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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Kiko
    Kiko


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    Post  Kiko Wed Oct 23, 2024 9:23 am

    The West was preparing the fate of Ukraine for Georgia, by Andrey Rezchikov, Dmitry Alexandrov from Tbilisi for VZGLYAD, 10.23.2024.

    Experts: If Georgia Opened a “Second Front,” the Russian Army Would Take Tbilisi.

    The West suggested that Georgia start a short war with Russia and then switch to guerrilla resistance. But then Prime Minister Irakli Garibashvili refused to open a "second front." At the same time, the Georgian army is striving for NATO standards and gradually increasing defense spending. How serious could Georgia's entry into the war be against the backdrop of the NVO and what would Russia's response be?

    A high-ranking Western official suggested that former Georgian Prime Minister Irakli Garibashvili start a short war with Russia. This  was stated by  the founder and honorary chairman of the ruling Georgian Dream party Bidzina Ivanishvili. It should be noted that Garibashvili held the post of prime minister from February 2021 to January 2024, and now heads the Dream.

    According to Ivanishvili, the military conflict would last three to four days, after which Georgia would have to switch to "partisan resistance." Such proposals could have turned into a catastrophe for the country, since "three to four million" Georgians would have risked their lives, to which Garibashvili responded that "they won't kill everyone in three to four days."

    As Ivanishvili noted, after this proposal, the authorities became more collected and began to act more harshly against such calls.

    Georgia has repeatedly stated that certain forces are attempting to drag the country into a military confrontation with Russia and open a "second front" after the armed conflict in Ukraine began. At the same time, the leaders of the ruling party emphasize that involvement in the conflict will lead to catastrophic consequences for Georgia, and the task of the leadership is to maintain peace in the country. A week before the parliamentary elections, this topic is especially relevant .

    As Prime Minister Irakli Kobakhidze noted, after the end of the Ukrainian war, “interest in Georgia opening a ‘second front’ will immediately end, and this will help reset our relations with the EU and the US.” At the same time, according to the annual  Global Firepower Index 2024 rating  , the Georgian army ranks 84th out of 145 countries. The rating takes into account the number of military units, financial situation, logistical capabilities and geography of the country.

    The rating data also shows that the Georgian army is significantly behind the Azerbaijani army, which is in 59th place, but surpasses the Armenian army (102nd place). The Defence Ministry's budget this year was $511 million, which is $40 million more than the previous year. The country is also actively modernizing its military infrastructure.

    Experts agree that Georgia would have faced a quick defeat in a few days if a “second front” had been opened, as during the war in August 2008, but Russia had to deploy additional forces and resources. This is what the West was actually going to count on, given the conflict in Ukraine.

    Former Chief of the General Staff of Georgia Guram Nikolaishvili stated that “possible proposals or hints from external forces about involving the country in military actions could have been aimed at temporarily drawing off certain forces of the Russian army, but this would have led to catastrophic consequences for Georgia.”

    "It would take Russia several hours to blockade all of Georgia – ports, strategic highways, air. Units located in the Abkhazian and South Ossetian territories would be used, possibly also units deployed in the vicinity of Georgia. Of course, the West would not come to Georgia's aid. We saw this in 2008," Nikolaishvili said.

    "Russia could easily declare war on Georgia if Tbilisi began some kind of operations," the retired military commander believes. "Moscow could use all its might if necessary - missile forces, aviation, navy."

    According to Nikolaishvili, "I would like to hope that the West actually understands that Georgia's entry into military action is not beneficial to it. The West will then lose Georgia." The interlocutor also recalled that "Ukraine, which wanted help, openly said that Georgia could fight."

    In this situation, he believes, "Azerbaijani President Ilham Aliyev is acting wisely, balancing between various interests." "It is difficult for Aliyev, but he has a partner like Turkey, and he maintains neutrality. But we do not have such a partner, we ourselves must defend state interests," the former Chief of the General Staff noted.

    In his opinion, “that is why the message of the ruling Georgian Dream – ‘No to war, choose peace’ – works so effectively during the preparation for the elections , when people see the destruction in Ukraine and peaceful life in their homeland.

    “Of course, Georgia would not have been able to seize Abkhazia or South Ossetia, but creating tension and tying up our troops, giving them additional leverage – that would have been a certain success,” says Andrei Klintsevich, head of the Center for the Study of Military and Political Conflicts.

    If the Georgians had started a guerrilla war, it would have “drawn out for a long time.” “What is a guerrilla movement in modern conditions? During the day, a person sells bread, and at night, he plants explosives. Underground guerrilla activity is an ongoing terrorist action. Therefore, it would be difficult to stop this process,” the expert believes. According to him, “we would have received destabilization, and a significant number of troops would have had to be sent to control Georgian territory, which was what Western strategists were counting on.” In response, Russia could have reached not only Gori in the eastern part of the country, but also Tbilisi, “but everything would have depended on the number of forces and resources available at that time.”

    "It is clear that Georgia is not Ukraine, which was prepared for so long. Therefore, we could repeat the 2008 campaign, when our advanced units were already near Tbilisi, and this time we would go there. But control of this territory would be difficult for us from the point of view of the need to allocate a large number of forces and resources," Klintsevich added.

    Military expert Boris Dzherelievsky also agrees that Georgia’s entry into a short war would create an additional source of tension for Russia and would require the diversion of forces from the main conflict zone in Ukraine: “We are already forced to keep our entire western and northern border, as well as part of the southern one, under increased control.”

    The interlocutor explained that the West "does not expect the Ukrainians or Georgians to defeat us, but wants to spark as many conflicts as possible." "At the cost of the lives of their proxies, the goal is to exhaust our forces, to create an image of an aggressor in the eyes of the world community. War is always a great opportunity to accuse us of something," the speaker added.

    As for the confrontation with Georgian underground fighters, “Russian security forces have the most experience in fighting terrorism.”

    "After the Georgian-Abkhazian conflict of 1992-1993, terrorist organizations were created that were based in the mountainous Svaneti (a historical region in northwestern Georgia) and operated on the territory of Abkhazia, taking hostages, carrying out terrorist attacks and sabotage. Of course, this was unpleasant, but it did not create an insoluble problem," recalled Dzherelievsky.

    The well-known Gelayev raid from the Pankisi Gorge to Kodori can be considered similar, "when Eduard Shevardnadze (then the leader of Georgia) engaged Chechen and Arab terrorists to attack Abkhazia." "During that raid, civilians died, but the Abkhazians, at the level of their militia, coped with this challenge without much difficulty. This would be the case now," the speaker emphasized.

    https://vz.ru/world/2024/10/22/1293767.html

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Fri Oct 25, 2024 6:00 pm

    The West will take cruel revenge on Georgia in the coming days, by Dmitry Bavyrin for VZGLYAD. 10.25.2024.

    Saturday's Georgian parliamentary elections are set to be historic, no matter who wins. In terms of foreign policy, two very important questions are at stake: will Georgia enter into a military conflict with Russia and will the West lose Georgia? The resolution of these questions could come at a high price, including an attempt at revolution.

    Both questions – about war with Russia and about renunciation of the West – would seem insane, and the second one is even more insane: the West could not lose Georgia, of all people. Just yesterday they were reveling in Russophobia and convincing themselves that Russia “occupies 20%” (i.e. Abkhazia and South Ossetia).

    Diplomatic relations between Moscow and Tbilisi have been absent for more than 15 years, and after the start of the NWO, a significant diaspora of Russian emigrants with anti-Russian views formed in Georgia. For most of the rest of Russia, this Caucasian republic became a permanently cut-off slice that few wanted to sew back on. And few in Russia noticed when trade between the countries began to recover, because it is difficult to notice a drop in the ocean.

    Overall, unlike in the 2000s, there is no sense that Russia is seriously competing with the West for Georgia – or that Georgia could become anti-Western. There is only one significant pro-Russian party (the Alliance of Patriots) with a tiny rating and (one suspects) affiliated with the government. All other parties – both the government and the opposition – advocate friendship with the US and joining the EU, and joining the EU has long played the role of a national idea.

    This made Tbilisi vulnerable to blackmail from Brussels, which it did not succumb to: it did not impose sanctions against Russia and did not open a second front against it, although NATO emissaries tried to convince the Georgian authorities of this at all levels. Such principledness is not due to Russophilia, but to intelligence: Georgian sanctions are like a drop in the bucket for Russia, but are felt by Georgia itself.

    As for persuasion to enter the war, Georgia's inevitable defeat in it is too obvious to agree to such a proposal even with a strong desire to return Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Nevertheless, there are Georgians in the country who are ready to accept such a proposal: this is the leading opposition party "United National Movement" (UNM), founded by former President Mikheil Saakashvili (the same one who finally tried to fight with Russia in 2008).

    Therefore, the current government – ​​the Georgian Dream party, founded by the country’s richest man Bidzina Ivanishvili to defeat Saakashvili – is effectively conducting its election campaign under the slogan “peace or war.” And this, it seems, is not just a slogan – it is a deep conviction that the country needs to be saved from being drawn into a bloody adventure.

    They plan to save it with radical measures – a ban on the UNM if the Georgian Dream manages to obtain a constitutional majority. Ivanishvili himself stated this, comparing the main opposition party to a cancerous tumor that “can spread if the body weakens.”

    "We need a constitutional majority to ban them, to get rid of this scourge. Otherwise... something incomprehensible might happen, like on Khorava Street. Society will be provoked, we will get misfortune, they will return," he emphasized.

    Ivanishvili does not currently hold any posts, but the degree of his influence on the government is assessed as absolute: his political children are sitting there, still needing his money. Thus, if Ivanishvili said they will ban it, then they will ban it. This sharply raises the stakes for Georgia in its confrontation with the West (which, let us recall, it did not want and does not want).

    It is not that the UNM is Saakashvili's party (no one is interested in him in himself). It is the West's main counterparty in Georgia. These are the people that the US and EU want to see at the helm of the country, which they have made clear to the population by declaring the current government "enfant terrible".

    The current leader of the UNM and candidate for Prime Minister Tina Bokuchava (a very aggressive supporter of NATO and opponent of Russia) was even a guest at the US Democratic Party convention when Kamala Harris was nominated for president.

    If on Saturday the Georgians decide that their homeland is more important to them than Europe and even faraway America, the agents of Western political influence will not only be branded, as in the case of the local analogue of the law on foreign agents, but also purged. Most likely, this will be justified not by the UNM's desire to get involved in the war, but by its unconstitutional activities. In the sense that they consistently do not recognize the election results and prefer the tactics of street riots, for which they are looking for reasons. For the last 15 years, mostly unsuccessfully, although with some local victories. Now they plan to suppress revolutionary discourse completely.

    It seems that the Georgian Dream does not want to eradicate Western influence in Georgia, but to get rid of the counterparty and take its place. Like, if you do not want to deal with us, you will not deal with anyone and will completely lose Georgia.

    Such a strategy could work, but for it to happen, Ivanishvili's people would have to not only win elections for the fourth time in a row, but also defend their victory under pressure from the streets.

    For now, Georgian political scientists estimate the ruling party's chances to be better than those of the opposition. However, the UNM will definitely not admit defeat, will definitely try to organize a Maidan, and will definitely receive support from the West. We cannot rule out some kind of bloody provocation like the murder on Khorava Street mentioned by Ivanishvili (in 2017, two schoolchildren were stabbed to death in a street fight under strange circumstances).

    Including because of Ivanishvili’s threats to the UNM, the elections and the night after them will become a “do or die” dilemma: either you claw back power by any means necessary, or you will be wiped out.

    The West, shocked by Georgia's intransigence, is also ready to act harshly. The infrastructure has already been created and the accents set for covering the events of Sunday night: "the regime that sold out to Russia is establishing authoritarianism and destroying democratic organizations."

    This is still an information war. Whether it will become real or not, it is up to the Georgians to decide. And not only during the elections, but also after them, when they try to start a war on Rustaveli Avenue.

    If a large number of dissatisfied people are drawn into this (and there are many dissatisfied with the government for one reason or another in Georgia), the country will turn into a hot spot in a few stages. If there are only a few people willing to stir up trouble, these elections may be the last for the UNM. Then the country's political system will reboot, and Tbilisi will be ready to restore relations with the East and the West (on its own terms).

    But for now these are Yanukovych's plans for the period after the victory over Maidan. First, he still needs to win. Let's hope that Ivanishvili, who has raised the stakes so sharply in the election campaign, remembers this important rule.

    https://vz.ru/politics/2024/10/25/1294201.html

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sat Oct 26, 2024 6:24 am

    The lesson for the rest of the world countries is you get the choice to be a BRICS country or a pro west country... BRICS offers a future of trade and cooperation, and friendship offers a future of never joining the west as an equal partner, and they will interfere in your country till you submit to sacrificing your wealth and population in their fight against Russia... and rest assured even if they manage to beat Russia... and they wont, but if they did then China would be next... and India and Iran and all the other countries that don't submit to western dictats.

    You can become a free democratic state without joining the lines of cannon fodder for the west in their holy war agaisnt everything that is not western and holy.

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Sun Oct 27, 2024 12:38 am

    Saakashvili might be interested in requesting Madrid a political asylum there.

    The most interesting things are beginning in Georgia, by Fyodor Lukyanov, Editor-in-Chief of the magazine "Russia in Global Affairs", for VZGLYAD. 10.26.2024.

    In Georgia, an attempt is being made to correct the outcome of the election through protest actions and provoking the use of force. There are two conditions for the success of such tactics. But there are doubts that they can be fulfilled in Georgia.

    The most interesting part is beginning in Georgia. The disposition is well known from the times of "color revolutions". The ruling party declares victory in the elections, the opposition, relying on moral and political (at least) support from the West, does not recognize the result . An attempt is made to correct the outcome of the vote by means of protest actions and provoking the use of force.

    There are two conditions for the success of such tactics. The first is the active position of an external patron, who puts pressure on the authorities in various ways. The second is the authorities' perception of this patron as so significant that it is dangerous and unacceptable to significantly complicate relations with him. Simply put, the readiness of external forces to seriously get involved in the situation and the confidence of the ruling circles that resistance can only be up to a certain limit, after which they must back down. The scheme is, of course, greatly simplified, but now, in general, complexity is not in favour, everyone prefers to act head-on.

    There are doubts that these two conditions can be met in Georgia.

    The EU and the US are critical of the Georgian Dream and are showing deep disappointment with its course. Symbolic measures are being taken, such as declarative sanctions and the suspension of the EU accession process (which is not actually happening). In the Euro-Atlantic media environment, the Georgian conflict is described in terms of “pro-Russian – pro-Western”, which reflects its perception exclusively through the prism of geopolitical rivalry (the state of affairs in Georgia, naturally, does not concern anyone). In principle, the prerequisites for initiating unrest are quite suitable.

    However, in general, it is clear that Europe and the US have more important things to do, to put it mildly. There is no sense of the real passion that was present in the 2000s and early 2010s in relation to various countries – post-Soviet and not only. The inspiration to transform the world by exporting a set of techniques and guidelines has ended, and without inspiration such complex things do not work.

    As for the position of the Georgian government, there is no sign of reverent fear of senior partners that would force them to limit their own instincts and intentions. Tbilisi's policy towards the West since 2022 is not only independent, but also quite daring in places. Ivanishvili and his associates, apparently, understand that the West not only has different priorities, but also somewhat different opportunities.

    "Dream" is confident that the bulk of the population, not as noisy as the opposition supporters, really supports it. In Georgia, unlike a number of other countries of the former USSR, there is political competition, although the authorities always and everywhere, of course, have a head start.

    The bottom line: an attempt at a forceful revision may be undertaken, especially since the main opposition is still the current president. However, the preconditions for success are not very favorable. However, in life, as they used to say in the USSR, there is always room for a feat.

    https://vz.ru/opinions/2024/10/27/1294633.html

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Sun Oct 27, 2024 5:58 am

    Georgian Dream Gains About 54.2% of Votes With Data From 99% of Polling Stations Counted, 10.27.2024.

    TBILISI (Sputnik) - The ruling party Georgian Dream gains about 54.2% of votes in the parliamentary elections after data from almost 99% of polling stations has been counted, the Central Election Commission of Georgia said.

    According to the commission, with data from 3,085 polling stations, or about 99%, counted, Georgian Dream has received over 1 million votes, or slightly less than 54.2%.

    Main opposition parties that overcame the 5% threshold needed to enter the legislative body, include Unity — National Movement (about 10%), Coalition for Change (about 11%), Strong Georgia (about 8.7%) and For Georgia (about 7.7%). In total, the opposition gains about 37% of the votes.

    https://sputnikglobe.com/20241027/georgian-dream-gains-about-542-of-votes-with-data-from-99-of-polling-stations-counted-1120687949.html

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Sun Oct 27, 2024 8:59 pm

    Next, following the Venezuelan precedent and example, she, together with Saakashvili, will be requesting political asylum to Madrid.

    Georgian president calls for protesting against election results in Tbilisi on Monday, 10.27.2024.

    Salome Zourabichvili added that this would be a peaceful protest.

    TBILISI, October 27. /TASS/. Georgian President Salome Zourabichvili has called on people to gather for a protest against the outcome of the parliamentary elections at the parliamentary building in Tbilisi on Monday.

    "I want to invite you tomorrow evening, at seven (3:00 p.m. GMT) to Rusraveli Avenue so that we together tell the world and ourselves that we don’t recognize these elections," she told a briefing, adding that this will be a peaceful protest.

    Zourabichvili has refused to recognize Saturday’s parliamentary elections in the country, which were won by the ruling Georgian Dream - Democratic Georgia party, slamming them as totally falsified.

    "We saw something very unusual. It was a total falsification, total theft of your votes, when all means <…> were used to falsity the elections," she told at a briefing.

    "As the only remaining independent institution in the country, I want to say that I don’t recognize these elections," she stressed.

    Georgia’s Prime Minister Irakli Kobakhidze said earlier that no one would be able to provide any facts indicating that the parliamentary elections in the country were illegitimate. He also said that Zourabichvili would not be able to block the first session of the new parliament.

    Meanwhile, the president slammed the current government as illegitimate. "I would like to address our partners, European and American. I have heard the statements made by various sides. We are very thankful for these statements. But everyone outside the country must know that the defence of Georgia, defence of Georgia’s future in this region, defence of the geopolitical balance, defence of this region’s European future is the defense of the people but not establishing contacts with this illegitimate government," she said.

    According to data of the Central Electoral Commission after counting ballots from 99.64% of polling stations, the Georgian Dream garnered 54.08% of the vote, the Coalition for Change took 10.92%, the United National Movement party won 10.12%, the Strong Georgia coalition had 8.78%, while the Gakharia For Georgia party scored 7.76% of the vote. All of them refuse to recognize the voting results. The voter turnout stood at 58.94%.

    https://tass.com/world/1863141

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    Post  lancelot Sun Oct 27, 2024 11:16 pm

    Kiko wrote:Next, following the Venezuelan precedent and example, she, together with Saakashvili, will be requesting political asylum to Madrid.
    She is a French citizen. Born and raised. She will just go back to France.

    If the government had any balls left they would ban transplants like her from running for the top jobs like President and Prime Minister.

    I would declare her persona non grata for trying to destabilize the country which is the opposite a President should do. She should just be politely escorted to the airport to never come back.

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    Kiko
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    Post  Kiko Sun Oct 27, 2024 11:32 pm

    Boris Johnson Supports Georgian Opposition Protests, by Denis Telmanov for VZGLYAD. 10.27.2024.

    Boris Johnson Claims Election Fraud in Georgia, Supports Opposition.

    Boris Johnson accused the Georgian authorities of falsifying the elections and expressed support for the opposition.

    Former British Prime Minister Boris Johnson has accused the Georgian government of "stealing the election." Johnson believes that the recent elections were rigged.

    In his microblog, the politician expressed support for the Georgian people.

    "The picture emerging from Georgia is clear: yesterday's election was stolen," Johnson wrote on his microblog. "I stand with the people of Georgia as they fight for their freedom, their rights and their future."

    Earlier, the Georgian Dream party won 53.92% of the votes in the parliamentary elections in Georgia, while the four opposition parties that entered parliament received a total of 37.78%. The opposition Coalition for Change party said the election results were a constitutional coup, while the Unity – National Movement party also did not recognize the results.

    As Vzglyad newspaper reported, Georgian President Salome Zurabishvili refused to recognize the results of the parliamentary elections, which were won by the Georgian Dream party. The European Parliament also announced that it had found serious violations in the elections in Georgia, including pressure on voters and chaos at polling stations, which "raises concerns about the state of democracy in the country."

    Meanwhile, Viktor Orban, the head of the Hungarian government, which holds the rotating presidency of the European Council, said he would pay an official visit to Georgia on October 28-29.

    A week before the elections in Georgia, the German Konrad Adenauer Foundation predicted the possibility of mass unrest in Tbilisi, following the Ukrainian scenario of 2014. The foundation's article stated that in case of doubts about the fairness of the elections, "a strong autumn storm in Tbilisi seems inevitable." The authors noted that the situation could be reminiscent of Kiev in February 2014, when shooting on the Maidan led to the deaths of dozens of people. "Then the three foreign ministers of Germany, Poland and France managed to successfully mediate between the conflicting parties. This autumn, Europe may again be in demand. It should be prepared," the authors of the article conclude. At the same time, they keep silent about the fact that the mediation of Western politicians ultimately led to a coup d'état in Ukraine.

    https://vz.ru/news/2024/10/28/1294765.html

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    Post  Kiko Mon Oct 28, 2024 12:38 am

    Georgian Dream's Win is Undisputable and Mass Protests in Tbilisi are Unlikely - Analyst, by Ekaterina Blinova for Sputnikglobe.com. 10.27.2024.

    Georgian Dream founder Bidzina Ivanishvili is the only political leader who managed to unite people of different stripes in the country, Arno Khidirbegishvili, general director and chief editor of the Georgian Information and Analytical Agency Geoinform, tells Sputnik.

    According to the pundit, Ivanishvili and the Georgian Dream chose a middle path of avoiding confrontation with Russia and maintaining ties with the West and have visibly improved the socio-economic situation in the country which laid the groundwork for the ruling party's election victory.

    Regardless of the opposition's threats not to recognize the election outcome, there won't be a new color revolution, Khidirbegishvili believes: there are no reckless revolutionaries among Georgian opposition figures.

    The ruling Georgian Dream party has gained 90 of 150 seats in the country's legislature, while the nation's four opposition parties together received just 37% of votes.

    According to Khidirbegishvili, that means that roughly 750,000 Georgians align themselves with the West and its Russophobic, LGBT* and homosexual propaganda, as well as its neglect of Christian Orthodox values and desire to open a "second front" against Russia.

    "It will always be a time bomb and they will always be a destructive element," he warns.

    The analyst draws attention to the fact that it's relatively calm in Tbilisi even though it was earlier expected that the entire Shota Rustaveli Avenue would be blocked by protesters after the election.

    "So everything will continue as it was before," he assumes.

    Former leader of the 2003 Rose Revolution Mikheil Saakashvili and incumbent President Salome Zourabichvili, who advocated sanctions against the Georgian Dream, are nothing but a "spent force", according to the pundit.

    "Saakashvili is unhappy that he remains in prison… Everyone is tired of him," the pundit says, adding that Zourabichvili has likewise outlived her usefulness for the Western-backed opposition.

    Meanwhile, Georgian President Salome Zourabichvili refused to recognize the outcome of the parliamentary elections that took place in the country on October 26, calling for protests.

    "I do not recognize these elections," Zourabichvili told a briefing.
    She also claimed the elections were falsified.

    "I would like to call you tomorrow to Rustaveli Avenue at 7 p.m. [15:00 GMT] so that we can all say together that we do not recognize these elections," Zourabichvili added.

    The Georgian president also thanked those who had "voted for the European future of our country."

    *banned for extremism in Russia

    https://sputnikglobe.com/20241027/georgian-dreams-win-is-undisputable-and-mass-protests-in-tbilisi-are-unlikely---analyst--1120695680.html

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    Post  caveat emptor Mon Oct 28, 2024 4:02 am

    As expected:

    https://news.ru/europe/premer-gruzii-otvetil-na-vopros-o-diplomaticheskih-otnosheniyah-s-rossiej/

    Georgia has no plans to restore diplomatic relations with Russia

    Georgia currently has no diplomatic relations with Russia and does not plan to restore them, Prime Minister Irakli Kobakhidze said at a briefing, answering a question from a NEWS.ru correspondent. According to him, the republic is simply pursuing the president's policy in the national interest.

    We do not have diplomatic relations with the Russian Federation. We are simply pursuing the president's policy in the national interest. But we do not have such serious relations, such as, for example, European integration, with foreign policy players, Kobakhidze answered.

    When asked whether the lack of serious relations with foreign policy players increases the likelihood of establishing strong diplomatic relations with Moscow, Kobakhidze answered in the negative.

    Sorry. No-no-no. There are no plans on this account, because 10% of the territory (Abkhazia and South Ossetia. — NEWS.ru) is occupied by the Russian Federation. Considering that diplomatic negotiations are only just beginning, we decided that we will fulfill these requests, the prime minister said ...
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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  GarryB Mon Oct 28, 2024 9:03 am

    Russia does not need diplomatic relations with Georgia, but it needs a rabid Maidan in Georgia leading to another open conflict zone with thousands of dead Georgians even less.

    The border disputes have been going on for quite some time and wont be solved overnight with any election.

    From a Georgian perspective relations are improving with Russia, though they have slid backwards with the US and EU, but the cost of better relations with the west is to sacrifice a generation of Georgian men and to have their country bombed and shelled, so the current situation is their best option moving forward.

    They will need to wait out the west... the west clearly has to suffer a lot more before it understands it has a choice to fight Russia or to not fight Russia because that choice will have significant effects on the future of the west as an economic and military and political block... fighting Russia has clearly not made things better at all... in fact they have made things worse and they haven't even come into direct conflict with them yet.

    Like the dog chasing the car... if it ever actually caught the car it would not know what to do... yet it continues to bark and chase the car...

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  Kiko Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:38 am

    If only there was no war: Russia's neighbours surprised everyone, by Victoria Nikiforova for RiaNovosti. 10.28.2024.

    The Georgian Dream party won the parliamentary elections in Georgia. The opposition is still whining and denying the obvious, still throwing in some alternative results, but the cries of "Europe has won!" are becoming quieter and less convincing. It is obvious that Europe, represented by pro-European (and more broadly, pro-Western) parties, lost miserably in the elections in Georgia.

    This is a very important turn in the consciousness of the post-Soviet masses, because the European dream has been planted on the outskirts of the USSR like potatoes for more than thirty years. Generations of Georgians grew up with the conviction that Tbilisi is the Georgian Paris , and their small, cozy country is doomed by the very course of events to become part of the European Union. What went wrong?

    To begin with, the Europeans were vigorously, to the point of heartburn, imposing on Georgia perversions that were absolutely alien to its mentality. They came with economic initiatives and a visa-free regime, and it was impossible to avoid them - it was like in the USSR, in addition to chocolate, tea with an elephant and other goodies in the food set, some inedible nastiness was always included.

    The Georgian people voted against gay parades and other LGBT propaganda (banned in Russia), as well as against the persecution of the Orthodox Church, which is sewn into the programs of pro-Western parties under tolerant formulations. And most importantly, against the disgusting arrogance with which Europe imposes all these newfangled nastiness on an ancient civilization that successfully existed back when medieval Paris was drowning in dirt and ignorance.

    Georgia adopted Christianity a century earlier than France . It is natural that the people of this country protect their holy places. It is unnatural that the French despise their heritage. But it is even worse that Europeans who have rejected their roots are making the same demands on other countries. Well, Georgia has put an end to these absurd claims.

    Relations with Russia turned out to be an even more important factor. The Euro-elites wanted to pull the same trick with Georgia as with Ukraine : to plant their puppets in Tbilisi, who would drive the people to fight the Russians.

    Here is what Bidzina Ivanishvili , the founder of the Georgian Dream, said shortly before the elections : "I can remember what former Prime Minister Irakli Garibashvili told me . A high-ranking official from a Western country was talking to him. Irakli asked: "Yes, but how many days do you think we can fight Russia for? How many days can we hold out?" They answered him - three or four days. He said: "And for the sake of these three or four days, you are destroying us?" They answered him: "But there are three or four million of you. They won't kill everyone in three or four days. Then you can start fighting guerrillas in the forests. We will help you."

    "They won't kill everyone", "we will help you"... Similar speeches were also made in Kiev at the beginning of the SVO: remember Boris Johnson with his "let's fight"? Well, what did this lead to for the Ukrainians? To complete devastation and demographic catastrophe - and yet Nezalezhnaya is many times larger than Georgia.

    "Georgian Dream" positioned itself as a party of peace with Russia, and it is not surprising that the Georgian people supported it with their votes. To wage guerrilla warfare in the forests while waiting for help from the Europeans is an extremely stupid idea, Ukraine will not let you lie.

    Now in Europe they are complaining that the Georgians voted so "incorrectly" because they were intimidated by Moscow . But in fact, it was Brussels that was openly blackmailing them . Tbilisi was under severe pressure, demanding that it support anti-Russian sanctions, help Ukraine and open a second front against Moscow. The citizens of the country said that they do not want this - now the newly formed government will carry out their orders.

    Note to Brussels: This is what real democracy looks like. Citizens vote to bring politicians to power, who then begin to implement the will of the people. In Europe, this mechanism has long been broken - they should learn from Georgia, rather than lecture it.

    There is now a groaning in Europe to the skies. Not only have they lost Georgia, but also Moldova is ambiguous. The notorious referendum on joining the European Union looked simply disgraceful. Within the country, the population clearly voted against joining the EU - there were more than 54 percent of such votes. Only the night-time ballot stuffing (according to the official version, these were the votes of Moldovans working in Europe) made it possible to barely stretch an owl onto a globe and count as many as 50.4% of voters who approved joining the EU.

    At the same time, half a million Moldovans living in Russia were practically not allowed to vote - only ten thousand ballots were allocated for all of them. But no abuses helped to ensure the image that Moldovans want to join Europe. In the same way, they did not save the pro-European Maia Sandu - she made it to the second round, but her victory is by no means guaranteed.

    All these machinations cannot be hidden, Europe itself does not believe in its victory in Moldova. The citizens of this country, as well as the Georgians, understand perfectly well that Brussels needs them only as cannon fodder.

    The failure is obvious, and the European establishment should think about its behaviour, so to speak, work on its mistakes. In essence, the only resource they had in the post-Soviet space - the notorious visa-free regime - they have already lost.

    In fact, this mechanism was needed first of all by the Europeans themselves - it provided an influx of disenfranchised and cheap labor. Then, manipulating the visa-free regime, they forced Ukrainians to die for it, and now they thought to use Georgians and Moldovans in the same way. However, the peoples of these countries turned out to be smarter and did not fall into this trap.

    What now? Maybe it's time for the EU to become more humble and stop lecturing other countries, as retiring European Council President Charles Michel advised? (It's amazing how the IQ of European politicians rises immediately after resignation.)

    But Brussels is not heeding this advice yet and is sticking to its favorite tactic - if you can't win fairly, stage a coup. Opposition demonstrations are expected in Tbilisi, where the decisive role will be played by "they are children", familiar to us from the time of the Kyiv Maidan. Riots and rebellions, the overthrow of the legally elected government under the fig leaf of a "color revolution" - this is the last resort to impose "European values" in Georgia, there are simply no others in the EU's arsenal.

    Moldova and Georgia are not some kind of outsiders. In the European Union itself, millions of people do not want to become cannon fodder that corrupt elites will throw to the Eastern Front at the whistle from Washington. If Brussels does not take into account the opinion of these people and continues its suicidal policy, then the Europeans will vote against it with their feet. They were shown how to do this the other day in Georgia, it is worth learning.

    https://ria.ru/20241028/gruziya-1980366318.html

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  Kiko Mon Oct 28, 2024 4:37 pm

    The West has decided to test the Georgian people's resolve, by Anastasia Kulikova, Dmitry Alexandrov from Tbilisi, for VZGLYAD. 10.28.2024.

    Experts assess the prospects of protests in Georgia.

    Georgian President Salome Zurabishvili did not recognize the results of the parliamentary elections, allegedly because of falsifications. Western politicians, European and American media have spoken in a similar vein. The Georgian Dream, which won the elections, insists that Zurabishvili is lying. How will the standoff end and who are its main stakeholders?

    Georgian President Salome Zurabishvili  accused  the authorities of falsifying the parliamentary elections. She also called on her supporters to come out to a protest action, which will take place on Monday at 19:00 (18:00 Moscow time) on Rustaveli Avenue. In this way, the head of state allegedly wants to protect the "totally captured" votes of citizens who want to bring closer the "European future of the country."

    "I want to say on behalf of the only independent institution left in this state - I do not recognize these elections. Recognition of these elections is impossible. This is tantamount to recognizing Russia's arrival here, subordinating Georgia to Russia," she said.

    In turn, the Chairman of the Parliament of the Republic, Shalva Papuashvili,  called  Zurabishvili's statements a lie. According to him, the President "together with the opposition, is involved in a scenario of destabilization of Georgia." Against this background, he also reported that a member of the local self-government body (sakrebulo) from the ruling Georgian Dream, who stuffed ballots for voting in the elections in Marneuli in front of the TV cameras of the opposition companies, has been detained. According to Georgian law, the falsifier faces up to two years in prison,  a correspondent for the Vzglyad newspaper in Tbilisi reports  . According to Papuashvili, there were only "several incidents" during the elections, and this fact is considered the most resonant.

    However, Western countries are actively  criticizing  the results of the parliamentary elections in Georgia. Thus, US Secretary of State Antony Blinken stated that international observers did not recognize the election campaign as free and fair, and the head of European diplomacy Josep Borrell expressed "serious concerns" about the impact of recent legislative amendments on the voting results.

    In addition, the head of the European Parliament delegation, Antonio Lopez-Isturiz White,  expressed  concern on the part of the EU about the regression of democracy in Georgia. According to him, observers from the organization allegedly noticed "a tense atmosphere, confusion and chaos" at the polling stations. He also claims that there was pressure from members of the ruling party on voters. Michael Roth wrote that Germany is also "concerned about the Georgian elections, which were neither free nor fair."

    The results of the campaign are also being actively discussed in Western media. Thus,  The Guardian  writes that the election results will be a "watershed" since they risk changing the path of "once one of the most pro-Western post-Soviet states." The Economist  notes that the scale of the Georgian Dream's victory "has knocked the wind out of the opposition's sails." According to the publication, this will slow down the country's aspirations for EU integration.

    The Financial Times takes a similar position  . The newspaper focuses on the upcoming visit of Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban to the republic. According to  the  publication, this event could exacerbate the political crisis in the country, as well as complicate the European Union's response to the current state of affairs.

    Recall that the elections in Georgia were held on October 26. According to the results of the Central Election Commission, the ruling party "Georgian Dream" took the leading position with 54.08% of the votes after counting 99.2% of the ballots. "Coalition for Change" gained 10.92%, "Strong Georgia" received 8.72%, the party "For Georgia" - 7.76%. Prime Minister of the country Irakli Kobakhidze  assured that the opposition will not be able to interfere with the work of the new parliament.

    "Zurabishvili does not know how to compromise. Moreover, she spoke in advance about falsifications in the event of the victory of the "Georgian Dream", about some secret Russian special operations, so she a priori cut off all her paths to retreat. The president cannot now not say that Tbilisi has strayed from the European path and only she will fight to return to this course,"  said  Georgian political scientist Petre Mamradze. "It seems to me that

    The opposition, deep down, understands Zurabishvili’s inadequacy, but they themselves are not capable of retreating.

    So this game will continue for several more months. But I believe that everything will calm down later. "Georgian Dream" should withstand the pressure, because the truth is on its side," the analyst believes. "In reality, no facts of mass violations were revealed. Perhaps there were only isolated cases. But the election process itself, and this is confirmed by international observers, was well organized by the CEC. And as for talk of polarization, Georgia is no stranger to this," he notes.

    "By the way, I did not see any coercion of civil servants during the elections, and most observers called them honest and free in their interviews with Georgian media," the interlocutor says. He also recalled the "fake hunger strike" of former President Mikheil Saakashvili and the West's calls to release him from prison.

    "But as soon as the ECHR recognized that there was no need to take Saakashvili out of Georgia for treatment, he immediately recovered. I expect something similar this time. There are also more and more people in the West who see that Georgia is being subjected to excessive and undeserved pressure from outside. The visit of Viktor Orban to Tbilisi on October 28-29, the current head of the EU, is one of them. It is very good that he is coming," Mamradze noted.

    German political scientist Alexander Rahr recalls that on Sunday, a number of international media outlets broadcast interviews with international observers who were in Georgia.

    "They started off with restraint, and then louder and louder, talking about manipulations in the elections. The method worked: by evening, the entire West began saying that the results were falsified," he noted. "The liberal elites simply cannot imagine that Georgians would suddenly start voting for a party that acts against European values. According to politicians from Europe and the US, Bidzina Ivanishvili has sold out to Moscow, and he and the Georgian Dream need to be kicked out, and Tbilisi and Kiev should be taken into the European Union," the interlocutor specified.

    Against this backdrop, Berlin's decision not to recognize the election results is a direct signal to the Georgian opposition to take to the streets in protest, Rahr believes. "This is always the case in color revolution scenarios. Tbilisi is threatened by a Maidan supported by the West," he admits.

    According to the political scientist, if Ivanishvili's party remains in power, Germany will cool off significantly towards Georgia and will begin to disrupt partnership relations. "It is also possible that Berlin will completely switch to cooperation with Armenia in the Transcaucasus region," the interlocutor does not rule out.

    As for Viktor Orban's position, his recognition of the legitimacy of the government party's victory will result in another scandal in Brussels, the political scientist predicts. "Ursula von der Leyen is furious about his constant opposition to Brussels' course," Rahr noted.

    Fyodor Lukyanov, editor-in-chief of the magazine Russia in Global Affairs, calls the West's reaction to the elections in Georgia predictable   . He added that the hostility between the country's government, the EU and the US had been forming for quite some time. "But in the last two years this confrontation has worsened, because Tbilisi categorically does not want to get involved in the confrontation between Russia and the West, insisting on its right to remain on the sidelines," the source specified. At the same time, such Brussels and Washington do not like the state of affairs, so they are using the methods and tools they have in their arsenal.

    "So, the argument is used that the Georgian government is burying the country's European future. Negotiations on joining the EU have been suspended. However, this is a bit of demagogy, because the prospects are completely unclear, and there is no real dialogue. Nevertheless, it existed as a label, and now they are waving it around in order to put pressure on Tbilisi," the political scientist said.

    Lukyanov recalled that there is a segment of society in Georgia that considers European orientation to be an absolutely uncontested option for the development of the republic. "The current statements about non-recognition of the elections, about violations that allegedly took place, are aimed at agitating this segment of the population, forcing them to take to the streets and provoke unrest. After all, as soon as an act of force is used, the whole situation gets heated up," the interlocutor explained.

    Georgian President Salome Zurabishvili's calls for protests are also quite an expected step, the expert believes. He noted that the politician is in opposition to the Georgian Dream party, which "in its most radical form is a supporter of blindly joining the Western anti-Russian coalition." "As long as Zurabishvili remains in office, she will try to use her resources to provoke unrest," the political scientist added.

    However, Budapest stands out against the backdrop of calls from European countries not to recognize the parliamentary elections. However, the weight of the position of Hungary, which holds the EU presidency, is small, Lukyanov pointed out. “Viktor Orban is a dissident. Within the European Union, he represents a certain attempt at an alternative view. His position on the elections in Georgia is very consistent. But if Europe and the United States decide to play a certain card in Tbilisi, then he will hardly be able to do anything, to counter the pressure from the West,” the interlocutor specified. According to him, the question of whether to play the “game” has not been finally decided by Western countries. “Is there potential? Of course. Everything will depend on the mental stability and strength of nerves of the “Georgian Dream.” Because the example of Ukraine in 2014 shows that if the government begins to waver, as Viktor Yanukovych did, if it begins to weaken, to go to supposed negotiations, compromises, then this does not lead to anything good,” the political scientist reasons. “Until now, the Georgian authorities have demonstrated amazing firmness. It was difficult to expect Tbilisi to take such a consistent position in defending its interests without succumbing to Western pressure. All previous experience before the events of ten years ago spoke otherwise,” Lukyanov recalled. Now, the Georgian Dream is behaving quite confidently, because the party is convinced that a significant majority of the population is on their side.

    "If the faction chairman Bidzina Ivanishvili and his associates show firmness and are careful - after all, the West's goal is to provoke them into serious use of violence - then, I think, the situation will calm down after some time. They will be left alone for the reason that the US and Europe will see the futility of their actions, and Western countries will not spend too much time and effort on Tbilisi," the expert believes.

    After this, according to the political scientist’s forecasts, the republic’s relations with the West will gradually stabilize, because they are “needed by both sides.” “If the politicians of the Georgian Dream prove that they are stable and cannot be turned away, the US and Europe will have nowhere to go, they will have to interact with Tbilisi. Although, obviously, the processes of so-called integration into the Euro-Atlantic institution are stuck, at least as long as the Georgian Dream remains at the helm,” Lukyanov concluded.

    https://vz.ru/world/2024/10/28/1294834.html

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  Kiko Mon Oct 28, 2024 8:54 pm

    The US has threatened Georgia with consequences if it continues on its current course, 10.28.2024.

    The State Department has threatened Georgia with consequences if Tbilisi maintains its current course.

    WASHINGTON, Oct. 28 — RIA Novosti. The United States is threatening Georgia with "further consequences" if Tbilisi continues on its current course, said US State Department spokesman Matthew Miller.

    "We have been constantly calling on the Georgian government this year to stop its anti-democratic actions and return to the Euro-Atlantic path. We do not rule out further consequences if the direction of the Georgian government does not change," he said, commenting on the results of the elections in Georgia and the policies of the country's authorities.

    Miller added that Washington joins calls from international and local observers for a full investigation into alleged reports of voting irregularities.

    As RIA Novosti was informed by official sources in the region today, the West has already sent snipers trained in Ukraine to Georgia. In this way, they plan to destabilize the internal political situation in the country and provoke another "color revolution."

    Parliamentary elections were held in the country on October 26. According to the Central Election Commission, after counting all the ballots, the ruling party "Georgian Dream" won, gaining 53.93% of the votes. Four opposition parties also entered parliament, receiving a total of 37.78%.

    Opposition representatives stated that they do not recognize the CEC data, all four parties refused the mandates they received. Opposition leaders demanded a new vote under "international administration."

    Georgian President Zurabishvili called the elections totally falsified and called for protests. In addition, speaking at a rally against the voting results, she said that today she had spoken with Western representatives who promised her not to recognize the elections.

    Zurabishvili, who began her political career in Georgia as the French ambassador to the Transcaucasian republic, supports the pro-European opposition, although the constitution requires the president to be non-partisan. She refused to recognize the results of the recent elections and initiated the unification of major opposition parties.

    In turn, the speaker of the Georgian parliament, Shalva Papuashvili, called the actions of Zurabishvili and the opposition preparations for a coup d'état.

    https://ria.ru/20241028/tbilisi-1980593372.html

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  sepheronx Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:39 pm

    Interfering in other countries democracy. Hmm, maybe everyone should start sanctioning US then.

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  d_taddei2 Tue Oct 29, 2024 10:11 am

    USA spitting it's toys out the pram because it doesn't get its own way. The USA and UK governments are the biggest criminals on the planet. I hope the USA descends into civil war when the dollar collapses while the rest of the world is left alone from USA meddling. I hope Georgia forms something similar to customs union with Russia just to piss of the west even more.

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  Kiko Tue Oct 29, 2024 10:49 am

    Relations with Georgia as an example of a new normal, by Timofey Bordachev, Programme Director of the Valdai Club, for VZGLYAD. 10.29.2024.

    For Russia, it is important now to monitor not how diligently the authorities of its neighbours are paying their respects to Moscow, but rather the direction in which their own political system is developing.

    Modern relations between Russia and Georgia are a new normal, in which there is no place for meaningless symbolism, but in which the practical interests of the parties are fully present.

    This practicality extends equally to current issues of relations, as well as to their philosophy itself. The content of this philosophy defines, naturally, Russia as the most powerful state and the pole of attraction for the entire space around us.

    Russia does not need love and assurances of loyalty from its neighbors. If they are not our military and political allies, like Belarus, it is enough that they do not do nasty things to Russia, live by their own wits and understand that any peace is better than a quarrel. And those who have now received a majority in the Georgian parliamentary elections understand this perfectly well.

    However, we should not relax and think that the current situation is forever. Whether we like it or not, relations between nations are never predetermined and represent a constant interaction of checks and balances. Georgia's development, which is favorable to Russia's interests, is the result of Russian policy, which must remain vigilant in the future.

    The first round of presidential elections in Moldova and the voting for parliamentary deputies in Georgia, which took place within a week of each other , show us how different the fates of the peoples of the former USSR have become. And Russia's attitude to everything that is happening there.

    In the first case, we all saw how the will of the absolute majority of citizens living in Moldova was ignored : the “European” amendments to the constitution of the republic were pushed through by a minimal majority of votes of those who are not physically on its territory and do not in any way connect their personal fate with their native land. The definition of the future of a small country was completely denationalized by the ruling group and foreign compatriots.

    In Georgia, everything happened completely differently. There, the president of the republic, a French citizen who often spends long periods of time abroad, heads the camp of the losers. And the forces that won were those that rely on the will of the majority of the permanent population.

    The ruling party "Georgian Dream" is not a pro-Russian force, no matter how much it is accused of this in the West. On the contrary, the head of the republican government representing it declared the day after the elections that the question of restoring diplomatic relations with Russia was not on the table.

    And he accused us of Russia allegedly "occupying" 10% of Georgian territory. This refers to Abkhazia and South Ossetia, whose independence Russia recognized after Mikhail Saakashvili's military adventure in August 2008.

    In part, such statements should, of course, be viewed as a desire to sweeten the pill for the US and the EU of the defeat of their clientele in the parliamentary elections. In part, they serve as a good reminder that we should not confuse the prudence of our neighbors with their desire to be passionate friends with Russia. Which, in fact, concerns not only Georgia: the absolute majority of countries that do not support Western sanctions are not Russia's allies.

    But in a world where independent decision-making has become a scarce commodity, the ability to do so is worth far more than any assurance of brotherly love.

    There is a boring and obscure word in the science of international politics called subjectivity. It means exactly this – the ability of a state to have its policy determined on the basis of its own national interests. It would seem obvious enough that this is how it should be. But the example of Moldova shows how the opposite can happen. When the most important political decisions are the product of anything from Washington’s strategic manipulations to the personal interests of individual politicians, but not the genuine interests and will of the majority of citizens.

    We see something similar in France , where the president of a nuclear power thinks only about how his actions will affect his own job prospects in Brussels or on the board of directors of a transnational corporation. In Finland, where a poorly educated prime minister dragged the country into NATO and then moved into major international consulting. The unfortunate people of Ukraine were dragged into a tragic conflict with fraternal Russia by the strategic maneuvers of the United States. Georgia, on the contrary, having learned from the dramatic experience of the first decades of independence, is choosing to live by its own wits.

    Therefore, it seems that the absence of diplomatic relations, as well as other symbols, do not have fundamental significance for Russia here. What is important is that, with or without diplomatic relations, Georgia's foreign policy is determined by a government that is able to look at the map and understand the economic interests of the population voting for it. Therefore, even with the closed embassies in Moscow and Tbilisi, there is regular air traffic between our countries, a visa-free regime for the movement of citizens, and bilateral trade turnover for the first nine months of 2024 amounted to about $1.8 billion.

    Georgia's geographic location makes it both a great "bridge" for international trade and a hopeless case in a major armed conflict, from which the country and its population would gain nothing in any case. It is no coincidence that during the election campaign, the Georgian Dream party paid special attention to comparing Georgia with what is currently happening in Ukraine.

    As a result, we see what can partly be considered a prototype of Russia's relations with most countries of the former USSR. Like any prototype, it is somewhat exaggerated: no one is saying that the absence of formal diplomatic ties is a panacea for conflicts. But it shows how insignificant the observance of customary procedures can be if good neighborliness is a conscious internal choice. And the policy of a particular state is national in the good sense of the word.

    What is important for us now is not to follow how diligently the authorities of our neighbours are working on their bows to Moscow, but to follow the direction in which their own political system is developing. If it remains governed from national territory, reflects the interests of the population and the economy, we can be relatively calm about the future of our neighbors and our relations with them. But if behind the most beautiful facade there is a shift in the loyalty of the elite and the population to one of the major external partners, then there is every reason to worry. And this is a reason for fairly decisive actions.

    And finally: we must understand that when it comes to the future, no current situation is predetermined. Modern Georgia, independent and thoughtful, can change for the worse under the influence of even random factors. The people of Moldova can regain the right to determine their own destiny if an external force capable of supporting them is found. Or the power of those who deprived them of this opportunity will collapse. In the same way, we cannot now judge with complete confidence the prospects for the foreign policy of other countries in the Caucasus, Central Asia or our neighbors in the West. International relations are not characterized by constancy and stability in general.

    We do not choose our neighbours. But their friendly or hostile behaviour is the result of our own constant efforts. Reminding others that peace is better than war, that good neighbourly relations with Russia will bring benefits, and hostile ones will harm, is a work that can never stop.

    https://vz.ru/opinions/2024/10/29/1294983.html

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  GarryB Wed Oct 30, 2024 6:49 am

    I would declare her persona non grata for trying to destabilize the country which is the opposite a President should do. She should just be politely escorted to the airport to never come back.

    If the west wants a French Revolution in Georgia, then perhaps a whisper in this Presidents ear of a single word... guillotine, and her attention will suddenly be focused somewhere else and require her urgent attention... perhaps a demonstration might be needed to other blind human beings who think Georgia is a pawn to the thrown under the bus and suffer for the amusement of the west.

    We don't see any EU countries ready to send their active armies to fight Russia, but want to haze the newbies by making that a requirement of membership.

    Look at how much this has cost Ukraine and they are not members of the EU or HATO... so they are paying this price for nothing... not a single step to the East... really...

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    Post  Kiko Wed Oct 30, 2024 10:06 am

    Georgian President Zurabishvili Summoned to Prosecutor's Office for Questioning, by Dmitry Alexandrov from Tbilisi for VZGLYAD. 10.30.2024.

    Georgian President Salome Zurabishvili was summoned on October 31 for questioning by the Prosecutor General's Office, which, based on an appeal from the Central Election Commission, is investigating allegations of possible falsifications in the October 26 parliamentary elections, a Vzglyad correspondent reports in Tbilisi.

    Zurabishvili regularly speaks about such falsifications without providing specific facts.

    Under the article of the Criminal Code of Georgia “Falsification of elections” the punishment is up to two years in prison.

    There are no comments from Zurabishvili yet.

    Earlier, Georgian President Salome Zurabishvili accused the authorities of falsifying parliamentary elections, while the Chairman of the Republic’s Parliament, Shalva Papuashvili, called these statements lies.

    According to the Central Election Commission results, the ruling Georgian Dream party received about 54% of the votes.

    https://vz.ru/news/2024/10/30/1295245.html

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    Post  kvs Wed Oct 30, 2024 11:02 am

    No indication of fraud but the usual cookie cutter regime change BS about fraud.   The regime change organizers are in full banana republic
    corruption mode.  Somehow we have Biden allegedly getting 81 million votes which is a total outlier from every previous election:

    https://www.270towin.com/historical-presidential-elections/

    No US president ever got more than 70 million votes before Biden in 2020.   The US population did not surge that much.   One could posit
    that there was a surge in the turnout but this would be an outlier as well.   The D and R total vote counts were under 140 million before
    but in 2020 the vote count was 155 million.   So there was fraud for Trump as well.  

    We'll see if the turnout hits over 155 million this time around with the millions of illegals being voting "rights" via issuance of ID cards.  
    Harris should be getting 90 million or more votes if the 4 am ballot stuffing with mail in ballots pans out.

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    Post  higurashihougi Wed Oct 30, 2024 12:58 pm

    Just some infographic for illustration, how big the 54% of the winner party is :3

    It is noteworthy to see that Gruzian Dream only lost 1 seat compare to their last tenure. The biggest loser is the Unity – National Movement of Tie Eater Mikhail Saakashvili. Other pro-EU opposition parties got a great rise on vote share by eating into the losses of the Unity.

    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Gru20210

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    Post  Kiko Wed Oct 30, 2024 6:35 pm

    Recount of votes in Georgian parliamentary elections confirms CEC data, by Dmitry Alexandrov from Tbilisi for VZGLYAD. 10.30.2024.

    A selective recount of votes at 366 of the 3,111 polling stations opened on October 26, the day of the Georgian parliamentary elections, confirmed the preliminary results of the Central Election Commission on the victory of Georgian Dream, reports a correspondent for the Vzglyad newspaper in Tbilisi.

    As noted in the statement of the Central Election Commission, the results at 334 polling stations were left unchanged – this is 91.25% of the total number where the votes were recounted.

    The final protocols were "minorly changed" at 32 polling stations, the Georgian Central Election Commission said. A recount of the votes took place on October 29.

    Let us recall that the Central Election Commission of Georgia announced that it would recount selectively the votes in all 73 districts, in each of them at five polling stations. This was done against the backdrop of critical comments on the election results.

    Earlier, the Chairman of the Georgian Parliament, Shalva Papuashvili, stated that the Georgian Dream received 263 thousand votes in the parliamentary elections in Tbilisi, which is 45 thousand more than four years ago.

    https://vz.ru/news/2024/10/30/1295362.html

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  Kiko Thu Oct 31, 2024 10:20 am

    Ukraine faces the fate of Georgia and Moldova, by Pëtr Akopov for RiaNovosti. 10.31.2024.

    Zelensky has a new reason for dissatisfaction with the West and accusations of short-sightedness - they can’t stop thinking about Russian red lines not only in relation to Ukraine:

    "We must admit that today Russia has won in Georgia. First they took part of Georgia, then they changed their policy, changed the government - and now there is a pro-Russian government, pro-Russian positions. No sanctions against Putin, there are many Russians in Georgia. Their choice is friendship with Russia, their choice is not to join the EU. They changed their position. Russia has won today. They have taken away Georgia's freedom. This is in relation to Georgia."

    In case Georgia alone is not enough for the West, Zelensky warns of Moldova as Russia's next acquisition: "You will see that Russia is going down the same path. They want to do the same and they will do it if the West does not stop talking about red lines. If they do not stop this and continue this rhetoric, they will lose Moldova in a year or two."

    That is, now Kyiv is scaring the West not only with Russian tanks in Warsaw and Bucharest, but also with the loss of Georgia and Moldova, which were almost in its pocket. Russia has already taken Georgia, and it will soon gobble up Moldova and not choke on it. So the West should think carefully about its prospects and help Ukraine more, which is still holding on and is not going to become part of Russia:

    "That's the difference between us and Georgia: we are much bigger. We have a larger population, more men who didn't want to be Russian. That's all."

    Zelensky's worldview defies logical analysis because it contradicts reality. It turns out that Georgians wanted to be Russian, but Ukrainians and Ukrainian Russians did not want to, and therefore Georgia decided to be friends with Russia, and Ukraine is forced to fight it? But Georgians still cannot forgive Russia for the loss of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, believing that Russia took these regions from them. Although in fact, Georgia lost them after the collapse of the USSR (in the initiation of which it took an active part), when the national autonomies of Georgia did not want to leave the Union with it. In 2008, Georgia tried to take revenge at least in South Ossetia, which it had long been out of control of, and received a military response from Russia. Since then, there have been no diplomatic relations between our countries, and Georgia dreams of joining the EU and NATO. That is, what kind of friendship is there - a course towards the West and "Russia is an occupier."

    But despite all the claims against Russia and the dream of unity with the West, Georgia does not want to become a battlefield between Russia and the West - it wants to go to Europe quietly, without tugging the Siberian bear's whiskers, moreover, it also counts on the return of Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Therefore, Tbilisi did not join the sanctions against Russia and generally behaves more than carefully with Moscow - and the recent parliamentary elections confirmed the support of such a course by at least half of the republic's population. The "Georgian Dream" of billionaire Ivanishvili retained power, although the opposition and the European Union accuse it of falsifications, and the outgoing President Zurabishvili, who is in opposition to the "dreamers", accuses Russia of interfering in the elections. However, the chances of a color revolution are very small - despite all the dissatisfaction with the authorities in the big cities (and the "Dream" lost the elections there), the Georgians are not ready to demolish Ivanishvili. Not only because the opposition is divided, but also because many people actually understand the justice of Ivanishvili’s main slogan: if you want peace, vote for “Dream”, if you want war, vote for the opposition.

    Of course, the slogan is speculative - even if it took power, the opposition would not only not open a "second front" against Russia (which is what they dream of in Kyiv), but it would not even change its policy towards our country much. Yes, Ivanishvili played on fear, but there are grounds for this fear.

    Georgians not only see what is happening in Ukraine, they remember what was happening in their own country in the early 90s, when Tbilisi was essentially in the midst of a civil war, with various parts of the elite locked in a struggle for power. Now Georgia has some kind of vertical power structure, and if the opposition wins, there will be immediate squabbles between its parts. The opposition is not united, but the loudest and most active part of it is made up of supporters of former President Saakashvili. And if they come to power (even as part of a coalition government), where is the guarantee that their leaders (or even Saakashvili himself, whom they will free from prison) will not get involved in some anti-Russian adventure? After all, Saakashvili went on a completely insane attack on South Ossetia in August 2008, during which Russian peacekeepers who were there were killed? And in response he received a Russian attack on Tbilisi, which could have ended with the liquidation of Georgia’s independence, if Russia had had such intentions.

    So the Georgians do not want to experiment with Saakashvili's fans again, especially since if in 2008 only some forces in the West very gently pushed them towards an adventure, now, against the backdrop of the Ukrainian fire, there may be many more people in the West who want to play the Georgian card against Russia. Therefore, it is completely logical that Georgia prefers to wait out the turbulent times in the most neutral position, which, however, is immediately declared pro-Russian in the West and in Kyiv.

    No, Russia did not win in Georgia and did not subjugate it - national interests and sober calculation won in Georgia. Of course, the general weakening of the EU and the West as a whole helped - the US and Europe would like a change of power in Tbilisi, but did not place a big bet on a color revolution. They helped the opposition and supported it, but with the expectation that if it succeeds in overthrowing Ivanishvili, then great, and if it does not, they will have to deal with the current government. Declaring the illegitimacy of the Georgian rulers, that is, breaking ties with Tbilisi, is not in the interests of the West, because the "Georgian Dream" does not abandon the path to the EU. The West is not interested in pushing Georgia into the arms of Russia, so they will grumble, but cooperate with Ivanishvili.

    Neither Europe (united or not), nor the United States, will ever be a guarantor of independence or an ally of Georgia - this is a simple geopolitical truth. And its understanding will come to the majority of the Georgian people.

    By the way, everything said above also concerns Ukraine in many ways, or rather what will remain of it after the war. Only to an even greater extent: an independent Ukrainian state (which is destined to live a life separate from Russia for some time) cannot have any choice at all except friendship and alliance with Russia. Because Georgia is not part of the Russian world, and Ukraine is not just a part, but its birthplace. And if Georgia has a theoretical option of living outside the union with Russia - as a province of Turkey, then Ukraine simply does not and cannot have a path separate from Russia. The "road to Europe" never really existed for it - it was simply a way to separate, split, set two parts of the Russian world against each other, and will soon be closed officially (due to Europe's unwillingness to continue a hopeless conflict with Russia). The time will come to return home.

    So Zelensky is right in some ways, albeit a little ahead of his time: Russia will ultimately win in Georgia and Moldova. And in Ukraine as a whole. In different ways – and at very different prices.

    https://ria.ru/20241031/ukraina-1980997500.html

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    Post  Kiko Thu Oct 31, 2024 7:25 pm

    Zelensky gave Russia victory in Georgia, by Dmitry Bavyrin for VZGLYAD. 10.31.2024.

    "Russia has won in Georgia today. Their choice is friendship with Russia, not with the EU," said Volodymyr Zelensky, suggesting that they come to terms with this. And Europe seems ready to come to terms with this. It will be much more difficult for Brussels to come to terms with something else: the loss of its unambiguous attractiveness for the peoples of the "European periphery." Georgia is not a symptom, it is already a diagnosis.

    "After a toast to public education and irrigation in Uzbekistan, the guests began to disperse." This quote from the film "12 Chairs" is well suited to describe the protests in Georgia .

    After the third action of the pro-Western opposition on Rustaveli Avenue and near the parliament building (in Georgia, it is always there that they make trouble), its participants went home again. For a new revolution , like in 2003, these people have neither anger, nor drive, nor numbers - only boring political activism. Neither the support of the West, nor the participation in the protests of a star - President Salome Zurabishvili - helps.

    Here's the paradox: the current head of state calls for a coup d'état and rejects the results of the recent elections. Donald Trump was almost jailed for much less, but this is normal for Georgia: the president and the government are at odds there. True, now - after the victory of the Georgian Dream party both in the elections and in the subsequent fist-waving session - Zurabishvili's political career is in danger of ending prematurely.

    In turn, the Americans and European commissioners are close to accepting defeat. They comment on the results of the vote through clenched teeth , emphasizing the "investigation of mass violations." However, no one has evidence of these violations or falsifications, although everyone knows what they look like in such cases.

    The compliance of the Georgian elections with the standards adopted in Europe was previously recognized by the relevant structure – the OSCE ODIHR, which traditionally monitors the voting process. According to the rules adopted in the West, the ODIHR should have the last word in such cases, and everything after that is speculation. Brussels has long ceased to be embarrassed by speculation, but the West is literally in a stalemate in Georgia – there is nothing to walk with. The revolution is not taking off, and the winners dominate the legal field.

    The Electoral Commission recounted the votes, but the balance of power will not change . The prosecutor's office began an investigation into possible falsifications (at the request of the Electoral Commission) and summoned the president to testify as a valuable witness and the main exposer of violations in the elections. But Zurabishvili said that she will not testify . This means that she does not have any specifics, and unfounded accusations at this stage of the confrontation with the government will not be enough for her: it is clear whose victory.

    As the children say, "ours" won, although they are not ours at all, and think mainly of themselves. "Georgian Dream" does not want to open a second front in the war with Russia, become a transit country for terrorists and impose sanctions, because it is painful, dangerous and expensive, and not because they are Moscow's allies (no matter what Zurabishvili, the European commissioners and the opposition claim).

    And for that, as they say, we are grateful, because many others – from Moldovan President Maia Sandu to that same Georgian opposition – are not at all frightened by this prospect.

    If the Georgian Dream is true to its promises and is ready for reasonable compromises, diplomatic relations between Russia and Georgia will be restored (trade relations have already been restored). If not, no big deal – we will easily survive this. The main thing is that there is no war.

    By declaring the victory of pro-Russian forces in Georgia, the Georgian Dream is being greatly overpraised. But there is no doubt that the European Union lost in this confrontation. It tried to feed and direct its numerous counterparts inside Georgia – and together with them it lost, and not only in the political sense, but also in the information space: there was propaganda, but it did not work.

    This is a sobering blow for the EU at the worst possible time. While the EU's top diplomat, Josep Borrell, was pondering what to do with the Georgians and whether to fly to Tbilisi, he was beaten to it by Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban, the EU commissioners' main domestic enemy.

    "Nobody wants their country to be destroyed and involved in a war. Therefore, we understand the decision of the Georgian people to choose freedom," he declared there. "I also want to congratulate the Georgian government for not allowing you to become a second Ukraine by pursuing a pro-European policy."

    Hungary currently holds the EU presidency and advocates for Georgia's integration into the EU, but mercilessly criticizes the EU itself, which is also quite a paradox. Orban wants a different European Union - more conservative and without the likes of Ursula von der Leyen. He flew to the banquet in Tbilisi, filled with sincere joy: the Hungarian understands what defeat in Georgia means for the pride and position of the European bureaucracy. Reality flew into her face with asphalt.


    In the perception of the peoples around it, the European Union has transformed from a shining city on a hill that everyone wants to get to into “well, so-so,” as bloggers say.

    The Hungarians are the first to start this re-awareness. Orban was among those who brought them into the EU, but now he seems to be undermining it from within. He is an example man, but there is also an example people: the British. In the 20th century, they voted to be with the EU, and in the 21st century, to leave it.

    True, the British are an ambitious nation that has always had its own mind. Peripheral and poor peoples, comparing the standard of living and quality of governance in their countries with that of the EU, saw a significant difference in favor of the EU. Aware of the attractiveness of their project, the European commissioners put forward conditions, were selective and could always count on obedience.

    They were kings in the eyes of the poor (not monarchs, but democrats), but that time has passed due to the progressive movement of kings and poor towards each other.

    The beggars did not become kings, but in a number of ways they stopped being completely beggars – they saved up some fat, made repairs and softened their morals (which is clearly visible in Georgia). And the European masters of life, on the contrary, began to approach the population of the outskirts in terms of the number of problems. The burden became heavier, the economy weaker, the streets of large cities more dangerous. Now citizens of the countries of the eastern part of Europe have many reasons to compare themselves with citizens of the countries of the western part, and to their own advantage too.

    In Brussels, they did not feel the comprehensive significance of this "erasure of differences". On the contrary, they began to behave more brazenly. The demands of European integrators shifted from the rights of sexual minorities and transparency of tenders to complete political subordination and entering into conflict with Russia. At the same time, "the young one was no longer young". Not as attractive as she would have liked.

    The methods that worked so well in the Balkans, where only the Serbs are trying to resist, are no longer working even in Moldova . The idea of ​​changing the constitution for the sake of joining the EU barely won in a photo finish and only thanks to the votes of the diaspora. This was followed by a clear defeat in Georgia, which is richer than Moldova, but the president is also one of our own.

    There could be a toast here about how, high up in the mountains, the unpleasant bureaucrats from the uncomfortable city of Brussels learned that they were no longer a beauty, and for many, a toad. But it is better to give this toast to the Georgians. They are good at it.

    https://vz.ru/politics/2024/10/31/1295333.html

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    Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia. - Page 10 Empty Re: Georgia's possible rapprochement with Russia.

    Post  Kiko Fri Nov 01, 2024 7:39 pm

    Medvedev spoke about restoring diplomatic relations with Georgia, 11.01.2024.

    Medvedev: Russia will restore diplomatic relations with Georgia if the republic's authorities want it.

    MOSCOW, November 1 - RIA Novosti. Russia will restore diplomatic relations with Georgia if the republic's authorities want it, but now the ruling Georgian party does not want it, said Deputy Chairman of the Russian Security Council Dmitry Medvedev.

    "For us, these Georgian authorities, the Georgian party are not close. They proceed from completely different ideas. They do not even want to restore diplomatic relations. But this is a matter for the future. If they want to restore them someday, we will restore them. Although it is possible to cooperate without diplomatic relations," Medvedev said in an interview with RT.

    https://ria.ru/20241101/medvedev-1981438639.html

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