RUSSIA - INDIA Military Contracts

GarryB wrote:

another glaring example being indian signed 5 batteries of s400 and no further details but cost amounts to over 4 b $ though China got at different rates

I rather suspect if India is paying more for their S-400s it is because China is getting and paying for the bare minimum deal, and the Indians are perhaps buying all the extras and perhaps the production rights to perhaps produce the missiles themselves... or mostly anyway.

haha you are spot on i got this news link today

although details about any deal by Russia-India is hard to get in media though we discuss about what is known probably like take the case of despite feeling absence of AMRAAM in feb air conflict India orders many missiles from Russia worth 300 million $ but again no details about range ot which longest range indian ordered on emergency basis ?

Moscow, New Delhi in talks over S-400 missiles production in India: Rostec CEO

MOSCOW: Moscow is holding talks with New Delhi on starting the production of S-400 Air Defense Systems in India, said Sergey Chemezov, CEO of Russia`s Rostec state corporation on Sunday. "Yes, we are discussing the localization [of S-400 production] with India as well," Chemezov told the RBK broadcaster, adding that India has already acquired the license for the production of a lot of technology, such as the Su-30 fighter jet and the T-90 tank, reported Sputnik.

"We have developed the BrahMos missiles together with them [India], on their territory, together with their scientists," Chemezov pointed out.Last month, External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar was in Moscow to meet his Russian counterpart Sergey Lavrov to discuss ways to further advance bilateral cooperation.

New Delhi had signed a USD 5.43 billion deal with Russia for the purchase of five S-400s during the 19th India-Russia Annual Bilateral Summit in New Delhi on October 5, 2018, last year, which Washington had indicated may trigger Countering America`s Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA) sanctions.

Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov on last week had said S-400 air defence missile systems will be delivered to India in strict accordance with the schedule."The advance payment has been received and everything will be delivered in strict accordance with the schedule, within about 18-19 months," Borisov told state-owned broadcaster Rossiya-1.

https://zeenews.india.com/india/moscow-new-delhi-in-talks-over-s-400-missiles-production-in-india-rostec-ceo-2234625.html

Regarding Air to Air missiles, they have recently shown the RVV-BD export version of the R-37M on MiG-35s and Su-35s, so there should be no reason why they wouldn't be able to adapt the Su-30MKI to use it too... or they could look at new model R-77s...

GarryB wrote:Regarding Air to Air missiles, they have recently shown the RVV-BD export version of the R-37M on MiG-35s and Su-35s, so there should be no reason why they wouldn't be able to adapt the Su-30MKI to use it too... or they could look at new model R-77s...

Its means india has acquired 120 km + rage air to air missile from russia in this order to be use don sukhois ?

Pinto wrote:

GarryB wrote:Regarding Air to Air missiles, they have recently shown the RVV-BD export version of the R-37M on MiG-35s and Su-35s, so there should be no reason why they wouldn't be able to adapt the Su-30MKI to use it too... or they could look at new model R-77s...

Its means india has acquired 120 km + rage air to air missile from russia in this order to be use on sukhois ?

Indian sukhois can only carry r27E and r-77. If they want the the r-77-1 or r-37 they need software upgrades.

For israeli or western missile, they woukd need bugger changes as the radar wasn't made to control foreign missiles.

If they are smart they will wait the r-77ME with 200km range and not buy neither r-77 nnor r77-1.

Isos wrote:

Pinto wrote:

GarryB wrote:Regarding Air to Air missiles, they have recently shown the RVV-BD export version of the R-37M on MiG-35s and Su-35s, so there should be no reason why they wouldn't be able to adapt the Su-30MKI to use it too... or they could look at new model R-77s...

Its means india has acquired 120 km + rage air to air missile from russia in this order to be use on sukhois ?

Indian sukhois can only carry r27E and r-77. If they want the the r-77-1 or r-37 they need software upgrades.

For israeli or western missile, they woukd need bugger changes as the radar wasn't made to control foreign missiles.

If they are smart they will wait the r-77ME with 200km range and not buy neither r-77 nnor r77-1.

So it means none of the recently ordered missiles by India from Russia has range of 150 km or so ?


But there is a talk of india got R37M missiles as well, is it confirmed ?

GarryB wrote:Regarding Air to Air missiles, they have recently shown the RVV-BD export version of the R-37M on MiG-35s and Su-35s, so there should be no reason why they wouldn't be able to adapt the Su-30MKI to use it too... or they could look at new model R-77s...

India and Russia also have Novator KS-172 with a long range ?

So it means none of the recently ordered missiles by India from Russia has range of 150 km or so ?

No.

India and Russia also have Novator KS-172 with a long range ?

It is/was a project. It is not in active service and no one really knows how far they went in this project.

Russia stoped it for r37M. India wanted to continue the project for its su-30MKI.

Isos wrote:

So it means none of the recently ordered missiles by India from Russia has range of 150 km or so ?

No.

India and Russia also have Novator KS-172 with a long range ?

It is/was a project. It is not in active service and no one really knows how far they went in this project.

Russia stoped it for r37M. India wanted to continue the project for its su-30MKI.

hmm but many sites including wike shows that india and russia have these missiles

Indian sukhois can only carry r27E and r-77. If they want the the r-77-1 or r-37 they need software upgrades.

That is like telling me I can't play World of Tanks on my computer because I haven't downloaded it and installed it on my computer.

For israeli or western missile, they woukd need bugger changes as the radar wasn't made to control foreign missiles.

If they are smart they will wait the r-77ME with 200km range and not buy neither r-77 nnor r77-1.

If they were buying Su-57s they would likely be getting the new missiles as part of the package, but if they want range then the easiest current way for them to get that is a combination of buying the R-77-1 which is already in production and RVV-BD which should already also be ready for production and export... being a missile for export... and then in 4-5 years time or before when they are ready they can look at licence production of the R-77ME.

So it means none of the recently ordered missiles by India from Russia has range of 150 km or so ?

Depends on what they ordered specifically, but probably not. They talk about R-27E missiles with ranges of 160km but I doubt they reach more than 100km to be honest.

But there is a talk of india got R37M missiles as well, is it confirmed ?

That would be the RVV-BD which is a 200km range missile for export...

India and Russia also have Novator KS-172 with a long range ?

There was talk but no actual evidence of anything that was operational.

AFAIK it lost the competition to arm the MiG-31M, which was won by the R-37M... which we have seen advertised and on aircraft.

hmm but many sites including wike shows that india and russia have these missiles

I have seen mockups, but never an operational missile on anything.

hmm so by above comments from Garry and Isos its clear that india did get many missiles for emergency storks in recent times but its not clear what exactly range they are and which version they are

Don't think the missile with the longest range wins.

Long range is a useful feature, but you still need to ID the target... in the Ukraine they were doing an air defence exercise and launched off an S-200, an SA-5 Gammon, which has a particularly long range... it ended up getting a lock on a civilian airliner outside the exercise area and shooting it down...

GarryB wrote:Don't think the missile with the longest range wins.

Long range is a useful feature, but you still need to ID the target... in the Ukraine they were doing an air defence exercise and launched off an S-200, an SA-5 Gammon, which has a particularly long range... it ended up getting a lock on a civilian airliner outside the exercise area and shooting it down...

lol damn thats scary

In the 1980s BVR was considered a total waste of time and money... Sparrows had turned out ineffective in Vietnam... but then they were using them at short range against manouvering fighters... it was generally accepted that BVR missiles were for shooting down bombers and cruise missiles and other simple targets at long range, and that the rest of air combat would be with short range missiles and guns.

Note before Vietnam the US had decided that their Sparrows were good enough that their backstop became their Sidewinders so they didn't need guns on fighter planes any more. Ironically the Phantom would have been an excellent aircraft for the North Vietnamese for shooting down B-52s... WVR missiles had rather smaller HE payloads which often struggled doing enough mortal damage to a big aircraft to bring it down. Kills of B-52s would have been much higher if the Soviets and Vietnamese had changed the proximity settings for their SA-2s so they exploded closer to the targets... but everyone learned something...

Modern evidence seems to suggest that if the enemy aircraft is basic and doesn't have much of a self defence electronics set up, a sneaky shot from a BVR can get a kill, but most of the time most long range AAMs will struggle against an aware and well equipped enemy.

The thing is that now the have track while scan and ARH missiles. The targeted plane will know only in the last few seconds that a missile is coming on him.

Evasive action can be made but it reduces the speed of the aircraft, turns the belly (bigger rcs) towards the missile's seeker and the jammers stop facing the front where they are most of the time and lose of altitude making its own missile shorter range.

If there is a second missile behind the first one, he will get the kill.

And even if not, the targeted plane will go defensive (evasive actions) lose speed and altitude making it an easier target for the second volley MRAAM which have the advantage of speed and altitude over the targeted fighter's missiles or of short range IR missiles which will also have longer range.

If those one still miss, the attacking aircraft will have the speed and energy to fire with its guns first.

The thing is that now the have track while scan and ARH missiles. The targeted plane will know only in the last few seconds that a missile is coming on him.

Normally when the target is owned by a third world country and the missile was fired from an aircraft of the first world, that is probably exactly what happens.

More capable aircraft will detect incoming threats and might even get warning of the enemy aircraft being in their airspace prior to the engagement.

Modern air to air combat is like submarine warfare with fighters not wanting to give their positions away with excessive radar use, but with the proper support most modern fighters... especially stealthy 5th gen ones should have a reasonable air picture so surprise is less likely.

Evasive action can be made but it reduces the speed of the aircraft, turns the belly (bigger rcs) towards the missile's seeker and the jammers stop facing the front where they are most of the time and lose of altitude making its own missile shorter range.

Evasive manouvers will likely be in response to EW warning which might indicate a suitable evasive manouver to enhance the performance of onboard active measures... ie towed decoy, disposable decoys, active and passive jammers etc.

If there is a second missile behind the first one, he will get the kill.

A second missile would be a problem, but only if it had an alternative homing method as if both are IR guided or ARH guided or SARH guided then whatever made the first missile miss, might also render the second ineffective.

A modern self defence suite should fairly rapidly distinguish between an IR guided weapon from an ARH or SARH, and act appropriately, but certainly firing different missile types makes the targets task of evasion much more difficult.

And even if not, the targeted plane will go defensive (evasive actions) lose speed and altitude making it an easier target for the second volley MRAAM which have the advantage of speed and altitude over the targeted fighter's missiles or of short range IR missiles which will also have longer range.

Equally even if the second wave of missiles miss, your enemy has spent the last few minutes manouvering hard and not really doing much that threatens you, all the while you are getting closer and perhaps are ready to launch your third missile.

But again it depends on the calibre of the target... with the near future introduction of the 9M100 which is also for use as a CIWS for the navy as well as a similar role for S-350 batteries and possibly even on separate units like perhaps tanks or maybe even as an additional weapon for other platforms while they are reloading, it might come down to how many self defence missiles does your aircraft carry?

If those one still miss, the attacking aircraft will have the speed and energy to fire with its guns first.

Speed and energy were critical because they could be changed for height and of course avoiding that terrible state the stall where you are a victim and not a hunter.

Modern TVC engines means even in a stall an aircraft can point its nose directing its radar and other sensors in any direction and launch its weapons on direct paths to targets... which gives their missiles more energy on target...

Rob Lee
@RALee85
·
4h
ET reports that at the meeting between Indian Defense Minister Rajnath Singh and Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu Russia offered India the Project 12701 Alexandrit-E ships under a transfer of technology deal with the Goa Shipyard. 3/


Rob Lee
@RALee85
·
4h
According to ET, India "urgently" needs 12 minesweepers to replace its decommissioned Pondicherry class minesweepers. The two sides agreed to go ahead with the modernization of India's 272 Su-30MKI fleet, the prototype of which will be developed by HAL with Russian support. 4/


Rob Lee
@RALee85
·
4h
The contract to build 670k AK-203 rifles in Amethi through the lndo-Russia Rifles Private Limited JV will soon be "operationalized." Singh also pushed for "joint manufacturing of spares, components and aggregates in India to reduce costs and supply timelines." 5/


https://m.economictimes.com/news/defence/russia-ready-to-start-amethi-rifles-unit/amp_articleshow/71945502.cms?from=mdr&__twitter_impression=true

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1225141837469495301

"In an interview at India's DefExpo 2020, Minpromtorg's Denis Manturov said that India has made proposals to purchase or license produce the BTR-82A, BMP-3, and Sprut SDM1. And Russia has offered the joint production of an IFV with a 57mm cannon."

Weaponry worth $15 billion in Moscow pipeline, underlining Russia's status as India's premier arms supplier

On Wednesday, the Ministry of Defence (MoD) will clear the purchase of one, and possibly two, Russian weapons systems, taking orders in the Moscow pipeline to above $15 billion and underlining Russia’s status as India’s premier arms supplier.

The Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) — the MoD’s apex procurement body, headed by Defence Minister Rajnath Singh — is poised to clear the purchase of the 9K338 Igla-S missile system for a sum of $1.3 billion. India will buy 800 launchers and 5,175 Igla-S missiles, which fall in the so-called “Very Short Range Air Defence System” (VSHORADS) category. The VSHORADS procurement has been mired in controversy. The Igla-S is a 16-year-old missile system, first built in 2004, which the Russian military replaced in 2014 with the newer, far more capable, 9K333 Verba missile.

After the MoD announced in November 2018 that it had chosen the Igla-S over the other two VSHORADS on offer – Swedish firm Saab’s RBS-70; and the Mistral, offered by European consortium, MBDA – Saab shot off four letters of protest to the MoD alleging foul play in testing.

However, internal MoD evaluators ruled that testing had followed procedure. In a reply to Saab that Business Standard has reviewed, the MoD wrote the “case has progressed as per provisions of Defence Procurement Procedure (DPP) with level playing field to all the participating vendors.”

Apparently, the MoD feels the Igla-S met India’s needs and Rosoboronexport’s price of under $1.47 billion makes it a value proposition compared to Saab’s tag of $2.6 billion and MBDA’s offer of $3.68 billion.

Russian industry sources say that, when the Indian tender was floated in 2010, they had only the Igla-S to offer since the Verba was not ready. In 2014, when the Russian military introduced the fourth-generation Verba, Rosoboronexport offered to replace the Igla-S with the new missile.But the MoD said the DPP did not permit this change.

Consequently, the Indian military will get an obsolescent VSHORADS that will be almost two decades old by the time it enters service, and almost fifty years old at the end of its service life cycle.

Furthermore, since the 2010 tender did not specify any “Make in India” stipulations, production of the Igla-S will take place mostly in Russia.

VSHORADS are the ground forces’ last defence against attack from enemy ground strike aircraft. At the apex level, the IAF is responsible for air defence, which it does by bombing enemy airfields to prevent combat aircraft from even taking off. Those that do manage to enter our airspace are engaged with the IAF’s fighters and missiles.

However, some enemy aircraft still sneak through to attack ground troops, who protect themselves with VSHORADS.

The MoD is also racing against time to bring before the DAC the long-delayed proposal to build 197 Kamov-226T helicopters for an estimated $2 billion. This is being touted as a “Make in India” initiative, with the choppers being built by a joint venture (JV), Indo-Russian Helicopters Ltd (IRHL). The biggest stakeholder in the JV is Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) with a 50.5 per cent stake, while Russian Helicopters has a 49.5 per cent stake.

However, there will be only limited indigenisation. The inter-governmental agreement (IGA) between New Delhi and Moscow permits Russian Helicopters to deliver the first 60 helicopters in flyaway condition. The next 40 helicopters would be shipped as kits from Russia to be assembled in India. Only after that would indigenisation pick up momentum over the last 97 choppers.

The VSHORADS and Kamov-226T contracts will supplement the on-going purchase from Russia of S-400 air defence systems ($5.43 billion), AK-203 rifles ($1 billion), Krivak III frigates ($2 billion), BrahMos anti-ship missiles ($2.6 billion) and a supplementary order for 18 more Sukhoi-30MKI fighters ($1.15 billion). This will take the value of on-going arms imports from Russia to $15 billion – far more than any other country, including the US.

Washington, however, has created a lever to discourage Indian weapons imports from Moscow. A recent US law – Countering America’s Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA) – requires the US government to sanction countries that engage in “significant transactions” with Russian, Iranian and North Korean entities. The US president has the power to grant India a waiver from CAATSA. However, without large arms purchases from the US, there is no certainty that that Donald Trump would grant a waiver.

https://www.business-standard.com/article/economy-policy/two-major-russian-arms-deals-worth-15-billion-likely-next-week-120031401099_1.html

The Igla-S is a 16-year-old missile system, first built in 2004, which the Russian military replaced in 2014 with the newer, far more capable, 9K333 Verba missile.

Apparently, the MoD feels the Igla-S met India’s needs and Rosoboronexport’s price of under $1.47 billion makes it a value proposition compared to Saab’s tag of $2.6 billion and MBDA’s offer of $3.68 billion.

Consequently, the Indian military will get an obsolescent VSHORADS that will be almost two decades old by the time it enters service, and almost fifty years old at the end of its service life cycle.

Wow the super butt hurt is on display for all to see.

Russia entered a missile in a competition held by India for a set of requirements... it beat two western missiles... which are much older than 16 years BTW, and it comes in much cheaper than either western missile while meeting the requirements... but they now have a newer missile and they are crying about that?

Now the real problem is that they want Verba for $1.47 billion dollars, and ignore the fact that they themselves did not allow the Russians to substitute the newer missile when it became available.

Furthermore, since the 2010 tender did not specify any “Make in India” stipulations, production of the Igla-S will take place mostly in Russia.

Well obviously... if it was going to need to be produced in India they would need to pay to build factories to make it and train up a work force to make these missiles so the price would probably go to 3-4 billion for the exact same missile with no actual improvement in performance.

You get what you pay for... you can have capable missiles or you can spend a lot more for the ability to produce your own capable missiles.

However, some enemy aircraft still sneak through to attack ground troops, who protect themselves with VSHORADS.

On any battlefield any enemy aircraft will be a threat whether it is a dedicated CAS aircraft like an Su-25, A-10, or something like a Super Tucano or L39 jet trainer with bombs and rockets, or a vast array of helicopters both attack and assault and transport... and of course cruise missiles and drones.

The Igla-S introduced proximity fusing to the Igla family which makes it very effective against small targets like missiles and drones... very very useful.

However, there will be only limited indigenisation. The inter-governmental agreement (IGA) between New Delhi and Moscow permits Russian Helicopters to deliver the first 60 helicopters in flyaway condition. The next 40 helicopters would be shipped as kits from Russia to be assembled in India. Only after that would indigenisation pick up momentum over the last 97 choppers.

It is a Russian designed and built helicopter... eventually India is going to be making many of the parts itself but they will be paying money for that too.

I don't understand the made in India programme when it comes to Russia... Russia makes it cheap enough to just buy it... I would think it would make more sense for India to want to produce western kit instead of buying it from western factories because they will be much better able to compete with them in terms of costs and also the west has a history of sanctions so local production is protection from a dick head like Trump turning off the taps.

Their obvious problems are that the west is not interested in licence production in India.

The US president has the power to grant India a waiver from CAATSA. However, without large arms purchases from the US, there is no certainty that that Donald Trump would grant a waiver.

That law violates the WTO trade rules, if the US wants to impose its local laws on India then India can effectively close its markets to the US... lets see whose eyes water first... India needs to work on its own internal market and raise standards and incomes and quality of life... I can't see the US doing anything about that except using it to criticise India when it misbehaves (in US eyes).

India cannot buy from Russia because America says so... really?

Make America Gay Again... it is working.

Well, in a normal world this would cause US to be kicked out from WTO. Since this is not possible most probably the result will be that the more and more countries will start getting out of the WTO...

About Indian localised production.

It has been seen with the parts for Su30 and Mig29 that Indian produce these with higher price and lower quality than Russia...

Maybe the compromise could be for them to buy the top end product from russia and develop together a smaller cheaper alternative to be mass produced in India (with russian engine, of course).

This indigenous alternative should have been the tejas, but i do not know if it will ever be successful.

If I were in the indian government I would buy mig 35 in Russia  and ask Russia to help develop a simple and cheap 4+ generation single engine fighter based on the same engine, similar to the JF17 that China developed for Pakistan.

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:

If I were in the indian government I would buy mig 35 in Russia  and ask Russia to help develop a simple and cheap 4+ generation single engine fighter based on the same engine, similar to the JF17 that China developed for Pakistan.

i am not seeing present MMRCA of 108 fighters succeeding either, it's going to be 36 more Rafales, and rest of the 80 fighters can be MIG 35/SU35 and money saved going into SU30MKI modernisation which too is not going to cost less then 7-9 b $ as it includes newer radars, engines and meanwhile Tejas in 200 Nos will be inducted in various versions. Although it would be interesting to watch US moves as they are trying there best to push for either of there aircraft from lockheed or boeing but its not going to succeed

Pinto wrote:

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:

If I were in the indian government I would buy mig 35 in Russia  and ask Russia to help develop a simple and cheap 4+ generation single engine fighter based on the same engine, similar to the JF17 that China developed for Pakistan.

i am not seeing present MMRCA of 108 fighters succeeding either, it's going to be 36 more Rafales, and rest of the 80 fighters can be MIG 35/SU35 and money saved going into SU30MKI modernisation which too is not going to cost less then 7-9 b $ as it includes newer radars, engines and meanwhile Tejas in 200 Nos will be inducted in various versions. Although it would be interesting to watch US moves as they are trying there best to push for either of there aircraft from lockheed or boeing but its not going to succeed

Actually if I am not mistaken The JF17 was developed with serious help from MiG corporation. If so it would be maybe possible to develop in a relatively short time a variant for India without any Chinese or Pakistani component.

I do not know the status of tejas, but I heard that there were quite a bit of problems.
And anyway I do not see the point of having the tejas also as a carrier based aircraft... are they planning to have a mixed fleet on their carriers?

I thought they just needed to replace the mig21 that will be retired, and some will be replaced with bigger aircrafts (mig35 or rafale) while others with cheaper smaller aircrafts

Concerning the carrier based fighter, the rational decision will be to buy additional mig29k or navalised mig35... we will see what they will do...

About Indian localised production.

It has been seen with the parts for Su30 and Mig29 that Indian produce these with higher price and lower quality than Russia...

To be fair that is not actually true... everybody decides on what they want to pay for and where they can save money.... the factories and tools the Russians make their MiGs on they might not have spent too much on so they can keep the production price down for the Russian AF purchases.

If that is the case India could spend more and get better tooling and production equipment and end up with better made aircraft, or more accurately aircraft made to a higher standard without needing highly skilled labour.

The problem of course is that for Russia to make some planes they have the factories and much of the tooling was paid for by India when it ordered MiG-29KR fighters for its Navy. The Russian Navy tacked on orders of its own so it did not have to pay for tooling and training up a work force... they were ready to go when the order was made.

When India orders either MiG-35s or MiG-29M2s and wants to produce them in India then they need to also pay for factories and tooling and training skilled labour to make those planes so it is always going to cost more... but the point is that when they have finished making those planes they have a workforce and factory that is ready to make more planes or something else... if they make another 200 planes then they don't need to pay for another factory to be built and because they make them themselves no one can stop them from making as many as they want within reason and of course they can make spare parts and also support their own aircraft which reduces operational costs.

Of course they might also want to reduce costs and cut corners where corners should not be cut to make the planes and have some real problems down the road... which might give the plane a bad reputation it does not really deserve... which is probably why France is not allowing local production of Rafales.

Maybe the compromise could be for them to buy the top end product from russia and develop together a smaller cheaper alternative to be mass produced in India (with russian engine, of course).

This indigenous alternative should have been the tejas, but i do not know if it will ever be successful.

AFAIK they had three stealth fighter programmes the light (Tegas II) the medium (?) and the heavy (Su-57 variant)... personally I think the light aircraft is a waste of time and should be non stealthy 4++ gen light plane that is cheap but with lots of external hard points and cheap to make in large numbers, while a medium stealthy fighter is big enough to carry a reasonable internal weapon load to remain stealthy when loaded and of course the heavy stealth fighter makes sense as your primary air control fighter.

I would keep going with Tegas but scale back some of the requirements and just keep it cheap and simple and make lots of them, and create a MiG-35 based medium stealth fighter with Russian contributions and of course the Su-57MKI...

The MiG-29M2 could replace current MiG-21 and MiG-27 and Jaguar and M2K aircraft, plus a few MiG-35s. Over time you will work out what the MiG-35 has that is worth the money and over time its advanced bits will get cheaper too so over time transition the MiG-29M2s into MiG-35s and together with mass produced Tegas IIIs they can be the backbone of the force.

Many of the components on the MiG-35 and MiG-29M2 could be used on the Tegas III for commonality.

i am not seeing present MMRCA of 108 fighters succeeding either, it's going to be 36 more Rafales, and rest of the 80 fighters can be MIG 35/SU35 and money saved going into SU30MKI modernisation which too is not going to cost less then 7-9 b $ as it includes newer radars, engines and meanwhile Tejas in 200 Nos will be inducted in various versions.

They were buying those 36 Rafales for about 8 billion so there wont be much left over for anything else... if they bought two lots they are probably already 5-6 billion over budget as it stands.