Finally, I agree with the Frenchman who writes that German tanks will be destroyed like any other tanks. Although, I am convinced that France will also have to send Char Leclerc tanks, even though these tanks have one advantage - in the event of the destruction of the tank, one less crew member would die because the Leclerc has 3 crew members
France sent amx-10RC. They ain't sending leclerc. They vave barely 200 of them in active service and production line doesn't exist anymore. They can't send any even if they want to.
They are also trying to sell the ones in reserve to arab state like saudi arabia who seems to prefer it over their own m1a2. So Ukraine will wait long time unless Macron obei the orders.
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Finally, I agree with the Frenchman who writes that German tanks will be destroyed like any other tanks. Although, I am convinced that France will also have to send Char Leclerc tanks, even though these tanks have one advantage - in the event of the destruction of the tank, one less crew member would die because the Leclerc has 3 crew members.
Nah, bro, he has REALLY good comments and observations. That is why I felt really sad seeing him in rage mode for no reason. Defending something undefendable.
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@Alamo you quote that it can operate for 15-20 MINUTES before needs to be turned off for cooling for about half an hour.
I agree that nowadays the TI of the Leo2 is not the most modern equipment but the statement that it has to be turned of for cooling is not true. According to the Dutch manual it was put on when switching the FCS on. It took about 10 minutes to cool down so it could ''see'' the temperature differences. It could stay on a long as you wanted, there was no time limit or degradation of picture quality after hours and hours of use. You could see and identify a peeing man in the treeline at 3000 mtr, so it was good enough to see the heat signature of a vehicle. Snow and fog degraded the image, that is true. I have tanked the Leopard A4, A5 AND A6 (same thermal image for gunner) for about 20 years, I think I know how to operate a Leopard 2 thermal.
Sincerely Lesley
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I agree that nowadays the TI of the Leo2 is not the most modern equipment but the statement that it has to be turned of for cooling is not true. According to the Dutch manual it was put on when switching the FCS on. It took about 10 minutes to cool down so it could ''see'' the temperature differences. It could stay on a long as you wanted, there was no time limit or degradation of picture quality after hours and hours of use. You could see and identify a peeing man in the treeline at 3000 mtr, so it was good enough to see the heat signature of a vehicle. Snow and fog degraded the image, that is true. I have tanked the Leopard A4, A5 AND A6 (same thermal image for gunner) for about 20 years, I think I know how to operate a Leopard 2 thermal.
Sincerely Lesley
Bro, don't teach me things I did (there should be a beer cheering icon Garry! ) Maybe - and surely that is the case - you have just a different climate We couldn't see shit. A cow was a bright green blob the same size as BMP sided by. Sure I saw that! Just bet what?!? I have not a single clue about A5 and A6 - never used it. I'm too old
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GEROMAN -- time will tell - -- @GeromanAT · 1h as far as I understand the Ugledar situation 1. RF made some probing attacks on the left flank and took the area on the right flank north of the river 2. moved north along the Dacha area 3. took the Dacha area 4. and is now attacking on the edge of Ugledar proper
War Reports @InsaleZ · 1h Rybar confirmed that the dachas east of #Vuhledar had been captured. Rybar dismissed rumors that Russian forces had entered the city. The battles are fought on the eastern outskirts Small Russian advance from Pavlivka. Ukrainian forces are trying to stabilize the situation.
Theresa tretter @tretter50001 · 2h Soldiers of the assault battalion entrenched themselves in a dacha area in the southeast of Ugledar. At the moment, fighting is underway on the outskirts, where units of the 72nd OMB of the Armed Forces of Ukraine tried to go to the rear,
As many have already realized, sending small numbers of tanks or even jets will not change the war, but politicians might use these deliveries just to find out how far they can go. In the next escalation step they might send weapons with very long range or even weapons of mass destructions. As long as those Western war criminals do not have to deal with too much resistance from their own population and from Russia, they will continue to double down - probably without any limits.
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@AZgeopolitics Missile hit Turkish-owned ship in Ukraine's Kherson- Reuters Reuters was not able to independently confirm the date the videos were filmed. No one was injured. The vessel has been blocked in the port since February 2022.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1618362984686047232
Will already have a reason why the rocket hit exactly this ship.
Then as now, many scoffed that Ukraine could conduct an offensive - but were left with an egg on the face when it came
Sure, Russia retained its combat power - but lost lands with pro Russians that really affected the domestic opinion of the SMO
With the saving grace being that wagner went to work in donbass and managed some local successes across Donbass and some minor success in Kamianka and Ugledar
Again the Ukros are preparing merrily for an offensive, even telegraphing their intention, and there's no reaction
People like Antonov or Peskov claim the tanks will be destroyed
Great, but not if kherson and Zaporozhye are lost
Russia needs to maintain a strong presence there even if they do not intend to resume offensive operations
The danger of western tanks , is that the mass of Ukrainian infantry will be able to move with speed in the south
If the front lines are staffed with minimal manpower, the Leopard 2 and the Abrams will be able to cut through the lines, just like T64 did in Kharkov
That's a bunch of crap. They reorganized their defences because they were too much spread and ukro where using ambushes, special ops and drobe attack against advanced russian troops too far from russian protection.
T-64 breack nothing. Where are those t-64 now ? Dead. Leo 2 will end same way. Just hunt them with drones + kancet strikes. After 15 video if such attacks no ukrainian will get in one of them anymore.
Looking at all the video of civilians getting arrested to ve sent by force on the front I have the impression they have no more real and motivated soldiers out there. Those guys will surrender much easily than previous nazi gangs. Things will just go faster and easier for Russia.
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for all the talk of NATO sending Armor and Aircraft.
Ukrainians do not have cloning facilities to just shit out new men to send to the front. they just grab any man they can now at gunpoint. Cemetary's as far the eye can see.
They do not have (almost) nothing left, All their reserves where used to hold on to meatgrinders like Soledar and Bakhmut. Soledar was a massacre, Bakhmut is in the process of falling. New RF assaults are underway without Ukrainian units moving in to reinforce.
The writing is on the walls what is happening when you compare all this with NATO going in panic mode and throwing everything they can to Ukraine. And here is the American MIC, "do not worry!, we will supply you with sub-standard crap to replace whatever you send!". and Well, its still pretty laughable when you look at what NATO really sends.
Incomplete Patriot battery's, maybe they get lucky and can assemble a complete one?. $4 million a missile for an flying lawnmower?. yes sounds like win-win to me.
A handful of older generation Leo-2 here and there. M1a1, 35 of them. On an contact line so extensive as it is. You need to go searching with an magnifier to find these. I do advice RF troops to keep a geiger counter nearby. I do not know if Americans will supply DU munitions. Personally i know they still used it as i was deployed in Afghanistan in 2009 So they might hand it too to the Ukrainians Like the Ukrainians care with their rich track record of using forbidden munitions?.
In the end, these are "just" tanks. they went to hell just fine in Iraq, Yemen and Syria.
Meanwhile, Western MSM goes crazy, Promoting to all the new wave of WunderWaffe that will pave the way for Kiev to Retake Crimea. There is going to be one way how this ends, burning Western armor that the Western MSM will do it's best to ignore. Meanwhile, The Rest of the world will watch how detached from reality NATO really is. Corrupt and Incompetent.
NATO, Having an combined defense budget of 1.2 trillion U.S. dollars in 2022. versus Russia with 75 billion defense budget. Meanwhile NATO cant replace anything it wants to send (it takes half a year or longer) and Weapon factory's in Russia go BRRRRRRR! with 3 shifts 24/7 in some cases.
These shortcommings where already very noticable during my time in Afghanistan. Logistics was shit, Factory's of vehicles and munitions had issues meeting demand even then. And weapon R&D was even more corrupt and dirty deals with every new system being bought.
And to top it off when you needed it to work, it did not do it's job. To the point you discussed the problem with your squadmates and you all agree the guy that put his approval for this should be put against the wall.
And here we are now, Where the Whores to U.S Foreign policy decide to do everything that is NOT in their own nations interrests. As long they can crawl on Dementia Joe's lap for a little nibble of that Approval.
This is not going to end well for Europe. Even after this war the rest of the world that has been treated like shit by the EU and U.S will remember everything. First the defeat of Ukraine will come, followed by an massive wave of refugees from Ukraine that may have been rooting for the Bandera scum. Putting massive strain already of what is a house of cards in Europe.
Then EU, lacking any resources of its own to meet its energy demands competitively with the rest of the world. will no longer be able to compete on the world economy. And the list goes on why things go to shit from that point.
For now tough, it is what it is. War is unpredictable. We will see how things progress.
Last edited by Airbornewolf on Wed Jan 25, 2023 3:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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The cause of those withdrawals was the accumulation of large Ukro reserves and armored vehicles, which allowed them to launch human wave attacks which overwhelmed the front line
In this case, M1abrams and Leopard 2, can help them with this
If ATGM really make a difference as is claimed, then it should have been enough for T64 in Kharkov
But ATGM didn't stop them from taking Stary Saltov, Liman, Kupyansk, Chuiguev, Balakleya, and so on
And the same for Andreyevka, Davydov Brod, Kherson
It's the same mistakes of the general staff, this time there is AMPLE warning and if nothing is done it will be a disaster
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(there should be a beer cheering icon Garry! )
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Rybar confirmed that the dachas east of #Vuhledar had been captured.
Soldiers of the assault battalion entrenched themselves in a dacha area in the southeast of Ugledar. At the moment, fighting is underway on the outskirts, where units of the 72nd OMB of the Armed Forces of Ukraine tried to go to the rear,
