Russian special military operation in Ukraine #62

Just in case anyone missed it Garry issued an important announcement this morning. 

Everyone needs to read it, especially those who issue low level and other insults against others here.

https://www.russiadefence.net/t9144-expected-behaviour-part-2

Some visual effects on the arrival of the "Nutwood"      

P.S. For those who do not understand what he saw:
the standard equipment of a nuclear warhead is 150 kilotons for each of the six warheads. So you see the arrival of the equivalent of about FIFTY Hiroshima bombs in a fairly small area in seven seconds.
Try this on any hostile European city.
This is the very message that Russia sent.
I see that this conclusion has proved too difficult for many here.

Almost angelic.

@SeigSoloyvov

Looks like you've just earned yourself a new name..."SMIRV"

Ah so racism and calls from for genocide are okay now, see that's all I wanted know. Now I won't call PHST out for breaking such rules because they don't exist

Just don't ban anyone If they Make such remarks on the Russians, after all of one aise can do it both can.

The rules are pretty clear, they don't mention racism or genocide, but they do mention abuse of other members and I have spoken to PhSt about this and he has apologised to me and has said he will try to abide by the rules of this forum in future... like I would expect from all members including myself.

I have used inappropriate language and called people idiots too so it is a bit hypocritical of me banning everyone.

Of course enforcing the rules is my job so after giving him a ban and explaining to him what he was doing wrong I would then proceed to give the same explanation to half the members here about their bans for their abuse in return.

In this case I decided a global warning to everyone to show a bit more respect was a better option and to tell everyone that if there is abuse including racism which is abuse isn't it?... then the procedure for members is to reply in kind and expect to be banned if anyone complains along with the other verbal abusers, or to notify a mod about the problem and let them deal with it, or just ignore them for the angry little people they clearly are being at the time.

Oreshnik is derived from the RS-26 Rubezh.

Basically it a two stage (instead of three) version of the Rubezh.

Is that official from the Russian government or military, or western speculation?

Either way it would go better in the appropriate new thread where other speculation should go that is not directly related to the Ukraine conflict.

Bullshit! Can't you see all these third world states like Pakistan, India issuing a NOTA several times a year before testing their MRBM and IRBM.

They signed up to those international agreements over international safety concerns. Russia and the US didn't have to sign such agreements because the INF treaty banned that range of weapon types from production or even testing.

They are no a party to those agreements, though in this case Russia warned them as a courtesy... they were not required to... and may not in the future if civilian casualties are not likely.

You are really dumber than anyone would dare to assume

Personal insults are not necessary. Rather than saying he is stupid, perhaps it would be more constructive to educate him with the facts.

P.S. For those who do not understand what he saw:
the standard equipment of a nuclear warhead is 150 kilotons for each of the six warheads. So you see the arrival of the equivalent of about FIFTY Hiroshima bombs in a fairly small area in seven seconds.

To be clear if those warheads were nuclear they would be moving just as fast but would detonate mid air and would have separated much earlier so they could hit separate targets (cities).

Normal procedure would be to launch say five missiles with roughly parallel flight paths, and with each missile having 6 warheads warhead number one on all six missiles would be aimed at one target, warhead two on a different target, warhead three on a third target etc etc so that each city might get 6 nukes hitting it but each will come from a different missile coming in on a different angle. It also means in the unlikely event one missile fails or is shot down warheads from the other missiles will still hit the target 5 times so it will be destroyed anyway.

You've just earned yourself a new name..."SMIRV"

I am not counting that as abuse because Smurfs are cool...

Dial back the negative comments please... act like adults.

Anyone can make mistakes.

Either a secondary detonation, or after the big missile, its smaller sisters arrived.

Just compressed air in front of the penetrators as they come in will make them white hot.

The APFSDS penetrator from a 125mm smoothbore tank gun travels at about 1.8km/s... these much bigger much heavier lumps of metal are coming in rather faster at 2.5 to 3km/s and could weigh 20 times more... APFSDS rounds are about 7kgs...

When they impact the ground the energy from the impact will be converted to very high temperatures... underground bunkers would burn with that sort of kinetic energy... and fragments breaking off the penetrators and also material at the target site being thrown around by the impact would do serious damage as well... the shockwave would kill a human being.

The Americans developed a nuclear powered cruise missile that flew at about 60m atltitude at mach 3 and it could kill people on the ground as it flew by just by the shockwave it generated. These penetrators are moving three times faster.

Eugenio Argentina wrote:An emergency meeting of the Ukraine-NATO Council will be held on November 26 to discuss the consequences of the use of a new Russian missile at a Ukrainian defense industry facility, the AFP agency reported, citing its diplomatic sources.

I still don't understand why they have let a defence facility untouched so close to the them and let them produce weapons there.

Pacense wrote:Impossible to descalate now. From both sides. Prepare for the worst.

It's always possible to de-escalate

Because it's only one side that's escalating

All they have to do is stop doing so, and everything will fall into place and gradually calm down

pavi wrote:There are couple of reasons. First even though Russia can produce a lot of missiles the supply is not infinite which leads target priorization. Second, the amount of missile capable doing enough damage required to destroy this fortification has been too much to justify it. Third , they maybe wanted capture the plant realtively intact. It is Russians, who are rebuilding these areas.

Option 4

Russia had some sort of 'deal' or 'tacit understanding' with the Ukraine, which of course the Ukrainians broke after playing Russia for the fools that they are. Or maybe it was Russia that broke the understanding for once. That would be an improvement.

Americans are cuckolds par excellence.

At the critical moment they will choke, turn tail and slink back to their island.

Tale as old as time.

Arkanghelsk wrote:The US controls Israeli actions, you attribute to much agency to the proxy

Just like Ukraine

US chooses the target , the weapons and the course of action , then they pretend they don’t have control over those crazy proxies

US psychology is maximum reward for minimal consequence

Should NATO get hit, the US won’t do much except a symbolic strike to maintain their image

Because that’s what it boils down to

It’s hold and strike strategy

But the US won’t escalate into a wider war, they can neither afford it, or supply it

Resistance is figuring that out, and the pushback will increase , the US is in scorched earth retreat mode

Not fit to fight a large war or risk its own economy and population

IMO too much caution was used with the US, but they aren’t some crazy suicidal guy, they just use intimidation and reputation to force their opponents to blink

The opponent is only now realizing the US can’t take a punch

Problem with all that is, arkhangelsk

Is that the US knows they're done. That's why they're so desperate to defeat Russia in the first place. Because if they do so, the BRICS will be neutered and the rest of the world will quickly get into line. China may try to resist, but at that point it will be surrounded on all sides, with a pro-Western Russian puppet regime to the north and Kazakhstan will use the excuse to jump ship to the West immediately too. It'll be over.

But that requires Russia to capitulate.

Or at least agree to a 'freeze' of the conflict, which will allow the West to rebuild its war industries, blockade Chinese goods, re-arm the Ukraine and get ready for its next attempt. That's the next best thing for the West and what it's shooting for now. BRICS will proceed but the wind will be taken out of its sails and the West will gradually be able to strong-arm the more vulnerable countries out of joining any alternative payment systems and so on.

But if none of that is possible then what's left?
Might as well go out with a bang. There is no plan C.

Which is of course, no excuse for Russia to pull its punches and avoid responding to escalations. Russia has to do that, as there are also some sane-minded people in the West who may be able to seize the initiative if the circumstances are right.

pavi wrote:There is zero evidence, that it was kinetic. Also there is zero evidence that HE was involved. If itwas kinetic, it would be very mild for warhead, only 75 kg or 150 kg TNT equivalent (M=100/200 kg, v~2500 m/s). Why bother do that kind of warhead?
The yuszhmash factory consists several uderground floors where are bunker like workshops underground. Woul it be visible, if penetrating warhead explose somewhere lowest floor. I don't think so...

Well, it might only be a 150kg TNT equivalent, but the roof coming down over your head at a speed of Mach whatever will still kill you. For underground facilities, that's all you need to do.

Isos wrote:I still don't understand why they have let a defence facility untouched so close to the them and let them produce weapons there.

Not as bad as the one in the Sumy region that they only destroyed a few days ago

That one was literally just across the border

Not enough missiles my ass

Summary of the Russian Ministry of Defense on the progress of repelling the attempted invasion of the Armed Forces of Ukraine into the territory of the Russian Federation in the Kursk region (as of November 22, 2024)

The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue to defeat the formations of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the Kursk region.

Units of the North group of forces defeated formations of the 41st, 47th and 115th mechanized, 5th and 17th tank, 82nd airborne assault brigades, 36th Marine Brigade, 112th, 117th and 129 brigades of territorial Defense of the Armed Forces of Ukraine districts of the settlements of Alexandria, Viktorovka, Darino, Lebedevka, Leonidovka, Malaya Loknya, Nikolsky, Novoivanovka and Sverdlikovo.

The enemy's manpower and equipment were hit by tactical and army aviation strikes and artillery fire in the areas of the settlements of Alexandria, Kurilovka, Lebedevka, Leonidovka, Malaya Loknya, Martynovka, Melovy, Nizhny Klin, Nikolaevka, Nikolaevo-Darino, Nikolsky, Novoivanovka, Plekhovo, Sverdlikovo, Staraya Sorochina, Cherkasskoye Porechnoye, as well as Basovka, Belovody, Zhuravka, Obody and Yunakovka in Sumy region.

During the day, the losses of the Armed Forces amounted to 150 soldiers. Four vehicles, an artillery piece and two mortars were destroyed.

In total, during the fighting in the Kursk direction, the enemy lost more than 34,690 servicemen, 215 tanks, 147 infantry fighting vehicles, 120 armored personnel carriers, 1,190 armored combat vehicles, 992 vehicles, 297 artillery pieces, 40 multiple rocket launchers, including 11 HIMARS and six MLRS manufactured by the United States, 13 anti-aircraft launchers missile systems, seven transport-loading vehicles, 68 electronic warfare stations, 13 counter-battery radars, four air defense radars, 27 units of engineering and other equipment, of which 13 engineering barrier vehicles, one UR-77 mine clearance unit, as well as six armored recovery vehicles and a command and staff vehicle.

The operation to destroy the AFU formations continues.

https://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12538283@egNews

Summary of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the progress of the special military operation (from November 16 to 22, 2024)

From November 16 to 22, the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation carried out massive and 30 group strikes with high-precision weapons, including the Kinzhal hypersonic aeroballistic missile, as well as unmanned aerial vehicles. As a result, important facilities of the military-industrial complex of Ukraine, energy facilities used to provide the Armed Forces, the infrastructure of military airfields, assembly and storage sites for attack unmanned aerial vehicles, as well as arsenals, ammunition and fuel depots were hit. On November 21, 2024, in response to the use of American and British long-range weapons at facilities on the territory of the Russian Federation, the Armed Forces launched a combined attack on one of the facilities of the military-industrial complex of Ukraine in Dnepropetrovsk. For the first time in combat conditions, a medium-range ballistic missile in nuclear-free hypersonic equipment "Oreshnik" was successfully used in the strike. The launch goal has been achieved. All combat units have reached the target of destruction. In addition, the points of temporary deployment of units of the Ukrainian armed forces, nationalist formations and foreign mercenaries were defeated.

During the week, the units of the North group of troops continued to defeat the Armed Forces of Ukraine formations in the Kursk region. Air strikes, unmanned aerial vehicles and artillery fire hit the manpower and equipment of the tank, five mechanized, three airborne assault brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, a marine brigade, five air defense brigades and two National Guard brigades. In the Kharkiv direction, units of the mechanized, motorized infantry, amphibious assault brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, four air defense brigades, a brigade of the National Guard and a border detachment of the border service of Ukraine were defeated. During the week in the area of responsibility of the North group of forces, enemy losses amounted to 2,620 soldiers, seven tanks, including the Leopard tank produced by Germany, 73 infantry fighting vehicles, two of them Bradley made by the United States and three German Marder armored vehicles, an American M113 armored personnel carrier, 47 vehicles and 24 guns field artillery.

Units of the Zapad group of forces occupied more advantageous lines and positions, defeated the manpower and equipment of five mechanized, jaeger, airborne brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, two defense brigades and a National Guard brigade. 27 counterattacks of the AFU assault groups were repelled. The enemy lost more than 3,210 military personnel, 16 armored combat vehicles, including four M113 armored personnel carriers manufactured by the United States, 36 vehicles and 30 field artillery guns, including ten self-propelled artillery installations and 155-mm howitzers manufactured by NATO countries. Six electronic warfare stations and 17 field ammunition depots were destroyed.

As a result of active actions, units of the "Southern" group of troops liberated the settlement of Dalneye of the Donetsk People's Republic. The formations of four mechanized, motorized infantry, mountain assault, two airmobile, amphibious assault brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were defeated. We repelled 13 counterattacks by AFU units. The enemy's losses amounted to over 3,845 military personnel, four tanks, ten armored combat vehicles, of which five M113 armored personnel carriers manufactured by the United States, 51 vehicles, 35 field artillery guns, including 16 Western-made. 10 electronic warfare and counter-battery warfare stations were destroyed, as well as 16 field ammunition depots.

Units of the Center group of forces continued to advance into the depth of the enemy's defense and liberated the settlements of Leninskoye, Novoalekseyevka, Novoselidovka, Ilyinka and Novodmitrovka of the Donetsk People's Republic. The manpower and equipment of the tank, four mechanized, infantry, three jaeger brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, two marine brigades, three defense brigades and two National Guard brigades were defeated. We repelled 68 enemy counterattacks. During the week, the losses of the Ukrainian armed forces in this area amounted to over 2,680 servicemen, two Bradley infantry fighting vehicles made in the USA, 17 armored combat vehicles, including two American M113 armored personnel carriers, six Cossack armored vehicles, MaxxPro made in the USA and Kirpi made in Turkey, 19 vehicles and 36 guns field artillery.

As a result of the active actions of the units of the Vostok group of forces, the settlement of Makarovka in the Donetsk People's Republic was liberated. The formations of the mechanized, motorized infantry, infantry brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, a marine brigade, four air defense brigades and a National Guard brigade were defeated. Nine counterattacks of the AFU assault groups were repelled. The enemy lost up to 975 soldiers, seven tanks, including a Leopard made in Germany, 13 armored combat vehicles, 36 vehicles, 15 field artillery guns, as well as two M113 armored personnel carriers, an HMMWV armored vehicle and a HIMARS multiple rocket launcher.

Units of the Dnepr group of forces defeated the manpower and equipment of three mechanized, infantry, mountain assault brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and three air defense brigades. The losses of the Armed Forces amounted to up to 530 servicemen, 37 vehicles, four field artillery guns, 11 electronic and counter-battery warfare stations and four field ammunition depots.

Air defense systems shot down a long-range guided missile "Neptune", five operational and tactical missiles ATACMS manufactured in the United States, two cruise missiles "Storm Shadow" manufactured in the United Kingdom, 16 guided aircraft bombs "Hammer" manufactured in France, 18 rockets of the HIMARS multiple launch rocket system manufactured in the United States and 642 unmanned aerial vehicles of the aircraft type.

During the week, 82 Ukrainian servicemen surrendered on the line of contact, 52 of them surrendered in the Kursk direction.

In total, since the beginning of the special military operation, 648 aircraft, 283 helicopters, 36,500 unmanned aerial vehicles, 586 anti-aircraft missile systems, 19481 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 1490 multiple rocket launchers, 18388 field artillery and mortars, 28637 units of special military vehicles have been destroyed.

https://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12538287@egNews

Russian MoD reporting 13,860 Ukrainian casualties over the past 7 days.

Isos wrote:
I still don't understand why they have let a defence facility untouched so close to the them and let them produce weapons there.

Quite clever actually. Give your enemy a false sense of security and then one foggy morning...BAM!

A couple of restless nights ahead - where will they strike next? And then one day when the dust has settled and everyone is cozy...BAM!

Time to play Schiffeversenken with Nimnitz Class in Houthi edition.

Arrow wrote:Ukraine is asking for US THAAD on Oreshnik. Trump reportedly fully supported attacks on Russia with NATO weapons. So those who believe in Trump so much will soon be disappointed.

Hopefully the US will comply and send the THAAD so that Russia prove its utter inability to shoot down these missiles. They couldn't even shoot down Iranian missiles with it in Israel.

Some people are really gullible. Thinking you can intercept a Mach 10 weapon with a Mach 8 missile.