The Situation in the Ukraine. #14

flamming_python wrote:

Neutrality wrote:Asking again. Is there any confirmation on that American instructor defecting to the DNR?

Why don't you check out the photo and decide for yourself

max steel wrote:  What Saakashvili's Appointment as Governor of Odessa Means for Transnistria

..................................................

] The journalist argues that the appointment must instead be considered from a wider perspective: "The main explanation, in my view, is the fact that [the Moldovan breakaway region of] Transnistria is situated next to Odessa," Chalenko argues. "The events of the past months suggest that authorities in Ukraine and Moldova, with the support and guidance of the US, naturally, are preparing something bad for Transnistria

  http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150531/1022785389.html

Sputnik wrote:Ukraine's Economic Crisis Compounded by Demographic Catastrophe – Media
EUROPE 21:51 31.05.2015(updated 22:01 31.05.2015)

Ukraine's dramatically worsening demographic situation over the past year-and-a-half is set to result in a sharp future decline in the country's working-age population which, according to Forbes, will mean new economic crises, the consequences of which will be wrought by Western creditors.

In an article published Sunday, Forbes contributor Mark Adomanis noted that whatever the present status of Ukraine's economy, "its demographics are in a far more parlous state." Citing statistics from the State Statistics Service of Ukraine and Russia's Rosstat to obligatorily include Crimea and Sevastopol in the count, Adomanis notes that the country's natural population has declined by more than 250,000 between 2014 and 2015. The State Statistics Service's data shows that between January and March alone, deaths exceeded live births by over 62,000 people.

According to the journalist, Western leaders should care about Ukraine's population trends because "the West has set itself the task of underwriting Ukraine's reform efforts. All kinds of commitments (primarily rhetorical but some financial) are being made to assist Kiev's 'European choice,'" and, as a result, a much less populous Ukraine means that "right at this very moment permanent damage is being done to Ukraine's future output." Continue reading.

TASS wrote:Saakashvili cannot be extradited to Georgia after obtaining Ukrainian citizenship
World  May 31, 22:46 UTC+3

Under the Ukrainian constitution, a Ukrainian citizen cannot be extradited to another country


TBILISI, May 31. /TASS/. Georgia’s former President Mikhail Saakashvili cannot be extradited to Georgia after he has been granted Ukrainian citizenship, Georgian Minister of Justice Teya Tsulukiani said on Sunday.
"Under the Ukrainian constitution, a Ukrainian citizen cannot be extradited to another country. And now that Saakashvili has been granted Ukrainian citizenship, there are no legal chances to have him extradited to Georgia," she told journalists.
Saakashvili was Georgia’s President from January 2004 to November 2007 and from January 2008 to November 2013. He left his country in mid-November 2013, days before the expiration of his presidential term and the inauguration of President Georgy Margvelashvili on November 17, 2013. After his departure from Georgia, Saakashvili stayed in the United States and Ukraine. In recent months, he has been in Kiev working in the rank of the International Reform Council chief. On May 30, Ukraine’s President Pyotr Poroshenko appointed Saakashvili governor of the Odessa region and granted Ukrainian citizenship. Continue reading.

Sputnik wrote:CyberBerkut Warns US Plans Information Sabotage in Eastern Ukraine
EUROPE 09:14 31.05.2015(updated 09:47 31.05.2015)

The Ukrainian hacking group CyberBerkut warns that possible “acts of information sabotage” may be carried out by US Psychological Operations specialists against the self-proclaimed republics of Donbass and the Russian-speaking population of Ukraine and has called on Ukrainians to be vigilant.

The Ukrainian hacking group CyberBerkut has released a warning of “acts of information sabotage” being planned in Ukraine.

The group is monitoring the computer networks of the Ministry of Information Policy of Ukraine and says the US military's psychological warfare experts are set to arrive in the country within the next few days.
“Today we obtained information that the Head of the Department of Special Operations' Coordination Center of the United States European Command will arrive in Kiev from Stuttgart within the next few days with a group of the US military psychological warfare experts,” says the statement on the group’s website. Continue reading.

TheMedvedova wrote:NPT militia in Shyrokyno - Ukraine

Flagship Victory wrote:Is there a deadline to implement Minsk 2? Is there an election in Donbas this year?

Flagship Victory wrote:Interview with a Russian volunteer who fought in LPR. He says Russian deployed FSB to stop Russian volunteers from helping Donbas. Many volunteers were caught by FSB, but some did fortunately made it to Donbas where they helped the people fight against Maidan which is hell bent on destroying Russia.

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/interview-with-stas-shustrov-inzhener.html

sepheronx wrote:http://sputniknews.com/politics/20150601/1022789020.html

Didn't EU start it first?  What a joke.

Flagship Victory wrote:Interview with a Russian volunteer who fought in LPR. He says Russian deployed FSB to stop Russian volunteers from helping Donbas. Many volunteers were caught by FSB, but some did fortunately made it to Donbas where they helped the people fight against Maidan which is hell bent on destroying Russia.

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/interview-with-stas-shustrov-inzhener.html

Here is my conspiracy but I believe they have to do this under accordance of Minsk II agreement and that they are simply doing some of them while letting others slip (wouldn't be hard) and state "we tried".  That is about it.  The other benefit too is that Russia could try to stop people who they know are real dangerous to the average people and would be a problem in the conflict zone.

It isn't a secret that Russians operate there.  If it is true about our old friend from MP.NET anobalism joining, then there you go.

Flagship Victory wrote:Interview with a Russian volunteer who fought in LPR. He says Russian deployed FSB to stop Russian volunteers from helping Donbas. Many volunteers were caught by FSB, but some did fortunately made it to Donbas where they helped the people fight against Maidan which is hell bent on destroying Russia.

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/interview-with-stas-shustrov-inzhener.html

sepheronx wrote:

Flagship Victory wrote:Interview with a Russian volunteer who fought in LPR. He says Russian deployed FSB to stop Russian volunteers from helping Donbas. Many volunteers were caught by FSB, but some did fortunately made it to Donbas where they helped the people fight against Maidan which is hell bent on destroying Russia.

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/interview-with-stas-shustrov-inzhener.html

Here is my conspiracy but I believe they have to do this under accordance of Minsk II agreement and that they are simply doing some of them while letting others slip (wouldn't be hard) and state "we tried".  That is about it.  The other benefit too is that Russia could try to stop people who they know are real dangerous to the average people and would be a problem in the conflict zone.

Cowboy's daughter wrote:Ukrainian lawmaker no good can be expected from Saakashvili’s appointment
http://tass.ru/en/world/797830

Flagship Victory wrote:Maidan's biggest funder and backer IMF says Maidan's economy to fall 9% this year.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-32954874

Werewolf wrote:IMF is so obligated to the truth like they are obligated to actually help countries... they do the exact oppossite genocide by IMF austerity, stealing countries resources and infrastructure is sold to the West after the country fails to repay the debts and that is exactly how that works. That is modern genocide, reduction of population by bringing its economy down. With a fucked up economy, people get paid below minimum wages, so people can not and have no capital to raise a family that is exactly what happens all across EU and every other failed nation that has its 5th columnists seeking for IMF loans, that is a planned genocide.

Vann7 wrote:Busted! Ukrainian officers responsible for death of five civilians in Horlivka are identified!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=l7xh0fwCBR0

higurashihougi wrote:

Vann7 wrote:Busted! Ukrainian officers responsible for death of five civilians in Horlivka are identified!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=l7xh0fwCBR0

May I ask for a sub or rough translation of the clip ?

Al-Romo from themess wrote:Continuation from previous translation about prisoner exchange

Politics in prison

- Do you know how militiamen POWs are treated in Ukraine?

- They are treated horribly, but we seek no revenge. We just want them to understand that we are human beings and we want humane treatment. If they are sane, they will get it.

- You do not seek revenge just because you are against violence or because you want to be heard?

- Because we do not want to harm anyone! THEY MUST HEAR US, THEY CANNOT DO HARM TO US LIKE THEY DO NOW! Even animals do not do these things! True, some civilians arm themselves after they were captured by Ukrainians. We had a case when an influential criminal from Debaltsevo was taken in captivity after he was noticed evaluating damage that was caused to his home by shelling. He was thought to be separatist. Later they stuck him into exchange process as if he was one of militiamen. Indeed, once he was freed, he immediately joined militia ranks despite the main criminal principle - we are on our own, no politics in prison. However Ukraine has already brought politics over there. When courts convict militiamen to serve a term, they have them thrown to prison and ruthlessly abused by criminals.

- Why do other prisoners do that?

- They are prisoners, for what they are worth. Do not know what did they get from that. Although I can tell you about one other case. Few civilians were taken captive near Snezhnoe and kept in Kramatorsk airfield inside a grave pit with corpses. Later one of those boys was sent to prison in Poltava. Ukrainians presume it to be a fine educational work - to throw a boy inside a cell to criminals. This boy was severely beaten by convicts and they knocked all teeth of the other boy's mouth, Alexei Zhukov, who actually suffered from diabetes. As the result his blood sugar level raised and he started falling in coma. Luckily, an underboss found out about those boys and stopped bullying at once. He even made some convicts chew the food and feed it to Alexei. All kind of things happen these days.
Captivity at home

- I also was taken in captivity, it happened in July 2014 when I began to travel to Slavyansk relocating wounded and civilians who suffered heart attack or brain attack. I took everyone until ambulance was stuffed full. Then I started traveling to Snezhnoe and rode to Marinovka to take an Ukrainian soldier and bring him to Donetsk?

- Why did you decide to risk your life for an Ukrainian?

- I did not see any difference. We spent all that day evacuating wounded people from Snezhnoe and he was the last one who left. He must've been taken to hospital but occasionally we ran on Ukrainian block post. It was not supposed to be there. Ambulance car got under heavy fire, I still cannot comprehend how we could survive that. We hid in all holes we could find, don't know how we made it.

- Who was guarding that block post?

- Border guards I think.

- But Ukrainian border guards allegedly do not harm civilians?

- They didn't beat us. They were even in doubts on what to do with us? Like, should they just leave us be? When I left the car in my medical suit they started swearing:

- 'MEDICS!!!'
- 'Yes, we are medics?'

As if it wouldn't be strange if medics were not riding that ambulance. It was equipped with flashing lights and buzzers, they were able to see us from the distance. I think they shot at us because they got scared as if we were a sabotage-recon group. After long period of doubts they decided to send us to superiors, brought us to Uspenka and then to Sontsevo in Starobeshevo district where we were subjected to physical abuse. Finally we were taken to Kramatorsk airfield.

- What do you mean under "physical abuse"?

- They beat us with the butt stocks of their rifles, my shoulder still hurts. They took all our cloves, don't know why. They forced us to crawl on a ground from helicopter to a wall where they imitated execution by a firing squad.

- You were crawling?

- I did not, I was being lead down while my companions were forced to crawl with bags on their heads. Then we were beaten several times.

- What did you feel when you were naked? A shame?

- Felt nothing, I also had a bag on my head. I was completely devastated. Later I was asked if I was praying? I told them that I only asked Lord for help, nothing more. For some reasons or captors liked to do that. Of course I found it difficult to unclothe myself like that, but then I thought - 'If you like it, if you need it, then have you time'. Finally they gave or clothes back but did not take bags from our heads.
- That means you didn't see them?

- I did not. I only saw one's sneakers in Soltsevo and nothing more, only voices. Then we were brought to Izyum. We meet policemen there who were genuinely shocked - 'Why did they do that to doctors'? They gave us bread with tee and left in a cell. From there we were delivered to SBU in Kharkov. We spent great time waiting inside the car and started to talk with our custodians despite that they were ordered to keep silence. One of them said that he was born in Russia and he was among Berkut operatives during Maidan:

- 'You served in Berkut' Then why are you doing this?
- 'I am loyal to my oaths'.
- 'But to whom does your loyalty belongs to?'
- 'To the people'.
- 'But I am also part of the people! I am sitting right in front of you with my hands cuffed and with a bag on my head!'
- 'But you are a separatist!'
- 'Do you know why I am a separatist? Because when Maidan was jumping I was working on my job every day and every evening I ran to home, turned on a TV to find out what was happening. And they started to throw molotovs at you I joined the rally and shouted "Glory to Berkut"! I did not shout "I want to Russia"! We did not know any other way to help you. Now you must live with the consequences of your choice'!

- When others took me he shook my cuffed hand twice

- So that handshake is a valuable reminiscence for you?

- I'd rather have it valuable for him! He should think about that granting he is still alive! Russian ministry of foreign affairs sent a request to Kharkov SBU and got an answer that we were not in there. Because we had been arrested illegally, no records were made. Ukrainian cooked up a story that my fingerprints (that they had not taken) were found on four RPGs. However they we hear them talking - 'Those people are being searched'. It was such a relief and joy for us - to be searched. After that they stopped to beat us so openly. You know, my mother lives in Solntsevo. My home as just in 10 km from our prison.

A being without anything
- Thereafter we gave an amulet to one Ukrainian officer. I do not know if he is still alive, Starobeshevo became an extremely hot spot later.

- Why did you give him such gift?

- Because if not for him we would've been slaughtered. One UA unit was also stationed near us, all of them spoke Ukrainian with some sort of heavy western accent. When that officer went for dinner some soldiers came and started to beat us:

- 'You fascist, you came to OUR land!'
- 'My mom lives here! Where did YOU come from!!'

- Luckily officer came back, drove them away, put guards and forbade to talk to us. Who knows how this could've ended, they could've rape us or mutilate, no other options, they reeked from malice. All that took place from 23rd to 24th of June, just because they had a friendly fire accident in the night from 21st to 22nd. It occurred when most of their unit was stationed in Kashty, this settlement is not shown on any map but relatives still call us, their children were stationed there and are now missing. They were given food supplies by helicopters and one day they were shelled by someone unknown from Solntsevo. They responded and consequent fire duel was so intense that it left all land in between totally immolated, I touched it myself. Strawberry bushes were reduced to cinders.

- Why were they shooting at their comrades?

- Well, it is very common for them. At first it was accidental, fear has many eyes. First one fires, second one replies and all hell breaks loose. At that time 95th airmobile brigade suffered the same damage. Captors told us, I quote - 'We are going to give you to 95th. They are very angry now, they will finish you'. You asked if I remembered them, I did, one of them.

- From you words it seems that he was a devil in flesh

- He was very cruel and spoke 100% pure western Ukrainian. But when we were sitting in a car, one young guy (according to his voice) came to us and tried to give me a piece of a chocolate - 'Eat, eat' - he whispered, clearly afraid of being heard.

- Did you consider yourself a victim?

- I did.

- Did you consider yourself debased?

- I did. I was helpless, I was nothing, a being without anything.

Not an enemy any longer

- Do you regret about your actions?

- No. Of course not. I went to Severs to evacuate wounded from the hospital. Came but there was no electricity, all was dark in hospital. A nurse called, asked to pick up the wounded. But after we left, she called again and said that half an hour later a group of Nazis (soldiers of the National Guard.) came seeking the wounded. Wounded did not believe that anyone could come after them. And then, two months later I was called by the father of one of them and asked:

- 'Do you remember that one?'
- 'Yes, I do.'
- "He died in battle.'

- How can I regret of something? Yes, before all these events, I had a good job, a cat, a dog.

- Where are they now?

- For a long time my house was in the occupied territory. At 7th of August I drove home. I was there exactly for seven minutes. I met my mother. I petted the dog and the cat. And left. After that dogs refused to eat, later cat did the same. All of them perished. And I do not have now neither dogs nor cats ... We used to have a family dinner at seven o'clock with tablecloths and flowers. I did not know that I can sleep in tents and eat anything that falls in my mouth, live without money, don't use cosmetics. Don't use everything I was used to.'

- During the year we witnessed horrific events. Those that cannot occur even in the scariest horror movies. Why is this all happening?

- We live in Donbas, we are like microbes over here. Who need us? There are other forces involved, much greater forces. Everything happens when it should happen. I actually think now that the Soviet Union was actually good. People here do not need any Novorossiya and neither Russia. People want to come back to the USSR.

- To gain if not equality or justice but at least the idea of ​​them?

- I'm a birth attendant. I've been delivering babies since 1985. I remember a lot of bad things that we've learned after the collapse of the Soviet Union. I've delivered many, many births. Time has passed and I started delivering births from those women who were delivered by myself years before.

- And what do you feel when you are now picking up the pieces of those who may've have delivered by yourself?

- I saw many dead people ... Even when I see a stranger, it's hard ... We had a case. I was called by a mother of a soldier, Haritonyuk . She couldn't find her son. After two or three days, I went to Logvinovo and found a wrecked tank. Boy from militia showed me the burial. He buried an Ukrainian soldier in a shell hole. And on the label was written 'Haritonyuk.'

- 'Oh, his mom was looking for him.
- 'And how old was he?'
- 'I do not remember. '
- 'And old are you'?
- 'Twenty-one. I buried him here in a shell hole during the battle. Made a mound, found some sticks, tied up them in a cross and even signed a plate with his helmet on top.
- 'But he was your enemy?'
- 'Wrong, he was not an enemy any longer. Can you tell me how old he was?'
- 'I can, this tanker was 19 y.o.'

- People do not want to kill each other?

- Of course not. We recently exchanged prisoners and KIAs as well. Trenches in the Ukrainian checkpoint are very narrow. I got out of the car and almost stepped on the head of a soldier who sit in that trench. They told:

- 'We do not know about any exchange.'
- 'Okay I'll call to the officers.'

- However there was no connection. And suddenly twenty soldiers got out of the trenches, it was interesting to them. One boy came up to me:

- 'Tell me, is it true that you have wounded children with you?'
- 'Of course. All wounded, some are without legs or without arms or without eyes.'
- 'Are you cheating? Is this true? '
- ' It is true. '

Then they brought captured militia men, eight of them. But I brought only four prisoners. And they had eight. Ukrainians said that they will release only four. That moment I was more scared than at the time when I was going to be killed by my captors. I couldn't understand... There they were, our captured comrades, in front of me with their hands tied and with bags over their heads. I could only pick four but what about the rest? I was bluffing so hard. Told them that I was going to bring three POWS but brought the fourth so make me a gift as I made to you. Before they could change their minds I grabbed the bags with KIAs and tossed them in another car. Then I went to return the flashlight they lent me and the same boy pulled me out of the darkness:

- 'Tell me, what do I do now?"
- 'Run away! Flee while you are alive. Run away, run!'

- And he ran. I will remember him. But what will happen to the people after the war ... They're like dogs who tasted blood. It is very difficult to cope with such dog. And people are even more problematic. Especially women. If woman went to war to kill she becomes extremely violent and dangerous. For her, the war is as an alcoholism. I saw such women. People ask me what would've I done if I had had a weapon? I do not know how I would've behaved, but I do not think that I can kill. Well, I just cannot kill. And some still say that I must hate Ukrainians. Wait ... Why do I have to hate someone? I always try to understand a person and found him an excuse. After all, he was guided by something and had the right to choose. Maybe he do not understand something, or maybe I do not understand something. But I do not hate.

The Guardian wrote:Putin’s travel bans are the latest mis-step in a clumsy diplomatic dance with Europe
Mary Dejevsky Sunday 31 May 2015 19.30 BST

Relations have deteriorated so much that we don’t know if the bar on Nick Clegg and others visiting Russia is a sham diplomatic storm or a real one

onsigned to the back benches, party leader and deputy prime minister no more, Nick Clegg finds himself suddenly back in the spotlight … because he has been banned from Russia. Tragi-comic, perverse, regrettable – choose your adjective to describe this latest twist in international diplomacy.

Clegg is one of nine Britons and 89 European Union citizens on a list of prohibited individuals that Russia has now “shared with” Brussels, and the response was predictable. The bans were immediately condemned by the EU as arbitrary, unjustified and possibly illegal. A common conclusion was that Russia is deliberately escalating the conflict with the west over Ukraine to a new and even more dangerous level.

Tempting though it may be to see it in this way – especially for fractious Europeans in need of a new rallying point – this is not the only permissible interpretation. We could in fact be watching the latest mis-steps in the clumsy diplomatic dance that has Russia and the EU still treading on each other’s toes, just as the United States is trying to change the music. John Kerry, the US secretary of state (now recovering from a broken leg), stopped off in Sochi to meet President Putin two weeks ago, in a reopening of public contact that the EU has yet to follow.

Throughout the east-west standoff over Ukraine, mistiming and misreading have been the norm, and the latest verbal sniping offers more of the same. Russian visa bans are not new; what is new is the “sharing” of the list – it has still not been officially published. But this comes in response to long-standing efforts by the EU for clarification from Russia about who is and is not subject to a ban. Now the Russians have apparently provided it: is this an unfriendly act or not? (And, they might ask, who started the war of visa bans anyway?)

Now consider who is on this list: not exactly A-listers. The vast majority are former this and former that. As well as Clegg, the UK list includes the former MP, former foreign secretary and former intelligence committee chairman Malcolm Rifkind. Speaking today, Rifkind said the Russian ban was proof of EU sanctions working, and he had no immediate plans to visit the country. Nor, no doubt, do Clegg, Andrew Parker, the head of MI5, John Sawers, the former head of MI6, and Nicholas Houghton, the chief of the defence staff. Continue reading.

Лента Новостей wrote:In Moscow, beaten by protesters against the war with Ukraine. 31/05/15

Vox Populi Evo wrote:Lyashko and Kolomoisky about Saakashvili appointed Odessa governor | Eng Subs