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Then they are wrong these ships are for the NF and PF's.
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91 posters
Project 22350: Admiral Sergei Gorshkov
SeigSoloyvov- Posts : 3910
Points : 3888
Join date : 2016-04-08
George1- Posts : 18522
Points : 19027
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
Benya wrote:
I have seen some reports that indicates that the first two frigates of this class will be delivered to the Black Sea Fleet.
Why?
The BSF is already receiving Project 11356 ("Admiral Grigorovich"-class) frigates, why would they need Gorshkovs?
maybe you didn't see correctly. Project 11356 were ordered especially for Black Sea Fleet
Benya- Posts : 526
Points : 528
Join date : 2016-06-05
Location : Budapest, Hungary
SeigSoloyvov wrote:Then they are wrong these ships are for the NF and PF's.
Indeed, BTW I don't understand why Milkavkaz put them to the BSF's ORBAT list.
George1 wrote:maybe you didn't see correctly. Project 11356 were ordered especially for Black Sea Fleet
Not especially, but exclusively (and for export).
For both of you, here is what I saw: (the 2nd and 3rd ship names on the list, each of them has blue color)
http://www.milkavkaz.net/2015/12/chernomorskij-flot.htmlOf course, we can argue about the credibility of the source, but I would not recommend to start an argument about that, since it would derail the topic.
franco- Posts : 7053
Points : 7079
Join date : 2010-08-18
Of course, we can argue about the credibility of the source, but I would not recommend to start an argument about that, since it would derail the topic.
Then what would you argue if not the credibility of the source?
Then what would you argue if not the credibility of the source?
Benya- Posts : 526
Points : 528
Join date : 2016-06-05
Location : Budapest, Hungary
franco wrote:Of course, we can argue about the credibility of the source, but I would not recommend to start an argument about that, since it would derail the topic.
Then what would you argue if not the credibility of the source?
Nothing. I only wanted to conclude my talk with Seig and George about where those two Gorshkovs will be delivered to.
GarryB- Posts : 40545
Points : 41045
Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
If the source cannot be questioned then what is there to discuss?
SeigSoloyvov- Posts : 3910
Points : 3888
Join date : 2016-04-08
Far has I am aware the first two are going tot he NF fleet with the next two going to etheir the NF or PF.
Russia said they wanted to build a large amount of these but in recent years hey seemed to scale back how many they want.
The current number is around 16?
Which would mean eight for both fleets.
Russia said they wanted to build a large amount of these but in recent years hey seemed to scale back how many they want.
The current number is around 16?
Which would mean eight for both fleets.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
Points : 13512
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
SeigSoloyvov wrote:Far has I am aware the first two are going tot he NF fleet with the next two going to etheir the NF or PF.
Russia said they wanted to build a large amount of these but in recent years hey seemed to scale back how many they want.
The current number is around 16?
Which would mean eight for both fleets.
I don't think they are really scaling back anything. They need frigates and Gorshkov is it.
More likely due to engine issues and other delays, ones that are ordered after these first 16 or whatever will be Gorshkov v2.0.
Steregushi and Derski class situation, only frigate sized. Same number of vessels in class, different iteration of model.
franco- Posts : 7053
Points : 7079
Join date : 2010-08-18
SeigSoloyvov wrote:Far has I am aware the first two are going tot he NF fleet with the next two going to etheir the NF or PF.
Russia said they wanted to build a large amount of these but in recent years hey seemed to scale back how many they want.
The current number is around 16?
Which would mean eight for both fleets.
There are only 6 on order presently. Hopefully more will follow.
SeigSoloyvov- Posts : 3910
Points : 3888
Join date : 2016-04-08
franco wrote:SeigSoloyvov wrote:Far has I am aware the first two are going tot he NF fleet with the next two going to etheir the NF or PF.
Russia said they wanted to build a large amount of these but in recent years hey seemed to scale back how many they want.
The current number is around 16?
Which would mean eight for both fleets.
There are only 6 on order presently. Hopefully more will follow.
This is planned not on order this could change of course. I remember them saying they want 20's before then downscaled the number.
In my opinion, they need at least 10 per major fleet.
If they have any interest in the Asian region they will need even more then that
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
Yeah gonna be interesting whether they go for a relatively minor change or significantly different.ones that are ordered after these first 16 or whatever will be Gorshkov v2.0.
Steregushi and Derski class situation
Hopefully whatever the difference it'll be without the massive delays of Gorshkov.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
Points : 13512
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
hoom wrote:Yeah gonna be interesting whether they go for a relatively minor change or significantly different.ones that are ordered after these first 16 or whatever will be Gorshkov v2.0.
Steregushi and Derski class situation
Hopefully whatever the difference it'll be without the massive delays of Gorshkov.
They first need to deliver couple of batches of Gorshkovs before any updates are on the table so we are talking about at least decade from now before new iteration comes into equation.
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
Didn't stop them with 20385 -> 20386
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
So on the topic of upgraded 22350:
In a report about Salyut http://nortwolf-sam.livejournal.com/1773651.html
This 'pyramid' concept has been seen before
Easy to write it off as just a sketch to highlight the rough locations/scale of bits of their systems & it may very well be just that eg most of the pics on http://nortwolf-sam.livejournal.com/1449376.html
Even then, there is a concept similar to the 'pyramid' 22350
And somehow the 'pyramid' version really feels 'right' to me
In a report about Salyut http://nortwolf-sam.livejournal.com/1773651.html
This 'pyramid' concept has been seen before
Easy to write it off as just a sketch to highlight the rough locations/scale of bits of their systems & it may very well be just that eg most of the pics on http://nortwolf-sam.livejournal.com/1449376.html
Even then, there is a concept similar to the 'pyramid' 22350
And somehow the 'pyramid' version really feels 'right' to me
Luq man- Posts : 67
Points : 69
Join date : 2016-03-26
Location : The Netherlands
Admiral Kasatonov looks like all of equipment is fitted on.
Shame they didn't show the inside but looks like it will go on trials in the summer and hopefully delivered by the end of this year.
Shame they didn't show the inside but looks like it will go on trials in the summer and hopefully delivered by the end of this year.
George1- Posts : 18522
Points : 19027
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
Russian Navy to receive two advanced frigates by 2020
The Russian Navy will receive two frigates by late 2020 that will feature a new antiaircraft missile/artillery system with several types of missiles
MOSCOW, March 7. /TASS/. The Russian Navy will receive two Project 22350 frigates by late 2020 that will feature a new antiaircraft missile/artillery system with several types of missiles, including a long-distance air defense missile, Russia’s Defense Ministry Sergei Shoigu said on Tuesday.
"The third thematic issue is devoted to developing an antiaircraft missile/artillery system and a long-distance antiaircraft missile. By late 2020, the Navy will receive two most advanced Project 22350 frigates armed with the Kalibr and Oniks modern strike complexes," the defense minister said during a conference call.
"Air defense for these ships will be provided by a new antiaircraft missile/artillery system with several types of missiles," Shoigu said during a live broadcast of Rossiya-24 TV Channel.
Over 60 launches of these missiles have been made at the naval ranges of the Baltic and Northern Fleets, and also at the Kapustin Yar training range in the Astrakhan Region in south Russia and now state trials of a promising long-range antiaircraft missile are under way, the defense minister said.
"As a whole, the implementation of these two projects will help develop weapons with unique combat capabilities. The Defense Ministry expects these weapons to be delivered to troops soon," Shoigu said.
"Today we’ll discuss the results of trials aboard the lead frigate 22350," Shoigu said.
The Russian Defense Ministry expects to receive a new shipborne antiaircraft missile system in the imminent future, Shoigu said.
The Project 22350 lead frigate Admiral Gorshkov was laid down in early 2006 and put afloat in the autumn of 2010. The ship started undergoing trials in November 2014. The frigate is expected to be delivered to the Russian Navy in late July this year.
The second Project 22350 frigate Admiral Kasatonov was floated out in 2014. The third frigate Admiral Golovko is expected to be put afloat in 2017.
The Project 22350 frigate has a displacement of 4,500 tons and a speed of 29 knots. The frigate is armed with Oniks (NATO reporting name: SS-N-26 Strobile) and Kalibr (SS-N-27 Sizzler) missiles and the Poliment-Redut air defense missile system.
More:
http://tass.com/defense/934350
The Russian Navy will receive two frigates by late 2020 that will feature a new antiaircraft missile/artillery system with several types of missiles
MOSCOW, March 7. /TASS/. The Russian Navy will receive two Project 22350 frigates by late 2020 that will feature a new antiaircraft missile/artillery system with several types of missiles, including a long-distance air defense missile, Russia’s Defense Ministry Sergei Shoigu said on Tuesday.
"The third thematic issue is devoted to developing an antiaircraft missile/artillery system and a long-distance antiaircraft missile. By late 2020, the Navy will receive two most advanced Project 22350 frigates armed with the Kalibr and Oniks modern strike complexes," the defense minister said during a conference call.
"Air defense for these ships will be provided by a new antiaircraft missile/artillery system with several types of missiles," Shoigu said during a live broadcast of Rossiya-24 TV Channel.
Over 60 launches of these missiles have been made at the naval ranges of the Baltic and Northern Fleets, and also at the Kapustin Yar training range in the Astrakhan Region in south Russia and now state trials of a promising long-range antiaircraft missile are under way, the defense minister said.
"As a whole, the implementation of these two projects will help develop weapons with unique combat capabilities. The Defense Ministry expects these weapons to be delivered to troops soon," Shoigu said.
"Today we’ll discuss the results of trials aboard the lead frigate 22350," Shoigu said.
The Russian Defense Ministry expects to receive a new shipborne antiaircraft missile system in the imminent future, Shoigu said.
The Project 22350 lead frigate Admiral Gorshkov was laid down in early 2006 and put afloat in the autumn of 2010. The ship started undergoing trials in November 2014. The frigate is expected to be delivered to the Russian Navy in late July this year.
The second Project 22350 frigate Admiral Kasatonov was floated out in 2014. The third frigate Admiral Golovko is expected to be put afloat in 2017.
The Project 22350 frigate has a displacement of 4,500 tons and a speed of 29 knots. The frigate is armed with Oniks (NATO reporting name: SS-N-26 Strobile) and Kalibr (SS-N-27 Sizzler) missiles and the Poliment-Redut air defense missile system.
More:
http://tass.com/defense/934350
calripson- Posts : 753
Points : 808
Join date : 2013-10-26
Does this imply that the first two 22350 ships, both of which are built, will not enter active service till 2020 ? Does the statement about "new anti-aircraft missile system" imply that the problems with the existing installation require a complete redo and hence the now additional three year delay ?
Luq man- Posts : 67
Points : 69
Join date : 2016-03-26
Location : The Netherlands
This project is an absolute total disaster. Pure incompetence to the finest. 
SeigSoloyvov- Posts : 3910
Points : 3888
Join date : 2016-04-08
Oui managed to check in on here.
Kurds are annoying the hell outta me.
Side note, they are clearly talking about the Redut system.
They are referring to the 3rd and 4th series of this class.
Admiral Golovko is to be launched this year.
By late 2020 this means they expect to get two more ships at the latest by that timeframe, don't get me wrong they are building these things super slow. Engine issue excluded.
Kurds are annoying the hell outta me.
Side note, they are clearly talking about the Redut system.
They are referring to the 3rd and 4th series of this class.
Admiral Golovko is to be launched this year.
By late 2020 this means they expect to get two more ships at the latest by that timeframe, don't get me wrong they are building these things super slow. Engine issue excluded.
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
Points : 13512
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
SeigSoloyvov wrote:Oui managed to check in on here.
Kurds are annoying the hell outta me.
......
Hahaha, good to hear from you man, stay safe out there!!!
SeigSoloyvov wrote:..........
Side note, they are clearly talking about the Redut system.
They are referring to the 3rd and 4th series of this class.
Admiral Golovko is to be launched this year.
By late 2020 this means they expect to get two more ships at the latest by that timeframe, don't get me wrong they are building these things super slow. Engine issue excluded.
Yeah, the are taking their sweet time. They should just put another shipyard on the job already.
I also read that this shipyard has issues with delivery dates across the board not just with combat vessels.
George1- Posts : 18522
Points : 19027
Join date : 2011-12-22
Location : Greece
Advanced Russian frigate Admiral Gorshkov leaves St. Petersburg for firing trials
More:
http://tass.com/defense/936511
More:
http://tass.com/defense/936511
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
And a pic to go with it 
Big_Gazza- Posts : 4901
Points : 4891
Join date : 2014-08-25
Location : Melbourne, Australia
If I'm not mistaken that is the Adm Kasanatov behind her (you can just make out the scaffolded superstructure).
hoom- Posts : 2352
Points : 2340
Join date : 2016-05-06
More lovely pics 
via http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2504497.html
Definitely Kasatanov behind
via http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2504497.htmlDefinitely Kasatanov behind
PapaDragon- Posts : 13472
Points : 13512
Join date : 2015-04-26
Location : Fort Evil, Serbia
A larger version of Gorshkov frigate might be in the works. Unofficial name is Super-Goshkov. Should be 1100 tons heavier than standard one.
http://izvestia.ru/news/668261
So if Gorshkov is replacement for Sovremennyy class destroyers then Super-Goshkov should be replacement for Udaloy class destroyers.