Crimea and ex-Ukrainian/Black Sea regions integration into RF

As I know, Crimea have enough water for farming autochtone traditional crops. Water from canal was mostly used for rice producing, which need a lot of water in some period of time. Crimea now doesn't produce rice and transitioning to more traditional crops as well as to fruit plantages and vineyards will reduce their need for water from canal and their own water sources will be enough.

PapaDragon wrote:

medo wrote:As I know, Crimea have enough water for farming autochtone traditional crops. Water from canal was mostly used for rice producing, which need a lot of water in some period of time. Crimea now doesn't produce rice and transitioning to more traditional crops as well as to fruit plantages and vineyards will reduce their need for water from canal and their own water sources will be enough.

I am quite surprised that they were bothering with rice in the first place.

Just buy that stuff from Asia (they are drowning in it already) and focus on crops with actual profit margin.

Yeah, rice plantations in semi-arid Crimea are rather idiotic. Keep the production to the wet tropics where it belongs.

kvs wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

medo wrote:As I know, Crimea have enough water for farming autochtone traditional crops. Water from canal was mostly used for rice producing, which need a lot of water in some period of time. Crimea now doesn't produce rice and transitioning to more traditional crops as well as to fruit plantages and vineyards will reduce their need for water from canal and their own water sources will be enough.

I am quite surprised that they were bothering with rice in the first place.

Just buy that stuff from Asia (they are drowning in it already) and focus on crops with actual profit margin.

Yeah, rice plantations in semi-arid Crimea are rather idiotic.   Keep the production to the wet tropics where it belongs.

This was typical of Soviet-era grandiose agriculture plans that ended in failure, like Khrushchev obsession with maize, or cotton plantations in Central Asia that also needed intensive irrigation (and one of the causes of shrinkage of lake Aral).

Svyatoslavich wrote:

kvs wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

medo wrote:As I know, Crimea have enough water for farming autochtone traditional crops. Water from canal was mostly used for rice producing, which need a lot of water in some period of time. Crimea now doesn't produce rice and transitioning to more traditional crops as well as to fruit plantages and vineyards will reduce their need for water from canal and their own water sources will be enough.

I am quite surprised that they were bothering with rice in the first place.

Just buy that stuff from Asia (they are drowning in it already) and focus on crops with actual profit margin.

Yeah, rice plantations in semi-arid Crimea are rather idiotic.   Keep the production to the wet tropics where it belongs.

This was typical of Soviet-era grandiose agriculture plans that ended in failure, like Khrushchev obsession with maize, or cotton plantations in Central Asia that also needed intensive irrigation (and one of the causes of shrinkage of lake Aral).

Corn is a very water hungry plant. Soviet agricultural engineering was obviously based on ignorance.

"Sila yest, uma ne nada".

https://ria.ru/economy/20170710/1498213204.html

So as a note, Siemens didn't send those turbines. Partially made ones from unknown source were transferred to Russia, upgraded and parts added by Russian companies, then placed in Crimea.

miketheterrible wrote:https://ria.ru/economy/20170710/1498213204.html

So as a note, Siemens didn't send those turbines. Partially made ones from unknown source were transferred to Russia, upgraded and parts added by Russian companies, then placed in Crimea.

Thank you for the link.

Poor little Siemens is safe and secure from the mighty sanctions.

This forum board underscores how little intellectual credit Russians are given for coming up with innovative solutions. This
sort of underestimation has f*cked up all the previous invaders.

kvs wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:https://ria.ru/economy/20170710/1498213204.html

So as a note, Siemens didn't send those turbines. Partially made ones from unknown source were transferred to Russia, upgraded and parts added by Russian companies, then placed in Crimea.

Thank you for the link.

Poor little Siemens is safe and secure from the mighty sanctions.

This forum board underscores how little intellectual credit Russians are given for coming up with innovative solutions.    This
sort of underestimation has f*cked up all the previous invaders.

Siemens are claiming they will sue but they will have to prove it first. They are simply going by media sensationalism of course. I hope they do so Russia counter sues for not getting the product they paid for.

miketheterrible wrote:

kvs wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:https://ria.ru/economy/20170710/1498213204.html

So as a note, Siemens didn't send those turbines. Partially made ones from unknown source were transferred to Russia, upgraded and parts added by Russian companies, then placed in Crimea.

Thank you for the link.

Poor little Siemens is safe and secure from the mighty sanctions.

This forum board underscores how little intellectual credit Russians are given for coming up with innovative solutions.    This
sort of underestimation has f*cked up all the previous invaders.

Siemens are claiming they will sue but they will have to prove it first.  They are simply going by media sensationalism of course.  I hope they do so Russia counter sues for not getting the product they paid for.

I think that they will have quite easy job to prove that their turbines are delivered to Crimea. Sanctions are vis majeur so you cannot isse counter claim.

marat wrote:That is great thank you Auslander.

I now that i am borring but do you have any info regarding new solar plants in Crimea, iirc several of those plants were planed as well.

And what is situation regarding watter supply? As far as i know there is enought watter for drinkig and fore household usage but is there any project to provide supply for farming. I think that watter will be hardes think to make Crima self-sufficient.

I know of two solar power systems built in Krim, one north of Yevpatorya on the west coast and one on the north side of our harbor. The Yevpatorya unit was disassembled and taken to orcland in late February '14. The one in Sevastopol is still in place but I do not think it is in operation. Both were built in '13, by whom I do not know with certainty.

Water is not a problem. The reservoir for Sevastopol is south of the city in the foothills and is quite large, adequate for use as long as they hold the local population below half a million.
I know there are other reservoirs in Krimu but I don't know where. I do not know of special plans for farming water supply but I do know that for current agricultural work few, if any, of the crops require irrigation although the massive hot houses in certain areas to. I have heard of no complaints of crops being lost due to lack of water.

The canal that the orcs blocked drew water from the Dnepr in orcland and was instrumental, and built for, taking enough of the spring melt run off to avoid flooding along that river. I do not know if floods were a problem for the orcs this spring but they were last spring. It was this canal that allowed the farming of rice in the northeast end of Krimu.

medo wrote:

Turbines in Crimea.

I am not sure that shot is in Sevastopol. If it is, and there's only one place it could be, then for whatever reason the units were sent by ship and as such would have been much better unloaded at the docks closer to Inkerman. If they are at the one location possible from the photo then they have to be trucked or railed all the way across Sevastopol to Yalta Ring on the southeast side at Balaklava and then north from the ring half way to Inkerman, which ain't far from the ring.

Of course if level headed thinking had prevailed, and it may have, the units should have been sent by rail from Kerch to the Inkerman Yards and from there a short hop on the same cars to the TPP, which is on the main line going to south side. They have two cranes of more than adequate capacity at the construction site to unload and position the units in the construct of the TPP.

http://www.intellinews.com/siemens-considers-quitting-russia-exec-of-partner-power-machines-questioned-for-treason-125408/

The CEO of German technology major Siemens Joe Kaeser is considering pulling out of projects and joint ventures in Russia, Russian media reported on July 14 citing a report by German magazine Wirtschafts Woche.

....

Meanwhile the general manager of another Siemens partner in Russia Power Machines (Silovie Mashini) Roman Filippov was detained and questioned by Russian law enforcement authorities on July 13, as reported by Interfax.

Unnamed sources claimed Filippov was detained under treason accusations, which was also confirmed by sources of the RBC business portal. At the same time it remained unclear how the accusations are related to the reports of Siemens turbines finding their way into Crimea.

The high speed train programs in Russia were going to be a huge revenue gain for Siemens.  Glad they are going to lose out on it.  And as for Power Machine's CEO getting arrested for treason, that one is interesting.  I guess he was working as an agent for the Germans.  Power Machines is Russia's largest manufacturer of energy systems.  Their products can be found in many western countries.

Note* Siemens owns a 5% stake in Power Machines - very tiny. Easily to be sold to some other group. I imagine there would be plenty of other businesses interested since Power Machine's Turbines are heavily used in Asia.

If Siemens pulls out, they will be losing a huge market. Massive market actually since Power Machines has a somewhat large monopoly on such turbines. But I guess they are more afraid of losing their business in the west than in Russia which is understandable. But this will end up as no problem for Power Machines as what they have already built is theirs.

marat wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:

kvs wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:https://ria.ru/economy/20170710/1498213204.html

So as a note, Siemens didn't send those turbines. Partially made ones from unknown source were transferred to Russia, upgraded and parts added by Russian companies, then placed in Crimea.

Thank you for the link.

Poor little Siemens is safe and secure from the mighty sanctions.

This forum board underscores how little intellectual credit Russians are given for coming up with innovative solutions.    This
sort of underestimation has f*cked up all the previous invaders.

Siemens are claiming they will sue but they will have to prove it first.  They are simply going by media sensationalism of course.  I hope they do so Russia counter sues for not getting the product they paid for.

I think that they will have quite easy job to prove that their turbines are delivered to Crimea. Sanctions are vis majeur so you cannot isse counter claim.

BS. Siemens cannot exert control over production in Russia. Any technology it transferred to Russian companies in the past does not enable
some sanctions imposed later to impose a control regime on Russian companies. Maybe if the production facilities were run 100% by Siemens
then there would be something for the sanctions regime to latch onto.

This is all about Siemens sucking Uncle Scumbag's cock and acting "tough on Russia" to prove its fealty. It has nothing to do with any
legal case against Russia. The analogy would be Ford or GM suing their customers for some end use of the cars they bought that
was prohibited after the sale of the cars. Clearly Ford or GM have no legal case or standing. It would have to be the higher authority
that prohibited the end use to impose legal sanction. In the case of Russia and NATO dirtbags there is no higher authority. NATO
cannot regulate inside Russia's borders. NATO dirtbags also have no case against Siemens as well since Siemens did nothing after the sanctions
were imposed. But being a pack of hyenas, Siemens needs to appease its masters.

I am seeing the same "Russia can't make turbines, even though the technology transfer occurred a long time ago and turbines were locally
produced" theme as elsewhere. Cut the retarded propaganda drivel. These turbines are not brand new products from Germany. They
were manufactured in Russia with about 30% from Russian designed components that could not be sourced from Siemens.
So NATO and its fanbois can bugger off.

kvs wrote:

marat wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:

kvs wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:https://ria.ru/economy/20170710/1498213204.html

So as a note, Siemens didn't send those turbines. Partially made ones from unknown source were transferred to Russia, upgraded and parts added by Russian companies, then placed in Crimea.

Thank you for the link.

Poor little Siemens is safe and secure from the mighty sanctions.

This forum board underscores how little intellectual credit Russians are given for coming up with innovative solutions.    This
sort of underestimation has f*cked up all the previous invaders.

Siemens are claiming they will sue but they will have to prove it first.  They are simply going by media sensationalism of course.  I hope they do so Russia counter sues for not getting the product they paid for.

I think that they will have quite easy job to prove that their turbines are delivered to Crimea. Sanctions are vis majeur so you cannot isse counter claim.

BS.  Siemens cannot exert control over production in Russia.   Any technology it transferred to Russian companies in the past does not enable
some sanctions imposed later to impose a control regime on Russian companies.     Maybe if the production facilities were run 100% by Siemens
then there would be something for the sanctions regime to latch onto.    

This is all about Siemens sucking Uncle Scumbag's cock and acting "tough on Russia" to prove its fealty.   It has nothing to do with any
legal case against Russia.    The analogy would be Ford or GM suing their customers for some end use of the cars they bought that
was prohibited after the sale of the cars.   Clearly Ford or GM have no legal case or standing.   It would have to be the higher authority
that prohibited the end use to impose legal sanction.    In the case of Russia and NATO dirtbags there is no higher authority.   NATO
cannot regulate inside Russia's borders.   NATO dirtbags also have no case against Siemens as well since Siemens did nothing after the sanctions
were imposed.   But being a pack of hyenas, Siemens needs to appease its masters.  

I am seeing the same "Russia can't make turbines, even though the technology transfer occurred a long time ago and turbines were locally
produced" theme as elsewhere.    Cut the retarded propaganda drivel.   These turbines are not brand new products from Germany.  They
were manufactured in Russia with about 30% from Russian designed components that could not be sourced from Siemens.  
So NATO and its fanbois can bugger off.

Especially since Renova group, which isn't part of Power Machines, owns the Ural turbine plant which produces competitive to Siemens in Turbines.

Tempest in a teacup fueled by West media. A source I can not ID but who is reliable (sound familiar?) told me the units coming to Sevastopol were made in Russia. ANY units made at the St. Petersburg plant were and are made in Russia and the St. Pete plant is not the only plant in Russia that makes such units. I don't know where our units were built and/or 'modernized' and such, the fact remains they will be installed and the TPP will be operational as will be the one in Simferopol.

If Siemens don't like it then let Siemens flutter on down here and try to take them away from us. Hope they pack their lunch.

Methinks Siemens would make a nice lunch for those pups of yours.

franco wrote:Methinks Siemens would make a nice lunch for those pups of yours.

Aleksandr does love his meat as does our guest, Deesik, who while not quite as big as Alik can pack away the food. I think he's put on two kilos since he arrived and some good German wurst will do him well. A little choice German fresh meat will do all of them good. Even old Melik will enjoy a tasty scrap or three.

This is getting messy as Siemens tries to deflect the 'sanctions buster' blame. Very good history at https://twitter.com/jc_stubbs/status/886862359326863362

BERLIN/FRANKFURT (Reuters) - Germany's Siemens (SIEGn.DE) said on Monday at least two of its gas turbines had been moved "against its will" from Russia to Crimea, a region subject to sanctions barring EU firms providing it with energy technology.

The European Union imposed the sanctions after Russia's 2014 annexation of the peninsula from Ukraine, a move it sees as breaking international law.

Siemens, which has repeatedly insisted it was not aware the turbines were destined for Crimea, said it would press criminal charges against those responsible for diverting the turbines. "Siemens has received information from reliable sources that at least two of the four gas turbine sets, which were delivered for the project in Taman, Southern Russia, have been moved to Crimea against our will," it said in a statement. "Over the last few months, our customer has confirmed to us numerous times in writing that a delivery to Crimea would not occur. As a consequence, Siemens will initiate criminal charges against the responsible individuals."

Reuters reported last week that the Siemens turbines had been delivered to Crimea.

A Siemens spokesman said the customer in question was Russian state-owned engineering company Technopromexport, which bought the turbines from Siemens. Technopromexport had no immediate comment, and Russia's energy ministry declined to comment.

PapaDragon wrote:
I assume Siemens received money for those turbines hence they can no longer claim any ownership of them

It's like selling a car and then wanting to decide where new owner can drive his car

They can either have money or turbines but they can't have both

Yes that is the real world but Siemens is trying to protect itself from blowback in the crazy world of sanctions, where, like in military sales, the end user certificate is always accurate and adhered to.

I suspect opening his mouth when he shouldn't have was one reason why that guy got fired last week.

They may come to some settlement and all will be forgotten. Siemens would be losing billions if they back out. This may be an attempt to save face while still doing work.

Hmmm. What has suddenly disappeared from western news in the last couple days? Like I said, tempest in a teacup. With the current 'big news' in US this news item may disappear completely. Seems the perpetrator of the maidan mess plus Syria has brain cancer.