Russian Space Program: News & Discussion #3

I forgot to add that Boeing did not do any preflight system checks.   One can't make this inanity up.

The space shuttle concept was flawed from the beginning... at about 600 million dollars a launch it is an incredibly expensive way of moving people to and from a space station... ie to perform as a shuttle.

The reality is that the us kept using their space shuttles because in effect they were also their space stations for a week at a time... launch... spend a week doing stuff and then land.

For the Soviets they had a real space station so using rockets at 60 million per launch to take up people and supplies was much more affordable and they could stay up for months at a time to do much more meaningful experiments... they were getting much better value for money.

The fact that ISS is basically MIR-2 based on the MIRs modular design tells you who got things right.

The US doesn't even have any Space Shuttles any more because space is expensive and they need to work out ways of making it pay.

Remember how USSR decided to drop Moon landings just because USA got there first?

Mountain of money and years of effort instantly flushed down the shitter just because mighty USSR ego got butthurt...

Putting people on planets is an ego trip... most of the time robots make rather more sense and is cheaper.

In the longer term making a small group of humans self sufficient in air and water and fuel and energy for long periods either in deep space or just away from the earth where everything is abundant is a useful goal because we on earth need to learn to create less poison and pollution and use our resources much more efficiently or we are going to have problems. Everyone is worried about the planet... the planet will be fine... Chernobyl shows humans are more toxic and damaging to nature than radiation is... when we disappear probably at our own hand, nature and life will flourish and grow again... it isn't fossil fuels it is us.

GarryB wrote:
Putting people on planets is an ego trip... most of the time robots make rather more sense and is cheaper.
.

you are so amazingly wrong dude.. and kvs too.. no offense but you are the most uninformed people in the forum ,about politics and business strategy..and military tactics too.. and so many other things.. that is not even fun.

A nation economy and money goes hand with hand with trust.. with influence ,with leading business.
This is not about Ego ..      About Ego is what Putin is doing bragging about most powerful nukes.. or fastest missiles.. which is scare mongering..

Having business ,that amaze people all around the world , this are like WEAPON OF MASS INFLUENCE.
and no advance business excite more society than Space leadership ,in every area.. from explorations ,to tourism to security.

This is extremely important , because who leads  and dominate in space.. will attract the best scientist and engineers in the world.. to work for you.. and those who fail in space ,will get their scientist and engineers abandon ship.. US was able to create an empire ,because its business leadership.. gots a shit ton of foreign scientist including Russians and engineers around the world moved to America.. because they were leading in every area in science and engineering..
so this is not about ego..  but about breaking the western advance business hegemony and creating an alternative system.. to the west.  if putin want peace.. he needs to break the influence of the american empire with their business..  Soviet union understood this.. they both tried to compete for space leadership.. problem was soviet did not had a balanced budget and wasted too much in weapons and wasted a ton of money in endless wars.. in the afghan trap ,setup by americans.. that soviet fall on it..  To say space domination is about Ego.. you have to be in complete detachment of reality.. or a major brain Disorder that unable you to reason.

Putin complains that Russia is not respected nation in the world.. and he is the only one to blame
for it.. because he don't do much to break the western system.. he follows the western leadership..
by allowing US business to dominate in the most important influential with society business... only china
is fighting back.. to the western world.. but putin is distracted in the old past tradition and sports.. and develops Russia economy as if was a banana congo republic of africa ,that depends on food ,mining and oil exports its economy.

leading in space ,boost not only flight travels business in space.. but advances thousands of other areas.. in the nation.. and the most important thing.. is that it attract cooperation from other nations.. is like a carrot to a horse.. if Russia was landing in moon and mars with humans today and had bases there , it will invite only nations friendly to Russia to get closer to Russia ,specially in europe and US will become isolated in the world ,if they choose to continue with its sanctions and cold war vs Russia.. without business domination ,the american empire can't exist.. so is not ego.. is about break the american influence in the world.. so to force them to cooperate and abandon its hostilities towards their competition.. because they will cooperate if they benefit from it..

It is about money... people go to the US for money and an easier life... whether it is engineers from Russia or peasants from Mexico... the smart and talented get to stay and the poor tend to get sent back or trapped in menial jobs.

For space travel to be viable it needs to be able to pay and it is not going to pay until we get much better propulsion so trips are faster, but also being able to reuse material means we wont need to take so much which also makes the trip faster and easier.

There is nothing Russia can do to appear to be good in the eyes of the west... except the obvious of handing over all resources and land to western owned companies for them to rape and pillage and make enormous fortunes from... which is not going to happen under Putin.

Russia needs to give up the idea of being a good little poodle to the west... that ship has sailed... Russia needs to work towards its own interests and develop relations with the rest of the world that does not include the west where a normal trade relation is possible without them demanding Russia accept gays or 20 genders and without Russia demanding anything from them.

You can buy ethical coffee in the west where the growers are paid a fair wage for the product they deliver to western consumers... makes you wonder why it is possible to buy unethical coffee made by slave labour for wages so small they barely get by... it is an interesting statement about the west when they talk about workers rights and human rights that most of the time they don't practise what they preach... rights for our people but we don't care about yours in fact our companies will exploit your lack of labour laws to make cheap products cheaper.... because that is what we want... something for nothing.

https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/131174/

The share of Russian microelectronics in new satellites increased from 2017 to 27%

The share of domestic electronic component base in the Russian satellites has increased by 2017, from 53% to 80%.

Overall, in 2017 the proportion used by the Federal space Agency of the domestic microelectronics industry category space (for space purposes) to our new satellites has increased from 53% to 80%.

This year Russia begins the transition to spacecraft of new generation "GLONASS-K1". They will significantly increase the share of domestic components.

Currently, the Russian orbital grouping used satellites "GLONASS-M". 16 March from the Plesetsk cosmodrome was launched the next device of this type. The third generation satellites "GLONASS-K" of the Russian system GLONASS have greater positioning accuracy. They are designed for 10 years, unlike the previous generation of satellites "GLONASS-M" with a lifetime of seven years. The first satellite "GLONASS-K" was launched into orbit in 2011, the second — in 2014.

miketheterrible wrote:https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/131174/

The share of Russian microelectronics in new satellites increased from 2017 to 27%

The share of domestic electronic component base in the Russian satellites has increased by 2017, from 53% to 80%.

Overall, in 2017 the proportion used by the Federal space Agency of the domestic microelectronics industry category space (for space purposes) to our new satellites has increased from 53% to 80%.

This year Russia begins the transition to spacecraft of new generation "GLONASS-K1". They will significantly increase the share of domestic components.

Currently, the Russian orbital grouping used satellites "GLONASS-M". 16 March from the Plesetsk cosmodrome was launched the next device of this type. The third generation satellites "GLONASS-K" of the Russian system GLONASS have greater positioning accuracy. They are designed for 10 years, unlike the previous generation of satellites "GLONASS-M" with a lifetime of seven years. The first satellite "GLONASS-K" was launched into orbit in 2011, the second — in 2014.

These journalists are illiterates. The share of microelectronics increased by 50% to 80% of the total. Nobody uses the percentage delta
to describe the increase amount. A 50% increase since 2017 is impressive considering the Soviet legacy which gave Russia an under-developed
electronics manufacturing base.

Also the fact that the percentage is not 100 is that the foreign components are warehoused and available even today, regardless of sanctions.
So it is obviously cheaper to use them. The import substitution is being done gradually and that is the right approach. It gives Russian
electronics companies time to properly develop domestic replacements and it saves money by not trashing viable components.

The west f*cked itself with its cheesy, mentally deficient sanctions. The Congress geriatrics and retards think it is 1980 and Russia
is devoid of the capability of making every type of electronics device known to man. They need to update their bigoted minds.

Actually I think it is great and I think the US should impose harder sanctions on Russia accessing western electronics... Russia getting cheap food from the EU meant producing food in Russia was difficult because who would buy more expensive inferior food... but when that cheap food is blocked money and technology is invested in Russian production and it improves to the point where it is able to produce quality food better than anything the EU could make but can make it cheaper and sanction proof for Russian consumers...

A western ban on electronics will be the boost to the Russian electronics industry that it needs... it will block western competition and create a captive market where they can grow and develop their products safe from much larger western companies that make their products in sweatshops in China and have the entire world to sell to so they can take a loss in the Russian market to damage Russian producers... so eventually they can buy them out...

Good to see the west shooting itself in the foot yet again... long may they continue...

GarryB wrote:Actually I think it is great and I think the US should impose harder sanctions on Russia accessing western electronics... Russia getting cheap food from the EU meant producing food in Russia was difficult because who would buy more expensive inferior food... but when that cheap food is blocked money and technology is invested in Russian production and it improves to the point where it is able to produce quality food better than anything the EU could make but can make it cheaper and sanction proof for Russian consumers...

A western ban on electronics will be the boost to the Russian electronics industry that it needs... it will block western competition and create a captive market where they can grow and develop their products safe from much larger western companies that make their products in sweatshops in China and have the entire world to sell to so they can take a loss in the Russian market to damage Russian producers... so eventually they can buy them out...

Good to see the west shooting itself in the foot yet again... long may they continue...

The agricultural adaptation has been impressive. Dinosaurs used the past productivity data to claim Russia could not handle loss of imports. But
as with sugar beet production, we have seen massive yield per hectare increases. This has meant both sufficient supply and reasonable price.

The same economics works for electronics of all types. Domestic production capacity is increased which creates a critical mass of money
circulating in this sector to allow for equipment upgrades. It actually allows for Russia to start developing its own manufacturing equipment
instead of living off western hand-me-downs like we saw up until 2014 and later. Unfortunately, the government is sabotaging itself and
Russia in this area. The case of RZD's attempt to purchase Elbrus based PCs is case in point. The ridiculous decision of the the "anti-monopoly"
agency to force RZD to let Intel/AMD based PCs to compete for the tender is a crime. There is nothing monopolistic about Elbrus and by
having western component based PCs forced into the Russian market in the name of some BS free trade agreements is unacceptable. When
Elbrus can compete with x86 head to head, then open up the market for the western trash. Russia will never develop a solid CPU design
and manufacturing industry if clown outfits in the government sabotage such efforts.

A lot of the criticism of Russia found on this board and elsewhere is based on ignorance. Russia is fighting an uphill battle since western money
can buy politicians and bureaucrats. We saw this with Rodchenkov and WADA. We see this with the Russian anti-monopoly clown show and
the RZD Elbrus case. I am quite sure the rot at Roscosmos was orchestrated by the west as well. Putin is not running a gulag dictatorship so
he cannot have the sellouts shot as soon as they stick out their heads. I wish he could, but there is value on due process.

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:https://aviation21.ru/sudno-sea-launch-commander-pribylo-na-dalnij-vostok/

Sea launch arrived in the far east of Russia.

I have a question for the experts in the forum.

How does the Zenith rocket made in Dnipropetrovsk compare with the latest versions of the Russian Soyuz?

I was reading that they  planned to use sea launch with the Soyuz 7 (in development)  to replace the Zenit 3sl.
However, from the information  available online it looks like  Soyuz 7 is quite lighter and can launch a smaller payload than Zenith 3SL... a more comparable missile would be Irtysh (Soyuz-5)...

The Soyuz 5 or whatever it is now called was going to have each module be very similar to a Zenit, including the use of the RD-170 type four
nozzle engines. So it would fit the Sea Launch platform without any major redesign. I do not know the plans for the Soyuz 5. I think
it is going to be realized since the modules will allow assembly of a heavy launcher with a payload over twice that of the heaviest Angara variant.

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:https://aviation21.ru/sudno-sea-launch-commander-pribylo-na-dalnij-vostok/

Sea launch arrived in the far east of Russia.

I have a question for the experts in the forum.

How does the Zenith rocket made in Dnipropetrovsk compare with the latest versions of the Russian Soyuz?

I was reading that they planned to use sea launch with the Soyuz 7 (in development) to replace the Zenit 3sl.
However, from the information available online it looks like Soyuz 7 is quite lighter and can launch a smaller payload than Zenith 3SL... a more comparable missile would be Irtysh (Soyuz-5)...

Soyuz-7 is super-heavy variant comprised of several Soyuz-5 cores so Soyuz-7 will not be launched from SeaLaunch (too big)

Putin is not running a gulag dictatorship so
he cannot have the sellouts shot as soon as they stick out their heads. I wish he could, but there is value on due process.

Which amuses me... in one breath the west demands Putin step in and interfere with due process to save this or that person from actual justice... like western governments do all the time... in fact the US government really does not accept any legal authority over their citizens international or not... and in the next breath they claim he rules Russia with an iron fist and nothing happens without his say so... he even runs elections around the world... the puppet master...

Yet Putin is generally the opposite... Russian forces didn't invade the Crimea to force them to join Russia... Russian forces based in the Crimea kept the peace but did not interfere and let the people of the Crimea have a referendum in peace despite attempts to disrupt from Kiev so they could decide their own future.

Contrast that with US forces in Iraq and Iran and Syria and Afghanistan fighting to keep a government that is pro US in power or to remove one that is not pro US(Syria)... totally ignoring the will of the local people or international law... but Russians are the bad guys... when you say it often enough it becomes true right...

Russian rocket plans are quite confusing and subject to change due to budget pressures (and endless misreporting).

Soyuz 5 (Irtysh) is essentially a modernised Zenit with upgraded engines and avionics and will have significantly higher lift performance (~18T to LEO) than the legacy Ukropi product (<14T). First flight will be from Baikonour approx 2021-22 using the existing Zenit pad, to be upgraded by Kazakhstan under the "Baiterek" bi-national project.

It will also form the basis of the booster section for the future modular SHLV such as Yenisei/Don. Think of an Angara 5 configuration but using Soyuz 5 blocks instead of the much smaller URM-1 cores. SHLV will launch from a new pad in Vostochny to be built after the Angara pad is complete. First flight approx 2027.

Soyuz 5 will be the nominated launcher for operational LEO flights of the new "Orel" crewed vehicle (renamed from Federitsya). Yenisei/Don is intended for lunar and BEO missions (as well as oversized station modules and similar payloads).

(BTW much confusion results from the fact that the Soyuz-5 designation was originally used for a Methane-LOX concept from TsKBM Progress. After the Soyuz 5 designation was "re-assigned" to Irtysh the methalox concept was renamed Soyuz 7, but is now apparently referred to as "RN SPG" after Soyuz 7 designation was again transferred to another project. RN SPG is currently proposed to be a Soyuz-2 class vehicle with a reuseable first stage)

The plans for Soyuz 6 is still rather hazy but it appears that it will be a cut-down version of Soyuz 5 using RD-180s for smaller payloads, essentially in the payload category of current Soyuz-2 (~8T to LEO). It will also serve as the 2nd stage of the Yenisei/Don SHLV.

AFAIK the current Soyuz-7 concept is apparently a development of Soyuz 5/Irtysh intended for Sea Launch but who knows what is really happening with them these days...

AFAIk there is no public announcemnet on when Sea Launch may restart operations. I thnk its fair to say that the accursed Ukropistanis won't be restarting Zenit manufacture anytime soon (hehe.. lets face it, the Banderite child-killer scum don't have the capability to built rockets anymore. Most of their experienced people have long since run away to Russia in search of a paycheck ).

They should invest in new ground stations. There is always a bottle-neck for data transmission from space back to the ground.
In particular, there is a lack of high bandwidth processing capacity and storage.

Russia conducts first Soyuz 2.1a human launch; MS-16 crew to Station

For the first time since 2002, humans departed for the International Space Station from Kazakhstan on a rocket other than the veteran Soyuz-FG, which was retired last year. Now, the Soyuz 2.1a rocket took up crew launch duties for the Russian element of crew support for the Station.

The Soyuz MS-16 three-person crew lifted off from Site No. 31/6 at the Baikonur Cosmodrome, Kazakhstan, on 9 April 2020 at 08:05:06 UTC (04:05:06 EDT) to begin a four orbit, six hour rendezvous with the Station.

Docking is expected at 14:15 UTC (10:15 EDT).

source

Signing of an agreement on modernization of the Gagarin launch is scheduled for the end of the year

NUR-SULTAN, April 12. / TASS /. Kazakhstan, Russia and the United Arab Emirates plan to sign an agreement to modernize the first launch pad of the Baikonur Cosmodrome (Gagarin Start) at the end of 2020. This was reported to TASS on Sunday by the press service of the Ministry of Digital Development, Innovation and Aerospace Industry of Kazakhstan.

"To date, the parties have jointly prepared a draft agreement, which is currently being finalized taking into account the proposals of interested state bodies of the parties. The signing of the agreement is scheduled for the end of 2020," the press service informed.

The total cost of the project will be $ 87 million - $ 29 million from each of the three parties. “The reconstruction will consist of replacing analog systems with digital ones, as well as replacing obsolete technological equipment with modern equipment and carrying out construction and installation works. I would like to note that before the planned modernization, the Soyuz-FG launch vehicle was launched, and after the modernization it is planned launch the Soyuz-2 launch vehicle and its modified versions, "the ministry explained.

Site No. 1 (Gagarinsky Launch) is the oldest launch pad at the Baikonur Cosmodrome, from which the Vostok spacecraft set off on April 12, 1961, with the world's first cosmonaut Yuri Gagarin (1934-1968) on board.

source

magnumcromagnon wrote:

Mind blowing. Cheers mate.

Elon Musk has accused Roscosmos of being dependent on government support.

Some genius this clown is. No shit Sherlock, Roscosmos is a government agency like NASA. And if you are trying
to hide your gross incompetence under the fig leaf of "not enough money", then GTFO.

Another gem is that the head of NASA only congratulated the two returning Americans. Clown-ass whose
country can't even launch astronauts to the ISS can't be bothered to show some decorum. The only
thing exceptional about Americans is their primitivism.