much less probable that the children will have congenit diseases if the mother is in her 20s.

Agreed. But it is also easier and healthier to have a child if you have enough money to raise it.

In a survey in Japan the majority of respondents said that they do want to have children but financial stress and workload prevented them from doing that. In USA it is said that financial stress, not feminism or individualism, is the biggest factor that drive people to childless. They can use individualism and "free choice" as arguments in a provocative debate but the underlying reason is always empty pocket and corporate slavery culture.

If we want them to manufacture more humans but do nothing about their salary, about the wage theft, price gouging and real estate speculation, then they will surely respond with a huge middle finger.

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:while working moderately is actually a good thing, striving for a extremely competitive career and aim for the top position is not, and it is often not even compatible with raising a family (unless you have a lot of support from other family members, as it was in the past for most families, where grandparents and aunts were helping the parents)

The problem here is "extremely competitive career " and "top position" mean higher salary, more money, more social positions, more prestige, more economical autonomy.

A "top" diploma also means that you can out-compete the rivals when applying for the job.

In current classed society "aim for the top position" is not greedy, but it means survival. In other words, people are greedy because money means power and power means you are less likely to be bullied.

If they was discouraged to aim for the top then should it be imperative to guarantee that they will not be pauperized, be unemployed, be bullied or be treated with contempt when they are at the bottom ?

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:I asked her if she would have liked to take that jobs and she said no, because it required much longer hours and additional responsibility. But earlier she was ready to criticise and say that it was a simbol of the man dominated society...

So if she, or any woman, change their mind and claim that they are now ready for the stress and workload and eager to take the job, would they be accepted ?

If the answer is no then there is clearly a symbol of man dominated society.

Do her colleagues tell her that woman is not suitable for stressful jobs and only men can do it ?

If the answer is yes then there is clearly a symbol of man dominated society.

By the way there are a lot of men who do not want to take stressful jobs, too. It is not exclusive to women.

Rodion Romanovic wrote:Furthermore most women (including colleagues) that I know want to reduce working hours after having children.

Then the solution should be the husbands take part in housechords to alleviate the burden then ? Or hiring professional domestic workers if the family had enough money ?

Or may be the employers should consider a wage rise and reduced working hours instead of wage theft and squeezing employees to the death ?

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:Anyway women need to understand that not every woman is a Marie Curie worth of a Nobel prize

And men need to understand that not every of them are Добрыня Никитич that can slay Dragon to rescue damsel in distress, and they need to get used to the fact that their spouse can be the main money maker, not them.

In fact it is not uncommon to witness the useless man laze around in drunken, gambling while the wife have to clean up his mess.

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:Going to war (and before that, dangerous animal hunting) has been almost exclusively for men since prehistoric times. Are women grateful that men take most of the dangerous jobs?

Yes, we are. I don't know what is happening in Europe and North America, but in Vietnam, we treat the revolutionary soldiers as heroes, we revere them, they are having a very prestigious position in our country as the defender of the people.

We have 27 July as the Vietnamese War Invalids and Martyrs' Day.

Do men revere and treat the women as heroes if they abandon their education and career future to devote their youth to rising their children ?

From what I see, many men take it for granted that women have to abandon their education "for family" and never say even a single word of thank you.

By the way a lot of woman doing menial jobs, for example http://hoilhpn.quangnam.gov.vn/Portals/0/ThuVienAnh/g3.png

lyle6

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Post n°146

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

lyle6 Sun Sep 22, 2024 4:46 pm

higurashihougi wrote:
They do complain, by both words and deeds - for example Ukraine, do you see that Ukrainian people are dodging conscription ?

If it is a war that to protect their own home, their own family, and the warriors are respected by the people, and their sacrifice are highly appreciated, then even women will volunteer to serve in the war.

If it is the opposite, they will point the gun to their own government.

It is the same as housechords.

If you want woman to do housechords and child rearing, do you respect their role ? Do you appreciate their contribution ? Or you say that housechords are dirty works and still want to enforce them to women ?

Why should they work for you if what they receive is contempt and mistreatment ?

"There is no free meal" is the mantra of your so-called revered capitalism. Then what is the payment for the woman that are doing housechords ?

Did you just compare fighting and dying, getting maimed and brutalized in a war to doing fucking household chores?

You feminists are really something. Razz

higurashihougi wrote:
Then why should not be a norm to increase salary, reduce working days, increase welfare and parental care payment, and purging of price gouging and real estate speculation instead ?

Make female employment illegal and you'll get all of those. Razz

higurashihougi wrote:
It is not my standard. I am stating the fact that many people do not appreciate the contributions of housewives (or househusbands) and have the tendency to abuse their spouse due to such prejuidices.

If you want to enforce child rearing and housechord as the sole duty for women they should you guarantee that they are not mistreated by such prejuidices or their task are appreciated by men ?

So instead lets condemn our societies to death by attrition because the housewives might felt unappreciated...

See, not all of us are willing to commit suicide just to placate someone's feelings...

Do you want make women 2nd class citizens again? Because that's exactly how one would go about if that is their intent.

higurashihougi wrote:
Agreed. But it is also easier and healthier to have a child if you have enough money to raise it.

Even easier and healthier to not have a kid at all. After all, isn't that what's most important? Convenience.

higurashihougi wrote:
The problem here is "extremely competitive career " and "top position" mean higher salary, more money, more social positions, more prestige, more economical autonomy.

A "top" diploma also means that you can out-compete the rivals when applying for the job.

In current classed society "aim for the top position" is not greedy, but it means survival. In other words, people are greedy because money means power and power means you are less likely to be bullied.

If they was discouraged to aim for the top then should it be imperative to guarantee that they will not be pauperized, be unemployed, be bullied or be treated with contempt when they are at the bottom ?

How can it be a matter of survival if 99.99% of the people who would never achieve such positions manage to stay afloat somehow? Is the ordinary employee dying of hunger, wearing only the one shirt on his back and living on the streets?

What priors are your working with? Because its 2024. Stop acting like its the late 1900s and you have Victorian era paupers dying from hunger because they failed to make the quota on their 18 hour shifts.

higurashihougi

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Post n°147

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

higurashihougi Sun Sep 22, 2024 5:31 pm

lyle6 wrote:Did you just compare fighting and dying, getting maimed and brutalized in a war to doing fucking household chores?

You feminists are really something.

How about you do all the housechords and childcaring for a day to see it is heavy or light ?

It is time for you people to stop lazing around get drunken on bars and pub like a parasite.

Your mother probably will be very happy seeing her son brushing off her works and labour caring for you as "f*****g chores".

Seems like filial piety and gratitude is luxurious for right wing people like you who always claim the mantle of family value but behave like ones devoid of parental upbringing.

By the way women took part in patriotic fights quite a lot, although it may not be visible to the cloudy eyes of you keyboard warriors who contribute nothing but empty mouth.

lyle6 wrote:So instead lets condemn our societies to death by attrition because the housewives might felt unappreciated...

From your behavior I can see that indeed you do not appreciate.

I guess it is fair for you to be condemned.

lyle6 wrote:Make female employment illegal and you'll get all of those.

And then your men will keep condemning woman for not working, not making money, only mooching off husband's money...

I know your hypocrites very well.

lyle6 wrote:Even easier and healthier to not have a kid at all. After all, isn't that what's most important? Convenience.

Pay back all the money that your father and mother spend to raise you up before you blabbering about how many kids people should have.

I don't expect you experience that how hard to raise a kid but you should understand how costly for your own parents to raise you up ?

I do not expect you to understand what is filial piety, which is actually mentioned in the Ten Commandment of your professed religion, but at least having a basic awareness of gratitude, will you ?

More and more I see the so-called "traditionalists", "family value" people actually do not have any moral and parental upbringing.

lyle6 wrote:What priors are your working with? Because its 2024. Stop acting like its the late 1900s and you have Victorian era paupers dying from hunger because they failed to make the quota on their 18 hour shifts.

Are you implying that we should reduce our living standard and survivability to the 19th century to satisfy your prejuidice to woman ?

I am quite shocked that while Jesus preached love, the self-proclaimed Jesus followers are having behavior that is worse than animals.

How about you go back to tell your parent that you will not attempt to get a good job or a good education diploma since it is so stressful and not necessary ? See if they agree with you ?

By the way a significant amount of Filippino people is still living with pagpag. Not that the wealthy rulers are treating people any better than the 19th century.

GarryB

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Post n°148

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

GarryB Mon Sep 23, 2024 4:42 am

Am willing to move with my whole family to Russia. How should I proceed? Contact with the Russian Embassy?

I would say go there for a holiday for a few weeks or months just to see what it is like.

You are from Brazil, so I suspect you can handle the heat of summer, so go in winter because if you can't stand their cold winters they come around every year and can be brutal.

Learning the language would make things much easier too, but being around Russian speakers would also make learning the language easier too.

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Post n°149

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Scorpius Mon Sep 23, 2024 8:06 pm

Am willing to move with my whole family to Russia. How should I proceed? Contact with the Russian Embassy?

To begin with, I would advise you to understand why you want to move to Russia, what you expect from moving, and also to understand exactly which part of Russia you want to move to. Because depending on where you want to live, life in Russia can range from more than acceptable to impossible for you.
After you find a suitable place to live, you should come there and just live for a period of at least 4-6 months. You have to walk among people, use public infrastructure, find out what the average earnings are in this area. After that, you need to compare the situation on the spot and how you communicate with people - to understand whether you want to spend the rest of your life here or a significant part of your life. Only then should you think about moving.

As one Mexican-American who recently moved to Russia said
You don't play on easy difficulty in Russia. In Russia, you play on the "hardcore" difficulty. If you are not ready to overcome difficulties - language, culture, bureaucratic difficulties of obtaining citizenship, complexity and strictness of local laws - then you should not move to live in Russia.

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Post n°150

Re: Russian population and demographics #2

Kiko Mon Sep 23, 2024 8:35 pm

I understand what you mean, but don't think life in Russia is more difficult than in Brazil, which is plagued by mediocrity in almost every aspect.
That is the problem here: the need to enjoy windows of self-fulfillment especially in cultural matters: arts, bookshops, literature, erudite music, journalism, etc.. The level of instruction of the population.
The common meaning of beauty in all aspects of life.
That is of paramount relevance for my family and I.

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