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Abortion should be illegal anyways.
I support the death penalty so I think abortion should be legal right up to retirement age...
I agree it is not a real deterrent, but it sure stops re-offending.
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GarryB- Posts : 40548
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I support the death penalty so I think abortion should be legal right up to retirement age...
I agree it is not a real deterrent, but it sure stops re-offending.
Hannibal Barca- Posts : 1457
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Gross
ExBeobachter1987- Posts : 441
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Location : Western Eurasia
Werewolf wrote:Abortion should be illegal anyways.
Bad idea. Societies where abortion is illegal are more violent and less peaceful.
Werewolf- Posts : 5928
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ExBeobachter1987 wrote:Werewolf wrote:Abortion should be illegal anyways.
Bad idea. Societies where abortion is illegal are more violent and less peaceful.
Ohh yes, because not killing innocent babies makes a society violent so that is the reason why americans have such a violent society, because they can not kill innocent babies? Oh wait they can... That is by far the most stupid thing i've ever heared
Viktor- Posts : 5796
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Nice 
2014 Russia Population Grew by 275,000. 2015 Growth Depends on Economics
2014 Russia Population Grew by 275,000. 2015 Growth Depends on Economics
GarryB- Posts : 40548
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Location : New Zealand
Ohh yes, because not killing innocent babies makes a society violent so that is the reason why americans have such a violent society, because they can not kill innocent babies? Oh wait they can... That is by far the most stupid thing i've ever heared
No... I don't think it would be that... more like any government that thinks it can tell women they have to have a child no matter what after the process to create one has started sounds like the sort of government that will tell people to do all sorts of other things that are really more morality motivated than logically motivated.
Also we are talking about abortion, not killing babies.
A fetus is a potential baby... and billions of unfertilised eggs go wasted every year with potential children... the reality is that the Earth could not possibly support the numbers of children humans are able to create. If some mother thinks she is not ready to be a mother, or can't afford a child, or there are issues with how the pregnancy came about, who are you or I to say she must have the child?
magnumcromagnon- Posts : 8138
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Russia ranks #1 in the world in upward mobility for women in the workplace, that constitutes 40% of the business leadership roles in Russia, and Russia is 6 places ahead of France, 8 places ahead of Sweden, 24 places ahead of the United States, and 34 places ahead of Japan:
http://rt.com/business/237989-russian-women-top-positions
http://www.grantthornton.global/en/press/press-releases-2015/women-in-business-2015/
http://rt.com/business/237989-russian-women-top-positions
http://www.grantthornton.global/en/press/press-releases-2015/women-in-business-2015/
George1- Posts : 18523
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Too high percentage in women, in former eastern European countries. Does this has an explanation?
Walther von Oldenburg- Posts : 1725
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Maybe communist gender egalitarianism that outlived communism?George1 wrote:Too high percentage in women, in former eastern European countries. Does this has an explanation?
NationalRus- Posts : 610
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George1 wrote:Too high percentage in women, in former eastern European countries. Does this has an explanation?
becouse we have no feminism since we never needed it becouse woman were equivalent to men and HAD to contribute ther part to our nation in war in the fabrics etc. etc.
flamming_python- Posts : 9547
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George1 wrote:Too high percentage in women, in former eastern European countries. Does this has an explanation?
Not enough men for the roles.
OminousSpudd- Posts : 942
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Location : New Zealand
GarryB wrote:Ohh yes, because not killing innocent babies makes a society violent so that is the reason why americans have such a violent society, because they can not kill innocent babies? Oh wait they can... That is by far the most stupid thing i've ever heared
No... I don't think it would be that... more like any government that thinks it can tell women they have to have a child no matter what after the process to create one has started sounds like the sort of government that will tell people to do all sorts of other things that are really more morality motivated than logically motivated.
Also we are talking about abortion, not killing babies.
A fetus is a potential baby... and billions of unfertilised eggs go wasted every year with potential children... the reality is that the Earth could not possibly support the numbers of children humans are able to create. If some mother thinks she is not ready to be a mother, or can't afford a child, or there are issues with how the pregnancy came about, who are you or I to say she must have the child?
Depends on your perception of what is a human life and what is simply a cell. If you're of the belief that at the moment of conception another human being (emphasise on the "being") is created then abortion instantaneously becomes a heinous crime. Is it really worth the risk? What's wrong with adoption?
Reality is, you're taking a situation that was completely out of the conceived child's control, and simply killing it. It doesn't matter if it was conceived by rape, incest, or prostitution. That is not the child's responsibility.
The entire argument is based on whether or not a foetus is a child, or rather when a foetus becomes a child. The problem is that the science behind the push for justifying abortion is/was incredibly corrupt in most countries, and only seemed to reflect a government's agenda.
Abortion should only be considered if the child is a threat to the mother's life, and even then, I do not think it is justified. You are simply exchanging one innocent's life for another. Besides, if the money that has been spent in the research and implementation of abortion was actually dedicated to saving a mother's life in a complicated birthing, that aforementioned problem would likely be null and void.
That's simply not true and there is a huge argument against that idea. Even if it was, is limiting our potential by actively stopping our growth the way to deal with it? No, it's only delaying the problem.the reality is that the Earth could not possibly support the numbers of children humans are able to create.
GarryB- Posts : 40548
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Join date : 2010-03-30
Location : New Zealand
I think there are already about 2 billion too many people on this planet already... look at the pollution problems in the oceans.
No one has the right to live and for every one person that does live there are billions of eggs that never get fertilised.
And you ask a good question... what is wrong with adoption... why are there orphanages... why all all those precious lives lapped up and taken care of by loving couples?
Life isn't that nice and perfect sadly... not matter what hollywood would like to claim.
No... conception is not the childs responsibility... that goes with the mother and father of the child.
The so called child has no responsibilities or rights.
We are talking about the mothers body... I don't think anyone has the right to tell her what she can or cannot do.
How many children have you adopted?
You are not one of those people who demand longer prison sentences but will protest if anyone suggests building a prison any where near your house?
WTF?
Look at all the plastic crap washing ashore in islands in the north pacific... it has become the toilet of the US and Asia... our appetite for oil... and building roads and houses where other animal types used to call home... no wonder so many animal and plant species are dying out... with more and more humans they don't have enough space to survive.
Given the choice between other animals or a few billion more humans...
Which made the stupid and still common stereotypes of women in the west unable to take hold...
No one has the right to live and for every one person that does live there are billions of eggs that never get fertilised.
And you ask a good question... what is wrong with adoption... why are there orphanages... why all all those precious lives lapped up and taken care of by loving couples?
Life isn't that nice and perfect sadly... not matter what hollywood would like to claim.
No... conception is not the childs responsibility... that goes with the mother and father of the child.
The so called child has no responsibilities or rights.
We are talking about the mothers body... I don't think anyone has the right to tell her what she can or cannot do.
How many children have you adopted?
You are not one of those people who demand longer prison sentences but will protest if anyone suggests building a prison any where near your house?
That's simply not true and there is a huge argument against that idea. Even if it was, is limiting our potential by actively stopping our growth the way to deal with it? No, it's only delaying the problem.
WTF?
Look at all the plastic crap washing ashore in islands in the north pacific... it has become the toilet of the US and Asia... our appetite for oil... and building roads and houses where other animal types used to call home... no wonder so many animal and plant species are dying out... with more and more humans they don't have enough space to survive.
Given the choice between other animals or a few billion more humans...
Not enough men for the roles.
Which made the stupid and still common stereotypes of women in the west unable to take hold...
Cyberspec- Posts : 2904
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GarryB wrote:Given the choice between other animals or a few billion more humans...
My thoughts exactly...
However, I don't think you can argue that overpopulation is a Russian problem.
magnumcromagnon wrote:Russia ranks #1 in the world in upward mobility for women in the workplace, that constitutes 40% of the business leadership roles in Russia, and Russia is 6 places ahead of France, 8 places ahead of Sweden, 24 places ahead of the United States, and 34 places ahead of Japan:
Ironic considering that one of the propaganda charges against Russia is that women don't have enough rights/opportunities.
collegeboy16- Posts : 1135
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could always spin it the other way- one of the , if not the biggest factor for the success of the invading mongol horde is that back home the women run things, leaving the men free to do all the pillage and burn, and rape and enslave and kill stuff. then point how much of russian men are employed in military/paramilitary after mentioning the fact.Cyberspec wrote:magnumcromagnon wrote:Russia ranks #1 in the world in upward mobility for women in the workplace, that constitutes 40% of the business leadership roles in Russia, and Russia is 6 places ahead of France, 8 places ahead of Sweden, 24 places ahead of the United States, and 34 places ahead of Japan:
Ironic considering that one of the propaganda charges against Russia is that women don't have enough rights/opportunities.
Werewolf- Posts : 5928
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Join date : 2012-10-24
I can not aggree at all and i am disgust by even this fraud and flawed argumentation. It is not a womens body, genetically and factually it is not a womens body but a new living being, even. Women have dozens of options, condoms, pill, spiral, diafragma etc pp, what kind of society is it where a mother can declare a unborn child to no living being?
I have a question if abortion is no problem and a child is only a child as soon it sees the light of the world, what i will get senteced with when i punch a women in the stumach and she loses the baby?
Will i get just fined for violance and hurting her or will i get jailed for murdering an unborn child?
It is absolutley disgusting to see todays society of degenerated cunts, who post even their abortions and hype it like they won a marathon or something, it is inhumane and disgusting how this bullshit was indoctrinated into a mindset where a living being, factually living child whos heart starts beating at 5-6 week and abortion is legalized up to 15 week. After 9th week of pregnancy the child will be cut into pieces in the abortion without anestetics for the child, what a great thing to give a cunt of mother the choice to murder cruelly and coldblooded her child, great society we live in.
Here a little video how abortion is done at living child.
Graphic for everyone to be warned.
http://www.dnatube.com/video/9141/Surgical-Abortion-done-to-remove-an-embryo-from-uterus
I have a question if abortion is no problem and a child is only a child as soon it sees the light of the world, what i will get senteced with when i punch a women in the stumach and she loses the baby?
Will i get just fined for violance and hurting her or will i get jailed for murdering an unborn child?
It is absolutley disgusting to see todays society of degenerated cunts, who post even their abortions and hype it like they won a marathon or something, it is inhumane and disgusting how this bullshit was indoctrinated into a mindset where a living being, factually living child whos heart starts beating at 5-6 week and abortion is legalized up to 15 week. After 9th week of pregnancy the child will be cut into pieces in the abortion without anestetics for the child, what a great thing to give a cunt of mother the choice to murder cruelly and coldblooded her child, great society we live in.
Here a little video how abortion is done at living child.
Graphic for everyone to be warned.
http://www.dnatube.com/video/9141/Surgical-Abortion-done-to-remove-an-embryo-from-uterus
max steel- Posts : 2930
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RUSSIAN POPULATION IS NOT DYING . IT'S A MYTH :
http://www.forbes.com/sites/markadomanis/2013/02/04/five-myths-about-russia/
Russia's Baby Boom. Fertility Rate Far Higher Than in EU, Rising Quickly. : http://russia-insider.com/en/politics_opinion_society/2014/10/27/03-27-22pm/russias_baby_boom_fertility_rate_far_higher_eu_rising
Russia's Birth Rate Is Now Higher Than The United States' : http://www.forbes.com/sites/markadomanis/2013/07/25/dying-russias-birth-rate-is-now-higher-than-the-united-states/
http://www.forbes.com/sites/markadomanis/2013/02/04/five-myths-about-russia/
Russia's Baby Boom. Fertility Rate Far Higher Than in EU, Rising Quickly. : http://russia-insider.com/en/politics_opinion_society/2014/10/27/03-27-22pm/russias_baby_boom_fertility_rate_far_higher_eu_rising
Russia's Birth Rate Is Now Higher Than The United States' : http://www.forbes.com/sites/markadomanis/2013/07/25/dying-russias-birth-rate-is-now-higher-than-the-united-states/
OminousSpudd- Posts : 942
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I actually have an adopted brother Garry. Yes, it's a hard road (he has two sisters, each with different families), but I shudder to think of his precious life simply cut short in the womb and he is/was by far worth the effort to raise. No, life isn't Hollywood, and we should damn well man up and accept what life is throwing at us, go for that adoption, don't abort that child. Killing the child is a coward's way out, especially when there are so many other alternatives (certainly in most Western countries anyway) in today's world.
I don't have an answer to our increasing detriment on our surrounding environment, but simply murdering a child in the womb is NOT the answer. And no, unfertilised eggs are not children, how can they be? They do not actively develop, with the end result being a fully fledged human.
At the moment of conception another human enters our world. Would you kill a child because it hasn't reached adulthood and therefore is not a true human?
Anyway, food for thought. I wasn't meaning to get in a blown up argument that has been fought in too many places already. This is a military forum after all and I'd rather focus on the areas we do agree on, which is why I joined anyway. Respect to you Garry and your opinion.
(This was from my phone, so please excuse any typoes, poor sentence structure etc.)
I don't have an answer to our increasing detriment on our surrounding environment, but simply murdering a child in the womb is NOT the answer. And no, unfertilised eggs are not children, how can they be? They do not actively develop, with the end result being a fully fledged human.
At the moment of conception another human enters our world. Would you kill a child because it hasn't reached adulthood and therefore is not a true human?
Anyway, food for thought. I wasn't meaning to get in a blown up argument that has been fought in too many places already. This is a military forum after all and I'd rather focus on the areas we do agree on, which is why I joined anyway. Respect to you Garry and your opinion.
(This was from my phone, so please excuse any typoes, poor sentence structure etc.)
GarryB- Posts : 40548
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However, I don't think you can argue that overpopulation is a Russian problem.
It is a problem for all humans.
Right now we live in a very small range of altitudes on a rock in space... go 5,000m up and we don't survive well... go 5m underwater and surviving is difficult too.
Within that 5,050m range is where we live and then 2/3rds of the planet is covered in water... the extreme north and south is too harsh... though most of the extreme south is water anyway.
There are new islands being created every day by underwater volcanoes but no where near enough to support a growing human population and a competing natural population of animals.
Sure this planet could take 50 billion humans, but that starts covering arable land with houses and buildings... some things got to give and that means nature.
When all the other animal species have gone what do we eat? ...or should I say who do we eat?
The number of new substances and cures and beneficial things we have learned from plants and animals is enormous, yet we are wiping out plant and animal species faster than we can record their existence and collect DNA samples.
Women have dozens of options, condoms, pill, spiral, diafragma etc pp, what kind of society is it where a mother can declare a unborn child to no living being?
People make mistakes. None of those mentioned are 100% reliable.
Why don't you argue against cancer treatment... surely cancer cells have the right to exist if a fertilised egg is a human being.
Besides it doesn't matter what you or I think if that mother wants to get rid of the child i am sure she will find a way.
what i will get senteced with when i punch a women in the stumach and she loses the baby?
You would be sentenced to death for performing abortions without a licence... can't let just any idiot do that sort of thing...
Will i get just fined for violance and hurting her or will i get jailed for murdering an unborn child?
You will get locked in a room bound and gagged to a chair while the father of the child shows you the depths of his disappointment as your actions to his partner.
great society we live in.
Life is a lottery.
I actually have an adopted brother Garry. Yes, it's a hard road (he has two sisters, each with different families), but I shudder to think of his precious life simply cut short in the womb and he is/was by far worth the effort to raise.
And that all worked out fine, but what about all the aborted kids that never were because they were aborted or died of natural causes. A lot of them might have been nice people too, but a certain percentage would have been serial killers, or child molesters and will blame it on their upbringing because they were poor, or their mother didn't love them enough.
The sad thing is that human beings get the equipment to reproduce way before they get the maturity to make sensible decisions about being parents. Some parents never get it right and should never be allowed to reproduce.
The point that I am making is that it is not up to the government or society to make that decision for someone.
Look at how ape shit the west goes over Chinas one child policy.
What happens in 100 years time when resources are not so easy to get and companies like Monsanto have a monopoly on food crops... GM food doesn't grow like normal food... it doesn't produce seed so after you harvest your crop you need to get more seed from Monsanto to keep growing the crop... what happens if the US government decides to impose sanctions on say India and all of Indias crops are GM... no seed = no crops which means 5 billion people with no way of producing food... pretty bleak future you want all these extra children to grow up in...
No, life isn't Hollywood, and we should damn well man up and accept what life is throwing at us, go for that adoption, don't abort that child. Killing the child is a coward's way out, especially when there are so many other alternatives (certainly in most Western countries anyway) in today's world.
By the time abortion becomes an option the other solutions are already too late... except adoption... and passing on your problem to someone else is a pretty selfish solution too.
Would you kill a child because it hasn't reached adulthood and therefore is not a true human?
WTF are you talking about... a child is a human child... are you suggesting the instant an egg is fertillised it becomes a human being?
This is a military forum after all and I'd rather focus on the areas we do agree on, which is why I joined anyway. Respect to you Garry and your opinion.
Quite true... it is a military forum, but it is also a moral dilemma that wont be solved here and now. Though it is a relevant topic when talking about population.
Thank you for being civil and respectful about this, obviously these are very serious issues I don't take lightly.
Doctors deal with life and death all the time, but it is their advice that determines when it is reasonable to have the cut off date for abortions.
Get ten different people and you will get ten different opinions... even if they agree it might be for different reasons, and indeed there might be the same reason that they disagree.
One person might argue that if prostitution is legal then pregnancy while on the job should be treated differently.
Either way we have to live with the laws we have and I rather doubt Russia will ban abortion... one could argue that a good economy and better support services for women make abortion a less attractive/relevant/practical option. I do think the option should be there however.
The amusing thing is that to drive a car or fly a plane you need to be trained and licenced, yet if you are going to be a mother there is nothing...
I always thought my education at school was far too academic and did not include real life skills... perhaps everyone should learn to cook and look after themselves and work out how to pay their taxes and drive and to look after children. Some might say that is what parents should be teaching their children but who taught them... and for many kids are they still around? What happens when you have two sets of parents and they each say something different?
As lifeguards say... Life's a beach.
Werewolf- Posts : 5928
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eople make mistakes. None of those mentioned are 100% reliable.
Why don't you argue against cancer treatment... surely cancer cells have the right to exist if a fertilised egg is a human being.
Besides it doesn't matter what you or I think if that mother wants to get rid of the child i am sure she will find a way.
What a fallacy of argument, one is cancer an deformed way of growing cells that is clearly a disease, the other is intended for reproduction and everyone knows what sex is for...that bullshit coming out of you is kind of astonishing.
Most of this works 98-99% of the time, that does not back up the numbers of women getting an abortion, it also does not back up the numbers of alledgled rape victims, such thing is an absolute minority and that is called "Einzelschicksal" "individual fate", minorities can not be used as a generalisation for everything else. It is just sickening that abortion can be performed to a point where the baby is not a fertilized egg, but a living being, with brain activity and beating heart up the the 15th pregnancy week where it has all organs developed to a point where it is not deniable that this is not a baby.
You would be sentenced to death for performing abortions without a licence... can't let just any idiot do that sort of thing... Twisted Evil
That is a genuine question, if a baby in womb is not counted as human life, i could beat her into the stoomach so she losses the baby without getting jailed for murder.
So what is the point and where exactly is the point that it changes from "fertilized egg" to human being?
It should be all fine punching pregnant women in stoomach as long they are not over their 15th week because i don't comit murder and i don't abortion the baby, abortion is a surgical invasion of human body, a punch is cosmetical and physical action.
Our society is simply disgusting at what point a baby counts as a baby and before that it counts as "fertilized egg", so human form at 15th pregnancy week is still a "fertilized egg"...sure.
NationalRus- Posts : 610
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abortion is murder period, you murder people, after 3 weeks the heart starts beating, after that is cold blooded murder and should be handled as such
also the earth can support with food 100billion people with ease, we are farming like our ancestors, its the old way and its dying out, vertical farming has already begun, its up to a 6000times as effective all year long without chemicals needed so 100% biological clean thats the future
7billion people is nothing
also the earth can support with food 100billion people with ease, we are farming like our ancestors, its the old way and its dying out, vertical farming has already begun, its up to a 6000times as effective all year long without chemicals needed so 100% biological clean thats the future
7billion people is nothing
GarryB- Posts : 40548
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What a fallacy of argument, one is cancer an deformed way of growing cells that is clearly a disease, the other is intended for reproduction and everyone knows what sex is for...that bullshit coming out of you is kind of astonishing.
A cancer cell is a cell... a fertilised egg starts out as a single cell organism that starts to split and multiply... just like a cancer cell. The only practical difference is that cancerous cells are more parasitic, but can form structures and growths, whereas the fertilised egg has a plan and a set structure and growth path that leads to a human being.
Sex is for fun... and it is intentionally fun to ensure even the dumbest humans will at least try to reproduce when they get the opportunity.
for most people however they want the fun but generally don't want the burden of having children every time.
Most of this works 98-99% of the time, that does not back up the numbers of women getting an abortion, it also does not back up the numbers of alledgled rape victims, such thing is an absolute minority and that is called "Einzelschicksal" "individual fate", minorities can not be used as a generalisation for everything else.
Most contraception works when it is used... unfortunately in the heat of passion it is not always used... or in the case of backward arse about religions the use of contraception is not acceptable... which is hugely ironic because those same religions often frown on casual sex so if you are going to ignore the rules on having sex, you would think they would also be sensible enough to break the rules and do it safely....
It is just sickening that abortion can be performed to a point where the baby is not a fertilized egg, but a living being, with brain activity and beating heart up the the 15th pregnancy week where it has all organs developed to a point where it is not deniable that this is not a baby.
You have to draw a line somewhere... like I have said... I support the death penalty so abortion is not really that big a deal for me.
That is a genuine question, if a baby in womb is not counted as human life, i could beat her into the stoomach so she losses the baby without getting jailed for murder.
Have you ever heard of a case where a woman is injured and has a miscarriage and the person responsible is charged with murder or manslaughter?
I haven't.
So what is the point and where exactly is the point that it changes from "fertilized egg" to human being?
I have no idea. Not my decision.
It should be all fine punching pregnant women in stoomach as long they are not over their 15th week because i don't comit murder and i don't abortion the baby, abortion is a surgical invasion of human body, a punch is cosmetical and physical action.
And if abortions are illegal you might find plenty of women doing all sorts of things to miscarry... or angry boyfriends doing all sorts of things to evade becoming a father... BTW love how you compare a physical blow to the stomach of a pregnant woman with lipstick and mascara... and you think I am a monster...
Our society is simply disgusting at what point a baby counts as a baby and before that it counts as "fertilized egg", so human form at 15th pregnancy week is still a "fertilized egg"...sure.
Eggs don't turn into babies the instant they are fertilised... the process of cell division takes time and 4 or 8 or 16 human cells does not constitute a human being... otherwise hairdressers would all be arrested for murder when they cut someones hair.
When a doctor has to amputate a limb... is that murder too? Don't arms with gangrene have rights? The rights to kill the person they are attached to?
abortion is murder period, you murder people, after 3 weeks the heart starts beating, after that is cold blooded murder and should be handled as such
Yeah... give all doctors who perform abortions the death penalty... and then give the people who administer the lethal injection the death penalty... and disband the army because if murder of babies and baby killers is not ok then bombing foreigners can't be ok either... and then I shall take over your fucked up loopy society with a bread and butter knife you lefty weak willed pussies....
also the earth can support with food 100billion people with ease, we are farming like our ancestors, its the old way and its dying out, vertical farming has already begun, its up to a 6000times as effective all year long without chemicals needed so 100% biological clean thats the future
7billion people is nothing
Animals and plants are dying out in greater and greater numbers as room for them gets smaller and smaller. Finding fresh water is becoming harder and harder and enormous masses of plastic rubbish is floating around our oceans. People are already starving and when the oil runs out a lot of resources focussed on food crops now will be diverted to crops to produce oil for fuel.
China sees it... it is already buying up land in New Zealand and the Ukraine and other countries to ensure it can produce its own food... when will the west wake up and smell the rising water...
Kimppis- Posts : 617
Points : 617
Join date : 2014-12-23
So now the Finnish media is reporting about "Russia's terrible brain drain":
- One article states that over 200 000 people moved out the of the country last year. That is as many as during the late 90s/early 2000s. (Which is quite surprising actually, considering Russian population increased by almost 300K last year, if I'm not mistaken. And according to recent survey, the number of Russians wanting to move abroad has dropped to an all-time low.)
- One IT expert is interviewed. He says that the legal process (or whatever the term is) doesn't work at all (authorities' "meddling" with VK is used as an example) and that it's impossible to make an internationally succesful IT company in Russia (which seems to be factually incorrect, but whatever...), so he has to move to - you guessed it right - to the US.
- Brain drain strengthens authoritarianism in Russia, as qualified people move abroad and due to that the country is not changed from inside.
Thoughts?
- One article states that over 200 000 people moved out the of the country last year. That is as many as during the late 90s/early 2000s. (Which is quite surprising actually, considering Russian population increased by almost 300K last year, if I'm not mistaken. And according to recent survey, the number of Russians wanting to move abroad has dropped to an all-time low.)
- One IT expert is interviewed. He says that the legal process (or whatever the term is) doesn't work at all (authorities' "meddling" with VK is used as an example) and that it's impossible to make an internationally succesful IT company in Russia (which seems to be factually incorrect, but whatever...), so he has to move to - you guessed it right - to the US.
- Brain drain strengthens authoritarianism in Russia, as qualified people move abroad and due to that the country is not changed from inside.
Thoughts?
flamming_python- Posts : 9547
Points : 9605
Join date : 2012-01-30
Kimppis wrote:So now the Finnish media is reporting about "Russia's terrible brain drain":
- One article states that over 200 000 people moved out the of the country last year. That is as many as during the late 90s/early 2000s. (Which is quite surprising actually, considering Russian population increased by almost 300K last year, if I'm not mistaken. And according to recent survey, the number of Russians wanting to move abroad has dropped to an all-time low.)
They mostly got that from all the Uzbeks who have moved back to Uzbekistan last year due to tighter immigration regulations; same for other migrant workers.
Go check out which countries those 200,000 have moved to if you're curious. Hint: Europe/North America/Israel/Australasia make up a very small proportion of the total destinations.
- One IT expert is interviewed. He says that the legal process (or whatever the term is) doesn't work at all (authorities' "meddling" with VK is used as an example) and that it's impossible to make an internationally succesful IT company in Russia (which seems to be factually incorrect, but whatever...), so he has to move to - you guessed it right - to the US.
Nonsense. I work in this industry and I've noticed plenty of new startups recently.
Of course, everyone is entitled to their opinions.
- Brain drain strengthens authoritarianism in Russia, as qualified people move abroad and due to that the country is not changed from inside.
Thoughts?
Russia has the highest percentage of young people with tertiary education in the world (+53%); so I wouldn't worry about Russians getting dumber, and I also have seen no evidence to indicate significant levels of brain-drain, or its increase over the past year.
If anything it's a brain-recipient. Where do you think university-educated Central Asians, Ukrainians, Azeris, Armenians, Mongolians, etc... are all going?
They're either getting their education in Russia and many of them staying, or they finish their education in their home countries and then often migrate to better oppurtunities elsewhere - as they often don't know English well and EU regulations can be quite strict - most of the ones that do emigrate; come to Russia.
Ukrainians are a seperate case altogether in fact. Over the past year hundreds of thousands have moved to the country, among them many experienced specialists.
as qualified people move abroad and due to that the country is not changed from inside.
Country is not changing from the inside, so someone has to come and change it from the outside for the people's own good, amirite?
sepheronx- Posts : 8850
Points : 9110
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 35
Location : Canada
Kimppis wrote:So now the Finnish media is reporting about "Russia's terrible brain drain":
- One article states that over 200 000 people moved out the of the country last year. That is as many as during the late 90s/early 2000s. (Which is quite surprising actually, considering Russian population increased by almost 300K last year, if I'm not mistaken. And according to recent survey, the number of Russians wanting to move abroad has dropped to an all-time low.)
- One IT expert is interviewed. He says that the legal process (or whatever the term is) doesn't work at all (authorities' "meddling" with VK is used as an example) and that it's impossible to make an internationally succesful IT company in Russia (which seems to be factually incorrect, but whatever...), so he has to move to - you guessed it right - to the US.
- Brain drain strengthens authoritarianism in Russia, as qualified people move abroad and due to that the country is not changed from inside.
Thoughts?
My thought is for you people to start openly criticizing your media. You can start by throwing facts at them. Ryssia now has stricter immigration rules and many central asians left as they couldnt afford new rules and or pass the test. In January alone this year was over 200,000 people migrated to Russia, and whoever made that quote was more than likely paid. Flaming is in that field and if you find any other news site, IT field, Russia is third largest in the world. China, where it is harder to do business than in Russia is larger than Russia for IT.
You finns need to smarten up and get decent media cause your media sure sounds like cheap propaganda that would make anyone with half a brain think twice.
http://tass.ru/en/russia/770826
That is 270,000 migrants at beginning of the year.
http://russia-insider.com/en/politics_business_media_watch_society/2014/11/04/02-06-40pm/brain_drain_russia_bbc_gets_it_wrong
Maybe there needs to be proper Russian news in Finland for ill informed finns.