The Situation in the Ukraine. #1

There is no option. Send in the army. These are often Russian people (despite their passports) and those who choose to ally with their Russian brothers, who are being attacked and killed by monsters from the W Ukraine.

And give terrorist state America some of this same "medicine".

Yanukovich cant negotiate with Nazis and terrorists. They are American backed scum, pure and simple.

Firebird wrote:There is no option. Send in the army. These are often Russian people (despite their passports) and those who choose to ally with their Russian brothers, who are being attacked and killed by monsters from the W Ukraine.

And give terrorist state America some of this same "medicine".

Yanukovich cant negotiate with Nazis and terrorists. They are American backed scum, pure and simple.

i agree with this statement,

what is the point of being political if the deals made have no worth?. and its not like anyone honestly expected the neo-nazi's and import psycho rioters to stand down did they?. or how these people are going to use the weapons and ammo they raided from government depots. the bolt action rifles and sidearms displayed on TV is just the beginning and if not dealth with its going to get a lot worse.


the west can shout "sanctions" all they want. Ukraine can either watch their country being destabilized slowly to the point where it becomes just as screwed up to the West's liking without any security of functional government. or intervene now and hard against these western-backed elements of insurgency.

personally, i would have started to deploy a hard response as soon i got messages of riot police being shot by firearms.




...and then there is this:

RT: Crimean MPs are considering bringing up the question of returning the peninsula to Russia if the escalation of violence in the country continues.

The local deputy of the ruling Party of Regions, Nikolay Kolisnichenko, has addressed the Supreme Council of the autonomous republic saying that “if the situation in Ukraine is not resolved, we as deputies must raise the issue of returning Crimea to Russia,” local media quotes the MP as saying.

The Crimean peninsula was transferred from the Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic to the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic in 1954. Following the breakup of the Soviet Union, Russia continued to lease part of the ex-Soviet naval base in Sevastopol for its Black Sea Fleet. According to the latest 2001 survey, 58.5 percent of the Crimean population is Russian.

Right now I'm the most concerned about Ukraine's NPPs.
Uranium stockpiles and countrywide chaos is never a good combination   

Austin wrote:If Ukraine joins EU will the south region of Ukraine will protest ?

Ae You serious dude? EU membership was never proposed to them. They can't join even if they wanted to.

Regular is correct.

Regular wrote:

Austin wrote:If Ukraine joins EU will the south region of Ukraine will protest ?

Ae You serious dude? EU membership was never proposed to them. They can't join even if they wanted to.

So what is the fuss about then , Free Trade Agreement with EU ?

The fuss about economic domination and isolating Russia

Was talking with a lady in Nizhny Novgorod earlier today & she said these protests in Ukraine have been timed perfectly to coincide with Sochi .

The fuss is about taking visas not now but in the distant future and get the f out of the country.
Most think that Western Europe is the Eden.
I remember this summer in Crete an Ukrainian girl asked me whether we are as rich as Switzerland                       
........and we have real unemployment in excess of 50%.................

Austin wrote:

Regular wrote:

Austin wrote:If Ukraine joins EU will the south region of Ukraine will protest ?

Ae You serious dude? EU membership was never proposed to them. They can't join even if they wanted to.

So what is the fuss about then , Free Trade Agreement with EU ?

Russian Patriot is right, its about isolating Russia economically and denying its strategic assets in the country.

i live in the E.U and where in the millitary of one of their country's army before i resigned voluntarily. this is about a dirty game played by the West under pretext of democracy and free trade. but what they do is the same as they do in Syria for example. support all opposition elements to destabilize the current goverment so the U.S can replace it with one that listens to them.

i am really not a western NATO ex-soldier with a grudge against its former employer, but ive kind off been out there and stood by while dirty political games where executed by politicians. and this exactly fits their strategy.

found this on RT: Ukraine police returning fire while retreating. and what they do is in my opinion is restraint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCzIIFAsGk4#t=16


Edit: and why i personally feel no shred of empathy for the "peacefull protestors". these policemen are serving their country while their fammily's at home are threatened by these neo-nazi scum.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhL5mlB8Wjc

Sujoy wrote:Was talking with a lady in Nizhny Novgorod earlier today & she said these protests in Ukraine have been timed perfectly to coincide with Sochi .  

Exactly. Just what I was thinking.

I read there are only 5000 Berkut in the Ukraine. Considering staff rotation, injuries etc, thats quite a small number. Altho in January of this yr, it was reported that they planned a 6 fold increase of that figure (acc to Wikipedia, anyway!)
I hope Russia is sending in elite units to support. Sometimes its literally looked like bringing a baton to a gunfight.

I've read from Western commentators who feel that the West has always felt that if Russia wants a fight over the Ukraine, the West can never win. I hope Putin has really thought out the end game to all this. Otherwise, mobs of scum could be causing trouble everywhere.

PS some pathetic entries here on the Wiki site, obviously drafter in Washington... (again!)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkut_(Ukraine)

Talking about "intimidation". Well, the Neo_Nazis and Obama would know all about that..!

Firebird wrote:

Sujoy wrote:Was talking with a lady in Nizhny Novgorod earlier today & she said these protests in Ukraine have been timed perfectly to coincide with Sochi .  

Exactly. Just what I was thinking.

I read there are only 4000 Berkut in the Ukraine. Considering staff rotation, injuries etc, thats quite a small number. I hope Russia is sending in elite units to support. Sometimes its literally looked like bringing a baton to a gunfight.

Russian government would loose A LOT of support both abroad, and domestically, if they do that. A good example is Afghanistan.

etaepsilonk wrote:

Firebird wrote:

Sujoy wrote:Was talking with a lady in Nizhny Novgorod earlier today & she said these protests in Ukraine have been timed perfectly to coincide with Sochi .  

Exactly. Just what I was thinking.

I read there are only 4000 Berkut in the Ukraine. Considering staff rotation, injuries etc, thats quite a small number. I hope Russia is sending in elite units to support. Sometimes its literally looked like bringing a baton to a gunfight.

Russian government would loose A LOT of support both abroad, and domestically, if they do that. A good example is Afghanistan.

How would anyone find out? Unless "Team America World Police" enter the country and start checking Berkut passports?

Russia had to assist in S Ossetia when that Western backed terrorist Sakhashvilli started causing similar shit. And virtually everyone thought Russia did the right thing.

Ultimately, those who are Russian, or kin of Russia are being intimidated and killed. So that justifies Russia's assistance. Its not like America invading Iraq.. or Vietnam, or Nicaragua, or Haiti, or Colombia etc etc etc

I suspect America and Russia have groups on the ground.

Ultimately, the West has breached international law, fermented terrorism, AND breached the agreements made with Yeltsin upon ending of the USSR.

Break the agreements, and Russia and the Ukraine have the right to put matters right.

And get bombed as soon as we break agreements

To Firebird:
"How would anyone find out? Unless "Team America World Police" enter the country and start checking Berkut passports?"

There're plenty of ways, actually. From radio transmissions, to capturing one or couple of members alive.






"Russia had to assist in S Ossetia when that Western backed terrorist Sakhashvilli started causing similar shit."

But this was war between different countries (Georgia and Ossetia), not internal strife.
Also, take into account the clear allegiances. Ossetians were the good guys, Georgians- the bad guys. And what are those allegiances in Ukraine?

And those SF would definitely need joint operations between them and local units. And what if the latter would be secretly cooperating with "svoboda", for example?




"Break the agreements, and Russia and the Ukraine have the right to put matters right."


At the end of the day, it's Ukraine's institutions that have to restore order, and they'd be able to do so much more effectively than Russians', for the simple fact that it's their country and they know their people better.


Also, if the information about foreign SF leaks, when western countries would be encouraged to support "you know what" militarily too.
That means, proxy war. And Russia won't be able to win.

Agreed with etaeposolnik

Russian Patriot wrote:Agreed with etaeposolnik

WTF??   

Sorry misspelled your username but I agree with you. As soon as Russia gets involved nationalism will spike.

Russian Patriot wrote:Sorry misspelled your username

Oh, I see. I thought for a second that you meant something else  

im serious, with some comments i read. the only question ringing in my head is how old are some members posting here?.

its either that or they never left their room in their parents house to actually find out how the world works...

there will be no obvious breaking of rules, these are political games. they use Ukranian opposition as expendable assets. if they lose, well no loss. they where tools bought by money and served their purpose. it was just money.it looks like they are not involved but meanwhile are fully in control of what the oppositions do and do not. the radical elements are on a payroll tough, these are national and neo-nazi elements that suddenly got the money to organize, outfit and mobilise....how do you figure they got the money from?. some wear 1300 dollar body armour, go figure.

this whole ordeal is politics being fought at the highest level trough proxy's. witch the West initiated after Ukraine government did not want to join the E.U. and i am not the only one that found it surprisingly coincidental that after the "revelation" of the U.S political phonecall forming a puppet government suddenly the opposition took up firearms and started shooting and violence after a "truce".

and the exact same thing is going on in Venezuela, exact same type of riots and armed violence. same time, and different country resisting western authority.

Airbornewolf is correct.

Its project Houston of 1993 developed by Pentagon.

Haven't got time to reply in full tonight, but anyway. Yanuk says that Berkut numbers are supposedly going up 6 fold. People don't wonder where he's getting the numbers from? Hmm..

America is caught doing shit. Like American soldiers in Georgia, and bringing huge amts of cash into the Ukraine. And guess what? The Western populance either never finds out or doesn't care. Ofcourse this is Western backed. RUssia can intervene secretively. Is it really a "cardinal sin" for them to defend their brothers from neo Nazis? There's plenty of legal and public relations justification for this.

Look how America acts like a gangster all round the World. Most people in the EU are horrified at the Ukraine joining it. Its American shitstirring... as usual.

All Russia wants to do is prevent mass slaughter. Hardly a heinous crime is it?

The fact is, the "business case" also justifies Russia, not the EU (or America!) being the partner of the Ukraine. Simply put, they are more compatible. America can cause shit, yes. So can the trashiest elements of the EU. But win vs Russia and Russia leaning Ukrainians? I dont think anyone seriously thinks that IF Russia really wants to compete for the Ukraine.

To airbornewolf:
"this whole ordeal is politics being fought at the highest level trough proxy's. witch the West initiated after Ukraine government did not want to join the E.U"

Oh yeah, this is all just ze evil west CIA plot, and totally has nothing to do with those 22 years of almost continuous downhill journey of Ukraine's economy, and, pretty much, the country as a whole  

To firebird:
"Yanuk says that Berkut numbers are supposedly going up 6 fold. People don't wonder where he's getting the numbers from? Hmm.."
Out of thin air, maybe?   
The much better question would be, where is he gonna find the money for that? Especially considering, that there're pretty scarce funds to even sustain existing forces.



"All Russia wants to do is prevent mass slaughter. Hardly a heinous crime is it?"

Hey, don't get me wrong. In my opinion, Russia can't send SF not because they wouldn't want, but because they CAN'T.
And it certainly isn't like Russia can't help Ukraine with other means, besides soldiers.
Radio pelengators, decyphers, tracking devices etc. would be very useful for tracking suspicious elements, for example.