Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39

It's incredible how people believe, in this story of Wagner's lack of ammunition,
as absolute truth, when facts on the ground tell a completely different story.

If there was a decrease in the supply of ammunition for the Wagner this would be reflected negatively on the battlefield, but this did not happen, in fact the opposite happened, the pace of advance in Artyomovsk increased. Does less ammo result in more advance? How does it work?

And why so much praise for Wagner, who is doing something that the Russian army "did not do"?
As far as I know, Wagner spent half a year outside Artyomovsk without doing shit, until the Russian command decided to focus on the region and help them.

The pic Prigozin posted is the biggest propaganda own goal of the war and that is saying something. It is treasonous. And total disrespect for the families of the dead.

He has to be punished. He's a loose cannon f*cking idiot. And be no longer has my support

Yeah he's taken this whole story too far

The pic is uncalled for, and the way he's going on about it all it's as if only his little private army is having problems. I'm sure plenty of units haven't had support at key moments, ran low on ammo, on medical supplies, weren't relieved in a timely manner - it's fucking war. Yeah you need to bring up problems but you can't create a witch's sabbath out of things.

Dunno what's up with all this 'criticism' and dooming. What is its purpose if not to confuse the enemy? And if its to confuse the enemy, well they should remember that the main thing is not to confuse yourself.

This is gruesome. But Ukraine signed up for this. Too bad

https://t.me/gzvonews/4778

He might be a loose cannon to a point but he's getting results the Russian army has problems getting

If the Russian army had problems getting such results they wouldn't have taken Popasnaya, Mariupol, Lishichyansk, and a whole bunch of other places. Wagner got a good result in Soledar and several other outlying suburbs. They haven't taken Bakhmut yet. It's just one formation along a long front and a war involving hundreds of thousands on both sides. Wagner is not that significant in the grand scheme of things, it just got some good local successes over the last 2 months - that's it.

The Armed Forces of Ukraine continue to bring personnel to Kupyansk. The city is preparing for defense. Almost all buildings are occupied by infantry.

Here we go again

That video posted by John, wow, what a bad luck for that soldier, probably was pulled apart in his sleep, what a shitty way to die

If you don't have something nice to say about the dead, so then don't say anything at all

@Flamming Python wrote:
If the Russian army had problems getting such results they wouldn't have taken Popasnaya, Mariupol, Lishichyansk, and a whole bunch of other places. Wagner got a good result in Soledar and several other outlying suburbs. They haven't taken Bakhmut yet. It's just one formation along a long front and a war involving hundreds of thousands on both sides. Wagner is not that significant in the grand scheme of things, it just got some good local successes over the last 2 months - that's it.

For the sake of veracity, Wagner took Popasnaya, as well. But, that is not too important.
Even if this was supposed to be maskirovka, at this point, it has been blown out of proportion and will do more damage than anything. When Wagner started to get onto scene, in 2015 or so, there were speculations that Patrushev was behind it, some were mentioning Bortnikov. All due to its fast ascent, especially, post-Syria involvement. It became a military hand for Russian diplomacy and interest in foreign countries. Prigozhin might be a great organizer, but i am doubtful that ex-restaurateur pulls so much weight in Kremlin.

That video posted by John, wow, what a bad luck for that soldier, probably was pulled apart in his sleep, what a shitty way to die wrote:

As gory as the death was, it was probably a better death then 3/4 of the population will have as it was instantaneous.

@Snufflebug

I had relatives in the anti-Soviet "resistance" in western Ukraine. It degenerated into banditry where they would terrorize the civilian population
into supplying them. The paranoia became intense and they would murder their own supporters who they suspected of working with the Soviet
authorities. One of my relatives was disappeared and another was murdered. The Banderites were not winning over hearts and minds. This
pattern of decay into banditry is rather common in spite of the western romanticism about "rebels" and "Robin Hoods" such as we had in Kosovo
and elsewhere. Columbia is another example of a long running insurrection that turned into a bandit operation.

The only reason the Banderites made a comeback was because they were reintroduced in the wrapper of western alliance and wealth. These
slime were succored in the west (Canada, USA, etc.) and took over grass roots action in the 1990s. The post-Soviet Ukraine was in economic
free fall and there was a civil society vacuum. The other key factor was corruption and emergence of the oligarchy. The supported the Banderite
line to consolidate their power against Russia. We see something similar in Kazakhstan were a former Commie Party boss is acting just like his
analogue Kuchma and allowing frothing at the mouth nazionalists to penetrate into the power structures and the media. This is not sane behaviour
so money must be involved. The clowns sell their countries to the foreign entities that promote the establishment of anti-Russian regimes on
Russia's borders.

These "Ghost of" telegram channel's are funny. They post a picture if a map and say "losing this or that".

Ghost used to just report action. But he has since turned into another wiseass spinster tosspot.

The current strategic arsenals of Russia and the US are very poor compared to the 1980s. To achieve them horizontally is no effort for China. It's only 1500 warheads approx.

That is strategic weapons only... when you add tactical weapons it is more like 6K each.

China needs more short range missiles because SK and Japan are close by, not to mention all those US bases in the region in various countries.

None of this shit should be aired in public.

Now everyone knows that Russia really does have an ammo shortage. Well done everyone. F'ing idiots.

No, they know there are distribution issues... but there are always issues because even if you have more than enough ammo you can't just ship it to the front and keep it in big stacks... it needs to be split up and distributed to hidden locations where it can be drawn from as needed so as not to become a target for enemy artillery.

Also before someone begins to think about buying untested stuff from foreign countries, just shorten the testing time of home made stuff and accelerate the
state acceptance trials

The testing can be large scale and therefore effectively put straight into service to see if it is useful and should be put into actual service or if it needs modifications and adaptations to be useful.

Prigozhin is very well connected

If he is so well connected then why is he embarrassing his entire country via social media... is he a fucking 12 year old girl who wants to be cool and get lots of likes?

Missile now in a Russian laboratory

It is only HIMARs... not much to learn there for a rocket with shorter range than Russian equivalents.

The Cook just reported that increased ammo is now on the way to Wagner.

Given that they are facing a lot and some of the best Ukr units there, they should be given more. A higher rate of return.

Putin must have put out this fire. And gave Prigozhin a talking to.

I said at first " keep PMC separate , " so that they can not possibly adversely affect regular troops , after all they are ex-convicts . Also I thought that their performance could be measured accurately , if they acted alone . Now it is clear that they are motivated , perhaps more so than regular troops . Winning battles disproportionately to their size and relative importance . All we hear how is what " Wagner " has done . This is a great disadvantage to morale of regular troops . What they are not man enough to fight and advance better than a bunch of criminals ?

Therefore the way the PMC is organised must change . They are better dispersed among regular troops , and fight with them . Their criminal history remains confidential and they are not distinguished by rank or uniform . The troops collectively take credit for victory and they are treated the same . Also the proportion of PMC among regular troops must not be too high , to allow them to take credit for any victory for themselves . Here their victory is a morale defeat for others .

I am also against inclusion of large numbers of foreign volunteer forces , fighting in separate units , for exact same reason . But volunteers or nationalities other than Russian , should be organised within the same fighting units . The Russian identity of units must not be diluted , and regular units , clearly Russian , must  regularly receive commendations and take credit for making advances .

Now that atmospheric nuclear terror tests are approved , there remains the following important steps for victory : First the understanding that no negotiation is possible with the Nazis and any talk of it is misleading and demoralizing . The Basis must be eliminated . Second is that destruction of all Bridges and Road and Rail must be done now , as having the greatest value , and a move that will fit any realistic future developing war scenarios . Third is indirect response to yank attacks , instead of complaints at UN , about finding guilty part to NS1 and NS2 .

Why are Wagner making public statements about ammo supplies?
Why are the MOD responding to it publicly?

This is normally sensitive data you don't talk to the media about, something is going on.

They are doing a great job in a difficult situation so making sure they have the tools they want should be a priority.

Of course they are not the only consideration and if there is an offensive then building up stores of ammo for one or more offensives means sometimes there is not an abundant amount of ammo to go round even when supply is good.

What they are not man enough to fight and advance better than a bunch of criminals ?

Plenty of Hollywood movies are based on such a thing... the dirty dozen, the expendibles, suicide squad... and plenty that are less obvious like 48 hours where a criminal is used by a cop to catch criminals...

The point is that these guys might have not been criminals if they had better lawyers and more money in the west, and I doubt they would recruit murderers and child molesters etc.

They were very selective about who they chose to give a chance at redemption to... and I am sure those guys appreciated the opportunity.

I don't think scattering them amongst other troops would help... I suspect part of their success is not a death wish, but the streamlined command and simplified rules of war they follow with them being a PMC and not regular army.

Why are Wagner making public statements about ammo supplies?
Why are the MOD responding to it publicly?

This is normally sensitive data you don't talk to the media about, something is going on.

Because stuffing problems under the rug leads to inevitable defeat? Because the male public needs answers in case it gets mobilized? Because potbelly dinosaurs need accountability?

Biden is going all in. 

In Ukraine, children are attracted to spy on their own parents in order to report whether they watch Russian TV channels and whether they followed Putin's speech. In the photo, one of the questionnaires filled out by a student of the second grade of the school.

Why are Wagner making public statements about ammo supplies?
Why are the MOD responding to it publicly?

This is normally sensitive data you don't talk to the media about, something is going on.

Because this is politics, and now there is a desperate struggle for political capital, and, accordingly, for the distribution of awards for the victory over Ukraine. The old corrupt officials really want to appropriate all the glory and continue to fill their pockets. The new ones want to convert military achievements into political capital, and for this they desperately need publicity to gain public support.
I don't like any of the sides here. For Prigozhin, for example, the lives of soldiers mean nothing, since they practice executions for the slightest offense there. Moreover, according to Prigozhin himself, the problems with ammunition began AFTER his public criticism of the leadership of the Ministry of Defense. Up to that moment there were no problems with the supply. So all those who are dying now because of shell starvation are dying because Prigozhin has too long a tongue and an exorbitant ego. He made a frankly unsuccessful move, in a hurry to gain political capital, and now the guys who went to work in his PMCs are paying for it. Not commendable behavior as a leader, in my opinion.

Wagner is already/was present in many countries: CAR, Syria, Libya, Mozambique, etc.
Prigozhin might have some political ambitions, but more likely is that he works in undermining political opponents of his protectors higher up.
With that said, Shoigu's daughter spending New Year in Dubai is his own goal. On top of it, Shoigu's daughter works for government structures herself, which looks bad enough in itself.
Not to talk about obvious problems that MoD and Army have.