The Situation in the Ukraine. #22

Rodinazombie wrote:What the eff?

This forum is becoming more degenerate every day.

I still don't know why mustafa tread still exists and why he isn't booted off forum already...

We need coal, so why don't we piss off our main and only supplier in some types, in as many ways as possible? Said Yats

MOSCOW (Sputnik) — Ukraine's coal reserves are insufficient for the winter period, Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk said Friday, urging emergency measures to deal with the situation. "According to my data, it is clear that we do not have sufficient coal reserves, which I warned about three months ago. In order to avoid blackouts like last year and to be able to go through the winter with a stable energy system in the country, I demand an immediate emergency action plan," Yatsenyuk said at Ukraine's so-called anti-crisis energy headquarters.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151127/1030877158/ukraine-coal-reserves-pm.html#ixzz3si2ULKwZ

This is another view via Interfax


The halt in electricity supplies to Crimea has led to the suspension of coal shipments from the Anti-Terrorist Operation zone in Donbas and Russia, however Ukraine's energy system has enough coal to provide for the country's needs for 45-50 days, taking into account shipments from South Africa, Energy and Coal Industry Minister of Ukraine Volodymyr Demchyshyn said at a parliamentary session on Friday. "At the moment, the supply of coal from the uncontrolled territories, as well as from Russia, is limited. Currently, coal reserves at our thermal power plants are sufficient for them to keep working for at least a month... To solve the issue of providing coal for our power plants we are actively negotiating with suppliers from South Africa. Two ships, one carrying 168,000 tonnes of coal for Centrenergo, and another carrying 80,000 tonnes for thermal power plants, are on their way," he said.

According to the minister, two ships laden with coal from South Africa will arrive in Ukraine on December 4 and 12. "This means that in December we will receive an additional 250,000 tonnes of anthracite coal. We've got more than one million tonnes of the coal of this type in stock. With the addition of these 250,000 tonnes, this ensures that at least the next 45-50 days our energy system will be working stably. In these 50 days, we will definitely be able find a solution to the coal supply issue, including shipments from South Africa and from other suppliers," he said.

JohninMK wrote:We need coal, so why don't we piss off our main and only supplier in some types, in as many ways as possible? Said Yats

MOSCOW (Sputnik) — Ukraine's coal reserves are insufficient for the winter period, Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk said Friday, urging emergency measures to deal with the situation. "According to my data, it is clear that we do not have sufficient coal reserves, which I warned about three months ago. In order to avoid blackouts like last year and to be able to go through the winter with a stable energy system in the country, I demand an immediate emergency action plan," Yatsenyuk said at Ukraine's so-called anti-crisis energy headquarters.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151127/1030877158/ukraine-coal-reserves-pm.html#ixzz3si2ULKwZ

Sometimes i wonder if Ukrainian current leaders are ever sober...

higurashihougi wrote:Dunno if anyone has posted, but...

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/ukraine-crisis-russia-gas-idUKL8N13K1R820151125

Date: Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:00pm GMT

* Ukraine says to stop buying Russian gas

* Says cheaper prices offered from Europe    

Can you believe it ?

Assume that Ukraine and say Slovenia pay Russia the same for gas. Ukraine gets paid for transporting gas from Russia to Slovenia. It then buys that gas back from Slovenia adding into the cost calculation as a credit the 'profit' from transporting it. The resultant figure is lower than the price Ukraine pays Russia for direct supply. So its cheaper buying from the West but its an accountancy fiddle creating 'fools gold'.

Back on Donbass, crystal clear declarations from Zakharchenko, warming up for next round of fighting.


http://fortruss.blogspot.com.es/2015/11/zakharchenko-we-perceive-minsk.html


Zakharchenko: We perceive Minsk differently, therefore war could be resumed
November 27, 2015 -
Novorossia -
Translated for Fort Russ by J. Arnoldski



“Zakharchenko: there is less hope for peaceful negotiations”

Different perceptions of the Minsk process in Ukraine and the DPR could ultimately lead to another military confrontation, the head of the DPR, Alexander Zakharchenko, told journalists today, as reported by a special correspondent from Novorossia Information Agency.

“We perceive the Minsk agreements differently than Ukraine. Ukraine sees them as returning us back, but that will never happen. The Minsk process is perceived by us as an equal partnership with the obligatory return of occupied territory as a basic condition for ending the war. So, there is all the less hope for a successful continuation of negotiations,” he said.

According to Zakharchenko, the difficult economic situation will force Poroshenko to compensate for drops in the economy with military successes, therefore confidence in the peaceful outcome of negotiations is reduced and confidence in a continuation of hostilities is increasing.


“Initially, when we signed the Minsk agreements, we were confident that Ukraine would not observe them...Therefore we are ready for any aggression and I want to assure the residents of the republic that if Ukraine decides to unleash hostilities, then the line of demarcation will be where we put it. “

Since the previous system is down, I want to use this post to thank everyone for keeping us informed about the events in Ukraine.

EDIT: I meant giving + votes by this.

SturmGuard wrote:Since the previous system is down, I want to use this post to thank everyone for keeping us informed about the events in Ukraine.

I think that many of us from the previous system that I think you might be referring to are here now. I just hope that the level of updates does not go manic, which would mean that the war had restarted. If it does many will die in an attempt to keep a few in power, as it always was.

Militarov wrote:

JohninMK wrote:We need coal, so why don't we piss off our main and only supplier in some types, in as many ways as possible? Said Yats

MOSCOW (Sputnik) — Ukraine's coal reserves are insufficient for the winter period, Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk said Friday, urging emergency measures to deal with the situation. "According to my data, it is clear that we do not have sufficient coal reserves, which I warned about three months ago. In order to avoid blackouts like last year and to be able to go through the winter with a stable energy system in the country, I demand an immediate emergency action plan," Yatsenyuk said at Ukraine's so-called anti-crisis energy headquarters.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151127/1030877158/ukraine-coal-reserves-pm.html#ixzz3si2ULKwZ

Sometimes i wonder if Ukrainian current leaders are ever sober...

True, or whether the left hand talks to the right.

So, on the one hand the energy minister is in effect saying that the current stocks last until the end of the year including contracted imports. The consumption rate seems to be around 250k tons a week. There is no indication that that amount is being bought let alone is on its way. The last time coal arrived from SA it was nowhere near the quality of Donbas/Russian that the power stations are optimised for. That will mean, unless local supplies are re-instated, power generation will be seriously reduced in January, possibly needing more gas or electricity from Russia.

Whilst on the other, there is no effort being expended by the interior or defence ministries to force the saboteurs to give up their stranglehold over the site of the downed power lines into Crimea..

Which means that those at the top in Kiev are happy with the current situation. Perhaps believing that, as in the past, in the final analysis the Russians will relent and come to the rescue.

What we do not know are the levers that Kiev can still use on Moscow, industrial or otherwise. As I have mentioned before, there is still the elephant in the room, the oil pipe that most of Russia's oil goes to the EU in. Unlike gas, there is no alternative anywhere in sight. In the last 18 months I have seen no mention of it anywhere which can only mean that it is so strategically vital to all concerned that it is above politics but it is Russia and Germany that are over the barrel. So if Russia does things that the rest of us do not understand, this could be the reason.

Rodinazombie wrote:What the eff?

This forum is becoming more degenerate every day.

Just relax! It's good entertainment.

JohninMK wrote:

Militarov wrote:

JohninMK wrote:We need coal, so why don't we piss off our main and only supplier in some types, in as many ways as possible? Said Yats

MOSCOW (Sputnik) — Ukraine's coal reserves are insufficient for the winter period, Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk said Friday, urging emergency measures to deal with the situation. "According to my data, it is clear that we do not have sufficient coal reserves, which I warned about three months ago. In order to avoid blackouts like last year and to be able to go through the winter with a stable energy system in the country, I demand an immediate emergency action plan," Yatsenyuk said at Ukraine's so-called anti-crisis energy headquarters.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151127/1030877158/ukraine-coal-reserves-pm.html#ixzz3si2ULKwZ

Sometimes i wonder if Ukrainian current leaders are ever sober...

True, or whether the left hand talks to the right.

So, on the one hand the energy minister is in effect saying that the current stocks last until the end of the year including contracted imports. The consumption rate seems to be around 250k tons a week. There is no indication that that amount is being bought let alone is on its way. The last time coal arrived from SA it was nowhere near the quality of Donbas/Russian that the power stations are optimised for. That will mean, unless local supplies are re-instated, power generation will be seriously reduced in January, possibly needing more gas or electricity from Russia.

Whilst on the other, there is no effort being expended by the interior or defence ministries to force the saboteurs to give up their stranglehold over the site of the downed power lines into Crimea..

Which means that those at the top in Kiev are happy with the current situation. Perhaps believing that, as in the past, in the final analysis the Russians will relent and come to the rescue.

What we do not know are the levers that Kiev can still use on Moscow, industrial or otherwise. As I have mentioned before, there is still the elephant in the room, the oil pipe that most of Russia's oil goes to the EU in. Unlike gas, there is no alternative anywhere in sight. In the last 18 months I have seen no mention of it anywhere which can only mean that it is so strategically vital to all concerned that it is above politics but it is Russia and Germany that are over the barrel. So if Russia does things that the rest of us do not understand, this could be the reason.

Even worse, they cut power to Crimea and they instead to fix it fast as possible (since part of Ukraine is also affected by it) to prevent further damage on their own energy supply they delay it and even try to use it as a lever to achieve something...what da... what kind of politicans are those...

You know that they also said some weeks ago how they will sue Russia for not prolonging payment time for gas... WHAT COURT ON EARTH would want to have anything with such retarded process. I belive, and i say this without any trace of joke that 80% of Ukrainian current leaders are either drunks or plain stupid...

JohninMK wrote:

higurashihougi wrote:Dunno if anyone has posted, but...

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/ukraine-crisis-russia-gas-idUKL8N13K1R820151125

Date: Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:00pm GMT

* Ukraine says to stop buying Russian gas

* Says cheaper prices offered from Europe    

Can you believe it ?

Assume that Ukraine and say Slovenia pay Russia the same for gas. Ukraine gets paid for transporting gas from Russia to Slovenia. It then buys that gas back from Slovenia adding into the cost calculation as a credit the 'profit' from transporting it. The resultant figure is lower than the price Ukraine pays Russia for direct supply. So its cheaper buying from the West but its an accountancy fiddle creating 'fools gold'.

Not really. Slovenia as other EU members pay full market price for gas without special discount as 404 had in the past. Also Slovenia have to pay for transportation through Ukraine and Hungary. So if Slovenia sell Russian gas back to Ukraine, than Ukraine have to pay full market price + transportation through Ukraine and 2 times through Hungary. Ukraine get transportation through Ukraine payed, so in this case the end price for Ukraine is full market price + 2 times transportation through Hungary. So this gas must be really cheaper for Ukraine than gas directly from Russia with discount price.

medo wrote:

JohninMK wrote:

higurashihougi wrote:Dunno if anyone has posted, but...

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/ukraine-crisis-russia-gas-idUKL8N13K1R820151125

Date: Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:00pm GMT

* Ukraine says to stop buying Russian gas

* Says cheaper prices offered from Europe    

Can you believe it ?

Assume that Ukraine and say Slovenia pay Russia the same for gas. Ukraine gets paid for transporting gas from Russia to Slovenia. It then buys that gas back from Slovenia adding into the cost calculation as a credit the 'profit' from transporting it. The resultant figure is lower than the price Ukraine pays Russia for direct supply. So its cheaper buying from the West but its an accountancy fiddle creating 'fools gold'.

Not really. Slovenia as other EU members pay full market price for gas without special discount as 404 had in the past. Also Slovenia have to pay for transportation through Ukraine and Hungary. So if Slovenia sell Russian gas back to Ukraine, than Ukraine have to pay full market price + transportation through Ukraine and 2 times through Hungary. Ukraine get transportation through Ukraine payed, so in this case the end price for Ukraine is full market price + 2 times transportation through Hungary. So this gas must be really cheaper for Ukraine than gas directly from Russia with discount price.

I should have picked Hungary as the example

JohninMK wrote:

medo wrote:

JohninMK wrote:

higurashihougi wrote:Dunno if anyone has posted, but...

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/ukraine-crisis-russia-gas-idUKL8N13K1R820151125

Date: Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:00pm GMT

* Ukraine says to stop buying Russian gas

* Says cheaper prices offered from Europe    

Can you believe it ?

Assume that Ukraine and say Slovenia pay Russia the same for gas. Ukraine gets paid for transporting gas from Russia to Slovenia. It then buys that gas back from Slovenia adding into the cost calculation as a credit the 'profit' from transporting it. The resultant figure is lower than the price Ukraine pays Russia for direct supply. So its cheaper buying from the West but its an accountancy fiddle creating 'fools gold'.

Not really. Slovenia as other EU members pay full market price for gas without special discount as 404 had in the past. Also Slovenia have to pay for transportation through Ukraine and Hungary. So if Slovenia sell Russian gas back to Ukraine, than Ukraine have to pay full market price + transportation through Ukraine and 2 times through Hungary. Ukraine get transportation through Ukraine payed, so in this case the end price for Ukraine is full market price + 2 times transportation through Hungary. So this gas must be really cheaper for Ukraine than gas directly from Russia with discount price.

I should have picked Hungary as the example

There's no cheaper gas, there's not paid to Russia gas, for that the Russian might check whose EU/EE volumes allow for that.

It's EU that pays for gas for urks. That is why this "reverse flow" scam is even possible.

404 dont pay for anything they dont have cash, everything is sponsored.

Russia had to financially support Ukraine since Independence and now the EU has to. They are country 404 and the gift that keeps on giving.

PS And the USA gets to tell both of them what's what...

German documentary (in german) about war in Ukraine, i suppose some ppl speaking german will find it interesting.

So with this ceaseless provocations of the peace loving Ukraine Armed Forces by the Russian backed terrorists in the Russian occupied Donbas, the Ukrainians are forced to move hundreds of AFV's and artillery towards the front lines.

Meanwhile in Turkey, the staunch defender of democracy and all things good, is forced by the the unlawful actions of Russia in support of an illegal morally corrupt Assad regime, to move hundreds of AFV's and artillery towards the Syrian border.

Makes one wonder and hope to blazes they are prepared in Moscow.

^ I'm sure yes, but I think the danger is that Washington and it's puppets will take a risk and have Turkey invade Syria for reasons of "self defence", and as Russia has no treaties with Syria and only essentially airforces in Syria, cannot do anything other than shout, and there will be a lot of shouting from all quarters and nobody looking at Donbass and, bang!. Any Kiev offensive will be portrayed as "defensive" and "righteous" whether the Stasi hausfrau agrees or not. It is not rational for Turkey to invade Syria or Kiev to attack Donbass, it is madness, but we are dealing with a Washington that has long been mad, and this is what I have been saying a long time, that all the diplomacy and talk of "partners" is totaly wasted as it all depends on what the loonies do. We are fast coming to endgame with Washington over these affairs and it will be unpleasant for Washington and disasterous for it's puppets.

Yana Chepikova, advisor for children's rights in Donetsk has said that as a result of ukrops military activity on 20 November, thirteen children from various families have been made orphans having lost both parents. It is also clarified that the figures for deaths issued for DNR a few months ago for all the war to date that showed nearly four thousand, was indeed the number of civilian deaths only. LNR have not issued casualty figures, but as Lugansk and other cities in LNR had suffered more bombardment than Donetsk up to Minsk 1, it could be expected that so far total civilian deaths for all Donbass must be at least eight thousand.

Has anyone noticed the emptiness of the Ukrainian airspace?